The Great Crusade (Reds! Part 3)

bookmark95

Banned
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Edit: it does looks better than most attempts to get a socialized version of the flag although I prefer the canon flag. I think you should have kept the red striped background and make the red horizontal stripes blue instead. Well, at least it isn't an eyesore.

While the flag is cool, I don't see it being used (except maybe by more conservative political parties).

The thing about revolutions, for better or for worse, is that they try up end everything about life. It is not a flag I can see being used in the revolution, since it would still remind people of the "evil bourgeois republic".
 
given that its easter and was just passover I have two questions:


1. What is judaism like in the UASR in the present?

2. What celebrations occur around easter?
1. There's a definite blurring of the lines between religious and cultural practice, a lot like the first generations of the Ashkenazim in Israel. Belief in god and the literal truth of the scripture is rare, but people continue to go through the motions of Jewish faith: predominantly eating kosher, continuing to keep the religious holidays like Passover, Hanukkah and Yom Kippur, though I imagine the solemnity begins to decrease among people born closer to present.

Jewish holidays are chiefly holidays of past struggles and disasters, and they tend to be reinforced by present experiences of persecution or struggle. Some like Purim might come to be more like St. Patrick's Day, i.e., ethnic celebrations often celebrated by people outside of that group.

2. A combination of civil and religious holidays. The secular trappings of Easter are probably common, along with civil memorials commemorating the Easter Rising (especially among Irish Americans), and the more religious keeping the holiday more solemnly.
 
Link is broken

Edit: it does looks better than most attempts to get a socialized version of the flag although I prefer the canon flag. I think you should have kept the red striped background and make the red horizontal stripes blue instead. Well, at least it isn't an eyesore.

Better than these things often are but im too in love with the official flag. Also, like all attempts to retain the design elements of the old flag it misses the point that the new flag doesn't look anything like the old flag, and is built entirely of elements commemorating the revolution. So red and black as primary colors to represent the anarchist and communist contributions, and the various elements are symbolic of workers, farmers and professionals.
 
Better than these things often are but im too in love with the official flag. Also, like all attempts to retain the design elements of the old flag it misses the point that the new flag doesn't look anything like the old flag, and is built entirely of elements commemorating the revolution. So red and black as primary colors to represent the anarchist and communist contributions, and the various elements are symbolic of workers, farmers and professionals.

but you should expect this reaction, after all misplaced nationalism is inevitable in AH and is the reason that, for instance, the USA has an asterisk in the Decades of Darkness timeline. Misplaced nationalism is annoying but after sometime you just learn to roll your eyes and move on.
 
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I have a theory regarding the woman fighting in the Second World War.

I'm guessing that huge majority of them come not from cities, from the Mountain West.

The history of the American frontier is full of surprises, one of them being that the mountain states gave woman the right to vote decades before Eastern states did. The reasons were far from altruistic, but states like Wyoming and Utah embraced woman's suffrage, even in the face of outrage from Washington. Many woman firsts came from the region, including Jeannette Rankin of Montana (who I imagine would play a prominent role in American socialism).

Would women living out west, inspired by woman rights victories in their past, make up a disproportionate number of volunteers in the UASR?


It's also a close enough war to the revolution that plenty of veterans of the civil war and the Spanish revolution will probably still be around.
 
The Darkest Hour: Opening of the Western Front Winter 1941/42
Excerpts from History of the Entente-cordiale, Fourth Edition (Paris: Fraternité, 2005)

A Sixth-Form/Lycée level history textbook, one of the standards in education since the late 1980s. Many modern French or British students were exposed to it in school. It represents the absolute middle of the road of historical opinion.

Chapter VI: The Darkest Hour

The Popular Front had been in power scarcely a month before the domestic situation began deteriorating. The invasion of Norway had provoked a deep rift among many figures in the previous centre-right régime. Under the leadership of Leon Blum of the SFIO, a broadly anti-fascist coalition had claimed a mandate to prepare for an “inevitable outbreak of hostilities with Germany,” as Blum had put it.

The army, always a deeply conservative institution, was still modernizing. Its leaders were as divided as the general populace. Many saw no sense in interfering with Germany’s anti-communist war aims. Marshal Petain, a patriot and hero of the Great War, made a grievous miscalculation in judging German aims. Communicating through back channels with Adolf Hitler, Marshal Petain became increasingly convinced that the civilian leadership was dangerously out of touch with the world, an increasingly common delusion among the military leadership.

The final straw came on 12 December 1941, when Prime Minister Blum issued orders for mobilization in response to increased German military presence in the Rhineland. Convinced that war was imminent, Marshal Petain began to rally a group of co-conspirators to deliver what he called “the military’s vote of no confidence in the Blum government.” This act would only serve to play into Hitler’s plans.

On 2 February 1942, preparations were complete. Marshal Petain delivered his pronunciamiento, announcing that the military had no faith in the civilian government. The address called upon “patriots of France” to oust the “communist dupes” from the Palais Bourbon. The commanders of the forces stationed along the Maginot Line made their support of the Marshal public. A week long standoff began between the government and the military.

Across the Channel, the government of the United Kingdom could only watch helplessly. Prime Minister Edward Wood sought to mediate between the two camps. The issue was forced when the Corps de Cavalerie, at the orders of General René Prioux, advanced on Paris. With his three light mechanized divisions, General Prioux hoped to seize the capital quickly, and overthrow the government before a civil war would develop between the Petainists and the Loyalists. The question of whether he acted independently, on the orders of his army group commander, or on the orders of Marshal Petain himself, is an open historical question. Many of the men who might have known took the secret to their graves, and the Nazi collaborationist regime worked tirelessly to destroy incriminating documents in its twilight days.

Regardless of whose orders General Prioux acted on, the civil war began with the Parisian citizens taking to the barricades to block the advance of the Corps de Cavalerie. The Gendarmerie fought tenaciously enough to give the mobilized reserve divisions loyal to the Republic time to reinforce the capital.

Whatever excuses we make for the old heroes of France must end on the night of 10 February. Marshal Petain met that evening with Rudolf Hess, Hitler’s favored lieutenant. They brokered an agreement in which Germany would support and recognize a new régime under Petain’s leadership and assist with the pacification of the country. In exchange, the French State would join as a full member of the Anti-Comintern Axis.

On the next day, the German government announced its police action in support of the French people’s “valiant efforts to throw off the Judeo-Bolshevik yoke.” The 1st and 2nd Army Groups, constituting the bulk of the French Army’s modern mechanized forces and combat power turned towards the heartland, supported by the German Army Group West.

It was a crushing morale blow that pushed much of the remainder of the French Army in the metropole into Petain’s camp. Nevertheless, the Loyalists mounted a valiant resistance. Battle was joined in the north-east, as Frenchman fought Frenchman amidst the cemeteries of the Great War.

In the UK, a faction of the Conservative Party rebelled, forcing a no-confidence vote against the Prime Minister. The splinter Torys, under the leadership of Winston Churchill established an alliance with Labour, elevating Clement Attlee to the premiership. The new government vowed to support the Republic unconditionally. A declaration of war was issued against Germany on 14 February 1942. The union treaty would be ratified two weeks later, mere days before the fall of Paris.

While much of the government was able to evacuate, the fall of the capital ended most major fighting in the metropole. Remaining loyalist units were ordered to evacuate to the south of France to continue resistance. In the resulting March of Sorrow, armed resistance began to collapse quickly. Military units were internally divided, and with Petain’s quick succession of crushing victories, demoralization hit swiftly. Only a handful of crack divisions endured the March of Sorrow, evacuating into Red Spain on 1 April 1942.

The Entente government was soon faced with a difficult choice. Italy had been mobilizing for war since the start of the crisis. With French Algeria and the bulk of the Marine Nationale swearing allegiance to Marshal Petain, the size of the threat to the Royal Navy in the Mediterranean had quickly doubled. With recent intelligence indicating mere weeks until Falangist Spain mobilized for war, the Blum-Attlee diumvirate agreed to begin evacuating refugee troops from Red Spain.

Right on their heels, the Italians began their move against Malta. In a costly victory, the long bastion of British power in the Mediterranean fell after a week of brutal fighting, while the Italian Navy delivered a powerful bloody nose to the Mediterranean fleet at the Battle of the Ionian Sea, sinking the aircraft carrier HMS Formidable, the battleship HMS Warspite, two light cruisers and destroyer, at the cost of one of their own battleships and a heavy cruiser.

Having lost the initiative in the Mediterranean, the military would be forced to make strategic withdrawals as the Italian Army advanced into Egypt. The vast fighting power of the British Empire was out of position, deployed in opposition to Socialist America with the expectation that the next war would be against them. The prospect of a general war in Europe was prepared for too little, too late, as Field Marshal Montgomery concluded in his memoirs.

1942 would be a year of retreat for the fledgling Entente. In June, a joint Falangist/German force would take Gibraltar, shuttering the Pillars of Hercules. In that same month, the British Somaliland force would fight a desperate and losing battle against the Italian Abyssinian Corps, while Italian spearheads moved on Alexandria and Cairo in Egypt. By September, the Entente would be forced out of the Mediterranean entirely. The damaged battleships HMS Valiant and Queen Elizabeth were scuttled just off the coast as rest of the Mediterranean Fleet evacuated via the Suez Canal.

The war reached its darkest hour, as the King of Iraq turned against his Entente allies, conspiring with Turkey to divide the Loyalist French Mandate for Syria. Within a day, Imperial Japanese forces announced the capture of Manila. A campaign against French Indochina and British Burma and New Guinea would soon follow.

On the Eastern Front, after a titanic summer battle that claimed nearly a million lives on both sides, the city of Stalingrad nearly fell to the Germans. While the Comintern saw more success in pushing German troops further from Moscow, it came at the staggering cost of almost four hundred thousand lives, more troops than had been lost in the entirety of fighting on the Western Front at that point in the war.

Next: the AH.com brigade picks apart their history books. Truly the universities are nests of Reds!
 
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Wow..I thought the FBU could pull off an Algerian evacuation as in The Sword of Freedom but they were in real deep trouble.

Why is the Regia Marina more successful though?

Also how's the Pacific unfolding?
 
Wow..I thought the FBU could pull off an Algerian evacuation as in The Sword of Freedom but they were in real deep trouble.

Why is the Regia Marina more successful though?

Also how's the Pacific unfolding?

Probably for the same reason why the Nazis are better at mass production ITTL: capital flight. We've already seen what Henry Ford contributed to the Nazi war effort, so maybe other capitalist running dogs from the Americas have made similar investments in the Fascist countries.

By early 1942, the Pacific theater should be in full combat mode. I imagine the UASR's strategy over here will be much the same as the OTL US's fight against the Japanese empire. The key difference is that the West European allies will be even more concerned about re-asserting post-war influence in the region so as to preserve capitalism's foothold in the East. Also, the WFRN will be a vital supplier of aid to the Latin American reds in their battle against Brazil's Integralists.

Meanwhile on the Asian mainland, the 2nd Sino-Japanese war is, according to the_red_star _rising, as much a civil war as it is a war of Japanese conquest. In the revisions, one of the UASR's earliest diplomatic successes was helping to negotiate a peace between the Chinese communists and the Guomindang/Kuomintang. This obviously displeases the right-wing segments of the GMD/KMT and other backwards forces within China (like the already-established Manchukuo puppet state), to the point where Japan's invasion is welcomed by such groups as a means of saving the Middle Kingdom from the Commies. All in all, the war in China will probably be just as, if not more brutal than OTL. There won't be a resumption of the country's civil war following WWII, since by that point all the native capitalists/rural elites/Imperial pretenders will have been defeated alongside the IJA.
 
Probably for the same reason why the Nazis are better at mass production ITTL: capital flight. We've already seen what Henry Ford contributed to the Nazi war effort, so maybe other capitalist running dogs from the Americas have made similar investments in the Fascist countries.

I mean on the operational level though.IOTL the RN could wreck them even when Britain was literally alone.

The WFRN might try to hammer unto the Southern Mandates without the need to defend Phillipines and Australia
 
I mean on the operational level though.IOTL the RN could wreck them even when Britain was literally alone.

The WFRN might try to hammer unto the Southern Mandates without the need to defend Phillipines and Australia
The great issue with the Regia Marina is that the Germans "borrowed" all their fuel and Italy's "fleet in being" doctrine discouraged them from ever actually seeking battle with the Royal Navy, and they couldn't get the Marine National's assistance because Britain basically sunk the parts of the French navy loyal to Petain as quickly as possible. Here, Germany had access to Britain, the Netherlands, and France's fuel supplies for two years and clearly Italy reconsidered the Regia Marina's status as Mussolini's personal fleet of rubber ducks. Italy also had some hilarious doctrinal issues regarding night fighting (they weren't allowed to do it at all, so they locked their turrets in place), which ITTL has been corrected a bit with some British and Japanese training assistance for night fighting. Similarly, the Royal Navy was not expecting to have to engage basically every battleship, plane, destroyer, cruiser, and canoe Mussolini had up his sleeve to win control of the Mediterranean to fulfill his mad dream of a new Roman Empire and mare nostrum.

They did make some preparations, because Italy's territorial ambitions are entirely incompatible with the extant French and British Empires, but not quite enough. More investment in 1920s Italy (and a much earlier discovery of Libyan Oil) followed by daddy Koch fleeing to Italy during 1933 to sink his money into the place (as well as Romania), also helps buoys Italy's military-economic potential and further alleviates its (and the Axis as a whole's) fuel concerns as well as gives it a much better base to attack Egypt and push into the middle east from. So I suppose you could say that Koch is the Henry Ford of Italy.

Italy ultimately can't win this war in the long run as Britain's shipbuilding capacity is simply much better, as is their carrier doctrine (though in the med, you can much more reliably count on land based airplane interference than in the Pacific), and France will turn out to not be particularly enthusiastic in the long run, and sooner or later, Britain can force Italy into engagements it can't win but has to fight anyway. Plus, the Commonwealth's pockets of manpower are a lot deeper than the Italian Empire's.
 
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The great issue with the Regia Marina is that the Germans "borrowed" all their fuel and Italy's "fleet in being" doctrine discouraged them from ever actually seeking battle with the Royal Navy, and they couldn't get the Marine National's assistance because Britain basically sunk the parts of the French navy loyal to Petain as quickly as possible. Here, Germany had access to Britain, the Netherlands, and France's fuel supplies for two years and clearly Italy reconsidered the Regia Marina's status as Mussolini's personal fleet of rubber ducks. Italy also had some hilarious doctrinal issues regarding night fighting (they weren't allowed to do it at all, so they locked their turrets in place), which ITTL has been corrected a bit with some British and Japanese training assistance for night fighting. Similarly, the Royal Navy was not expecting to have to engage basically every battleship, plane, destroyer, cruiser, and canoe Mussolini had up his sleeve to win control of the Mediterranean to fulfill his mad dream of a new Roman Empire and mare nostrum.

They did make some preparations, because Italy's territorial ambitions are entirely incompatible with the extant French and British Empires, but not quite enough. More investment in 1920s Italy (and a much earlier discovery of Libyan Oil) followed by daddy Koch fleeing to Italy during 1933 to sink his money into the place (as well as Romania), also helps buoys Italy's military-economic potential and further alleviates its (and the Axis as a whole's) fuel concerns as well as gives it a much better base to attack Egypt and push into the middle east from. So I suppose you could say that Koch is the Henry Ford of Italy.

Italy ultimately can't win this war in the long run as Britain's shipbuilding capacity is simply much better, as is their carrier doctrine (though in the med, you can much more reliably count on land based airplane interference than in the Pacific), and France will turn out to not be particularly enthusiastic in the long run, and sooner or later, Britain can force Italy into engagements it can't win but has to fight anyway. Plus, the Commonwealth's pockets of manpower are a lot deeper than the Italian Empire's.

Point taken.

Speaking of carriers,would Italy and Germany try to build the Aquila and the Graf Zeppelin?

inb4 cliche and target practice for the WFRN/RN
 
[FONT=&quot]Excerpts from History of the Entente-cordiale, Fourth Edition (Paris: Fraternité, 2005)[/FONT]



[FONT=&quot]Having lost the initiative in the Mediterranean, the military would be forced to make strategic withdrawals as the Italian Army advanced into Egypt. The vast fighting power of the British Empire was out of position, deployed in opposition to Socialist America with the expectation that the next war would be against them. The prospect of a general war in Europe was prepared for too little, too late, as Field Marshal Montgomery concluded in his memoirs. [/FONT]

Well, that's going to be awkward to explain to the folks at home.

"Yeah, so remember how we were all worried about the Socialists in the Americas? Welllll, it seems they didn't want to pick a fight with us, so, whoops?"
 
Well. Things are looking bad in Western Europe. That's for sure. Although something tells me Petain is going to have more trouble ruling than he did taking power. The government was ousted, but they haven't even really begun the effort of dislodging France's communist Unions from the factories or of really purging the probably substantial fifth column behind their backs.
 
Well, that's going to be awkward to explain to the folks at home.

"Yeah, so remember how we were all worried about the Socialists in the Americas? Welllll, it seems they didn't want to pick a fight with us, so, whoops?"

It's also not going to go over well to know that throughout three years of conflict between the Nazis and the communists they were deployed as if the assumption was that they'd fight with the Nazis.
 
Before or after they find the camps?

Both. Hindsight is a powerful thing, and the knowledge that the preparation was going towards the side they ended up fighting against (independent of all other factors) would not fly. But it will be worse and only get worse as public opinion on the Nazis becomes ever more viscerally hostile. I wouldn't be shocked if the communists spin this into winning propaganda. "As the Nazi War Machine rose in the east and killed millions, The Tories and the Labour government prepared for war to support them! Vote Communist, because the working class are the only class to have never betrayed Britain".
 
And here I thought the 1945 elections were bad for Tories.

It's starting to look like not having anyone run might be advisable.
 
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