Thousand-Week Reich - A 'realistic' Nazi victory scenario

[AP246]

What's the party system like? That's the one thing that would weaken US dominance, parties breaking up the regionalism. I'm also a little surprised not to see any minor Caribbean states joining.

I've thought about these things, and haven't decided yet if I will do a similar diagram with the parties and such.

As for small Caribbean nations, I did consider it, but decided against it, assuming they had some kind of perhaps bilateral arrangement with the Union (like I expect Ireland to have). I honestly planned out the seats and parliament and everything before I thought of having Caribbean islands, and at that point I honestly just decided not to change it too significantly. There'd also be the issue of lots of countries having 1 seat, which would be a bit weird maybe.

 

[AP246]

What's the party system like? That's the one thing that would weaken US dominance, parties breaking up the regionalism. I'm also a little surprised not to see any minor Caribbean states joining.

Oh yeah one more thing I forgot to mention - I had the idea that after the creation of the Parliament, perhaps in the mid to late 70s, that the US began to (perhaps semi-covertly) oppose full membership of new countries into the AU, as that would reduce their voting power and relative dominance inside the Parliament (and instead, preferring smaller countries becoming part of the economic 'sphere of influence' of the AU through monetary and economic deals), while other medium sized countries, such as the UK, push hard for expansion.

 

[Darktrooper007]

Any ideas for a future map? Working on the mod most of the time at the moment, but probably will have a bit of time going forwards. I've seen suggestions like Italy, anyone have any other ideas or requests?

Maybe some more info about Nazi political machinations and SS infighting (e.g. Himmler vs Heydrich) between the end of WWII and the German Civil War.

Maybe a map of the richest nations ITTL (In terms of GDP).

It would be cool to see a list/map of nations ranked by GDP per capita during and after the Thousand Weeks.

 

[AP246]

Maybe some more info about Nazi political machinations and SS infighting (e.g. Himmler vs Heydrich) between the end of WWII and the German Civil War.




It would be cool to see a list/map of nations ranked by GDP per capita during and after the Thousand Weeks.

Interesting ideas, though I think estimating the GDP of a Nazi Germany that's fighting rebels and insurgents constantly might be quite difficult.

 

[AP246]

A Timeline of the Atlantic Union

Hopefully this gives a bit more insight into how it worked and works in 2019.

 

[Bookmark1995]

A Timeline of the Atlantic Union

Hopefully this gives a bit more insight into how it worked and works in 2019.

I think there would be a bit of resistance against abandoning the dollar in the US.

Despite stronger internationalism, people wouldn't want to get rid of their currency.

OTL British certainly didn't want to abandon the pound.

 

[TheKutKu]

I think there would be a bit of resistance against abandoning the dollar in the US.

Despite stronger internationalism, people wouldn't want to get rid of their currency.

OTL British certainly didn't want to abandon the pound.

I'm pretty sure the Atlantic dolar would initially be worth 1:1 with the USD, and the two would likely be convertible for a good decade or two.

 

[Bookmark1995]

I'm pretty sure the Atlantic dolar would initially be worth 1:1 with the USD, and the two would likely be convertible for a good decade or two.

I just find abandonment of the dollar to be odd.

 

[Dr. No]

I'd like to know how potent the Atlantic Parliament is. A comparison to the OTL European Union would be nice. That Atlantic Dollar, however, seems way more implausible than the Euro currency from OTL. If something like a sovereign debt crisis happened ITTL, I guess the disparities would be harder to bridge than in the OTL Eurozone. The Atlantic institutions would have to be way more potent and integrated than the European institutions of the OTL 2010s. And this opens a whole can of worms, Atlantic legal supremacy, potent Atlantic legislatives, a single market, maybe even freedom of movement though I guess that initial opposition to Mexicans in the US, UK and Scandinavia would be tense at best.

 

[Bookmark1995]

I'd like to know how potent the Atlantic Parliament is. A comparison to the OTL European Union would be nice. That Atlantic Dollar, however, seems way more implausible than the Euro currency from OTL. If something like a sovereign debt crisis happened ITTL, I guess the disparities would be harder to bridge than in the OTL Eurozone. The Atlantic institutions would have to be way more potent and integrated than the European institutions of the OTL 2010s. And this opens a whole can of worms, Atlantic legal supremacy, potent Atlantic legislatives, a single market, maybe even freedom of movement though I guess that initial opposition to Mexicans in the US, UK and Scandinavia would be tense at best.

Wouldn't a lot of people complain about American domination too?

Being in a political union with the US would kind of lead to that.

 

[Lord Insane]

I find the quickness of it odder than the US adopting the Atlantic dollar, TBH (had the pound sterling not gotten hit by a speculation run when they joined ERM things might well have been different, and the closer comparison may be France dropping the Franc, if Franc had the global influence of it and the DM combined). The Euro had the Ecu predecessor and a multi-stage European Monetary Union process that set up the European Central Bank before the Ecu became the euro.

 

[AP246]

I'd like to know how potent the Atlantic Parliament is. A comparison to the OTL European Union would be nice. That Atlantic Dollar, however, seems way more implausible than the Euro currency from OTL. If something like a sovereign debt crisis happened ITTL, I guess the disparities would be harder to bridge than in the OTL Eurozone. The Atlantic institutions would have to be way more potent and integrated than the European institutions of the OTL 2010s. And this opens a whole can of worms, Atlantic legal supremacy, potent Atlantic legislatives, a single market, maybe even freedom of movement though I guess that initial opposition to Mexicans in the US, UK and Scandinavia would be tense at best.

I find the quickness of it odder than the US adopting the Atlantic dollar, TBH (had the pound sterling not gotten hit by a speculation run when they joined ERM things might well have been different, and the closer comparison may be France dropping the Franc, if Franc had the global influence of it and the DM combined). The Euro had the Ecu predecessor and a multi-stage European Monetary Union process that set up the European Central Bank before the Ecu became the euro.

In terms of the common currency, a couple of things. Yes, I had had it raised that a common currency may be less plausible in this situation than that of the euro, and I for a long time considered not including it in this. However, I had already mentioned it in previous bits of media and wanted to avoid confusing retcons whenever possible. Was it the right decision? Perhaps not, but currency and monetary policy is not something I'm an expert in or anything. I am aware that the Euro took a long time to adopt, and, while not shown on this timeline, I assumed the process was undertaken gradually roughly during the time between the exchange rate reforms and the final adoption, though yes this might not have been clearly put.

Wouldn't a lot of people complain about American domination too?

Being in a political union with the US would kind of lead to that.

US domination is very much an issue, and a controversial one, in this world. There are a few counters though in-universe.

1. The Union is just good for peace and we don't want something like the Nazis to happen again, so we'll go along with it.

2. In Britain and Canada's case, there is a genuine increased fondness for America, in its role in protecting against a much scarier looking Nazi Germany, and the much longer term and later direct military alliance.

3. Europe has been thoroughly destroyed, even more so than in otl's WW2, even to the point of demographics in huge swathes of Europe being damaged for decades to come. Reconstruction will be a long and arduous process, and along the way and even afterwards Europe will be poorer than otl and struggling. For countries like Britain and Scandinavian countries, that weren't affected by the war but (certainly in Britain's case) have had huge economic difficulty, going along with America, losing some global independence, but gaining economic links across the Atlantic rather than with mainland Europe may well seem appealing, at least at first. However, as countries recover, resistance builds up, which leads to the 1981 crisis (and the subsequent reforms), and then to the period of little getting done in the 90s and 2000s because a lot of people are pretty against policies which they see as strengthening the American-dominated bloc.

 

[Bookmark1995]

In terms of the common currency, a couple of things. Yes, I had had it raised that a common currency may be less plausible in this situation than that of the euro, and I for a long time considered not including it in this. However, I had already mentioned it in previous bits of media and wanted to avoid confusing retcons whenever possible. Was it the right decision? Perhaps not, but currency and monetary policy is not something I'm an expert in or anything. I am aware that the Euro took a long time to adopt, and, while not shown on this timeline, I assumed the process was undertaken gradually roughly during the time between the exchange rate reforms and the final adoption, though yes this might not have been clearly put.



US domination is very much an issue, and a controversial one, in this world. There are a few counters though in-universe.

1. The Union is just good for peace and we don't want something like the Nazis to happen again, so we'll go along with it.

2. In Britain and Canada's case, there is a genuine increased fondness for America, in its role in protecting against a much scarier looking Nazi Germany, and the much longer term and later direct military alliance.

3. Europe has been thoroughly destroyed, even more so than in otl's WW2, even to the point of demographics in huge swathes of Europe being damaged for decades to come. Reconstruction will be a long and arduous process, and along the way and even afterwards Europe will be poorer than otl and struggling. For countries like Britain and Scandinavian countries, that weren't affected by the war but (certainly in Britain's case) have had huge economic difficulty, going along with America, losing some global independence, but gaining economic links across the Atlantic rather than with mainland Europe may well seem appealing, at least at first. However, as countries recover, resistance builds up, which leads to the 1981 crisis (and the subsequent reforms), and then to the period of little getting done in the 90s and 2000s because a lot of people are pretty against policies which they see as strengthening the American-dominated bloc.

Political links is one thing, but I doubt most people are eager to give up their currencies.

 

[Alex1guy]

Eh this is a world where the anglosphere is bound by a traumatic era of war and co operation. Its not impossible to imagine a common currency. Seems weird to get super hung up on it, I don't see the problem.

 

[Bleh]

A Timeline of the Atlantic Union

Hopefully this gives a bit more insight into how it worked and works in 2019.

How seriously are the countries of Central America, the Caribbean, and Colombia being considered/advocated for admission into the union? I would imagine Mexico, Venezuela, and perhaps Portugal would be pushing for that rather hard while perhaps the US, UK and Canada(?) oppose it and Left and Right elements of each country's delegates are courted by either side respectively. But how much of an issue is it and what arguments are made for and against?

 

[AP246]

How seriously are the countries of Central America, the Caribbean, and Colombia being considered/advocated for admission into the union? I would imagine Mexico, Venezuela, and perhaps Portugal would be pushing for that rather hard while perhaps the US, UK and Canada(?) oppose it and Left and Right elements of each country's delegates are courted by either side respectively. But how much of an issue is it and what arguments are made for and against?

I assume already that many Caribbean and Central, or even South American countries are economically tied to the AU to some extent, either through being in the greater economic area, or through bilateral trade agreements.

Full membership is on the table, but obviously the possibility of adding 'poorer' nations into the AU comes with political baggage. In addition, the US may somewhat oppose new members, maybe not small Caribbean nations, but large latin American nations like Colombia or even somewhere like Brazil, because it'd significantly reduce their voteshare in the Parliament, as well as of course the immigration argument.

I expect other of the richer nations, like the UK, Canada and Sweden and such, to be divided on the issue. Some might support expanding the AU, both just for its own sale as well as to reduce American domination, while others might be opposed to 'subsidising' more poorer countries and the immigration aspects.

 

[H.Flashman(VC)]

Political links is one thing, but I doubt most people are eager to give up their currencies.

That isn't the greatest hurdle in this case. The public in 'proud' countries like Germany and France have also accepted the Euro for different reasons. Great Britain didn't for several reasons. The main one is London's important role in the international financial trade. That part of the economy wasn't integrated enough in Europe in 1996. This made the Pound susceptible to speculation in that year and as a consequence the link to the predecessor of the Euro had to be broken. It was mainly a pure economic reason.
I have another problem with a common currency, because i think it will not be necessary to have one really, and it has some economic disadvantages for the economic smaller countries, if not compensated somehow.
I imagine the US economy being the biggest one ITTL, their economy will determine the value of the common currency compared with other world currencies. A common policy of governments to stimulate international trade in a depression is to devaluate the own currency. With a common currency that's not possible anymore. To avoid situations of speculating that can wreck a country in depression, the US will have to financialy strenghten the economies of that country in depression, just like the federal government in the US itself has to finance statebudgets of states to avoid a bankruptcy of that state. The consequence is that in the long run the different economies of the countries need to integrate more and more and thus many linking policies.
My impression is that the main purpose of the AU is still a militairy one. For that wideranging economic integration is not neccesary. It is enough to have a Dollar block. A situation where the dollar is a legal tender in all countries. How larger the % of international trade of the AU members is with each other, how better this will work.

 

[Bookmark1995]

That isn't the greatest hurdle in this case. The public in 'proud' countries like Germany and France have also accepted the Euro for different reasons. Great Britain didn't for several reasons. The main one is London's important role in the international financial trade. That part of the economy wasn't integrated enough in Europe in 1996. This made the Pound susceptible to speculation in that year and as a consequence the link to the predecessor of the Euro had to be broken. It was mainly a pure economic reason.
I have another problem with a common currency, because i think it will not be necessary to have one really, and it has some economic disadvantages for the economic smaller countries, if not compensated somehow.
I imagine the US economy being the biggest one ITTL, their economy will determine the value of the common currency compared with other world currencies. A common policy of governments to stimulate international trade in a depression is to devaluate the own currency. With a common currency that's not possible anymore. To avoid situations of speculating that can wreck a country in depression, the US will have to financialy strenghten the economies of that country in depression, just like the federal government in the US itself has to finance statebudgets of states to avoid a bankruptcy of that state. The consequence is that in the long run the different economies of the countries need to integrate more and more and thus many linking policies.
My impression is that the main purpose of the AU is still a militairy one. For that wideranging economic integration is not neccesary. It is enough to have a Dollar block. A situation where the dollar is a legal tender in all countries. How larger the % of international trade of the AU members is with each other, how better this will work.

That's the problem facing Greece and Italy OTL: when faced with a recession, they devalued their currencies, but joining the Euro means this is no longer an option for them.

ITTL, many countries won't enjoy tying their fortunes to that of the US for similar reasons.

 

[H.Flashman(VC)]

That's the problem facing Greece and Italy OTL: when faced with a recession, they devalued their currencies, but joining the Euro means this is no longer an option for them.

ITTL, many countries won't enjoy tying their fortunes to that of the US for similar reasons.

Yes, and the great difference with the EU is the relative side of the US economy in the AU. I'm estimating that at something of 75% of the total. That's why i would say a dollar block is most natural here.

 

[AP246]

So, someone from discord/hoi4 circles contacted me (for something else, but made this as a possible part of it), and wanted to make a kind of fan TWR thing based on my Vietnam magazine article to show his ideas. Offered to post it here and they accepted, so here it is.

As it's not made by me, it'll basically be considered non-canon. Not to detract from the work, but I like to keep my own stuff my own so its consistent with my ideas.