A New Balance
- Thread starter Jim Smitty
- Start date
What Just Happened?
What is known of the Sino-Soviet War of 1933 is very limited. At the time China was in an unstated civil war and record keeping by these different factions was poor at best. More often than through there were no records taken. The “Central Government” in China was more for making sure the Boxer Indemnity was paid and the ambassadors of foreign nations had someone to bitch at about how their people were caught up in the on going civil war in China. Relations with the Soviets and the rest of the world was touchy at best and they didn’t generally informed the west of the world of their actions. And given the location of the war information in and out of this war were few and far between. In the New York Times there was ever only one piece on the war between the Soviet Union and China. And that was on page 14.
The Soviets were supporting one of the factions in the area of Xinjiang in an effort to create another client state there as they had in Mongolia. Yet their chosen forces were being defeated by another group with a power base in Qinghai. Soviet strongman Nikita Stalin[1] decided to invade Xinjiang. Stalin like other communist strongmen was paranoid most likely to clinician levels that the rest of the world would ban together to defeat revolution of the proletariat. However most of the world just wanted to check the growth of communist and keep it from spearing. Many around the world didn’t support another war. Yet to Stalin he saw this as a chance to expand the revolution even at the point of the gun.
Based on what report you believed the Soviets sent 8,000 to 12,000 troops across the border that was supported by goliaths, artillery, and airplanes. One thing every communist nation was doing was building up its military industry as they had all learned painful lessons about not having enough weapons from either the Great War or their civil wars. For the Soviets this was their first test of their systems since the civil war.
Reports of combat even 70 plus years later are hard to come by. Given the remove area the war took part in and lack of records from the Chinese side and the issues with Soviet records being believed no one really has a good idea what happened other than Soviet forces won. Soon after the Chinese and Soviet signed the Treaty of Peking. On the face of things the Treaty of Peking was just another unequal treaty. Yet when the Soviets informed the world that the Xinjiang Soviet Socialist Republic in 1936 the world really took note.
[1] This guy has traits of Stalin from OTL but is a very different man.
The Soviets were supporting one of the factions in the area of Xinjiang in an effort to create another client state there as they had in Mongolia. Yet their chosen forces were being defeated by another group with a power base in Qinghai. Soviet strongman Nikita Stalin[1] decided to invade Xinjiang. Stalin like other communist strongmen was paranoid most likely to clinician levels that the rest of the world would ban together to defeat revolution of the proletariat. However most of the world just wanted to check the growth of communist and keep it from spearing. Many around the world didn’t support another war. Yet to Stalin he saw this as a chance to expand the revolution even at the point of the gun.
Based on what report you believed the Soviets sent 8,000 to 12,000 troops across the border that was supported by goliaths, artillery, and airplanes. One thing every communist nation was doing was building up its military industry as they had all learned painful lessons about not having enough weapons from either the Great War or their civil wars. For the Soviets this was their first test of their systems since the civil war.
Reports of combat even 70 plus years later are hard to come by. Given the remove area the war took part in and lack of records from the Chinese side and the issues with Soviet records being believed no one really has a good idea what happened other than Soviet forces won. Soon after the Chinese and Soviet signed the Treaty of Peking. On the face of things the Treaty of Peking was just another unequal treaty. Yet when the Soviets informed the world that the Xinjiang Soviet Socialist Republic in 1936 the world really took note.
[1] This guy has traits of Stalin from OTL but is a very different man.
The Death of the Treaty System
The London Naval Conference had been set to take place in 1936 by agreement at Boston in 1930. However, when Italy had agreed to build the Ottomans a pair of battleships in 1933 had promoted the London Naval Conference to be moved up to 1934. The Ottomans had been wanting a new pair of battleships as part of a naval build to counter the Soviet build up in Black Sea. With oil money from the Baba Gurgur oil fields the Ottomans had the money to put into a good military which they had been working to fix since their poor showing in the Great War. They had when the Big Four naval power first before going to Italy before they found a nation that would break the Bern Naval Treaty for exporting of capital ships.
Further the Germans were all for an early naval conference as the Soviet naval build up in the Baltic had them unnerved. They wanted to build some modern battleships that were designed to deal with the growing Soviet naval threat in the Baltic. They wanted these ships not to count against their tonnage as designing battleships for the Baltic would be worthless elsewhere and they knew it. Further Japan was for an early naval conference as they wanted an increase in both capital ship and aircraft carrier tonnage along being allowed more heavy cruisers. But the official reason for the early conference was to bring the Ottoman Empire and possibly later others into the Treaty System and possible agree to the sell of capital ships for export again.
The conference got off to a bad start. Japan basically more or less demanded tonnage equal to that of the United States. From there things just when downhill. The Ottomans were badly treaty by everyone. The highest offer anyone was willing to offer the Ottomans was 200,000 tons of capital ships and 75,000 tons of aircraft carriers. This would had only allow the Ottomans one of the two capital ships they had ordered from the Italians which they wouldn’t accept. They were fine with the aircraft carrier tonnage but they wanted at least 300,000 tonnage limits which had been the limits of Italy, France, and Austria-Hungary. And the only one who offered them 200,000 limits was the US. Everyone else was offering 150,000 tons which would forced the Ottomans to decommission two of their battleships to get even one of their new ordered battleships into the fleet.
Japan was the first nation to walk out of the London Naval Conference after three weeks of talks. The US was willing to talk allowing Japan increase tonnage to German levels if they could subdivide their tonnage to German levels in the Atlantic and Pacific and French levels in the Caribbean. The British when hell no to the US offer of increasing Japanese tonnage for allowing the US to subdivide their tonnage. Following the Japanese walking out of the conference the US and Germany were trying to draw out concessions for the Japanese leaving the treaty systems. The UK was willing to give concessions in return for their support in cruisers and submarine restrictions. This was a heavy cruiser tonnage limits of 10,500 tons and light cruisers limited to 8,000 tons. Submarines would further be restricted to 1,500 surface displacement and deck guns up to 4 inches. Both the US and Germany almost laugh at this as they viewed 13,000 tons displacement for a heavy cruiser barely enough to make a good heavy cruisers. The idea of 8,000 displacement light cruisers was laughable to them.
Italy was the next nation to walk out of London and only days after Japan walked. This was after the British had made it clear they wouldn’t allow the Italians to have any share in the international capital ship market by the treaty system. The Ottomans walked out soon after the Italians. The Americans, Germans, Austro-Hungarians, and French all try to get concessions for the Italians walking out. It was the same story as when the Japanese walk out. The bridge was too far to gap for workable concessions. The conference took a two week sabbatical to hold meetings back in their home nations to see if they could some how find a workable agreeing to deal with the Japanese, Italians, and the Ottomans walking out of the conference.
When the conference restarted the United States spoke first and they were the last to speak. They declared the treaty system was dead in a short speech. The US team then walked out of the conference. With the US out of the treaty system there was no way to try and save the treaty system. The other nations still at London didn’t even try to save the treaty system. They simply ended the conference and the treaty system died. Within weeks a major naval arms race was starting.
Further the Germans were all for an early naval conference as the Soviet naval build up in the Baltic had them unnerved. They wanted to build some modern battleships that were designed to deal with the growing Soviet naval threat in the Baltic. They wanted these ships not to count against their tonnage as designing battleships for the Baltic would be worthless elsewhere and they knew it. Further Japan was for an early naval conference as they wanted an increase in both capital ship and aircraft carrier tonnage along being allowed more heavy cruisers. But the official reason for the early conference was to bring the Ottoman Empire and possibly later others into the Treaty System and possible agree to the sell of capital ships for export again.
The conference got off to a bad start. Japan basically more or less demanded tonnage equal to that of the United States. From there things just when downhill. The Ottomans were badly treaty by everyone. The highest offer anyone was willing to offer the Ottomans was 200,000 tons of capital ships and 75,000 tons of aircraft carriers. This would had only allow the Ottomans one of the two capital ships they had ordered from the Italians which they wouldn’t accept. They were fine with the aircraft carrier tonnage but they wanted at least 300,000 tonnage limits which had been the limits of Italy, France, and Austria-Hungary. And the only one who offered them 200,000 limits was the US. Everyone else was offering 150,000 tons which would forced the Ottomans to decommission two of their battleships to get even one of their new ordered battleships into the fleet.
Japan was the first nation to walk out of the London Naval Conference after three weeks of talks. The US was willing to talk allowing Japan increase tonnage to German levels if they could subdivide their tonnage to German levels in the Atlantic and Pacific and French levels in the Caribbean. The British when hell no to the US offer of increasing Japanese tonnage for allowing the US to subdivide their tonnage. Following the Japanese walking out of the conference the US and Germany were trying to draw out concessions for the Japanese leaving the treaty systems. The UK was willing to give concessions in return for their support in cruisers and submarine restrictions. This was a heavy cruiser tonnage limits of 10,500 tons and light cruisers limited to 8,000 tons. Submarines would further be restricted to 1,500 surface displacement and deck guns up to 4 inches. Both the US and Germany almost laugh at this as they viewed 13,000 tons displacement for a heavy cruiser barely enough to make a good heavy cruisers. The idea of 8,000 displacement light cruisers was laughable to them.
Italy was the next nation to walk out of London and only days after Japan walked. This was after the British had made it clear they wouldn’t allow the Italians to have any share in the international capital ship market by the treaty system. The Ottomans walked out soon after the Italians. The Americans, Germans, Austro-Hungarians, and French all try to get concessions for the Italians walking out. It was the same story as when the Japanese walk out. The bridge was too far to gap for workable concessions. The conference took a two week sabbatical to hold meetings back in their home nations to see if they could some how find a workable agreeing to deal with the Japanese, Italians, and the Ottomans walking out of the conference.
When the conference restarted the United States spoke first and they were the last to speak. They declared the treaty system was dead in a short speech. The US team then walked out of the conference. With the US out of the treaty system there was no way to try and save the treaty system. The other nations still at London didn’t even try to save the treaty system. They simply ended the conference and the treaty system died. Within weeks a major naval arms race was starting.
Building new capital ships should be easier, since in this timeline, there was a steady, if slow, replacement of older ships. I wouldn't be surprised if thre are somme 18" guns, officially built for coast defense, already tested, and perhaps built.
The Ottomans don't really have a lot of use for fleet carriers as I see it; they'll always be in range of support by land based air.
The Ottomans don't really have a lot of use for fleet carriers as I see it; they'll always be in range of support by land based air.
Ok guys I'm working on Nation updates to give you a general idea of what their militaries can do in 37. If there are any odd but promising weapons systems and want to see them in TL let me know and I will take a look at them.
A taste of what is to come as I had a few false starts with the nation updates, but now I have it set up a way I like and not being a clone of my PFS Nation updates which I'm also working on.
I was wondering if you ever get your two TLs confused, sometimes I get a little confused about what's happened in which timeline.
Somehow I keep those two TLs and the host of TLs I'm writing plans for straight.I was wondering if you ever get your two TLs confused, sometimes I get a little confused about what's happened in which timeline.
Also when you see what kind of numbers of cap ships nations are going to have when the naval treaties break down ITL.
The Bern Naval Treaty which is the ITL Washington Naval Treaty has much larger tonnage. Whereas the WNT is 5:5:3:1.75:1.75, ITL the BNT is 11:11:8:7:3:3:3. Granted I'm having to use execl for the first time in years to figure out the numbers but WWII is going to have a lot more naval ships in play than OTL
That will also depend on who can afford how many ships.
On interesting side effect of being able to have 2 ships under construction at a time: When the war breaks out, there will be a continuum of technology and speed, not the sharp distinction between old and new battleships.
Well the tonnage ratio is the US, British (Including Australia/New Zealand), Germany, Japan, France, Italy, Austria-Hungary. Its really only the last three where money really comes into play. Two of them were defeated in the Great War, one suffered a civil war another was damn close to a civil war, the other isn't really a naval power.
United States of America 1937
United States of America
Government Type: Constitutional Republic
Head of State: President Carl Olsen[1][2], Democratic
Head of Government: President Carl Olsen, Democratic
Power Status: Great Power
Population: ~145,426,129 (1937 Projected)
Minister of War: Karl Kerr[3], Democratic
Minister of Navy: Edward “Ed” Knox[4], Republican[5]
Minister of Air: Shawn Brown[6], Republican
Chief of the General Staff: Fleet Admiral Samuel “Sam” Soto[7]
Conscription:
The United States restarted conscription in 1934 following it being ended in 1929 as a cost cutting measure. Service is either two years in either the Army or Marines or three years in the Navy or Air Force. Air Crew is volunteer only and that is agreeing to a four year hitch, five for pilots. The US performs a class base draft at the moment. Its for males who turn 21 in that given year. If in college they are allowed to finished but have to join the ROTC detachment at their school to start training to be an officer. This is followed by four years of service no matter the branch, seven if they become a pilot once they go active.
Following this active phase, comes the reserve phase of the conscription program as outline in the Conscription Act of 1934. This is four years in the Federal Reserve or National/Territorial Guard, it is their choice on which they join. Following the active phase there is the inactive reserve phase where they only have to keep their contact information current till the age of 40 for possible recall in the event of national emergency if declared by the president of the United States.
Army
Army Chief of Staff: General John Garrett[8]
Unit Strength:
12 Infantry Divisions, 3 Motorized Infantry Divisions, 3 Armored Divisions, 1 Airborne Brigade,
Equipment:
Small Arms
Using the lessons from the Great War and Second Mexico has been reflected in small arms design within the US Army. Priorities had been shifted to firepower and mobility. Its one of the many reasons that the Model 1910[9] is still the only service weapon that was in service prior to Second Mexico that is still in current front line service within the army. Using feed back from its use in Second Mexico and the Great War it was updated in 1920 to the 1910A1 variant. This push for mobility and firepower was also reflected in the new service rifle that entered service in 1931. This was after the better part of 10 years of R&D, the M1 Springfield[10]. It marked the switch from the 30-06 as the standard rifle round to the .276. With a 10 round en-bloc design it was a mark improvement over the M1899 Springfield[11]. Even through the M1899 Springfield is still in service in some units as enough M1s haven’t been made to equipped every soldier with one yet. It also is being retained by snipers as it is far more accurate and longer effective range over the M1. The M1899 is also the standard weapon within Federal Reserve and National/Territorial Guard units.
Following Second Mexico the US Army started a crash program to improve firepower at the squad and platoon level. Most of these weapons were either short lived programs or entered service late in the Great War. The more famous of the two that is still in service is the M1917 Submachine Gun[12]. The M1917 Submachine Gun is still in service however, the army is looking for a cheaper replacement as the M1917 is a costly weapon to make. The firepower offered by it through is such that is was accepted into service even through it was costly. The second is the Browning Automatic Rifle or the BAR. Officially it’s the M1918 Automatic Rifle but its better known as the BAR. It was hoped that the BAR could give the standard rifleman an automatic weapon to replace the M1899. However its weight at almost 24.5 pounds made this idea ill-founded. Following the war it left the BAR in an abnormal position as the idea behind had been proven not to work. Testing during the 1920s through save the BAR from being pushed out of the arsenal. It was redesigned as a Light Machine Gun and when fitted with a bipod it proved to perform well in this role. When the army decided to field the M1 in its .276 ammo it was decided to refit the BAR in .276 as well. This version the M1918A4 was only fielded in 1936, but a vast improvement over the older models. Its far lighter of a weapon and the magazine has moved from being able only holding 20 to 30 rounds. Currently both 30-06 and .276 are in service, but the goal is to move to a total force of .276 BARs.
With the mess of machine guns that were present in Second Mexico and the Great War the Army has made a major effort to streamline its machine gun inventory. Since then the army had settled on three machine guns. The first is the M1916 Machine Gun[13]. Since the Great War the M1916 is still in use as the primary water cooled machine gun but its moved more to fixed defenses in the Pacific and vehicle mounts than the tripod mounts that were common during the Great War. The much more common M1919 Machine Gun[14] is the standard general use machine gun within the army. Both the M1916 and M1919 are going to be retained in 30-06 ammo as the greater range offered to them by that round over the .276. The third is more along the lines of the M1916 Machine Gun but can still be found on tripod mounts in some units, however its much more common use in either fixed defenses in the Pacific or vehicle mounts, this is the M3 Machine Gun[15].The M3 fires the much larger .50 caliber round and it was so powerful that it was first listed as an anti-Goliath machine gun. That said the M3 is an anti-material machine gun and that is deadly when used against troops.
Infantry Support Weapons
When the US entered the Great War they were fielding their first efforts at a hand grenade that could be used by just about anyone without specialist training. This effort was a total failure as they either didn’t work or they weren’t going off when they landed only to be thrown back by the other side to go off in American lines. Rarely did these work as designed and quickly withdrawn from service. Not wanting to wait the US simply reserved engineered the British Mills Bomb which they had captured in their efforts in Canada. These Mk 1 Grenades only enter service late in the war and failed to see service in the war. The US has upgraded the Mk 1 Grenade to Mk 2 standards with new explosive filler and cut the fuse from 7 seconds to 4. Both are still in use through.
Land mines have also been given a fair amount of importance in defending the Pacific. This led to the fielding of the M1 Bounding Mine[16] in 1933. The M1 Bounding Mine is based on French efforts the subject. The M1 is found in heavy use in the Pacific. The M1 is used with the M2 Anti-Goliath Mine[17] at a rate of 5 M1s to 1 M2 to counter Japanese amphibious goliaths. Both the M1 and M2 mines are also being stockpile for use when needed in the event of another war.
Again like hand grenades the United States simply used reserved engineered the British mortar from captured copies in Canada. Again it reached units too late see use in the Great War. This mortar however has largely been moved to into Federal Reserve or National/Territorial Guard Units. It has been replaced by a French license with a series of different sizes. This starts with the 2.4 Inch M1 Mortar[18] which is the lightest mortar currently fielded by the army only slightly redesign of the French design. This was done to fit American measurements as the infantry, cavalry, and artillery boards were dead set against a change from standard to metric. The M1 is counter parted with the 3.2 Inch M2 Mortar[19]. Both the M1 and M2 Mortars are in common use. The US is also testing a 4.2 Inch Mortar.
Artillery
Like many great powers the United States is still using large numbers of artillery designs dating from the Great War or prior to it, but has started to fielded more modern designs as time is catching up to the Great War artillery. Artillery from the Great War has been updated to help keep up with the changing world of artillery. The 3 inch M1901 Field Gun[20] is one of the more common pieces of artillery still in service from the Great War. Yet the M1901 is slowly being phased out of service as the newer M4 3 inch Field Gun[21] is entering service following it being accepted into service in 1935. The larger counter part to the M1901 and M4 is the 4.7 inch M1905 Field Gun[22]. Even through like the M1901, the M1905 has been modernized the US is currently looking for a replacement for it and the replacement weapon is in testing at the moment. Besides the 4.7 inch field gun that is in testing the US Army is also testing a 6 and 8 inch gun to enter service within the five to seven years.
In terms of howitzers the US entered the great war totally unready for. Besides the M1907 6 inch Howitzer[23] the US didn’t have any howitzers when they entered the Great War. They impressed captured howitzers as they captured them. In the wake of the Great War the US started efforts to fit this problem as during the war they had been focusing more building enough artillery pieces and shells for what they had. The only howitzer however they fielded before the depression of 28 was the M1 3 inch Pack Howitzer[24] which was fielded only months prior the start depression. In 1935 the US fielded the M3 4.2 Inch Howitzer[25]. Currently the T5 6 Inch Howitzer[26] is slated to enter service in 1938. Work is also under way on an 8 inch howitzer.
Anti-Goliath Artillery is currently the smallest section within the US Artillery department. This is the M8 1.5 Inch Anti-Goliath Gun[27]. The M8 is the largest anti-goliath guns by caliber. Currently the M8 is believed to be enough to deal with any goliath fielded by any power on the face of the earth. On the front of Anti-Aircraft Artillery. Currently the army uses three weapons for anti-air missions. The first is the M3 Machine Gun. In the middle size is the M7 Cannon[28] with the M9 3.5 Inch Gun[29].
Light Goliaths
M14
Entered Service: 1936
Weight: 11 tons
Crew: 4 (Commander, Driver, Gunner, Co-Gunner)
Armor: up to ½ inch
Main Armament: M3 Machine Gun
Secondary Armament: M1916 Machine Gun
Engine: 7 Cylinder, radical
Speed: 35 mph
Range: 150 miles
M11
Entered Service: 1934
Weight: 11.6 Tons
Crew: 4 (Commander, Driver, Gunner, Loader)
Armor: up to 1 Inch
Main Armament: M8 1.5 Inch Anti-Goliath Gun (A1 Models), 2 x M3 Machine Guns in duel turrets (A2 Model)
Secondary Armament: 5 x M1916 Machine Guns
Engine: 7 cylinder radical
Speed: 38 mph
Range: 200 miles
Air Force
Air Force Chief of Staff: General Mark Torstein [30]
Aircraft Strength:
~2,500 Front Line Aircraft
Equipment:
Fighters
P-45
Crew: 1
Powerplant: 14 cylinder, radical
Top Speed: 318 mph
Range: 650 miles
Service Ceiling: 31,500 ft
Armament: 2 x M3 Machine Guns, and up to 250 lbs ordnance
Entered Service: 1936
P-42
Crew: 1
Powerplant: V-12, liquid cooled
Top Speed: 314 mph
Range: 750 miles
Service Ceiling: 31,000 ft
Armament: 4 x M3 Machine Guns, and up to 250 lbs ordnance
Entered Service: 1935
Tactical Bombers
B-23
Crew: 6 (Pilot, Co-Pilot, Bombardier/Navigator, Flight Engineer, Radio Operator, Gunner)
Powerplant: 2 x 9 cylinder, radical
Top Speed: 218 mph
Range: 950 miles
Service Ceiling: 24,500 ft
Armament: 3 x M1919 Machine Guns and up to 4,500 lbs of ordnance
Entered Service: 1934
B-15
Crew: 3 (Pilot, Bombardier/Navigator, Radio Operator/Gunner)
Powerplant: 2 x 9 cylinder, radical
Top Speed: 209 mph
Range: 1,200 miles
Service Ceiling: 24,500 feet
Armament: 2 x M1919 Machine Guns and up to 2,500 lbs of ordnance
Entered Service: 1932
Heavy Bombers
B-29
Crew: 8 (Pilot, Co-Pilot, Navigator, Bombardier, Flight Engineer, Radio Operator, 2 x Gunners)
Powerplant: 4 x 9 cylinder, radical
Top Speed: 292 mph
Range: 3,100 miles
Service Ceiling: 25,000 feet
Armament: 5 x M1919 Machine Guns, and up to 5,000 lbs of ordnance
Entered Service: 1937
Navy
Chief of Naval Operations: Admiral Thomas “Tom” Perez [31]
Total Strength:
When the Naval Treaty System Broke in 1934
26 BBs (Including two Treaty BBs), 886,886 Tonnage
6 BCs, 208,600 Tonnage
1 ACR, 14,500 Tonnage
Total Cap Ship Tonnage in 1934 of 1,109,986 against a limit of 1,110,000
12 Aircraft Carriers in service, 365,000 tonnage
3 Aircraft Carriers being built, 91,500 tonnage
Total CV Tonnage in 1934 456,500 against a limit of 615,000
Current
Active Service
24 Battleships
6 Battlecruisers
15 Aircraft Carriers
26 Heavy Cruisers
51 Light Cruisers
168 Destroyers
98 Submarines (Various)
Pre-commission Work Ups/Fitting Out/On Slip Way/Laid Down/Ordered
6 Battleships
3 Large Cruisers
2 Aircraft Carriers
5 Heavy Cruisers
8 Light Cruisers
32 Destroyers
28 Submarines
Reserves
4 Battleships
1 Light Aircraft Carrier
1 Armored Cruiser
19 Light Cruisers
102 Destroyers
48 Submarines
Ship Overview (Cap ships and Carriers)
Battleships
Mississippi Class, Reserve
26,000 tons displacement, coal fired boilers turbine driven, 21 knots, 12 x 12/50s in twin turrets, 16 x 5/51s in casemates, 8 x 3/50s single mounts,
USS Mississippi, BB-40
USS Cuba, BB-42
Texas Class, reserve
27,000 tons displacement, coal fired with oil spray boilers, turbine driven, 21 knots, 10 x 14/45s in twin turrets, 16 x 5/51s in casemates, 8 x 3/50s single mounts
USS Texas, BB-43
USS Wyoming, BB-45
Oklahoma Class
27,500 tons displacement, oil fired boilers, turbine driven, 21 knots, 10 x 14/45s in two triple turrets, in two twin (Superfiring), 12 x 5/51s in casemates, 8 x 5/25s in single mounts, 8 x 1.1 AA Guns (4x2)
USS Oklahoma, BB-46
USS Georgia, BB-47
USS Nevada, BB-48
New York Class
29,158 tons displacement, oil fired boilers, turbine driven, 23 knots, 12 x 14/45s in triple turrets (Superfiring), 12 x 5/51s in casemates, 8 x 5/25s in single mounts, 2 x 3/50s in single mounts, 8 x 1.1 AA Guns (4x2)
USS New York, BB-49
USS Pennsylvania, BB-50
Arizona Class, slated to be modernized in 1938
32,000 tons displacement, oil fired boilers, turbine driven, 23 knots, 12 x 14/50s in triple turrets (Superfiring), 14 x 5/51s in casemates, 10 x 5/25s in single mounts, 8 x 1.1 AA Guns (4x2)
USS Arizona, BB-51
USS Idaho, BB-52
USS Virginia, BB-53
USS Maine, BB-54
California Class, slated to be modernized in 1938
33,190 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 23 knots, 12 x 14/50s in triple turrets (Superfiring), 14 x 5/51s in Casemates, 10 x 5/25s in single mounts, 8 x 1.1 AA Guns (4x2)
USS California, BB-55
USS Tennessee, BB-56
USS Connecticut, BB-57
Maryland Class
32,600 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 23 knots, 8 x 16/45s in twin turrets (Superfiring), 8 x 5/51s in single turrets, 4 x 5/25s in single mounts, 2 x 3/50s in single mounts, 8 x 1.1 AA Guns
USS Maryland, BB-58
USS Washington, BB-59
USS Colorado, BB-60
USS New Mexico, BB-61
West Virginia Class
43,200 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 25 knots, 12 x 16/50s in triple turrets (Superfiring), 6 x 6/52s in single turrets, 4 x 5/25s in single mounts, 4 x 3/50s in single mounts,
USS West Virginia, BB-62
USS Iowa, BB-63
USS Montana, BB-64
USS Indiana, BB-66
USS North Carolina, BB-67
Illinois Class, Treaty Battleship
44,050 tons displacement (Official), 45,100 tons displacement (Actual), turbo-electric, 29 knots, 9 x 16.5/50s in triple turrets(Superfiring), 12 x 5/38s in twin turrets, 16 x 1.1 Inch AA Guns (4x4)
USS Illinois, BB-68
USS Missouri, BB-69
Louisiana Class
52,500 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 31 knots, 9 x 16.5/50s in triple turrets, 16 x 5/38s in twin turrets, 16 x 1.1 AA Guns (4x4)
Louisiana, BB-70, pre-commission work ups
New Hampshire, BB-71, fitting out
Ohio, BB-72, on slip way
Florida Class
62,500 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 30 knots, 9 x 18/50s in triple turrets (Superfiring), 18 x 5/38s in twin turrets, 16 x 1.1 AA Guns (4x4)
Florida, BB-73, laid down
Sonora, BB-74, ordered
Oregon, BB-75, ordered
Battlecruisers
Lexington Class, Modernization slated for 1938
27,800 tons displacement, oil fired boilers, turbine driven, 29 knots, 8 x 14/45s in twin turrets (Superfiring), 12 x 5/51s in Casemates, 6 x 5/25s in Single Mounts
USS Lexington, BC-5
USS Ranger, BC-6
Saratoga Class
32,000 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 30 knots, 8 x 14/50s in twin turrets, (Superfiring), 12 x 5/51s in Casemates, 8 x 5/25s In Single Mounts, 2 x 3/50s in Single Mounts
USS Saratoga, BC-7
USS Constellation, BC-8
Essex Class
44,500 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 32 knots, 8 x 16/45s in twin turrets (Superfiring), 14 x 6/53s in Casemates, 10 x 5/25s in Single Mounts
USS Essex, BC-9
USS Constitution, BC-12
Bonhomme Richard Class
39,000 tons, turbo-electric, 33 knots, 8 x 12/50s (Superfiring, reused of turrets and guns but modernized), 12 x 5/38s in twin turrets, 16 x 1.1 AA Guns (4x4)
Bonhomme Richard, CC-15, fitting out
Yorktown, CC-16, on slip ways
Wasp, CC-17, laid down
Armored Cruisers
Detroit Class, reserve
14,500 tons displacement, coal-fired boilers, vertical triple expansion engines, 24 knots, 4 x 10/40s in twin turrets, 16 x 6/50s in casemates, 18 x 3/50s in Single Mounts
USS Denver, ACR-48
Aircraft Carriers
Enterprise Class
43,500 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 33 knots, 4 x 8/55s in twin turrets, 16 x 5/25s in single mounts, 94 aircraft
USS Enterprise, CV-3
USS Hornet, CV-4
Intrepid Class Aircraft Carrier
27,000 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 33 knots, 4 x 8.3/55 in twin turrets, 12 x 5/25s in single mount, 85 aircraft
USS Intrepid, CV-5
USS Ticonderoga, CV-6
USS Franklin, CV-7
USS Cabot, CV-8
USS Bunker Hill, CV-10
USS Hancock, CV-11
Cowpens Class Light Aircraft Carrier, Reserve
12,900 Tons displacement, oil fired boilers, turbine driven, 4 x 5/25s in single mounts, 36 aircraft
USS Cowpens, CVL-9
Oriskany Class Aircraft Carrier
29,000 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 34 knots, 4 x 5/38s in twin turrets, 18 x 5/25s in single mounts, 95 aircraft
USS Oriskany, CV-12
USS Bennington, CV-13
USS Boxer, CV-14
USS Kearsarge, CV-15
Reprisal Class Aircraft Carrier
30,500 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 33 knots, 12 x 5/38s, four twin turrets, four single turrets, 12 x 3/50s Single Mounts, 90 Aircraft
USS Reprisal, CV-16
USS Valley Forge, CV-17
USS Lake Champlain, CV-18
Independence Class Aircraft Carrier
33,500 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 34 knots, 16 x 5/38s in twin turrets, 12 x 3/50s in Single Mount, 90 Aircraft
Independence, CV-20, Fitting Out
Langley, CV-21, Slip Way
Marine Corp
Commandant of the Corp: Lt General Hubert Terranova [32]
Unit Strength:
2 Marine Division, 3 Marine Brigades
Equipment:
M7
Weight: 21.9 t
Crew: 9 (Commander, Driver, Gunner, Asst. Gunner, 4 x Loader, Radio Operator) (With Support Vehicle)
Armor: up to ¾ inch
Armament: 4/50 Naval Gun
Engine: 7 cylinder, radical
Speed: 17 mph
Range: 150 Miles
M9
Weight: 23.1 t
Crew: 9 (Commander, Driver, Gunner, Asst. Gunner, 4 x Loader, Radio Operator) (With Support Vehicle)
Armor: up to ¾ inch
Armament: 5/51 Naval Gun
Engine: 7 cylinder, radical
Speed: 15 mph
Range: 150 miles
[1] Sam Rayburn
[2] Note everyone name is born after the POD and the names in these notes are to give you a good analog to who said person would be. There will be differences between the OTL analog and who these people are ITL.
[3] Henry Stimson
[4] Frank Knox
[5] Olsen and others are viewing war as a growing of question of when and not if. So he is trying to build cross party support.
[6] Hap Arnold
[7] William Leahy
[8] George Marshall
[9] Colt 1911, later upgrade to A1 standards
[10] An outgrowth of the T3E2 .276 model, with gas port instead of gas trap systems.
[11] M1903 Springfield
[12] Thompson Submachine Gun
[13] M1917 Browning Machine Gun
[14] M1919 Browning Machine Gun
[15] M2 Browning
[16] M2 Mine
[17] Based off the Tellermine 35
[18] M2 Mortar, but in standard measurements.
[19] M1 Mortar
[20] 3 inch Field Gun M1902
[21] 76 mm Divisional Gun M1942 (ZiS-3)
[22] 4.7 inch Gun M1906
[23] 6-inch Howitzer M1908
[24] M116 Howitzer
[25] M101 Howitzer, but sight changes.
[26] M114 Howitzer, but with slight changes
[27] Ordnance QF 2 Pounder
[28] 37mm Gun M1
[29] M1 Gun 90mm
[30] Carl Spaatz
[31] Ernest King
[32] Thomas Holcomb
Government Type: Constitutional Republic
Head of State: President Carl Olsen[1][2], Democratic
Head of Government: President Carl Olsen, Democratic
Power Status: Great Power
Population: ~145,426,129 (1937 Projected)
Minister of War: Karl Kerr[3], Democratic
Minister of Navy: Edward “Ed” Knox[4], Republican[5]
Minister of Air: Shawn Brown[6], Republican
Chief of the General Staff: Fleet Admiral Samuel “Sam” Soto[7]
Conscription:
The United States restarted conscription in 1934 following it being ended in 1929 as a cost cutting measure. Service is either two years in either the Army or Marines or three years in the Navy or Air Force. Air Crew is volunteer only and that is agreeing to a four year hitch, five for pilots. The US performs a class base draft at the moment. Its for males who turn 21 in that given year. If in college they are allowed to finished but have to join the ROTC detachment at their school to start training to be an officer. This is followed by four years of service no matter the branch, seven if they become a pilot once they go active.
Following this active phase, comes the reserve phase of the conscription program as outline in the Conscription Act of 1934. This is four years in the Federal Reserve or National/Territorial Guard, it is their choice on which they join. Following the active phase there is the inactive reserve phase where they only have to keep their contact information current till the age of 40 for possible recall in the event of national emergency if declared by the president of the United States.
Army
Army Chief of Staff: General John Garrett[8]
Unit Strength:
12 Infantry Divisions, 3 Motorized Infantry Divisions, 3 Armored Divisions, 1 Airborne Brigade,
Equipment:
Small Arms
Using the lessons from the Great War and Second Mexico has been reflected in small arms design within the US Army. Priorities had been shifted to firepower and mobility. Its one of the many reasons that the Model 1910[9] is still the only service weapon that was in service prior to Second Mexico that is still in current front line service within the army. Using feed back from its use in Second Mexico and the Great War it was updated in 1920 to the 1910A1 variant. This push for mobility and firepower was also reflected in the new service rifle that entered service in 1931. This was after the better part of 10 years of R&D, the M1 Springfield[10]. It marked the switch from the 30-06 as the standard rifle round to the .276. With a 10 round en-bloc design it was a mark improvement over the M1899 Springfield[11]. Even through the M1899 Springfield is still in service in some units as enough M1s haven’t been made to equipped every soldier with one yet. It also is being retained by snipers as it is far more accurate and longer effective range over the M1. The M1899 is also the standard weapon within Federal Reserve and National/Territorial Guard units.
Following Second Mexico the US Army started a crash program to improve firepower at the squad and platoon level. Most of these weapons were either short lived programs or entered service late in the Great War. The more famous of the two that is still in service is the M1917 Submachine Gun[12]. The M1917 Submachine Gun is still in service however, the army is looking for a cheaper replacement as the M1917 is a costly weapon to make. The firepower offered by it through is such that is was accepted into service even through it was costly. The second is the Browning Automatic Rifle or the BAR. Officially it’s the M1918 Automatic Rifle but its better known as the BAR. It was hoped that the BAR could give the standard rifleman an automatic weapon to replace the M1899. However its weight at almost 24.5 pounds made this idea ill-founded. Following the war it left the BAR in an abnormal position as the idea behind had been proven not to work. Testing during the 1920s through save the BAR from being pushed out of the arsenal. It was redesigned as a Light Machine Gun and when fitted with a bipod it proved to perform well in this role. When the army decided to field the M1 in its .276 ammo it was decided to refit the BAR in .276 as well. This version the M1918A4 was only fielded in 1936, but a vast improvement over the older models. Its far lighter of a weapon and the magazine has moved from being able only holding 20 to 30 rounds. Currently both 30-06 and .276 are in service, but the goal is to move to a total force of .276 BARs.
With the mess of machine guns that were present in Second Mexico and the Great War the Army has made a major effort to streamline its machine gun inventory. Since then the army had settled on three machine guns. The first is the M1916 Machine Gun[13]. Since the Great War the M1916 is still in use as the primary water cooled machine gun but its moved more to fixed defenses in the Pacific and vehicle mounts than the tripod mounts that were common during the Great War. The much more common M1919 Machine Gun[14] is the standard general use machine gun within the army. Both the M1916 and M1919 are going to be retained in 30-06 ammo as the greater range offered to them by that round over the .276. The third is more along the lines of the M1916 Machine Gun but can still be found on tripod mounts in some units, however its much more common use in either fixed defenses in the Pacific or vehicle mounts, this is the M3 Machine Gun[15].The M3 fires the much larger .50 caliber round and it was so powerful that it was first listed as an anti-Goliath machine gun. That said the M3 is an anti-material machine gun and that is deadly when used against troops.
Infantry Support Weapons
When the US entered the Great War they were fielding their first efforts at a hand grenade that could be used by just about anyone without specialist training. This effort was a total failure as they either didn’t work or they weren’t going off when they landed only to be thrown back by the other side to go off in American lines. Rarely did these work as designed and quickly withdrawn from service. Not wanting to wait the US simply reserved engineered the British Mills Bomb which they had captured in their efforts in Canada. These Mk 1 Grenades only enter service late in the war and failed to see service in the war. The US has upgraded the Mk 1 Grenade to Mk 2 standards with new explosive filler and cut the fuse from 7 seconds to 4. Both are still in use through.
Land mines have also been given a fair amount of importance in defending the Pacific. This led to the fielding of the M1 Bounding Mine[16] in 1933. The M1 Bounding Mine is based on French efforts the subject. The M1 is found in heavy use in the Pacific. The M1 is used with the M2 Anti-Goliath Mine[17] at a rate of 5 M1s to 1 M2 to counter Japanese amphibious goliaths. Both the M1 and M2 mines are also being stockpile for use when needed in the event of another war.
Again like hand grenades the United States simply used reserved engineered the British mortar from captured copies in Canada. Again it reached units too late see use in the Great War. This mortar however has largely been moved to into Federal Reserve or National/Territorial Guard Units. It has been replaced by a French license with a series of different sizes. This starts with the 2.4 Inch M1 Mortar[18] which is the lightest mortar currently fielded by the army only slightly redesign of the French design. This was done to fit American measurements as the infantry, cavalry, and artillery boards were dead set against a change from standard to metric. The M1 is counter parted with the 3.2 Inch M2 Mortar[19]. Both the M1 and M2 Mortars are in common use. The US is also testing a 4.2 Inch Mortar.
Artillery
Like many great powers the United States is still using large numbers of artillery designs dating from the Great War or prior to it, but has started to fielded more modern designs as time is catching up to the Great War artillery. Artillery from the Great War has been updated to help keep up with the changing world of artillery. The 3 inch M1901 Field Gun[20] is one of the more common pieces of artillery still in service from the Great War. Yet the M1901 is slowly being phased out of service as the newer M4 3 inch Field Gun[21] is entering service following it being accepted into service in 1935. The larger counter part to the M1901 and M4 is the 4.7 inch M1905 Field Gun[22]. Even through like the M1901, the M1905 has been modernized the US is currently looking for a replacement for it and the replacement weapon is in testing at the moment. Besides the 4.7 inch field gun that is in testing the US Army is also testing a 6 and 8 inch gun to enter service within the five to seven years.
In terms of howitzers the US entered the great war totally unready for. Besides the M1907 6 inch Howitzer[23] the US didn’t have any howitzers when they entered the Great War. They impressed captured howitzers as they captured them. In the wake of the Great War the US started efforts to fit this problem as during the war they had been focusing more building enough artillery pieces and shells for what they had. The only howitzer however they fielded before the depression of 28 was the M1 3 inch Pack Howitzer[24] which was fielded only months prior the start depression. In 1935 the US fielded the M3 4.2 Inch Howitzer[25]. Currently the T5 6 Inch Howitzer[26] is slated to enter service in 1938. Work is also under way on an 8 inch howitzer.
Anti-Goliath Artillery is currently the smallest section within the US Artillery department. This is the M8 1.5 Inch Anti-Goliath Gun[27]. The M8 is the largest anti-goliath guns by caliber. Currently the M8 is believed to be enough to deal with any goliath fielded by any power on the face of the earth. On the front of Anti-Aircraft Artillery. Currently the army uses three weapons for anti-air missions. The first is the M3 Machine Gun. In the middle size is the M7 Cannon[28] with the M9 3.5 Inch Gun[29].
Light Goliaths
M14
Entered Service: 1936
Weight: 11 tons
Crew: 4 (Commander, Driver, Gunner, Co-Gunner)
Armor: up to ½ inch
Main Armament: M3 Machine Gun
Secondary Armament: M1916 Machine Gun
Engine: 7 Cylinder, radical
Speed: 35 mph
Range: 150 miles
M11
Entered Service: 1934
Weight: 11.6 Tons
Crew: 4 (Commander, Driver, Gunner, Loader)
Armor: up to 1 Inch
Main Armament: M8 1.5 Inch Anti-Goliath Gun (A1 Models), 2 x M3 Machine Guns in duel turrets (A2 Model)
Secondary Armament: 5 x M1916 Machine Guns
Engine: 7 cylinder radical
Speed: 38 mph
Range: 200 miles
Air Force
Air Force Chief of Staff: General Mark Torstein [30]
Aircraft Strength:
~2,500 Front Line Aircraft
Equipment:
Fighters
P-45
Crew: 1
Powerplant: 14 cylinder, radical
Top Speed: 318 mph
Range: 650 miles
Service Ceiling: 31,500 ft
Armament: 2 x M3 Machine Guns, and up to 250 lbs ordnance
Entered Service: 1936
P-42
Crew: 1
Powerplant: V-12, liquid cooled
Top Speed: 314 mph
Range: 750 miles
Service Ceiling: 31,000 ft
Armament: 4 x M3 Machine Guns, and up to 250 lbs ordnance
Entered Service: 1935
Tactical Bombers
B-23
Crew: 6 (Pilot, Co-Pilot, Bombardier/Navigator, Flight Engineer, Radio Operator, Gunner)
Powerplant: 2 x 9 cylinder, radical
Top Speed: 218 mph
Range: 950 miles
Service Ceiling: 24,500 ft
Armament: 3 x M1919 Machine Guns and up to 4,500 lbs of ordnance
Entered Service: 1934
B-15
Crew: 3 (Pilot, Bombardier/Navigator, Radio Operator/Gunner)
Powerplant: 2 x 9 cylinder, radical
Top Speed: 209 mph
Range: 1,200 miles
Service Ceiling: 24,500 feet
Armament: 2 x M1919 Machine Guns and up to 2,500 lbs of ordnance
Entered Service: 1932
Heavy Bombers
B-29
Crew: 8 (Pilot, Co-Pilot, Navigator, Bombardier, Flight Engineer, Radio Operator, 2 x Gunners)
Powerplant: 4 x 9 cylinder, radical
Top Speed: 292 mph
Range: 3,100 miles
Service Ceiling: 25,000 feet
Armament: 5 x M1919 Machine Guns, and up to 5,000 lbs of ordnance
Entered Service: 1937
Navy
Chief of Naval Operations: Admiral Thomas “Tom” Perez [31]
Total Strength:
When the Naval Treaty System Broke in 1934
26 BBs (Including two Treaty BBs), 886,886 Tonnage
6 BCs, 208,600 Tonnage
1 ACR, 14,500 Tonnage
Total Cap Ship Tonnage in 1934 of 1,109,986 against a limit of 1,110,000
12 Aircraft Carriers in service, 365,000 tonnage
3 Aircraft Carriers being built, 91,500 tonnage
Total CV Tonnage in 1934 456,500 against a limit of 615,000
Current
Active Service
24 Battleships
6 Battlecruisers
15 Aircraft Carriers
26 Heavy Cruisers
51 Light Cruisers
168 Destroyers
98 Submarines (Various)
Pre-commission Work Ups/Fitting Out/On Slip Way/Laid Down/Ordered
6 Battleships
3 Large Cruisers
2 Aircraft Carriers
5 Heavy Cruisers
8 Light Cruisers
32 Destroyers
28 Submarines
Reserves
4 Battleships
1 Light Aircraft Carrier
1 Armored Cruiser
19 Light Cruisers
102 Destroyers
48 Submarines
Ship Overview (Cap ships and Carriers)
Battleships
Mississippi Class, Reserve
26,000 tons displacement, coal fired boilers turbine driven, 21 knots, 12 x 12/50s in twin turrets, 16 x 5/51s in casemates, 8 x 3/50s single mounts,
USS Mississippi, BB-40
USS Cuba, BB-42
Texas Class, reserve
27,000 tons displacement, coal fired with oil spray boilers, turbine driven, 21 knots, 10 x 14/45s in twin turrets, 16 x 5/51s in casemates, 8 x 3/50s single mounts
USS Texas, BB-43
USS Wyoming, BB-45
Oklahoma Class
27,500 tons displacement, oil fired boilers, turbine driven, 21 knots, 10 x 14/45s in two triple turrets, in two twin (Superfiring), 12 x 5/51s in casemates, 8 x 5/25s in single mounts, 8 x 1.1 AA Guns (4x2)
USS Oklahoma, BB-46
USS Georgia, BB-47
USS Nevada, BB-48
New York Class
29,158 tons displacement, oil fired boilers, turbine driven, 23 knots, 12 x 14/45s in triple turrets (Superfiring), 12 x 5/51s in casemates, 8 x 5/25s in single mounts, 2 x 3/50s in single mounts, 8 x 1.1 AA Guns (4x2)
USS New York, BB-49
USS Pennsylvania, BB-50
Arizona Class, slated to be modernized in 1938
32,000 tons displacement, oil fired boilers, turbine driven, 23 knots, 12 x 14/50s in triple turrets (Superfiring), 14 x 5/51s in casemates, 10 x 5/25s in single mounts, 8 x 1.1 AA Guns (4x2)
USS Arizona, BB-51
USS Idaho, BB-52
USS Virginia, BB-53
USS Maine, BB-54
California Class, slated to be modernized in 1938
33,190 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 23 knots, 12 x 14/50s in triple turrets (Superfiring), 14 x 5/51s in Casemates, 10 x 5/25s in single mounts, 8 x 1.1 AA Guns (4x2)
USS California, BB-55
USS Tennessee, BB-56
USS Connecticut, BB-57
Maryland Class
32,600 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 23 knots, 8 x 16/45s in twin turrets (Superfiring), 8 x 5/51s in single turrets, 4 x 5/25s in single mounts, 2 x 3/50s in single mounts, 8 x 1.1 AA Guns
USS Maryland, BB-58
USS Washington, BB-59
USS Colorado, BB-60
USS New Mexico, BB-61
West Virginia Class
43,200 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 25 knots, 12 x 16/50s in triple turrets (Superfiring), 6 x 6/52s in single turrets, 4 x 5/25s in single mounts, 4 x 3/50s in single mounts,
USS West Virginia, BB-62
USS Iowa, BB-63
USS Montana, BB-64
USS Indiana, BB-66
USS North Carolina, BB-67
Illinois Class, Treaty Battleship
44,050 tons displacement (Official), 45,100 tons displacement (Actual), turbo-electric, 29 knots, 9 x 16.5/50s in triple turrets(Superfiring), 12 x 5/38s in twin turrets, 16 x 1.1 Inch AA Guns (4x4)
USS Illinois, BB-68
USS Missouri, BB-69
Louisiana Class
52,500 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 31 knots, 9 x 16.5/50s in triple turrets, 16 x 5/38s in twin turrets, 16 x 1.1 AA Guns (4x4)
Louisiana, BB-70, pre-commission work ups
New Hampshire, BB-71, fitting out
Ohio, BB-72, on slip way
Florida Class
62,500 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 30 knots, 9 x 18/50s in triple turrets (Superfiring), 18 x 5/38s in twin turrets, 16 x 1.1 AA Guns (4x4)
Florida, BB-73, laid down
Sonora, BB-74, ordered
Oregon, BB-75, ordered
Battlecruisers
Lexington Class, Modernization slated for 1938
27,800 tons displacement, oil fired boilers, turbine driven, 29 knots, 8 x 14/45s in twin turrets (Superfiring), 12 x 5/51s in Casemates, 6 x 5/25s in Single Mounts
USS Lexington, BC-5
USS Ranger, BC-6
Saratoga Class
32,000 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 30 knots, 8 x 14/50s in twin turrets, (Superfiring), 12 x 5/51s in Casemates, 8 x 5/25s In Single Mounts, 2 x 3/50s in Single Mounts
USS Saratoga, BC-7
USS Constellation, BC-8
Essex Class
44,500 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 32 knots, 8 x 16/45s in twin turrets (Superfiring), 14 x 6/53s in Casemates, 10 x 5/25s in Single Mounts
USS Essex, BC-9
USS Constitution, BC-12
Bonhomme Richard Class
39,000 tons, turbo-electric, 33 knots, 8 x 12/50s (Superfiring, reused of turrets and guns but modernized), 12 x 5/38s in twin turrets, 16 x 1.1 AA Guns (4x4)
Bonhomme Richard, CC-15, fitting out
Yorktown, CC-16, on slip ways
Wasp, CC-17, laid down
Armored Cruisers
Detroit Class, reserve
14,500 tons displacement, coal-fired boilers, vertical triple expansion engines, 24 knots, 4 x 10/40s in twin turrets, 16 x 6/50s in casemates, 18 x 3/50s in Single Mounts
USS Denver, ACR-48
Aircraft Carriers
Enterprise Class
43,500 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 33 knots, 4 x 8/55s in twin turrets, 16 x 5/25s in single mounts, 94 aircraft
USS Enterprise, CV-3
USS Hornet, CV-4
Intrepid Class Aircraft Carrier
27,000 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 33 knots, 4 x 8.3/55 in twin turrets, 12 x 5/25s in single mount, 85 aircraft
USS Intrepid, CV-5
USS Ticonderoga, CV-6
USS Franklin, CV-7
USS Cabot, CV-8
USS Bunker Hill, CV-10
USS Hancock, CV-11
Cowpens Class Light Aircraft Carrier, Reserve
12,900 Tons displacement, oil fired boilers, turbine driven, 4 x 5/25s in single mounts, 36 aircraft
USS Cowpens, CVL-9
Oriskany Class Aircraft Carrier
29,000 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 34 knots, 4 x 5/38s in twin turrets, 18 x 5/25s in single mounts, 95 aircraft
USS Oriskany, CV-12
USS Bennington, CV-13
USS Boxer, CV-14
USS Kearsarge, CV-15
Reprisal Class Aircraft Carrier
30,500 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 33 knots, 12 x 5/38s, four twin turrets, four single turrets, 12 x 3/50s Single Mounts, 90 Aircraft
USS Reprisal, CV-16
USS Valley Forge, CV-17
USS Lake Champlain, CV-18
Independence Class Aircraft Carrier
33,500 tons displacement, turbo-electric, 34 knots, 16 x 5/38s in twin turrets, 12 x 3/50s in Single Mount, 90 Aircraft
Independence, CV-20, Fitting Out
Langley, CV-21, Slip Way
Marine Corp
Commandant of the Corp: Lt General Hubert Terranova [32]
Unit Strength:
2 Marine Division, 3 Marine Brigades
Equipment:
M7
Weight: 21.9 t
Crew: 9 (Commander, Driver, Gunner, Asst. Gunner, 4 x Loader, Radio Operator) (With Support Vehicle)
Armor: up to ¾ inch
Armament: 4/50 Naval Gun
Engine: 7 cylinder, radical
Speed: 17 mph
Range: 150 Miles
M9
Weight: 23.1 t
Crew: 9 (Commander, Driver, Gunner, Asst. Gunner, 4 x Loader, Radio Operator) (With Support Vehicle)
Armor: up to ¾ inch
Armament: 5/51 Naval Gun
Engine: 7 cylinder, radical
Speed: 15 mph
Range: 150 miles
[1] Sam Rayburn
[2] Note everyone name is born after the POD and the names in these notes are to give you a good analog to who said person would be. There will be differences between the OTL analog and who these people are ITL.
[3] Henry Stimson
[4] Frank Knox
[5] Olsen and others are viewing war as a growing of question of when and not if. So he is trying to build cross party support.
[6] Hap Arnold
[7] William Leahy
[8] George Marshall
[9] Colt 1911, later upgrade to A1 standards
[10] An outgrowth of the T3E2 .276 model, with gas port instead of gas trap systems.
[11] M1903 Springfield
[12] Thompson Submachine Gun
[13] M1917 Browning Machine Gun
[14] M1919 Browning Machine Gun
[15] M2 Browning
[16] M2 Mine
[17] Based off the Tellermine 35
[18] M2 Mortar, but in standard measurements.
[19] M1 Mortar
[20] 3 inch Field Gun M1902
[21] 76 mm Divisional Gun M1942 (ZiS-3)
[22] 4.7 inch Gun M1906
[23] 6-inch Howitzer M1908
[24] M116 Howitzer
[25] M101 Howitzer, but sight changes.
[26] M114 Howitzer, but with slight changes
[27] Ordnance QF 2 Pounder
[28] 37mm Gun M1
[29] M1 Gun 90mm
[30] Carl Spaatz
[31] Ernest King
[32] Thomas Holcomb
Last edited:
RamscoopRaider
Donor
Okay you have too many main guns for that tonnage on your Maryland BB, try 4 twins instead of 4 triples for ~33,000t
Nice work, a few nitpicks but nothing worth talking about. The coal fired ships are really of no practical use, training ships only or for coastal defense in a pinch. Their armament would be better off being recycled in to coastal defense installations on some of those Pacific Islands the USA has. Oil fired ships with casemate guns are likewise obsolete, although perhaps they can be modernized with the casemate guns removed and casemates converted to other space, secondary armament done properly if possible.
I'm curious about why the USA went with the treaty maximum of 16.5" guns on the Illinois and Louisiana classes. Is the hitting power worth the logistics of an extra caliber, and the expense of designing a new gun? If they are going to go with a 16.5", and are also thinking of possibly upgrading the armament, perhaps make the guns 16"/56's--the same length as an 18"/50. The idea of a very long gun like this was played with, but turned out to be less that successful. If designed in, triple 16"/50's could be designed for replacement with twin 18"/50's, or a much bigger 16"/65 with thicker lining could have been designed for a gun for gun replacement with 18"/50's, depending on the desired balance of speed, firepower, armor, and fuel.
The US didn't think the treaty system was going to die in 1934. The Illinois Class was laid down in 1926 and 1927 respectfully. In their replacements the British, Germans, and Japanese were all fielding 16.5 inch guns. It was viewed as putting the US at a disadvantage not to have 16.5 inch guns as well. They were kept for the Louisiana Class as they were ready to go as the 18/50s used by the Florida Class still needed testing. From what I read about the 16/56s from OTL caused me not to go with something like that.
The Arizona and California classes are going in for a fairly major overhaul in 38. Something, something, is happening with them, but that would be telling.
There is a reason the Texas and Mississippi classes are in reserve. They are outdated and the navy knows it. But they aren't about to scrap more cap ships at the moment.
As to the defenses in the Pacific, I have a few tricks up my sleeve. But let me say a lot of recycled armaments from scrapped BBs, BCs, and ACRs found their way to the Pacific.