A New Balance
- Thread starter Jim Smitty
- Start date
Admiral Halsey
Banned
Need to get my ruler out but shouldnt the US fighters have the range to escort the bombers all the way if they can be based out of iceland?
I don't think the US has developed an equivalent of the Mustang or Lightning yet, they're still using an alt version of the P40 Warhawk. Even with drop tanks, I don't think it can make it to Britain from Iceland and back.
Are the Germans mounting an aerial campaign against Great Britain in concert with the Americans?
Ok to clear up a few points.
The US holds Iceland at the current time ITL.
The British as of the latest update had not deployed Jet or Rocket aircraft in Scotland.
The USAAF main fighters are equals to the P-40 and P-38. The ITL 38s can reach Scotland but can't go over Scotland for the most part as they are bingo on fuel at that point. As unlike OTL BOB or 8th Air Force over Germany, the British can engage at distance and are.
The Germans aren't doing as much in the air against the British as they could, well against the British Isles anyways.
The US holds Iceland at the current time ITL.
The British as of the latest update had not deployed Jet or Rocket aircraft in Scotland.
The USAAF main fighters are equals to the P-40 and P-38. The ITL 38s can reach Scotland but can't go over Scotland for the most part as they are bingo on fuel at that point. As unlike OTL BOB or 8th Air Force over Germany, the British can engage at distance and are.
The Germans aren't doing as much in the air against the British as they could, well against the British Isles anyways.
Combat Jets
French Air Force Base, Near Arras
45 Escadron Tactique de Bombardement Ready Room
October 12 1939
The way the French were waging its aerial campaign against the British was radically different than the way the Americans had been and the way the Germans do when they bother to go for the British instead of the Soviets. To put it simply, the French couldn’t afford to go down that road. They had neither the money, resources, nor men to do it like that. One of the harsh lessons learned from the last war by the French that wherever possible they should use a Fabian strategy instead of brute force. Brute force had almost destroyed the French nation last time they fought a war against other nations and they weren’t about to repeat those mistakes again.
So far most of the actions of the Force Aérienne Impériale had not been done in wing formations like the Americans and Germans did it. Instead the bulk of their actions to date have been done at the squadron level. The raid against Menorca which killed the bulk of the civilian population and military garrison of the island was an out layer. Instead they were using small scale attacks against the British, Spanish, and Swiss in what the Germans and Americans would be thinking of dime packages. This was because generally there were ten or so bombers with maybe 12 to 14 fighters as escort. It was one of the keys to the French aerial doctrine. Bombers never when beyond the range of fighter escorts which bucked the whole idea that others had the bomber would always get through. This was because again they lacked the resources that others had.
Currently the main goal of the FAI over southern England was to destroy British air defenses. They have been pounding British radar stations, fighter bases, and key logistical targets. They would also attack British bombing bases as they were performing counter bombing operations to stop the British from bombing them. Currently it wasn’t clear or not what kind of effect they were having on the British, however losses have been fairly low and moral was high in the FAI.
Today’s mission was against a fighter air field near Ashford. From recon overflights they knew this air field was home to one of the newest fighters in the British arsenal, the Hurricane[1].The Hurricane had been a nasty shock to the FAI as they didn’t have anything that could match the Hurricane in the air at the moment. So they simply have been trying to destroy them on the ground. To do this the French had been using low level intruder tactics to do this. Generally they have been flying in at 1,000 meters or less and putting their bombs on target. The 45 Escadron Tactique de Bombardement in their BT-13s[2] have been flying in their fast and getting out fast. That came at a cost of fewer bombs they could carry than if they had been flying higher and slower. Instead of their normal 1,500 kilogram bomb load they could only bring in 500 kilograms for their bomb load.
With the briefing finished the crews headed up to their aircrafts. Of the 13 aircraft currently assigned to the squadron, 11 were taking part in today’s mission. One of the two not taking part in the raid was being repaired from damaged from the last raid and the other had a pilot that was on medical hold. They were being escorted by 13 C-33 fighters[3]. There were rumors that there was something in the pipeline that would be the equal of the blasted Hurricanes being fielded in the near future.
Once in the air the bombers met up with fighter escorts before they made it to Calais. But once they reach Calais they put their aircraft down to 750 meters and opened up the throttles. The C-33s were equipped with drop tanks, but that added drag on them. However they were both up around 450 km/h by the time they crossed over England. Once they were over England they started a series of radical turns to throw the British off from where they were going to be going so they would vector fighters to the wrong locations.
The British however had a surprise for them. Just before they made their final turn to attack the base at Ashford one of the British secret weapons made it first combat debut. The Hurricane had been a nasty shock to the French, but the new Hunter[4] was in a different league. The jet aircraft hadn’t even been put into squadron service yet. Instead the British were using them in penny packages as they came off the factory line to defend their skies. For the French the Hunter was a deadly foe. The C-33s just didn’t stand a chance. The BT-13 gunners couldn’t put enough lead on their guns to hit the jet.
By the time the Hunter broke off his attack because his guns had ran dry on ammo he had claimed two C-33s, and another two BT-13s with a third damaged. It was one of the worse days in the squadron since the start of the war.
[1] Martin-Baker MB 3
[2] Lioré et Olivier LeO 45
[3] Morane-Saulnier M.S. 406
[4] Gloster Meteor
45 Escadron Tactique de Bombardement Ready Room
October 12 1939
The way the French were waging its aerial campaign against the British was radically different than the way the Americans had been and the way the Germans do when they bother to go for the British instead of the Soviets. To put it simply, the French couldn’t afford to go down that road. They had neither the money, resources, nor men to do it like that. One of the harsh lessons learned from the last war by the French that wherever possible they should use a Fabian strategy instead of brute force. Brute force had almost destroyed the French nation last time they fought a war against other nations and they weren’t about to repeat those mistakes again.
So far most of the actions of the Force Aérienne Impériale had not been done in wing formations like the Americans and Germans did it. Instead the bulk of their actions to date have been done at the squadron level. The raid against Menorca which killed the bulk of the civilian population and military garrison of the island was an out layer. Instead they were using small scale attacks against the British, Spanish, and Swiss in what the Germans and Americans would be thinking of dime packages. This was because generally there were ten or so bombers with maybe 12 to 14 fighters as escort. It was one of the keys to the French aerial doctrine. Bombers never when beyond the range of fighter escorts which bucked the whole idea that others had the bomber would always get through. This was because again they lacked the resources that others had.
Currently the main goal of the FAI over southern England was to destroy British air defenses. They have been pounding British radar stations, fighter bases, and key logistical targets. They would also attack British bombing bases as they were performing counter bombing operations to stop the British from bombing them. Currently it wasn’t clear or not what kind of effect they were having on the British, however losses have been fairly low and moral was high in the FAI.
Today’s mission was against a fighter air field near Ashford. From recon overflights they knew this air field was home to one of the newest fighters in the British arsenal, the Hurricane[1].The Hurricane had been a nasty shock to the FAI as they didn’t have anything that could match the Hurricane in the air at the moment. So they simply have been trying to destroy them on the ground. To do this the French had been using low level intruder tactics to do this. Generally they have been flying in at 1,000 meters or less and putting their bombs on target. The 45 Escadron Tactique de Bombardement in their BT-13s[2] have been flying in their fast and getting out fast. That came at a cost of fewer bombs they could carry than if they had been flying higher and slower. Instead of their normal 1,500 kilogram bomb load they could only bring in 500 kilograms for their bomb load.
With the briefing finished the crews headed up to their aircrafts. Of the 13 aircraft currently assigned to the squadron, 11 were taking part in today’s mission. One of the two not taking part in the raid was being repaired from damaged from the last raid and the other had a pilot that was on medical hold. They were being escorted by 13 C-33 fighters[3]. There were rumors that there was something in the pipeline that would be the equal of the blasted Hurricanes being fielded in the near future.
Once in the air the bombers met up with fighter escorts before they made it to Calais. But once they reach Calais they put their aircraft down to 750 meters and opened up the throttles. The C-33s were equipped with drop tanks, but that added drag on them. However they were both up around 450 km/h by the time they crossed over England. Once they were over England they started a series of radical turns to throw the British off from where they were going to be going so they would vector fighters to the wrong locations.
The British however had a surprise for them. Just before they made their final turn to attack the base at Ashford one of the British secret weapons made it first combat debut. The Hurricane had been a nasty shock to the French, but the new Hunter[4] was in a different league. The jet aircraft hadn’t even been put into squadron service yet. Instead the British were using them in penny packages as they came off the factory line to defend their skies. For the French the Hunter was a deadly foe. The C-33s just didn’t stand a chance. The BT-13 gunners couldn’t put enough lead on their guns to hit the jet.
By the time the Hunter broke off his attack because his guns had ran dry on ammo he had claimed two C-33s, and another two BT-13s with a third damaged. It was one of the worse days in the squadron since the start of the war.
[1] Martin-Baker MB 3
[2] Lioré et Olivier LeO 45
[3] Morane-Saulnier M.S. 406
[4] Gloster Meteor
The British are doing things differently than the Germans. The Germans are waiting to get their jets out into squadron service. The British not so much. British defensive for their jets are more along OTL WWII German Night Fighters for a while. They get assigned to a square and get to defend it with help from radar. Because of this the British are using their jets in penny packages instead of waiting for a squadron to be ready.
It should be noted in the British Isles at the moment, there are a total of 7 operational jets total.
What is prompting the Brits to deploy their jets in penny packets and, not in squadrons? Also is the RAF conducting a bombing campaign in Europe as well?
A mix of factors really. Slow production rates, French tactics eating up their radar and fighter force in Southern England, and a few other things.
Only Smitty knows the answer to that question but the US's first jet wont be called the P-51 since that's what they call the OTL P40 Warhawk, it might be called the Mustang though, I believe that name is still available.
Hoist the Colors
ARA Almirante Brown [1]
Argentine Sea
October 19 1939
Vicealmirante Noelia Antelmo was standing on what the was to be the pride of the Argentine Navy. Indeed that she was, the ARA Almirante Brown had no equal in any other South American Navy. However, she had barely entered service when this bloody war started. Her crew was still on the green side and needed more seasoning. Yet the idiots in Buenos Aires believed that they could just pick Chile apart without the god damn Yankees saying anything. FOOLS! Even with Antelmo being a party member, he knew the party was wrong when it had decided to fight this war, yet for the most part he had just sat at Puerto Belgrano waiting for orders since the start of the war. Without orders to sail all he could do was plan for operations.
Finally now that the war in South America already being decided had the idiots in Buenos Aires decided to use her fleet. The war was lost following the defeats at Oberá and Carirriñe Pass last month. Even more so with reports of American troops on the front lines with the bloody Chileans. The losses in men and equipment where just too much for the Argentine nation to recover from. Argentina wasn’t defeated yet, but the war was lost all the same. It was more a question of how badly would Argentine loose at this point more than anything else. Control of the news within Argentina however was so tightly controlled the true impact of the defeats at Oberá and Carirriñe Pass were only known by a select few. Antelmo being in charged of the fleet was one of the few that knew. However far more in this fleet knew the truth than should had.
He had just left Puerto Belgrano with his fleet. He was bringing his best. The Almirante Brown was his flagship. He was bring along both Libertad class Battleships[2], the San Martin,[3] both heavy and five of the seven light cruisers of the fleet along with destroyers as escorts. The sailors from the ships he left behind at Puerto Belgrano had brought some ships up to full crews and replace some green sailors. Others, well sailors were needed for this mission. Plus, the ships he had left behind were simply out of date and would slowed him down anyways.
It was time he said to himself. The fools should had removed him when they had the chance. He pulled out his pocket pistol shot the party stooge in the back of his head. Turning to his trusted aid, “Hoist the colors. All head flank.” Antelmo putting the derringer back in his pocket. He was loyal to Argentina not the party. The officers on the Almirante Brown were loyal to him, as was the captains on the other ships. They would have to kill the party stooges like he just had, but there was only one on each ship and they weren’t liked.
Instead of the Fascist Flag of Argentina Antelmo was hoisting the old Republican Flag of Argentina. Antelmo was going to save Argentina if he had anything to say about it or dying trying.
[1] 49,500 tons displacement, oil fired boilers, turbine driven, 29.5 knots, 8 x 18/45s in Twin Turrets (Superfiring), 8 x 5.25/50s in Twin Turrets, 24 x 2 pdr in Quad Mounts
[2] 38,900 tons displacement, oil fired boilers, turbine driven, 23 knots, 12 x 15/42s in Triple Turrets (Superfiring), 12 x 6/45s in casemates, 4 x 3 inch AA Guns
[3] 11,200 tons displacement, oil fired boilers, turbine driven, 30 knots, 2 x 4.5/45s in Twin Turrets, 12 x 2 pdr in Quad Mounts, 26 Aircraft
Argentine Sea
October 19 1939
Vicealmirante Noelia Antelmo was standing on what the was to be the pride of the Argentine Navy. Indeed that she was, the ARA Almirante Brown had no equal in any other South American Navy. However, she had barely entered service when this bloody war started. Her crew was still on the green side and needed more seasoning. Yet the idiots in Buenos Aires believed that they could just pick Chile apart without the god damn Yankees saying anything. FOOLS! Even with Antelmo being a party member, he knew the party was wrong when it had decided to fight this war, yet for the most part he had just sat at Puerto Belgrano waiting for orders since the start of the war. Without orders to sail all he could do was plan for operations.
Finally now that the war in South America already being decided had the idiots in Buenos Aires decided to use her fleet. The war was lost following the defeats at Oberá and Carirriñe Pass last month. Even more so with reports of American troops on the front lines with the bloody Chileans. The losses in men and equipment where just too much for the Argentine nation to recover from. Argentina wasn’t defeated yet, but the war was lost all the same. It was more a question of how badly would Argentine loose at this point more than anything else. Control of the news within Argentina however was so tightly controlled the true impact of the defeats at Oberá and Carirriñe Pass were only known by a select few. Antelmo being in charged of the fleet was one of the few that knew. However far more in this fleet knew the truth than should had.
He had just left Puerto Belgrano with his fleet. He was bringing his best. The Almirante Brown was his flagship. He was bring along both Libertad class Battleships[2], the San Martin,[3] both heavy and five of the seven light cruisers of the fleet along with destroyers as escorts. The sailors from the ships he left behind at Puerto Belgrano had brought some ships up to full crews and replace some green sailors. Others, well sailors were needed for this mission. Plus, the ships he had left behind were simply out of date and would slowed him down anyways.
It was time he said to himself. The fools should had removed him when they had the chance. He pulled out his pocket pistol shot the party stooge in the back of his head. Turning to his trusted aid, “Hoist the colors. All head flank.” Antelmo putting the derringer back in his pocket. He was loyal to Argentina not the party. The officers on the Almirante Brown were loyal to him, as was the captains on the other ships. They would have to kill the party stooges like he just had, but there was only one on each ship and they weren’t liked.
Instead of the Fascist Flag of Argentina Antelmo was hoisting the old Republican Flag of Argentina. Antelmo was going to save Argentina if he had anything to say about it or dying trying.
[1] 49,500 tons displacement, oil fired boilers, turbine driven, 29.5 knots, 8 x 18/45s in Twin Turrets (Superfiring), 8 x 5.25/50s in Twin Turrets, 24 x 2 pdr in Quad Mounts
[2] 38,900 tons displacement, oil fired boilers, turbine driven, 23 knots, 12 x 15/42s in Triple Turrets (Superfiring), 12 x 6/45s in casemates, 4 x 3 inch AA Guns
[3] 11,200 tons displacement, oil fired boilers, turbine driven, 30 knots, 2 x 4.5/45s in Twin Turrets, 12 x 2 pdr in Quad Mounts, 26 Aircraft
Cryostorm
Monthly Donor
Smart move, Brazil and Chile, maybe even Uruguay, are going to take a chunk out of Argentina and they can say good by to all claims on the Falklands, that will be going to the US. But if they can say that the Argentine Republic fought with them then they can reduce the loss.