America Be Watching With The Popcorn: A Sino-Soviet War TL
- Thread starter theflyingmongoose
- Start date
This is a baby sealion
Every time someone is a jerk (like making pointless, entirely unnecessary insults to an author) a baby sealion cries.
Please don't make baby sealions cry any more.
Cute Sealion. Baby sealions don't deserve to be sad.
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I do wonder how the USA ending the Vietnam War in a way that favors them will affect domestic politics.
The counterculture and leftist activism won't go away, but that'll probably do away with the malaise felt by the country after the war cause it was a clear win
Well it could very well mean Nixon gets a full 8 years. Not sure what that means for the country as a whole. But with a clear victory in the war I imagine it’ll definitely change our culture in some way.
Yay Warlords!
China becomes the definition of chaos, 1970-1971
The majority of China not under foreign control was in a state of anarchy. Most of the nation was under the control of warlords, usually high-ranking officers from the PLA who took control of the land with their troops. The groups of PRC loyalists, ranging from the Red Guard to Army remnants, pillaged the villages and towns of the country. To say China's infrastructure was bad would be an understatement, and many civilians were stuck in this terrible hellscape.
And obviously, there were the international 'expeditions'. While Xinjiang (now East Turkestan) was independent, it was under de-facto occupation by the Soviets. Tibet was the only country that was free of foreign influence. But the intervention of the ROC takes the cake as the largest. The Republic of China (ROC) had survived on Taiwan and never stopped presenting itself as the real, legitimate government of China, claiming the mainland and a whole bunch of other stuff including the entirety of Mongolia, along with parts of India, Bhutan, Pakistan, Afganistan, Myanmar, Tajikstan, and the USSR. Once it looked like the Sino-Soviet war was going to escalate, the Republicans had begun importing large amounts of the latest equipment, like transport and assault helicopters, along with M14 Snipers and M16 Rifles. Chaing Kai-Shek, the leader of the Republic of China, had also ordered a lot of ships and boats from the Americans, including one Tarawa-class amphibious assault ship, and dozens of riverine patrol craft freed up from the end of the Vietnam war. In May of 1970, only three months after millions of Chinese citizens were incinerated in nuclear fire, Operation Reunion was launched.
Ten ROC divisions landed in Guangdong and meeting minimal resistance (most of the anarchy was inland) captured most of it. The Red Cross with help from the American advisors and Taiwanese troops set up a relief network of hospitals and food distribution centers. Getting the Chinese to trust them was a difficult task seeing as they had been constantly denounced in propaganda for over 30 years and the time when they governed the mainland hadn't been extremely successful. Most people realized the People's Republic of China wasn't coming to their aid anytime soon (it didn't help that plenty of people in Red Guard and People's Liberation Army uniforms raped and pillaged their towns and cities), so they eventually began taking the food and medicine that was offered. Soon, recruitment was opened in the Republican Army for mainlanders, most of whom were either grateful for the aid and help and wanted to pay it forward to their fellow Chinese living in horrific conditions in the interior of the country, not to mention the pay was good for someone on the mainland. The troop strength of the ROC's army reached over 1 million within three months of the occupation beginning, as they steadily began liberating the coastline and some of the interior.
The British opened up Hong Kong's port for resupplying Republican forces, and the Americans loaned billions and sent over thousands of additional troops. While some were uneasy about getting involved in another 'foreign escapade' so soon after the Vietnam War, most thought the humanitarian crisis in China counted as a just cause (which resulted in some of the strongest supporters of the intervention being young people and former anti-war protesters. These truly were strange times.
NOTE: China has so many warlord feifdoms that I just included all of them in the PRC area. Beijing is under control of the central government, while the rest is under control of former PLA officers.
The majority of China not under foreign control was in a state of anarchy. Most of the nation was under the control of warlords, usually high-ranking officers from the PLA who took control of the land with their troops. The groups of PRC loyalists, ranging from the Red Guard to Army remnants, pillaged the villages and towns of the country. To say China's infrastructure was bad would be an understatement, and many civilians were stuck in this terrible hellscape.
And obviously, there were the international 'expeditions'. While Xinjiang (now East Turkestan) was independent, it was under de-facto occupation by the Soviets. Tibet was the only country that was free of foreign influence. But the intervention of the ROC takes the cake as the largest. The Republic of China (ROC) had survived on Taiwan and never stopped presenting itself as the real, legitimate government of China, claiming the mainland and a whole bunch of other stuff including the entirety of Mongolia, along with parts of India, Bhutan, Pakistan, Afganistan, Myanmar, Tajikstan, and the USSR. Once it looked like the Sino-Soviet war was going to escalate, the Republicans had begun importing large amounts of the latest equipment, like transport and assault helicopters, along with M14 Snipers and M16 Rifles. Chaing Kai-Shek, the leader of the Republic of China, had also ordered a lot of ships and boats from the Americans, including one Tarawa-class amphibious assault ship, and dozens of riverine patrol craft freed up from the end of the Vietnam war. In May of 1970, only three months after millions of Chinese citizens were incinerated in nuclear fire, Operation Reunion was launched.
Ten ROC divisions landed in Guangdong and meeting minimal resistance (most of the anarchy was inland) captured most of it. The Red Cross with help from the American advisors and Taiwanese troops set up a relief network of hospitals and food distribution centers. Getting the Chinese to trust them was a difficult task seeing as they had been constantly denounced in propaganda for over 30 years and the time when they governed the mainland hadn't been extremely successful. Most people realized the People's Republic of China wasn't coming to their aid anytime soon (it didn't help that plenty of people in Red Guard and People's Liberation Army uniforms raped and pillaged their towns and cities), so they eventually began taking the food and medicine that was offered. Soon, recruitment was opened in the Republican Army for mainlanders, most of whom were either grateful for the aid and help and wanted to pay it forward to their fellow Chinese living in horrific conditions in the interior of the country, not to mention the pay was good for someone on the mainland. The troop strength of the ROC's army reached over 1 million within three months of the occupation beginning, as they steadily began liberating the coastline and some of the interior.
The British opened up Hong Kong's port for resupplying Republican forces, and the Americans loaned billions and sent over thousands of additional troops. While some were uneasy about getting involved in another 'foreign escapade' so soon after the Vietnam War, most thought the humanitarian crisis in China counted as a just cause (which resulted in some of the strongest supporters of the intervention being young people and former anti-war protesters. These truly were strange times.
NOTE: China has so many warlord feifdoms that I just included all of them in the PRC area. Beijing is under control of the central government, while the rest is under control of former PLA officers.
the situation of PRC roughly resembles the warlord period.
Would be interesting to see the ramifications of a long term second warlord era.
What’s the timetable for China’s collapse? A few months or something? I imagine that with an unstable leadership in Beijing that civil war would eventually break and with it the warlords would take control as time went on.
Although the ROCs military growth seems a bit too quick. Even with lots of guns and money being thrown at Taiwan it would still take a long ass time to establish a foothold on the mainland, secure it, build or gain access to critical infrastructure, import the material, and train up these new recruits.
Hmmm I wonder how involved Nixon will get in China. Advisors, guns, and other goods are one thing I can’t see him risking much more than that. Even though he’s won Vietnam I don’t think he’d risk starting a new war when he’s midterms in ‘70 and re election in ‘72. Ending the war in Vietnam would be a huge win so I don’t think he’d risk that.
Also what kind of government would take control in Tibet? I imagine that uighuristan would be communist state but about Tibet?
What’s the timetable for China’s collapse? A few months or something? I imagine that with an unstable leadership in Beijing that civil war would eventually break and with it the warlords would take control as time went on.
Although the ROCs military growth seems a bit too quick. Even with lots of guns and money being thrown at Taiwan it would still take a long ass time to establish a foothold on the mainland, secure it, build or gain access to critical infrastructure, import the material, and train up these new recruits.
Hmmm I wonder how involved Nixon will get in China. Advisors, guns, and other goods are one thing I can’t see him risking much more than that. Even though he’s won Vietnam I don’t think he’d risk starting a new war when he’s midterms in ‘70 and re election in ‘72. Ending the war in Vietnam would be a huge win so I don’t think he’d risk that.
Also what kind of government would take control in Tibet? I imagine that uighuristan would be communist state but about Tibet?
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Beijing is under siege from Warlords. The central government does control some territory in Manchuria though.
Well, it is different when the people support you.
They are just 'Advisors'. Besides, politics is a reactionary sport- people are happy about Vietnam ending so they won't care about China unless it lasts solong that their attention changes to this.
Yeah I get that. Just curious how long it would take to get to that point. A few months? A year? Afterall it’s not like one day everyone wake up and goes warlord. Takes a bit before the idea that you can become one sets in.
Yes, it does make things easier. But it still takes time to do these things.
True. So long as it doesn’t escalate or draw too much attention I imagine the populace will let it slide. But they’d still be weary of war, not so much as iotl but still not fond of it. Tricky dick would have to tread lightly.
McPherson
Banned
Thought I would do a target distribution to date with damage circles representing 2.5 megaton (10.46 x10^14 joules) air burst events.
The Russians sure have a strange targeting set of criteria. An American would have hammered Chongqing to Shanghai and Quingzhou to Kumning and would have blasted Bo Hai and inland to Beijing. and surrounding ports and urban centers.
See here the logic.
Work added by McPherson. Target distribution map originally credited in map. Chinese military naval and rocket artillery map originally from Hyperwar and with "Tobias" work attributed at the imbb image sharing site.
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