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2009: Nuclear War. How did this happen? Keep reading.

In 2007 the Islamic Confederation tested it's first nuclear weapon. Combined with their support for violent muslim extremism abroad they were quickly denounced by most other world powers. Sanctions soon followed. Only Australia (happy to anger India and sell grain for a high price) and the United States (viewing any sanctions as fundamentally un-capitalistic and wanting to tick off Moscow) would trade with them, but it was enough to keep their extremist state afloat.

Military build up and harsh control of the populace could only last for so long though, and the hard liner regime knew it needed to do something grand to rally support. It was decided they would take the fight to their mortal foes in India and in February of 2009, on Maha Shivaratri, IC paramilitaries launched a string of terror attacks across India, killing just over 2 000 people in the combined bombings and shootings. Already sending material support to communists in Yemen, New Delhi gave no declaration of war. They simply began deploying troops directly and launching aerial bombing campaigns against the Arabian peninsula. Within 4 months over 1 million Indian soldiers, pilots, and sailors had been deployed to combat zones, while 3 million reserve forces mostly took charge of training the millions of new recruits. The Islamic Confederation stood undaunted, with several million men under arms themselves and a conviction that Subcontinental Muslims would rise up any day, they kept the war conventional (though put continued effort into expanding their nuclear arsenal). This confidence was shot when India transfered command to Karachi born Islam Iqbal and reports that enlistment by Muslims into the Indian army was only marginally lower than Hindus reached Cairo. Combined with Indian landings in Somalia the hard liners realised they had bitten off more than they could chew. 78 nuclear warheads flew on August 4th towards India (mostly aboard bombers, though a number were submarine launched). Indian interceptors stopped a number of bombers, but 63 mushroom clouds still rose over the subcontinent. The Indian response had been swift though, with their own bombers and submarines mobilised on a hair trigger for the war. The Islamic Confederation was hit with 83 warheads.

On August 5th the world was a very different place. Washington's efforts to regain control over breakaway republics and various nations sliding towards American ultra-liberalism were very clearly off the top priorities list of Moscow. Even recently partitioned Switzerland realised this had at least as much impact on their lives as the recent war had. Ottoman citizens who had watched mushroom clouds rise across the border knew two things were coming: radiation and refugees. The nations of Asia sat watching to see if India could hold together. Indonesia turned its eyes towards Australia, fearing mushroom clouds over their own nation now that India might no longer support them. Oil prices skyrocketed. As did food prices as the world feared a nuclear winter and massive food shortages in both regions.
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(The series has almost hit the present, so I thought I might as well finish it.)
 
Impressive set up, war between planets would be so impractical for so long that it should only be done for serious reasons.

Anyway, my one nitpick is with the Philippines, how the bloody hell did they manage to outbreed the US, Brazil, Japan, Bangladesh, Mexico, and probably countless other worlds?

That's a population boom so strong it increased their population by an entire order of magnitude, even at 1.2% growth rate it would hit barely half that, did they force their population at gun point to have children? With such a huge population boom, the government should have collapsed under its own weight, as maintaining nearly 10 billion humans in line is no easy feat.

I have population growth modeled out for every year until 2141, based on a number of parameters including OTL birth rates. I can explain it in more detail later.

That said, you're right; my spreadsheet actually does say that the Philippines should have collapsed and should have numerous breakaway states, but the primary government is the only one productive enough to have a mass driver.

I do have a couple of problems with this post, @Tsochar. The obscene population growth. The fact that, with the exception of Japan and a few others, there is (Seemingly) only one state on most of these seems unrealistic to me, unless you're arguing that they're the only major states on their respective worlds. That said, this is still the obscenely coolest idea I've seen in a while.

Most planets, by virtue of being descended from a single government, are still a single government. The population growth I'll explain in more detail later, but basically countries with initial food shortages got a persistent boost in birth rate.

That said, there are various communes, statelets, autonomies, and so on on most planets; they just aren't major.
 
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1928 in a world quite different from our own.

The Central Powers triumped in the spring of 1918 when they captured Paris. The situation in the East was quite different from OTL though. Lenin managed to choke on an olive pit in the early days of the war and while the Bolsheviks were attempting to take power they were much less organised. Still the chaos had forced Russia to accept terms. As well the Italians had sided with the CP this time around.

The 1920s have been rather unkind to the CP though. Austria-Hungary simply couldn't come to a good arrangement between Slavs, Hungarians, and Germans. Things collapsed in a bloody fashion in 1925. The Italians slid into fascism, bitter that they gained only table scraps in the peace process. The Ottomans have had trouble of their own.

Meanwhile the economic depression which followed the war hit the US particularly bad. The Entente had owed them vast sums of money they simply couldn't pay when having to also give reparations to Germany. While they negotiated a chance to postpone payments and other compromises the loss of capital still hurt the US. Mismanagement made matters worse, and while she remained neutral in the war the Americans couldn't escape the political extremes which hit the world. In the spring 1927 violence broke out in Kansas city between strikers and police, and quickly spread from there.

The increasing fascist remnants of the Entente have moved in to try and prop up the unpopular military junta in Washington, and the Germans are too busy elsewhere to stop their military rebuilding.

There is one bright spot though, Russia managed to stumble through the 1920s happily and has built itself a democratic institution (mostly by forcing fascists and bolsheviks out at gun point). There's some corruption and the occasional voting irregularities, but apart from New Zealand they're possibly the best place to live around.
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Found it. They're very scattered and lost in the thread...
 
Which parts can't work?

It’s all in the video.

And if you look at human progress and technology, it’s a serious one of these graphs

It’s literally not; that graph is the Second Most Wrong Thing Ever Created.

Hyper-loops fit quite well with the "rule of cool".

And that’s totally fine! Like the talk of ubiquitous pneumatic tubes in the 1920s. But it’s still ASB/sci-fi.

stuff like space elevators

Only unworkable on Earth (unfortunately). Moon and Mars? Perfect locations.

and FTL travel

We haven’t really ruled that out yet, though.

Why this single dislike of Hyper-Loops if those two technologies are more prevalent in maps?

Be…cause that map had a hyperloop? And didn’t have those. And passed off the hyperloop as possible. It’s like the people who think self-driving cars will not only be workable in five years, but will EVER eventually make real cars illegal. I’d call that out, too.
 
I do have a couple of problems with this post, @Tsochar. The obscene population growth. The fact that, with the exception of Japan and a few others, there is (Seemingly) only one state on most of these seems unrealistic to me, unless you're arguing that they're the only major states on their respective worlds. That said, this is still the obscenely coolest idea I've seen in a while.

I think the obscene population growth makes sense, considering that you're growing into a vacuum. Only China and India really have to worry in the short term about possibly overpopulating their planets; certainly I can see China keeping (relaxed) population controls in place. I'm also not sure why populations would explode following recovery from famine, and especially how Japan - OTL a country with one of the lowest population growth rates in the world - could suddenly explode like that.

I also think that the growth rate is some other countries is way too small - your growth for the US, for example, is just about modern growth (slightly lower, I think) - but that makes no sense; I'm sure that it would explode in the wake of an ISOT to a virgin world.

Also - what order are the worlds in?
 

Jcw3

Banned
Be…cause that map had a hyperloop? And didn’t have those. And passed off the hyperloop as possible. It’s like the people who think self-driving cars will not only be workable in five years, but will EVER eventually make real cars illegal. I’d call that out, too.

Two things. One, if it really was such a hopeless, ASB idea, Elon Musk would have figured it out, and SpaceX/other companies wouldn't be spending millions on it for literally no gain. Big companies with big science divisions know more than random people on the Internet.. There are kinks in new technologies. You work them out. And if driverless cars are more reliable than normal cars, then yeah, it would make sense that society might someday ban driving.

Two...But you know what? Even if I were to agree with you on hyperloops, or at least believe you that they were somewhat unfeasible, the absolutely rude way you put it ('This meme needs to die') has convinced me that I'm not going to stop using them. If you had said 'Hey, man, hyperloops actually aren't that feasible or realistic. Check this video out. There's a ton of issues that need to be worked out.', then I would have been cool with it, might have even stopped using them (or at least stopped mentioning them). But no, you said 'Ugh, this meme needs to die'.

There are enough points in favor of hyperloops that I'm going to keep using them. And I'm going to be perfectly honest with you, a large part of it is spite.
 

Red Orm

Banned
There are enough points in favor of hyperloops that I'm going to keep using them. And I'm going to be perfectly honest with you, a large part of it is spite.

Not to mention the fact that your map was ISOT, which is inherently ASB, to begin with, so why would anybody even bring it up?
 

Jcw3

Banned
Not to mention the fact that your map was ISOT, which is inherently ASB, to begin with, so why would anybody even bring it up?

No, criticizing tech choices makes sense. The ISOT is supposed to be the only ASB thing in my maps. After that, it's all supposed to progress in a mostly logical way, including tech development. So criticism on how tech develops in the post-ISOT world is totally reasonable to me. The problem is a disagreement on whether or not hyperloops are feasible or not.
 

CannedTech

Banned
I really don't see why you're on this giant crusade against HLs here of all places Skill. You could do something like make a thread in chat and not fun-police this thread for any map with HLs, cause' this whole argument here seems pointless and counterproductive (in the map thread at least).
 
One, if it really was such a hopeless, ASB idea, Elon Musk would have figured it out
You’re kidding, right? An appeal to authority?
Big companies with big science divisions know more than random people on the Internet.
So yes, an appeal to authority with zero evidence.
There are kinks in new technologies. You work them out.
Not these! It’s the fundamental design of the thing and it leads to the death of everyone in the tube.
And if driverless cars are more reliable than normal cars, then yeah, it would make sense that society might someday ban driving.
You can pry my steering wheel out of my cold dead hands, but that won’t happen because I don’t get into accidents.
the absolutely rude way you put it
Fuck’s sake, do you know what rudeness is?
a large part of it is spite.
How pathetic. Sad! Sci-fi is sci-fi; I love new and crazy things. But if this was a site in the 1970s and people were pushing cold fusion as the source of energy in ISOTs (or wherever else), you’d see the same sort of response.
I really don't see why you're on this giant crusade against HLs here of all places Skill.
Because I’m not? I mentioned it because it’s wrong and proved so. “Crusade” nothing.
 
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I think the obscene population growth makes sense, considering that you're growing into a vacuum. Only China and India really have to worry in the short term about possibly overpopulating their planets; certainly I can see China keeping (relaxed) population controls in place. I'm also not sure why populations would explode following recovery from famine, and especially how Japan - OTL a country with one of the lowest population growth rates in the world - could suddenly explode like that.

I also think that the growth rate is some other countries is way too small - your growth for the US, for example, is just about modern growth (slightly lower, I think) - but that makes no sense; I'm sure that it would explode in the wake of an ISOT to a virgin world.

Also - what order are the worlds in?

Population growth was modeled as follows:

Populations are split into Internal and External, with Internal being the ISOTed portion and External being in virgin earth. Internal portions grow at the same rate as OTL, tapering to zero over time while external portions have two sources of growth, natural growth and immigration. Natural growth per annum for external portions is initially the average of the OTL growth rate and 1.04, which is the maximum that humans can sustain; Niger's natural growth rate is 1.036. So Niger's initial external natural growth rate is 1.038, while Bulgaria's is 1.017. Immigration from internal to external is assumed to be 0.1% of the internal portion's population per annum. External natural growth rate is tapered over time at the same rate as internal.

The mechanics of famine were modeled somewhat crudely. Basically, I counted up the caloric value of each country's agriculture and fishing, then determined what the shortage would be compared to its population (based on 2000 calories). Wealthy countries with high HDIs were able to distribute food in such a way that relatively few people died, but in all cases people desperately emigrated to external areas. Their reproduction rate was modeled using the external model, but with a higher initial population value.

So, for example, Japan had a shortage of 62 million people. Of those, only 13 million starved to death while 49 million emigrated, and these 50 million expanded into a vacuum. On the other extreme, Djibouti produces basically no food; they had a shortage of 880,000, of whom 685,000 died and 195,000 emigrated. Djibouti is now a lawless, tribal society where the self-proclaimed successor to the original government governs maybe a quarter of the population. Their post-famine growth rate was 3%, which is in line with the US during the 1700-1900 period, while their current growth rate is... 3%? ...oh.

I forgot to taper the external growth rate. That's the problem. I'll need to tweak it a bit.

Also, for order I used the longitude values of their capital cities. The order is:
Tonga
Samoa
Mexico
Guatemala
El Salvador
Belize
Honduras
Nicaragua
Costa Rica
Cuba
Panama
Ecuador
Bahamas, The
Peru
United States
Jamaica
Canada
Colombia
Haiti[3]
Chile
Dominican Republic
Bolivia
Venezuela
Saint Kitts and Nevis
Antigua and Barbuda
Grenada
Trinidad and Tobago
Dominica
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines
Saint Lucia
Barbados
Argentina
Guyana
Paraguay
Uruguay
Suriname
Brazil
Cape Verde
Iceland
Senegal
Gambia, The
Mauritania
Guinea-Bissau
Guinea
Sierra Leone
Western Sahara
Liberia
Portugal[3]
Mali
Morocco
Ireland
Cote d'Ivoire
Spain
Burkina Faso
Ghana
United Kingdom
Togo
Andorra
Niger
France
Benin
Algeria
Belgium[3]
Netherlands
Luxembourg
Sao Tome and Principe
Monaco[3]
Switzerland
Nigeria
Equatorial Guinea
Gabon
Liechtenstein
Tunisia
Norway
Cameroon
San Marino
Italy[3]
Denmark[3]
Libya
Angola
Germany[3]
Czech Republic[3]
Slovenia[3]
Malta
Chad
Congo, Republic of the
Democratic Republic of the Congo
Croatia[3]
Austria[3]
Namibia
Slovakia
Sweden[3]
Bosnia and Herzegovina[3]
Central African Republic
Hungary[3]
Montenegro
Albania
Serbia[3]
Poland[3]
Kosovo[Note 14]
Macedonia
Bulgaria[3]
Greece[3]
Latvia[3]
Estonia[3]
Finland[3]
Lithuania[3]
Botswana
Romania[3]
Lesotho
Belarus[3]
South Africa
Zambia
Moldova[3]
Burundi
Rwanda
Ukraine[3]
Zimbabwe
Swaziland
Egypt
South Sudan
Sudan
Uganda
Mozambique
Turkey
Northern Cyprus[Note 18]
Cyprus
Malawi
Israel
Palestine
Lebanon
Tanzania
Jordan
Syria
Kenya
Russia[3]
Ethiopia
Eritrea
Abkhazia[Note 19]
Djibouti
Comoros
South Ossetia[Note 20]
Yemen
Iraq
Armenia
Georgia
Somalia
Saudi Arabia
Madagascar
Kuwait
Azerbaijan
Bahrain
Iran
Qatar
United Arab Emirates
Seychelles
Mauritius
Turkmenistan
Oman
Tajikistan
Afghanistan
Uzbekistan
Kazakhstan
Pakistan
Maldives
Kyrgyzstan
India
Sri Lanka
Nepal
Bhutan
Bangladesh
Burma
Thailand
Malaysia
Laos
Singapore
Cambodia
Vietnam
Indonesia
Mongolia
Brunei
China
Philippines
Taiwan
Timor-Leste
Korea, North
Korea, South
Palau
Japan[3]
Papua New Guinea
Australia
Federated States of Micronesia
Solomon Islands
Nauru
Vanuatu
Marshall Islands
Kiribati
New Zealand
Fiji
Tuvalu
 

CannedTech

Banned
There are enough points in favor of hyperloops that I'm going to keep using them. And I'm going to be perfectly honest with you, a large part of it is spite.

Heh, funny thing is that I didn't even really know all about the hyperloop idea before this argument. Now that I do know, I wanna' use em' as well.
 
Okay, I fixed the population growth model so that it wasn't quite so crazy.

Revised (and some new) populations are as follows:

India: 3.83 Billion
China: 2.25 Billion
USA: 537 Million
Indonesia: 681 Million
Brazil: 531 Million
Nigeria: 827 Million
Mexico: 381 Million
Egypt: 421 Million
Japan: 285 Million
Bangladesh: 621 Million
Ethiopia: 970 Million
Pakistan: 735 Million
Turkey: 207 Million
Philippines: 488 Million
 
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