Sir John Valentine Carden survives.

[Merrick]

For those on foot marching, any areas of sand will be a tough slog. Slows you down and is far more tiring.

Chances are, many never even bother trying, or give up after a couple of miles and turn back, or drop down and wait for the British.

Absolutely nobody is getting out on foot, not with the nearest point of vague safety 40-50km away and the British in control of the road.

The only reason anyone would even try to get away on foot is if they think there's a chance of getting to an assembly area to hitch a lift on a retreating column before it pulls out. As soon as it's clear that they're cut off and without transport any remaining foot soldiers will surrender (and if necessary, go looking for some British troops to surrender to - dying of thirst in the desert is pointless). The only possible exception is sacrifice rearguard units trying to delay the pursuit - and they'll surrender once they're bypassed, overrun or out of ammo.

The 5th Light and 15th Panzer Divisions are fully-motorised units, so the only German troops in this situation will be stragglers who've lost their transport. I'm not sure about the Italians, but any non-motorized units in the Trento division probably surrendered as soon as the defence at Nofilia collapsed and certainly would have when they learned that the Germans had failed to break the roadblock and no relief was available.

 

[PMN1]

Then I didn't find a proper photo to illustrate the challenges involved.

The thing remains though that even in that featureless sea of sand, the LRDG is needed to spot where the soft sand it located. That was a costant issue even in passable areas.

The enscarpments I am talking about are these ones

Google Maps

Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.

www.google.com

I like the fact that googlemaps brings up 'Groceries, Restaurants, Takeout, Hotels, Gas, Pharmacies and Coffee'................and is saying 'light traffic in this area, typical conditions.'

 

[Icedaemon]

A thought: might the Prussian junkers in the German armed forces conclude from this battle not that the British are a peer opponent to be vary of, or that Bavarian generals don't know their jobs? If the latter, might this lead to other battles of similar nature in some other theatre?

 

[Peg Leg Pom]

Yeah it does appear that the Africa Korps and the Italian Army have had their own version of the Gazalla Gallop

The Sirtie races?

The Sirtie Steeplechase.

Brought to you by Runaway Rommel.

 

[Onslow123]

A thought: might the Prussian junkers in the German armed forces conclude from this battle not that the British are a peer opponent to be vary of, or that Bavarian generals don't know their jobs? If the latter, might this lead to other battles of similar nature in some other theatre?

Rommel is a Württenbergian, not Bavarian general. It would be more accurate to say generals of southern German origin, includes all persons originating from Bavaria, Württemberg or Baden and of course the question of the Austrians arises.

 

[Look More Closely Later]

British & Commonwealth pursuit will to some extent I guess be hampered by having to stop and take prisoners.
Although it will look good for the propaganda film reels (in so much as the rules of war at the time permitted that - I'm not sure on that point) and be good for agricultural production in the long-run in various parts of the Commonwealth.

 

[CaptainCalvert]

Ramp-Rat raised the impact of the Afrika Korps Battleaxe defeat on the French colonies. This has potential to be a real big deal, but has to be handled carefully. IOTL the USA retained good relations with Vichy until December 1941, and even after was a useful intermediary. Would the Germans risk upsetting the USA by trying to keep them out, or risk promoting a switch by telling the colonies they can't deal with the USA?
As for the armistice commission, Vichy had separate agreements with Italy and Germany. Expelling the commissioners is a direct breach of armistice and they probably aren't ready for that yet as it opens Vichy to German takeover (and some kind of trouble from the Italians). Can they get a formal peace with Italy? Could the allies with USA help get the Italians to make peace with the British Empire, France and Greece? It's probably a bit soon for switching sides and fighting against the Germans, but withdrawing occupation forces would put a huge strain on the Germans and Bulgarians. Anyway, that's a few months away, and allanpcameron has to sort out how the DAK finally expires and what happens to Ariete division.

 

[CaptainCalvert]

I should mention that Battleaxe was a great read, very well put together and nothing was really certain until right at the end. A great bit of work. Well done

 

[Mr Carrot]

I think we're fixating a bit too much on how many get out and how they do it, instead it should be what they get out with and what's left at their logistics base because they are not getting anything new.

Limbered anti tank weapons and artillery are unlikely to make it off road in a mad dash.

Pre prepared stocks are not getting reloaded onto motor transport so that's all lost too.

Given the panzers that matter ittl are heavier if we're going to look at historical movement figured we need to factor that in too.

My point is that Rommel could have a million men left but if all he's got is one battery of 88mm that was left in port and airbase defence and no divisional artillery the British can take their time and go to a space the are happy with which is slow grinding artillery offensives.

@allanpcameron an excellent battle.

My only real critique of the writing was that the RAF began suffering attrition from sortie rate but the Luftwaffe didn't, Allan if you could add in one or two lines of why this is? I.e. larger force ittl? Less reliance on inferior Italian fighters due to lower losses over Crete?

 

[Cryhavoc101]

My only real critique of the writing was that the RAF began suffering attrition from sortie rate but the Luftwaffe didn't, Allan if you could add in one or two lines of why this is? I.e. larger force ittl? Less reliance on inferior Italian fighters due to lower losses over Crete?

Higher Sortie rate by the RAF?

 

[Tjyorksgeezer]

In the morning the rest of the outflanking force should reach the coast and take up the pursuit, can the Ariete division hold/delay long enough for any sort of regrouping of the Axis? They'll probably be the only forces on either side in any shape to do anything at the moment.

 

[pedmore1202]

My only real critique of the writing was that the RAF began suffering attrition from sortie rate but the Luftwaffe didn't, Allan if you could add in one or two lines of why this is? I.e. larger force ittl? Less reliance on inferior Italian fighters due to lower losses over Crete?

Higher Sortie rate by the RAF?

My guess would be a higher sortie rate by the RAF. The British were building up ready for an offensive, which meant that they needed airplanes pretty much constantly overhead in order to prevent the buildup and positions of troops from being detected as much as possible. Once the Germans/Italian's realised this, they probably would have husbanded their airforces a bit, allowing the majority of pilots to rest ready to counter the British offensive.

 

[allanpcameron]

10 June 1941. Operation Battleaxe. Day 4.

As dawn broke, General Beresford-Peirce had enough tanks under 4th Armoured Brigade command, the whole of 11th Indian Brigade and various other stragglers ready to set off. The overnight reports were that the German Panzer Divisions had disengaged and made off to the south into the desert. Reports from the LRDG and 11th Hussars noted that there was a trail of abandoned equipment and small groups of men that was easy to follow. With the LRDG’s ‘S’ Patrol back at the rendezvous position, Beresford-Peirce wanted to pursue the Germans directly. There was some debate about whether it would be quicker to head directly to the coast road and then head west, rather than take the desert route. The consensus was that it would be better to head directly to the coast for the welfare of the vehicles which had already done too many miles over rough terrain to risk too much more.

Once this decision had been taken the column followed the tracks of 7th Armoured Division. Lieutenant General O’Connor flew up to the site of the battle to confer directly with XIII Corps’ GOCs. With Major Generals Creagh (7th Armoured Division), Gambier-Parry (22nd Armoured Division), Evetts (6th Infantry Division) and when he arrived, Beresford-Peirce (4th Indian Division) the scale of the victory, and the butcher’s bill was examined. The Italian Trento Division was totally defeated. There were many casualties, but most of the Division had been taken prisoner. Elements of the 5th Light Division and 15th Panzer Division had escaped the trap. Going by the numbers of POWs, destroyed and abandoned vehicles and guns, with more being discovered by 4th CLY and 11th Frontier Force as they followed the route taken by the retreating Germans. From what the intelligence officers could piece together, the two Divisions had been reduced to about an Armoured Regiment, probably an Infantry Regiment, but very little in terms of artillery and anti-tank capability.

The butcher’s bill in 7th Armoured Brigade was 65 tanks lost, though how many could be repaired was still being looked at. They’d arrived from the rendezvous point with about 100, so they’d lost more than half that force. The good news was the arrival of a mostly complete 4th Armoured Brigade, and in due course more tanks would arrive from the desert route, bringing 7th Armoured Division up to about 70% strength. 22nd Armoured Brigade had started the battle with 140 tanks, less than full strength. The Royal Gloucestershire Hussars had come off worst, with only one compete Squadron (16 tanks) able to take to the field. Both the Sharpshooters Regiments had lost at least 10 tanks, about 25% of their strength. General Gambier-Parry had asked the RGH CO to put his remaining tanks under the command of 3rd CLY so at least one of his Regiments was at full strength. 7th Tank Brigade had also been hit hard. Brigadier Naesmyth noted that he had rolled his three Regiments into two, both were less than full strength, but were available. As with 7th Armoured Brigade there were a lot of tanks that were being looked at to see how many might be recovered and repaired. Over all, of the 600 tanks in the three Armoured Brigades and one Tank Brigade that had started the battle, there were currently just under 380 tanks available, which would rise as the stragglers came in, and simple repair jobs carried out. Quite a lot of the crews of the tanks destroyed by enemy action were killed or wounded, but about half the survivors would be fit for duty before too long.

6th Infantry Division had taken the most casualties in numbers of dead and wounded. General O’Connor, after consultations with General Evetts, ordered 6th Division back to Ras El Ali and El Agheila to reform. Once there, their transport would be reassigned to 9th Australian Division, who would be lifted to Nofilia and beyond, to give a fresh Infantry Division for the next phase of Operation Battleaxe. 4th Indian Division’s casualties had been taken mostly alongside 7th Armoured Brigade. Only 11th Indian Brigade was complete, the Regiments of the other two Brigades would be short of at least a Platoon, the worst affected, short of a Company. The 3rd Indian Motor Brigade hadn’t come off too badly, but would need replacements to make up their losses.

General O’Connor wanted to keep up the pressure as much as possible. 4th Armoured Brigade, with 3rd Motor and 11th Indian Brigade were ordered continue west until Wadi Harawah, about 30 miles west. There they would pause until 9th Australian Division arrived, which would likely be in 48 - 72 hours. By that time, 7th Armoured Brigade, brought up to full strength by 7th Tank Brigade, would give XIII Corps a full Armoured Division, a fresh Infantry Division, and much of 4th Indian Division to carry on to Sirte. The pause for two or three days would also allow for more supplies to be brought forward, both by road and by sea. It would also give the RAF a couple of days to prepare some air strips for their forward squadrons to be based out of. The chances were that the opposition in the future would primarily be Italian. The British army already had the measure of the Italians, and so progress would simply be a matter of logistics, pluck and concentration. In future, XIII Corps would be less inclined to split its forces. Sending 7th Armoured and 4th Indian Divisions so far through the desert could have been a spectacular success, but it turned out to be barely adequate for the job.

At Sirte, General Gariboldi, who’d come forward from Tripoli, listened to General Rommel’s tale of woe. It seemed to the Italian commander that his German counterpart couldn’t seem to bring any blame on himself, the whole disaster seemed to be the fault of the Italian army. Rome had already been informed of what had happened, and requests were being made to Berlin for further German help, but also with a request for a new commander. General Von Paulus had made a good impression with the Italians, if available he would make a very good overall commander. Gariboldi had a feeling that there would be no more help coming from Germany. 5th Light Division and 15th Panzer Division had arrived in Tripoli equipped with 340 panzers. At Sirte, they could only muster sixty, of which, only thirty were Panzer III and IVs. A concerted effort by the Division’s recovery vehicles was attempting to collect some that had broken down between Wadi Harawah and Sirte. Rommel had left a small force, mostly from a reconnaissance battalion, to try to pick up stragglers and the Luftwaffe was doing their best to protect the area to allow any survivors to make it back to Sirte. For this job, the Italians had sent forward some transport units to aid in the task.

Rommel had complained long and hard about not getting support from the Ariete Division. He told Gariboldi that he would take his complaint all the way to Hitler. The Italian general couldn’t help think that the German Fuhrer would be less than impressed by a General who managed to lose almost two Panzer Divisions in one battle.
While Rommel ranted and raved, Gariboldi had set his staff the problem of what to do next. If Rommel was right and he’d given the British a severe mauling, then the chances would be that the British would stop where they were and reorganise themselves. However, since it was General O’Connor he was facing, the loss of Cyrenaica had shown that the British might not stop at all. The positions around Sirte were a reasonable defensive position. At Buerat, some 90km west, there was much better terrain for defence. The approaches were narrow, and the chances of being outflanked less likely. It was tempting to withdraw back there, extending the distance that the British needed to transport their men and supplies. Whether Rome would agree to trade land for time was doubtful. After Buerat, Misurata was the next defensible position, but it was only 120kms to Tripoli.

With the loss of Trento Division, and all its transport, Gariboldi had very few fully mobile forces. Concentrating the best of his infantry Divisions at Buerat, with the mobile forces he did have, protecting the flank made the most sense. General Gariboldi decided he would need to seek advice from his own staff, as well as Rome. He could however make his life easier by sending General Rommel back to Tripoli. If he was put on a plane and flown back to Berlin to make his complaints, or better, be punished for his errors, so much the better. If he had followed his orders, and stayed in the defensive positions at Sirte, the Trento Division would have slowed the British down, given them a bloody nose, and then retired in good order. Instead of that he had committed his forces without full intelligence about the British strength, and got his men, along with Trento Division destroyed.

By nightfall, the 4th Armour Brigade, with 3rd Motor and 11th Indian Brigades had arrived at Wadi Harawah. There had been a short fight with what appeared to be a German rear-guard force, which retreated rapidly. The Luftwaffe had also been busy, attempting to do as much damage to any movement on the coast road, which caused the 6th Infantry Division even more casualties. Now that they were closer to their main bases, the Luftwaffe could increase their sortie rate. The forward airstrips they had been using, so often attacked by the RAF, had provided them with very little in the way of protection, and bringing up fuel and bombs had been a difficult task for the ground support element.

On the other hand, the RAF priority was currently to protect a substantial convoy of coastal craft to Benghazi, then onto Ras El Ali, as supplies coming forward by sea were important for the next phase of the operation. While many of the aircraft were serviced, and the pilots rested, ground elements and engineers were moving everything forward to new airstrips around Ras El Ali, a hundred miles forward from their current positions at Agedabia.

The Indian troops dug in at Wadi Harawah, prepared against any possible counter-attack. The route taken by the majority of the Afrika Korps had been swept by 4th Sharpshooters and 11th Frontier Force with aid from the 11th Hussars and LRDG. More prisoners had been taken, and it was clear that the toll taken on the two German Panzer Divisions was even greater than had been guessed at in the morning. Elements of 11th Frontier Force explored to the west of the Wadi, allowing 11th Hussars to have time to rest and regroup. The LRDG also had time to eat and sleep, before setting off the next day to reconnoitre the next part of Tripolitania.

 

[Unknown]

At Sirte, General Gariboldi, who’d come forward from Tripoli, listened to General Rommel’s tale of woe. It seemed to the Italian commander that his German counterpart couldn’t seem to bring any blame on himself, the whole disaster seemed to be the fault of the Italian army. Rome had already been informed of what had happened, and requests were being made to Berlin for further German help, but also with a request for a new commander

Rommel, you ain't getting that help, considering what's kicking off in eleven days...

 

[kelgar04]

Well TTL Rommel seems to be digging himself a very deep hole and making German-Italian relations even worse.

I also imagine the Spooky types and the engineers will be crawling over the captured German equipment like ticks on a strays back.

 

[Orry]

people will write what ifs about if the British had not messed up their flank march.......

 

[Cryhavoc101]

people will write what ifs about if the British had not messed up their flank march.......

Or

"If only a proper German general like Guderian had been in charge he would have chased them Brits all the way back to the Nile"

 

[JamesHunter]

Rommel, you ain't getting that help, considering what's kicking off in eleven days...

Well this will be good for British morale. Also shows excellent progress, France wasn't a total curbstomp, Greece was clearly an excellently executed tactical withdrawal that gave Germany a bloody nose and now Crete and Africa prove the Commonwealth can win fights on its own.

Also with Africa done with a year early that will hopefully give time to both send troops east and also to focus solidly on building up for the inevitable in Northern Europe. As long as they don't do anything stupid (like invade Italy or re-enter Greece) they can mop up the Mediterranean islands, practice amphibious landings and feel good about themselves.

Even better the US entry will feel less like a rescue and more like "Finally joined the winning side have you?"

 

[CV(N)-6]

How extensively will you be covering Barbarossa, allan?

 

[Cymraeg]

Well, Rommel's reputation is already in the toilet as the Italians are asking for a replacement who's more grounded in reality. If Paulus is sent though, who will command 6th Army in Case Blue after Von Reichenau drops dead?
It's looking as if North Africa will be done and dusted in 1941 instead of 1943. The French will be muttering a bit in French North Africa and I can imagine that O'Connor's star is rising nicely. That means stability in command, lots of lessons being learnt, no %^&ing Jock Columns and anything that Dorman-Smith says being ignored.
That's a point - where is the wretched man in this timeline?