That Wacky Redhead

[joea64]

The potential for a crossover between TheMann's "Canadian Power" and "That Wacky Redhead" is making my head spin. (If you haven't followed that excellent TL, or the spinoffs "Rise of the North" and "In Defense of Humanity" on ASB, the election of the Tories led by Robert Stanfield is the key POD, though I think in the case of "Canadian Power" the crucial election happened a few years earlier.)

 

[joea64]

Hmm... so Munich still happens.

Sadly, the butterflies don't appear to have hit the Middle East quite yet. However, it'll be interesting to see what OTL Trekker Prince Abdullah of Jordan thinks of TTL Star Trek.

 

[Falkenburg]

Intriguing Update, Brainbin.

I'm only really aware of Cosell from his interactions with Ali, so it is interesting to get an idea of his wider career.

Presumably the shock to the system will prompt a Canadian Comeback?
That should prove entertaining.
Perhaps an Olympic Revenge, if the issues with Professionals can be resolved.

Falkenburg

 

[phx1138]

The upstart WHA would prove surprisingly able to compete with the established NHL, due to their adeptness at attracting quality players

It also had a real beneficial effect in opening up the NHL to European players. And the pernicious effect of spiking salaries skyward...

infamous Munich Massacre, during which Palestinian terrorists kidnapped and later murdered Israeli athletes and coaches who had been participating in the Games. The international incident exposed West German authorities as woefully unprepared for such an event

It also sets the stage for one of Mossad's most famous ops & an excellent TV miniseries on it.

Canadian performance in ...in 1972 was shameful

Have you watched Canada's performance at an Olympics? The only way we win gold is for the Sovs or U.S. not to show up. (I'm waiting for Jamaica to beat Team Canada in hockey.)

narrowly lost the Summit Series

I recall the color guys at the time saying it was going to change how hockey was played, since the methodical Sov style was so much different, & clearly effective. TTL, I imagine that's even more true.

Tories, would win the election

I don't doubt it, but I do wonder how you're explaining that one.

Fischer, in addition to being eccentric, was also reclusive and egotistical

Can you say Arkady Balagan?

Among the incentives that finally convinced Fischer to challenge for the title on realistic terms IOTL was a phone call from National Security Advisor (and later Secretary of State) Henry Kissinger, who will not serve in either position ITTL.

The smallest things. And another item I'd probably have ignored, along with the Summit Series. Well done on both.

 

[Electric Monk]

Yay! Stanfield! The Last Radical Tory. If you want to make Ed Broadbent PM next that would just about cover nicest and smartest Canadian political leaders (albeit rather differently ideologically) to never make it there.

As for how he wins, well obviously he catches the football and spins it into a metaphor about how he's catching the ball and Trudeau is dropping it.

 

[Brasidas]

As for how he wins, well obviously he catches the football and spins it into a metaphor about how he's catching the ball and Trudeau is dropping it.

Stanfield repeatedly did catch the ball. The photographer kept snapping away that day until it he got the shot he wanted.

 

[Electric Monk]

Stanfield repeatedly did catch the ball. The photographer kept snapping away that day until it he got the shot he wanted.

Oh I know, which makes the photo even stupider. ITTL my guess is that sports based butterflies give Stanfield an opening his x number of successful catches to make a statement.

 

[Brainbin]

Thank you all for your replies - on the whole, I quite liked how this one turned out, as it really helps to put That Wacky Redhead within the context of a wide and equally wacky world! But first, as always, to catch up with older comments...

I hope you do something with Tom Baker- he's too good to waste!

We'll find out who succeeds Pertwee as the Fourth Doctor in due time. Whether or not it's Baker is another matter entirely - and if it isn't, I unfortunately see no real reason to mention him.

Will Zatanna still be around? Will she still join the JLA?

I'm afraid I'm not enough of a comics expert to say at the moment. That will require further research. If you have any suggestions on the matter, I would love to hear them. The same goes for the rest of you, with regards to comic books.

You might say there's a "gilt age" between the wartime books & Showcase, but that's really swan song of GA IMO.

My personal boundaries are: Golden Age 1938 - late 1940s; Silver Age late 1940s - 1970; Bronze Age 1970 - 86; Dark Age 1986 - 2000; "Modern" Age 2000 - present. I agree, there should probably be a more concrete delineation between the Golden and Silver Ages. TV Tropes refers to that murky period as the "Interregnum", which I suppose would work.

Neeless to say, a TL of mine would tend to be comics-friendly. (Which is why PIOT gives Wertham a smack & lets the horror books survive).

The core of Wertham's conclusions - that comics needed an internal ratings and review board - are sound, IMO. Of course, the rather sensationalistic tone of his findings and the acute paranoia that so defined the 1950s blew the whole thing way out of proportion, but I definitely think that there could have been a place for them, had a lot of other things gone differently.

Black and white Doctor Who will less reliably play on VHF and not in every market. It will tend to show up on early daytime or late night or even just as weekend fare. It's largest player will be UHF I agree and on those stations they might help fill the afternoon evening slots.

VHF is going to be a wasteland for early Doctor Who at this time. There are only so many timeslots, and two potential Doctor Who slots will, almost without exception, be occupied by one episode of Star Trek.

I could see some UHF stations playing several episodes in a row back to back as a Doctor Who weekend movie sort of like the olf Creature Feature type fare.

Fair enough - that's a distinct possibility.

Most of the Pertwee era story arcs ran four to six 25 minute episodes. I wonder if with an eye to stripping anyone would think to standardize to five which would fit neatly into a five day workweek daily airing.

Maybe when ratings are lower, thus giving NBC and Desilu more pull in editorial and creative content.

This might also suggest an-alt 4th Doctor along the lines of the resurrection as 6th Doctor where he's initially played much darker prompting any companions/audience to wonder if the new Doctor is actually the new Master....

I like that plot idea. We'll have to see if anything comes of it.

Happy TWR Centennary, Brainbin. Here's hoping for many more Posts.

Thank you very much

Er, I wouldn't want you to go away with that impression.
At most I'd say a tiny minority of even those of my 'persuasion' (themselves a minority within the Nationalist minority in Norn Iron)
would have shared the 'extreme' viewing prejudices of my childhood home.

All right, fair enough. Actually, it's funny that you mention this - I was actually thinking that Quebec fits the stereotype of Northern Ireland much better than Canada as a whole, at least in terms of passions and ideological "purity", and various "levels" of intensity. Your detailing of the finer nuances of the situation definitely strengthen that impression.

One good turn deserves another...

You've found Canada's greatest weakness: cheaply-produced game shows!

Now then, let me mention here that I am well aware that the jewel in the crown of early 1970s syndication is Star Trek. I suspect it will go to the biggest bidder for each market. Don't know what Desilu's policy will be on it, but you might even see more than one channel per market buying it, and then battling to see who can place it more strategically.

And that is the most important thing to remember about Desilu's marketing strategy at this time. They're commanding insane prices for Star Trek; by comparison, Doctor Who is very much a lesser priority. They want to sell the first season of the Pertwee era because they see direct benefits from that; but Hartnell and Troughton are headed deep into the UHF wilderness.

I'd bet you'll see a few bigger markets using it as late-night filler, the way my local station used to use Oz TV (before infomercials).

You better believe it.

Hmm... so Munich still happens.

Unfortunately, yes. Indeed, the situation in the Middle East is going to proceed along OTL lines for quite some time to come.

The potential for a crossover between TheMann's "Canadian Power" and "That Wacky Redhead" is making my head spin.

I have indeed read it, during my long, lean lurker days. Though it's both rather fanciful and butterfly-light, it's a great read. As for how closely the Canada of That Wacky Redhead will resemble that of Canadian Power, well, that would be telling

Sadly, the butterflies don't appear to have hit the Middle East quite yet. However, it'll be interesting to see what OTL Trekker Prince Abdullah of Jordan thinks of TTL Star Trek.

He'll be a big fan ITTL, as well - and he'll never suffer the indignity of having to appear on an inferior spinoff.

Intriguing Update, Brainbin.

Fittingly, I had some rather nice beer with dinner tonight. Consider that my drink.

I'm only really aware of Cosell from his interactions with Ali, so it is interesting to get an idea of his wider career.

Their relationship is a fascinating one, because it really gave us a unique look at two titans of their respective fields coming together.

Presumably the shock to the system will prompt a Canadian Comeback?

Well, once you've hit rock bottom, there's nowhere to go but up!

It also sets the stage for one of Mossad's most famous ops & an excellent TV miniseries on it.

And don't expect me to mention any of that! (But yes, those underlying events did happen ITTL.)

I'm waiting for Jamaica to beat Team Canada in hockey.

I should say that bobsledding is a little more realistic, wouldn't you?

I don't doubt it, but I do wonder how you're explaining that one.

My reasoning actually isn't even implied in the update itself; the "Sports Pledge" was just the icing on the cake.

The smallest things. And another item I'd probably have ignored, along with the Summit Series. Well done on both.

Thank you. Actually, anon_user gave me the idea to discuss chess. If you can believe it, that whole post was originally centred on that (non-)event. Then I remembered that chess is the "Sport of Kings", and it all snowballed from there.

Yay! Stanfield! The Last Radical Tory.

Red Toryism (think Rockefeller Republicanism or One Nation Conservatism, for outsiders) is going to see a very different fate ITTL.

If you want to make Ed Broadbent PM next that would just about cover nicest and smartest Canadian political leaders (albeit rather differently ideologically) to never make it there.

Funny that you should mention Broadbent - you'll be hearing about him sooner than you think.

As for how he wins, well obviously he catches the football and spins it into a metaphor about how he's catching the ball and Trudeau is dropping it.

Stanfield repeatedly did catch the ball. The photographer kept snapping away that day until it he got the shot he wanted.

Oh I know, which makes the photo even stupider. ITTL my guess is that sports based butterflies give Stanfield an opening his x number of successful catches to make a statement.

Welcome aboard, Brasidas! But as to this argument - though I like your reasoning, Electric Monk - I'm afraid it's all immaterial. Because IOTL, Stanfield made the famous fumble during the 1974 election campaign, not the 1972 one. But since the legend goes that it was primarily responsible for his loss, I think it came to be associated with the extremely close 1972 contest - in which such a near thing seems a lot more plausible - rather than 1974, which Trudeau won with a comfortable majority. And no such photo op took place ITTL, either.

Some information on the Canadian Federal Election of 1972 should be forthcoming in the next couple of days. After that, our next proper update will find us revisiting the Bunker household, as we explore the continuing broadcast history of Those Were The Days!

 

[Electric Monk]

I knew it was 1974 even as I was typing it and yet arrgh! I blame everything on other people .

 

[phx1138]

My personal boundaries are: Golden Age 1938 - late 1940s; Silver Age late 1940s - 1970; Bronze Age 1970 - 86; Dark Age 1986 - 2000; "Modern" Age 2000 - present. I agree, there should probably be a more concrete delineation between the Golden and Silver Ages. TV Tropes refers to that murky period as the "Interregnum", which I suppose would work.

I suppose it depends on how you mean the terms. If "GA" is "classic GA", the years of the origins of the GA characters & the best GA stories, I'd agree. The accepted break is Showcase, & I adopt the convention there, with the "gilt" proviso: comics generally, & superheroes especially, were in serious decline by '56. I put the SA end a little later, I think; if I was dating it, I'd tend to say the Bronze (a term I don't use much, myself) dates from Giant Xmen #1. Dark, as said, after the Brood Saga in Xmen, because this was also the era of JLI. I couldn't date it, tho I was reading a fair bit of stuff then.

The core of Wertham's conclusions - that comics needed an internal ratings and review board - are sound

Wertham's conclusions are nonsense. The supposed harms were based on books written, & intended, for adults causing children to misbehave. He utterly ignores the Baby Boom. He draws false causality. There is so much junk science in his work, it's impossible to take him seriously. (Honestly, Bruce & Dick as gay lovers?) The CCA ended up destroying a major competitor, EC, which is what it appears to have been designed to do. And Canadian prosecutions should have been thrown out as frivolous. Yes, the publishers should've policed the retailers more carefully, & should've expressly labelled some stuff in the modern fashion, "Mature readers" or "Not for children", or something. (Retailers complaining they "had to" buy it is nonsense, too. The order sheets would've allowed them to buy what they thought they could sell, unless I'm very much mistaken.)

the rather sensationalistic tone of his findings and the acute paranoia that so defined the 1950s blew the whole thing way out of proportion

Oh, yeah. There was an insane amount of overreaction. Burning comics?

And don't expect me to mention any of that!

Fair enough.

those underlying events did happen ITTL.

I'll satisfy myself knowing it hasn't changed. (Nor, I suspect, Mossad stealing the plans of the Mirage, a story no novelist would dare make up.)

I should say that bobsledding is a little more realistic, wouldn't you?

That was too easy. It was what I expected would be the first thought, since it was mine.

My reasoning actually isn't even implied in the update itself

That's why I ask, actually. Since politics is a complete mystery to me, mostly, & since I like to be able to understand the thinking. (Most of what you've done, I can follow the reasoning behind; I'm a bit curious, at all points, to know if I'd do differently.)

Actually, anon_user gave me the idea to discuss chess.

I'm not a bit surprised. That's a guy who's got excellent ideas, & I always find him thought-provoking, even when I can't get a grip to produce anything. (Whence PIOT in a deep slump...)

If you can believe it, that whole post was originally centred on that (non-)event. Then I remembered that chess is the "Sport of Kings", and it all snowballed from there.

I can easily believe it. It only takes one domino.

 

[Glen]

Brainbin,I will admit that I am trying to lay out best case scenario for Who ITTL but do so following the logic you've been setting out. Maybe there are one or two things that I am not getting right. First,I was under the impression that Desilu had bought the US syndication rights for ALL of Doctor Who,in which case they do have a vested interest albeit smaller in selling those First and Second Doctor episodes. Second,while I get that Trek is the number one syndication product, there is still only a few hours of network programming a day,and usually more than one big stgation in a market. Not every big station is going to be able to show every free hour Star Trek. I think there is enough time in the day for a half hour of Who,even with heavy Trek domination.

 

[Glen]

Brainbin,I will admit that I am trying to lay out best case scenario for Who ITTL but do so following the logic you've been setting out. Maybe there are one or two things that I am not getting right. First,I was under the impression that Desilu had bought the US syndication rights for ALL of Doctor Who,in which case they do have a vested interest albeit smaller in selling those First and Second Doctor episodes. Second,while I get that Trek is the number one syndication product, there is still only a few hours of network programming a day,and usually more than one big stgation in a market. Not every big station is going to be able to show every free hour Star Trek. I think there is enough time in the day for a half hour of Who,even with heavy Trek domination.

I guess you've just done too good of a job setting Who up for success in America,beyond anything a fan could imagine. You linked the show to a more successful Trek. You'e given the syndication rights to the Queen of Syndication. You have made Who a primetime network show that broke into the Top 30. You have post productin being done by what soulds like TTLs version of ILM. And you have given the Who one of the two hings it needed most to flourish - money! The only other thing it needs is time -ilming was always rushed.

NBC and Desilu do not need and should not get more involved in editorial decisions per se with oe exception - back up the show on making monsters more realistic and beat down the Don' Scare The Children crowd.

 

[Brainbin]

Appendix B, Part III: Canadian Federal Election, 1972

And now, for a brief synopsis of the Canadian Federal Election of 1972. (As always, editorial notes and comparison points to OTL will be highlighted in RED and placed in brackets.)

Election Results

The election was held on October 30, 1972, a Monday. (Canadian federal elections always take place on a Monday. The writs are usually dropped five or six weeks beforehand.) Turnout was 77.1%, with 9,730,000 electors casting a ballot. (Turnout IOTL was slightly lower; 76.7%, for 9,677,000 electors total.) 264 electoral districts, or "ridings", were being contested, with 133 seats required for any party to achieve a majority government. The incumbent Liberal government held 146 seats at dissolution (one fewer than IOTL), the opposition Tories held 73, the NDP held 25, the Socreds held 16 (one more than IOTL), there were two independents, and two vacant seats.

Progressive Conservatives ("Tories"): Led by Robert Stanfield, Leader of the Official Opposition, and MP for Halifax, Nova Scotia. Won 3,630,000 votes, or 37.31% of the popular vote. Ran candidates in all 264 ridings; elected 123 MPs. (They received 3,389,000 votes IOTL, good for 35% of the popular vote, and returned 105 MPs.) Areas of strength for the Tories included the province of Alberta, where they won every seat; Stanfield's home province of Nova Scotia; the smallest province, Prince Edward Island; and the largest province, Ontario. However, they won only three seats out of 78 in the second-largest province of Quebec. (An improvement over the two of OTL.)

Liberals ("Grits"): Led by Pierre Trudeau, Prime Minister, and MP for Mount Royal, Quebec. Won 3,540,000 votes, or 36.42% of the popular vote. Ran candidates in all 264 ridings; elected 92 MPs. (They received 3,718,000 votes IOTL, good for 38.42% of the popular vote, and returned 107 MPs.) The Liberals won only one province, Quebec; it was by building up large margins in their strongholds there that the popular vote was so close. (Also a truism IOTL; the Tories were able to form minority governments in 1957 and 1979, despite winning fewer votes than the Grits, because of their more efficient vote distribution.)

New Democratic Party ("Dippers"): Led by David Lewis, MP for York South, Ontario. Won 1,685,000 votes, or 17.32% of the popular vote. Ran candidates in 249 ridings; elected 28 MPs. (They received 1,726,000 votes IOTL, good for 17.83% of the popular vote, and returned 31 MPs.) The NDP won only one province, British Columbia, where the party formed government at the provincial level. They won no seats east of Ontario.

Social Credit ("Socreds" in English, "Créditistes" in French): Led by Réal Caouette, MP for Témiscamingue, Quebec. Won 780,000 votes, or 8.01% of the popular vote. Ran candidates in 171 ridings; elected 19 MPs. (They received 731,000 votes IOTL, good for 7.55% of the popular vote, and returned 15 MPs.) All of their MPs were elected from the province of Quebec, where they ran candidates in every riding.

Two (2) independents - former (and future) PC MP Roch LaSalle of Joliette, Quebec, and former Liberal Lucien Lamoureux of Stormont-Dundas, Ontario, the Speaker of the House of Commons (who had decided to follow the otherwise strictly British convention of ending any party affiliation upon being created Speaker) were elected.

Miscellany

This was the first time that the Tories had been in government since 1963, nine years earlier, under former Prime Minister John G. Diefenbaker (who continued to serve as an MP).

A number of close contests were fought on the riding level. One of the most "epic" was the rematch of the 1968 contest in Oshawa-Whitby, where defeated former cabinet minister Michael Starr of the PCs and incumbent NDP MP Ed Broadbent squared off against each other once again. In one of the narrowest victories of the election, Starr was able to triumph over Broadbent, returning to office and to cabinet. (This one was surprisingly close IOTL; however popular Broadbent - the future leader of the NDP IOTL - may have been with the general public, the good people of his riding seemed to be a lot more reserved about him. ITTL, after losing, he tries for a rematch in the following election, only to lose again and then deciding to return to his prior career as an academic.)

The Tories elected only three MPs from Quebec, all of whom were appointed to cabinet. Georges Valade, who represented a Montreal riding, was created Minister for Sport, in anticipation of the Olympic Games to be held there in 1976. (Valade, of Sainte-Marie, Quebec, is the third PC MP from Quebec, joining Heward Grafftey and Claude Wagner, elected IOTL. Valade had been an MP since 1962, and only narrowly lost his seat in this election, and then again in a rematch in 1974. His presence in the House ITTL gives the Tory government a seat in Montreal, the largest city in Canada.)

Rationale

Since this entire section is going to be out-of-universe, I'll eschew the annotation-style text here. As with so many elections, the question should not be "Why did Stanfield win", but rather "Why did Trudeau lose"? So, why did he lose? Well, Trudeau was known IOTL for his dynamism and charisma, but at the same time, he was very rude, pushy, impolite, brash, crude, and petulant. Regardless of his policies, he was very much a rebellious teenager: "Father" was the strict disciplinarian USA, and "Mother" was the country's British Imperial heritage. I'm going to posit that he, like so many others in this era, thrived largely because he could position himself against the quintessential "boogeyman": Richard Nixon. He invited draft dodgers to Canada with open arms; he took a strong stand against the overseas quagmire; he gloated about his harmonious and tolerant policies in contrast to the self-destructive tendencies of the United States. And naturally, certain groups of people rallied to him; however, he faced considerable resistance. Without the leverage of Nixon, he really has nothing to push against, which makes him look like less of a hero in that respect. And that is what allows critical voices to be heard more clearly: on matters involving the military, athletics, the economy, official bilingualism, etc. It also allows someone with less polish and more substance to come out ahead for once, and so he does. I may yet mention some of Stanfield's policies in the cycles to come.

And, as previously mentioned, the "Sports Pledge" of TTL is merely the icing on the cake. All that said, if anyone has any further questions about the election, or about how elections in Canada work, or the Westminster Parliamentary system in general, please feel free to ask.

 

[phx1138]

I think there is enough time in the day for a half hour of Who,even with heavy Trek domination.

More than that, "Dr Who" will be more in demand than "ST" because it's 30m, & 30m holes are more common. (It's why "Law & Order" was structured the way it was, FWI read...)

Rationale
<snip>

Thx for that.

 

[The Blue-Eyed Infidel]

Brainbin,

Excellent TL. Subscribed

And now, for a brief synopsis of the Canadian Federal Election of 1972. (As always, editorial notes and comparison points to OTL will be highlighted in RED and placed in brackets.)
{SNIP}

Glad to see Trudeau defeated, but then, as an Albertan, I would say that, wouldn't I .

As Red Toryism is in place, might we not see the Stanfield government offering subsidies to Desilu to film new series north of the border?

Anyway, very interested to see where the TL in general is going.

TB-EI

 

[Glen]

So you now have a dream causing the election of different national leaders in two nations, and doing so fairly plausibly. Impressive!

 

[Brainbin]

I knew it was 1974 even as I was typing it and yet arrgh! I blame everything on other people .

Psephology is a very tricky business. I'm certainly not above a few miscalculations and typographical errors either. But I would very much like to hear your thoughts on my summary of the TTL 1972 election in any case

I suppose it depends on how you mean the terms. If "GA" is "classic GA", the years of the origins of the GA characters & the best GA stories, I'd agree.

The unfortunate thing about the Golden Age of Comic Books is that, by most definitions, it overlaps both the Golden Age of Hollywood (1927-52) and the Golden Age of Television (1948-60). And I think that those two more prominent Golden Ages tend to tether it to one of them, depending on the perspective of the person setting the boundaries. And then there's the Golden Age of Radio (1926-62), within which all the other Golden Ages fall. And looking at those date ranges, it's no wonder historians remember Truman so fondly. That second term he wasn't supposed to win contains all four Golden Ages

Yes, the publishers should've policed the retailers more carefully, & should've expressly labelled some stuff in the modern fashion, "Mature readers" or "Not for children", or something. (Retailers complaining they "had to" buy it is nonsense, too. The order sheets would've allowed them to buy what they thought they could sell, unless I'm very much mistaken.)

That was my point. And indeed, if anything, the retailers have too much power, as OTL has repeatedly shown.

I'll satisfy myself knowing it hasn't changed. (Nor, I suspect, Mossad stealing the plans of the Mirage, a story no novelist would dare make up.)

"The difference between reality and fiction? Fiction has to make sense."

- Tom Clancy

I can easily believe it. It only takes one domino.

This whole timeline is quickly becoming a testament to that...

First,I was under the impression that Desilu had bought the US syndication rights for ALL of Doctor Who,in which case they do have a vested interest albeit smaller in selling those First and Second Doctor episodes.

They did indeed, and yes, they do have a vested interest in selling their product.

Not every big station is going to be able to show every free hour Star Trek. I think there is enough time in the day for a half hour of Who,even with heavy Trek domination.

There is - on the UHF stations, during the twilight hours.

I guess you've just done too good of a job setting Who up for success in America,beyond anything a fan could imagine. You linked the show to a more successful Trek. You'e given the syndication rights to the Queen of Syndication. You have made Who a primetime network show that broke into the Top 30. You have post productin being done by what soulds like TTLs version of ILM. And you have given the Who one of the two hings it needed most to flourish - money! The only other thing it needs is time -ilming was always rushed.

I did promise a carrot for my British (and Anglophile, apparently) readers. I did not promise a gourmet feast

NBC and Desilu do not need and should not get more involved in editorial decisions

I'd very much like to see you go to a Board meeting and tell them that.

More than that, "Dr Who" will be more in demand than "ST" because it's 30m, & 30m holes are more common. (It's why "Law & Order" was structured the way it was, FWI read...)

Except that it has never been syndicated in half-hour blocks. It has always been sold by the hour. And, obviously, they've had no shortage of customers. Indeed, the more holistic hour-long spinoffs, SVU and CI, probably do even better in syndication. But you have touched on something interesting about dramatic series that I will be discussing in some detail in later installments.

Excellent TL. Subscribed

Thank you very much, TB-EI, and welcome aboard!

Glad to see Trudeau defeated, but then, as an Albertan, I would say that, wouldn't I .

I'm glad to see that getting rid of Trudeau was able to lure one of his many detractors out of the woodwork - and from none other than Calgary, the very heart of Trudeau antipathy, no less! In fact, I can even guarantee that, unlike IOTL, he will never return to power.

As Red Toryism is in place, might we not see the Stanfield government offering subsidies to Desilu to film new series north of the border?

I have a lot of intriguing ideas with regards to how Stanfield and his Red Tory policies will effect popular culture in this timeline. I have to admit, I wasn't thinking about involving Desilu. And the thing about that studio is that they have a massive backlot (the "back forty", properly known as Desilu Forty Acres) and, when combined with Kirk's Rock, they have a very large number of settings at their disposal.

Anyway, very interested to see where the TL in general is going.

Thank you, and I'm very interested in hearing further input from you as we move forward

So you now have a dream causing the election of different national leaders in two nations, and doing so fairly plausibly. Impressive!

Thank you very much, Glen Trying to keep these causal chains going is challenging, but rewarding.

 

[Glen]

They did indeed, and yes, they do have a vested interest in selling their product.

Meaning when they acquire it, not half a decade later - don't sell short that desire or the ability to market behind it. That Wacky Redhead has already pulled off more with less...

There is - on the UHF stations, during the twilight hours.

That was my first thought, but it doesn't really track on closer inspection. You've raised the visibility of Doctor Who ITTL. I think the First Doctor episodes, which are must slower, and more primitive both in special effects and have the quaintly eccentric acting and ad libbing of Hartnell, they are likely to be the ones we see on UHF stations, but more likely in the early afternoon or even morning, times when kids can watch the show - not that they are really kids shows, but....

The Second Doctor has enough increase in production quality (well, we won't talk about the Yeti) and is more 'modern' in style compared to the First Doctor episodes that it can work in a more prominent role. It is also these episodes that lay a lot of the groundwork for the 'American Years' of Doctor Who, so will work as a good fill in until there are enough Third Doctor episodes for practical syndication. I think these will be attractive enough to end up on VHF stations, maybe even as a poor attempt to counter Star Trek on a competing station. While this is from a bit later date (1978), this is an interesting example:

I did promise a carrot for my British (and Anglophile, apparently) readers. I did not promise a gourmet feast

I know that, but I think you are underestimating the impact your changes are going to make on the syndication market for Doctor Who. I think I've laid out many reasons why that is so. I would ask that you at least consider those in detail. In the end, of course, this is your timeline, your story, and I will enjoy reading how you change things in this world of yours - just want to point out the pathways you have opened in this world.

I'd very much like to see you go to a Board meeting and tell them that.

Whose board meeting? NBC? Desilu? Or how about the BBC? You've already established Desilu as willing to stand up to a network for the good of a series, and quite frankly I doubt that NBC will want to work out the headaches of such a three way negotiation - they'll just cancel running the series if it doesn't fit their needs. Desilu I suppose might interject more, given their the 'talent' side of the American stakeholders, but from what I understand of their deal it really is about post-production, not production. While they might have an interest in discussing things with the BBC, I don't know that they are going to be able or willing to 'manage' a series being created in an entirely different system a continent and ocean away.

Thank you very much, Glen Trying to keep these causal chains going is challenging, but rewarding.

Agreed.

 

[phx1138]

The unfortunate thing about the Golden Age of Comic Books is that, by most definitions, it overlaps both the Golden Age of Hollywood (1927-52) and the Golden Age of Television (1948-60). And I think that those two more prominent Golden Ages tend to tether it to one of them, depending on the perspective of the person setting the boundaries.

I don't find that, myself. Not to say there isn't crossover; it was radio & serial (IDR which did which) which was first to use Perry, Jimmy, & kryptonite.

That was my point.

Then I've misunderstood. Wertham, Congress, & CCA all wanted content restrictions, beyond even the Production Code. On the basis of flimsy & flat wrong evidence.

And indeed, if anything, the retailers have too much power, as OTL has repeatedly shown.

I'm not seeing that, myself. Why were they complaining about "having to buy" the horror books? Was that the distributor offering no option? Even today, the majors don't actually own them (AFAIK).

"The difference between reality and fiction? Fiction has to make sense."

- Tom Clancy

So I've heard.

This whole timeline is quickly becoming a testament to that...

+1 to the TL game: take a shot when somebody mentions "domino".

Except that it has never been syndicated in half-hour blocks. It has always been sold by the hour.

IDK.

more holistic hour-long spinoffs, SVU and CI, probably do even better in syndication.

I've a suspicion that's because they're scheduled opposite so much junk... It's also possible to get really familiar with a show in a hurry, which helps. (I only started on "SG:A" in repeats after watching their second-last episode. {I'd seen bits & pieces, but never a whole one.} It was good enough, I started from the beginning...)

I can even guarantee that, unlike IOTL, he will never return to power.

So Canadan slang loses a valuable euphemism.

the thing about that studio is that they have a massive backlot ... very large number of settings at their disposal.

True. As the Canadian dollar drops, however, it makes shooting here more attractive. Moreso with Telefilm (whatever it was called...) money; there's a reason so many "tax dodge" films were shot here.

 

[Electric Monk]

Directory

• That Wacky Redhead
• This Season is the First Season of the Rest of Your Career (1966-67)
• Beyond the Rim of the Star-light, or: Star Trek: The Early Years (1964-67)
• We Hope You Enjoy the Show (1967-68)
• Appendix A, Part I: Star Trek, Season 2 (1967-68)
• Where No Man Has Gone Before (1968-69)
• Appendix B, Part I: Current Events (US Presidential Election, 1968)
• The Rating Game (1968-69)
• Appendix A, Part II: Star Trek, Season 3 (1968-69)
• More To Come... Right After These Messages (July 24, 1969)
• Let The Sunshine In (1969-70)
• Appendix B, Part II: Moonlight Madness
• Appendix A, Part III: Star Trek, Season 4 (1969-70)
• A Night At The Movies
• The Many Faces Of Doctor Who
• More To Come... Right After These Messages (April 15, 1971)
• The End of an Era (1970-71)
• Appendix A, Part IV: Star Trek, Season 5 (1970-71)
• Doctor Who and the Enterprise (1970-71)
• Science Fiction/Double Feature
• Meet The Bunkers
• The Final Curtain for Classic TV
• More To Come... Right After These Messages (May 19, 1972)
• The More Things Change, The More They Stay The Same (1971-72)
• Appendix A, Part V: Star Trek Miscellany
• Doctor Who and the Americans
• The Wide World of Sports
• Appendix B, Part III: Canadian Federal Election, 1972