No Southern Strategy: The Political Ramifications of an Alternate 1964 Election

[Bulldoggus]

DANIEL PATRICK MOTHERFUCKING MOYNIHAN!!!!!!! MY FAVORITE PERSON EVER!!!!!!! THE BEST PRESIDENT WE NEVER HAD!!!!!!!

 

[Bulldoggus]

Holy shit. I just saw Ben Carson as a paleoliberal. WHAT TORTURE ARE YOU GOING TO INFLICT ON US???

 

[Oppo]

Is Alan Keyes going to be a Democratic Senator in the Maryland update? If so, aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

 

[Bulldoggus]

Is Alan Keyes going to a Democratic Senator in the Maryland update? If so aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

Maryland Senators Keyes and Carson.
Goodbye, cruel world.

 

[Prince Daemon Targaryen]

Very interesting update! I'd love to hear one about the prominent ideologies of the GOP

 

[CLEMENT_ATLEES_SOCKS]

every time I'm done reading an update this is what happens

"this makes absolutely no sense"

*re-reads entire tl*

"Why does it make so much sense?

 

[GrasshopperKing]

The former Louisiana Governor had surrounded himself with likeminded individuals in his campaign team, ranging from Jeane Kirkpatrick, Zbigniew Brzezinski, R. James Woolsey, Richard Perle, and Paul Wolfowitz. It was under these conditions that the 'infiltration' of the McKeithen campaign was conducted, made easier by the good relations between Wagner, Casey, and Koch, to the candidate himself.

Rather worrisome echoes of Dubya here tbh. Is this trip around the world preparing us for TTL's Iraq?

Great update overall. Interesting to see the Democrats and Republicans reversed, sort of, in that Democratic coalition is built around a dominant ideology and Republicans are less ideological and primarily working to deliver to their base constituencies. Or at least that's my perception.

Paleoliberalism makes a lot of intuitive sense to me. Like if an ideology like that were so mainstream I might have been strongly drawn to it, and never become the weirdo socialist y'all know ans love. Like when I was a kid and I first found out about the Democrats for Life of America I thought they were great and wanted to join them and I had hoped I would be able to vote for Bill Ritter in 2016 after eight years of Obama. It's interesting to think about how I'd behave politically dropped into this timeline, but even more interesting to imagine developing politically in such a context.

 

[Morraw]

Rather worrisome echoes of Dubya here tbh. Is this trip around the world preparing us for TTL's Iraq?

*Cough Cough*

Kennedy resigned in mid-1991 due to his disagreements with President McKeithen over American involvement in the Korean Unification War, as well as exhaustion from the constant squabbling with other Secretaries and lower level agency heads. His tenure, while no successful in the way he wanted it, provided an early example for later Secretaries to follow. His successor was, fittingly enough, the first director of the Peace Corps, Robert Sargent Shiver.

 

[Nofix]

*Cough Cough*

Good memory.

*Says nothing else to further ruffle the reader's feathers*

 

[djPROUDGEEK]

*Cough Cough*

Good memory.

*Says nothing else to further ruffle the reader's feathers*

...Was that literally the only time that was mentioned? Did we all collectively miss that? Cause if a new Korean War occurred in a TL and no one acknowledged it, I think that's a pretty big failure on our part as AH.Commers.

 

[Prince Daemon Targaryen]

*Cough Cough*

 

[Morraw]

...Was that literally the only time that was mentioned? Did we all collectively miss that? Cause if a new Korean War occurred in a TL and no one acknowledged it, I think that's a pretty big failure on our part as AH.Commers.

I've read this timeline, like, 50 times by now, and I'm about 90% sure that's the only time its been mentioned. TBH, I was expecting it too get a lot more buzz by now.

 

[Francisco Cojuanco]

...Was that literally the only time that was mentioned? Did we all collectively miss that? Cause if a new Korean War occurred in a TL and no one acknowledged it, I think that's a pretty big failure on our part as AH.Commers.

It hasn't happened yet, no?

 

[djPROUDGEEK]

It hasn't happened yet, no?

I can never keep track of what year this TL is in. I just assume a vague "early 90s" timeframe while @Gonzo and @Nofix make their way around the world in big updates.

 

[Nofix]

It hasn't happened yet, no?

Not quite yet. This TL is mostly linear, occasionally jumping back to cover issues up to the """""""""present""""""""" of where a series of posts are. Only recently have we been kind of jumping ahead of America with some European affairs (and trust me, the next European update will do some more of that too).

The Korean War will get it's own update eventually.

 

[Lost Freeway]

How can someone be both so evil and so hilarious?

 

[lord caedus]

>Ochlocracy (mob-rule) is a key concept
>Ben Carson & Alan Keyes notable paleoliberals

Ruh-roh.

​

Paleoliberalism, also called Wardoliberalism, Scoop Jackson Democrat, Second Wave New Deal Democrats or American Christian Democracy is a liberal political philosophy found primarily in the United States and the Democratic Party, which stresses tradition, cultural conservatism, communitarianism, the welfare state, freedom of association, self development and interventionism. The ideology emerged in the late 1970’s and in the early 1980’s with Henry M. ‘Scoop’ Jackson’s nomination as the Democratic Party’s candidate for President in 1980. The ideology has subsequently become the dominant ideology of the Democratic Party.

Much of the bedrock beliefs of the ideology were set out by the American philosopher and University of Chicago academic, Allan Bloom. Bloom in his 1989 book ‘The Closing of the American Mind,’ is credited with the coining of the term “paleoliberalism is political liberalism in the New Deal mould, with a flare of cultural conservatism and opposition to cultural relativism.”

-SNIP-

Elsewhere the ideology was described by the libertarian political activist, David Nolan (who coined the term ‘wardoliberalism’ - a portmanteau of ‘war’ and ‘ordoliberalism’) as "the worst excesses of economic and bedroom statism [...] the Democrat's won't be happy until the government has complete control over the economy, over what you're allowed to do in your home, what you're allowed to think, it's a rancid belief." Meanwhile according to international relations scholar Michael Foley, “paleoliberalism is the espousing of the protection of the rights of workers to organise and bargain collectively; the protection of the interests of the underdog against the control and domination of the powerful; the support of the right to individual privacy within reasonable circumstances - this does not extend to abortion rights, homosexual unions, legalisation of drugs, or the general values of the permissive society - though it does extend to ensuring that the government does not interfere in the reading habits of citizens. The right of ethnic and social minorities to be free from discrimination in housing, employment and in public accommodations; freedom of a free vote without interference. The fundamental right to life, and a decent life for everyone in society - the sanctity of life should not be divorced from the quality of life. The fundamental support for human rights extends to interventionism abroad, in the name of human rights.” [1] Foley, however, adds “government mandated gender equality and the death penalty are issues of contention within the paleoliberal community, though the majority are in favour of the former and opposed to the latter.” Paleoliberalism was simply defined by political commentator Lou Dobbs as being, “pure unadulterated pre-1960’s center-left populist liberalism [...] They consider themselves to be the direct descendants of Jack Kennedy Liberalism.”

So basically these are people who try and combine the underlying beliefs of New Dealer liberalism with cultural conservatism and try and ignore the contradictions of such an ideology?

*Alan Bloom and the Kochs have shows*

Ick.

The former Louisiana Governor had surrounded himself with likeminded individuals in his campaign team, ranging from Jeane Kirkpatrick, Zbigniew Brzezinski, R. James Woolsey, Richard Perle, and Paul Wolfowitz. It was under these conditions that the 'infiltration' of the McKeithen campaign was conducted, made easier by the good relations between Wagner, Casey, and Koch, to the candidate himself.

Good memory.

*Says nothing else to further ruffle the reader's feathers*

B-but how are the American imperialists going to defeat the inventor of the hamburger and greatest golfer in the world?

 

[Lost Freeway]

Why exactly is New Deal economics incompatible wih social conservatism?

 

[sciscisciortino]

It's not that they're incompatible but that it's kind of an unstable compound politically speaking, much like the New Deal Coalition was itself.

 

[Prince Daemon Targaryen]

Why exactly is New Deal economics incompatible wih social conservatism?

I don't think it is, but only if the major underpinnings are structured in a certain way. For example, the economic justice argument that backs up New Deal liberal economics isn't compatible with social conservatism because notions of a "fair society" transform themselves to social issues quite easily (think Jack Kennedy or Barack Obama). However, if the economic liberalism is formed as the government extending it's helping hand to provide a scaffold for the people, then social conservatism can be justified as the government making sure the "moral fabric of the country is secure." Think the latter as George Wallace from NDCR or Rick Santorum.