I know you didn't lay out many details for the scenario but do you have any idea on who could be the ideological leader to establish such a state during the 1910s? I'm very interested in this.
Map Thread XVII
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I know you didn't lay out many details for the scenario but do you have any idea on who could be the ideological leader to establish such a state during the 1910s? I'm very interested in this.
WhiteDragon25
Banned
Quick question: exactly which forum would I post such a thread like this? Post-1900, or Shared Worlds, or some other one?
200 years. Russia has most of the resources it needs, and little competition, so growth was slow.
And... I'm leaning no for Drama's sake?
They're on my personal map thread.
Isaac Beach
Banned
The Kingdom at the Bottom of the World
The first centralized state, for these reasons, arose not along the coasts but in the heart of the island. The Tyerrernotepanner, situated in the Norerytmonerler valley, insulated on all sides by striking but certainly traversable mountains, were able to acquire the technologies from the coast without succumbing to mass extinction[3]. The first city and perennial capital of the island was built here; Tyerrernotepannermakara. The first farms, roadworks, written word and organized militia would develop here; all this in the pursuit of a stable trading relationship with Kuwundi (and later other Yavadvipan and Cinese[4] traders). The farms produced commercial goods for trade, which were carried along roadworks and guarded by militia against less developed tribes that would seek to raid these goods, where they were traded and recorded in official accounts (typically on bark tablets). This gave rise to general prosperity and functional government, leading to internal trade and ‘civilization’ and a rising population. Eventually a network of petty kingdoms arose throughout the eastern half of the island, with population and sophistication enough to insure against a collapse into tribalism even as trade sometimes grew spasmodic as empires arose and fell in those strange northern isles they shared so much with, although such practices persisted in the more isolated areas of the island well into the present day. All this was recorded in the 9th Century Oganeratta’s Chronicles, a surprisingly comprehensive and intact history of the island, having been translated and disseminated as far afield as Al-Yaman and Cina[5].
Although the Tyerrernotepanner did fall in the 8th Century their role was simply subsumed by the Braylwunyer tribe that displaced them, beginning a cycle of centralizations centred on the capital of Tyerrernotepannermakara not dissimilarly from Cina. Internal populations grew and a census in the early 13th Century records a population of at least 3 million. They were joined by coastal enclaves chiefly of Malay fishermen and traders, Cinese architects, Arab sailors and smaller numbers of Persians, Indians, Africans, Maori and the odd European.
As technology improved and Palawa rulers grew bolder, small colonies were established first on the neighbouring islands and then further afield on the great north continent. Following whales, seals and shoals of fish took them first east and then south. A crew of Palawa and Arabs would be the first ship to discovery the icy wasteland at the bottom of the world. Being an industrious sort, the complete lack of vegetation didn’t perturb the Palawans and tiny whaling and sealing outposts were built and would fluctuate between 5 and 200 people with the seasons.
An entire maritime network crisscrossing the Southern Ocean arose, tied into the wider trans Indonesian trade network.
In modern times Tyerrernotepannermakara stands as one of the prettier capital cities. Nicknamed Tyer, it is effectively an overgrown garden city. Towering domes of pines and granite punctuate a cityscape of parkland, orchards and thylacine reserves; vis[6] twine awkwardly overhead wide historic boulevards of cosmopolitan markets and the odd agmen[7], strutted by imported giant peacocks and full of the stenches of sagg bread and karkalla chandleries[8]. Industrial pools of lilies and other hydroponics back onto blocks of circular offices and conurbations, a design borrowed from Hakka architects, and the entire city is surrounded by forests and rivers. All the Palawa and their guests go about in furs and feathers and colour, enjoying what the world has brought them and what they will give to the world: a kingdom at the bottom of the world.
~
[1] – Established in the place of the Kalingga Kingdom of OTL.
[2] – Many of these things also exist in Indonesia, but were not easily harvestable in antiquity. Abalone grow in greater numbers in cold water (like Tasmania), and Indonesian ‘Darah’ trees (TTL’s eucalyptus), i.e. the Rainbow Gumtree, do not produce enough oil to be commercially viable even in modern times.
[3] – Norerytmonerler is the Palawa term for the Campbell Town region, situated in the central Midlands. It’s mostly well drained and supremely fertile grassland, punctuated by bushland, but is very much accessible even from the north and east coast (west and south, not so much).
[4] – Yavadvipa is TTL’s term for Indonesia. And ‘Cinese’ it’s pronounced exactly like ‘Chinese’, just without an H.
[5] – Yemen and China, see [4].
[6] – Vis is a general term for electricity but is also used for powerlines, such as here.
[7] – A train or other track bound vehicles like a tram, here used to describe that latter contraption.
[8] – Couple things here; peacocks were imported from India and per Bergmann's rule have grown larger over several generations due to a cooler climate. Sagg refers to Lomandra Longifolia, basket grass. Karkalla is a native name for pig face and here is used in chandleries, who sell soap, candles and pretty much anything aromatic.
~
This was requested by my partner, which I thought was very sweet. He’s also working on an accompanying infographic; an economic tree much like those export maps you can find on Wikipedia, which I think is absolutely marvellous and an inadvertently unique form of alternate history that I certainly haven’t seen before. Gah, I love him, but I digress.
This world isn’t a part of the world @HatKirby and I are building (which we should really get a name for), but it could be. Otherwise it stands alone just fine. It’s a little bit of a love letter to my state (which is bloody typical of me innit?) as well as the aforementioned partner, so I don’t mind if it’s not 100% plausible but I did try to keep it grounded; full of curios and imagination (‘industrial lily farms’, ‘giant peacocks’, etc.) but within the realm of reality.
I also really hope I didn’t come across as insensitive anywhere. It’s quite hard to talk about an indigenous culture developing technologically and societally without falling into certain condescending traps. I hope I avoided them.
In any event, I hope you enjoyed this little map and soliloquy, I certainly did.
Thank you! And don't worry, the crossing might seem a little overwhelming when I'm listing it all out clinically like I am now, but it's really just where I'm drawing inspiration from for each culture, the general vibe if you will. The individual cultures aren't nearly as crazy hodgepodge as I might have made them seem.
I'll probably get in depth with a full thread in a couple of months. I just need to finish up a few other projects first.
Wow, beautiful map! I am just lacking some legend for these colors...
@HowAboutThisForAName
That map is AMAZING. I literally was yrying to figure out how a Tasmanian Aboriginal civ would work but your map, and the description, is just A++++++!
Your partner has good taste in obscure ideas. What kind of crops are farmed in Palawa? What about the development of local Kangaroo animism?
That map is AMAZING. I literally was yrying to figure out how a Tasmanian Aboriginal civ would work but your map, and the description, is just A++++++!
Your partner has good taste in obscure ideas. What kind of crops are farmed in Palawa? What about the development of local Kangaroo animism?
Even more reason to incorporate them then, haha
Yeah; I could see the Voerstreek, the Dietse Streek en the Land of Herve be Germanized in your TLI am back with that terrible idea of Panslavic Russia trying to "make central Europe slavic again"!
Would someone eventually advise me what basemap would be best for eventual "proper" version of map?
Black are borders between states, yellow borders between Russia/Slavic union and its western "territories".
Territories are: Poland, Prussia, Silesia, Pomerania, Obodritia, Havolia and Lusatian Sorbia - mostly named after medieval slavic tribes/nations living there. Some russian (belarussian/ukrainian or even south slavic) settlers, efforts to assimilate Germans (mostly seen as "germanised Slavs") or to relocate them elsewhere. Towards Poles there is similar policy (soon there will be more of them in Manchuria, Siberia and central Asia than in Poland itself).
Rest are russian allies and puppets - kingdom of Czechoslovakia, Romania, Hungary and "slavic corridor"
Would someone eventually advise me what basemap would be best for eventual "proper" version of map?
Black are borders between states, yellow borders between Russia/Slavic union and its western "territories".
Territories are: Poland, Prussia, Silesia, Pomerania, Obodritia, Havolia and Lusatian Sorbia - mostly named after medieval slavic tribes/nations living there. Some russian (belarussian/ukrainian or even south slavic) settlers, efforts to assimilate Germans (mostly seen as "germanised Slavs") or to relocate them elsewhere. Towards Poles there is similar policy (soon there will be more of them in Manchuria, Siberia and central Asia than in Poland itself).
Rest are russian allies and puppets - kingdom of Czechoslovakia, Romania, Hungary and "slavic corridor"
WhiteDragon25
Banned
Something I wanted to note about my thought process behind how I made this map:
- I wanted to both smooth over some existing RL borders and make them less ugly (fucking panhandles!), and also provide every country with direct sea access of some sort, eliminating as many landlocked countries as possible (so poor Bolivia can finally into sea!).
- Additionally, I wanted to eliminate as many small, weak countries as possible, as they don't really do so hot economically and militarily speaking; better to be part of a larger political entity where they would have more resources to draw upon and have more relevance on the world stage. To that end, said small nations ended up being merged and folded into neighboring countries to fit with the previous point - some obvious examples would be Albania being partitioned between Yugoslavia and Greece, Haiti and the Dominican Republic being unified into a contiguous Hispaniola, and virtually every single remote island in the middle of the fucking ocean being given to the nearest reasonable country.
- This, obviously, all lends itself well to my other desire to include historical and a-historical countries for fun, such as a revived Gran Colombia, the Indochinese Union from Kaiserreich, pan-national groups such as the Benelux, Senegambia, the East African Community, and the Caribbean Community, and just ridiculously silly ones such as the Danubian Federation/Austria-Hungary and an independent Rhodesia. And of course a still-extant Soviet Union.
- Aside from pure alt-history country creations, there's also minute border adjustments to existing countries to better fit with historical claims: examples would be Abyssinia's claims over Somalia and Eritrea, Greece's claims over the European side of the Bosporus Straits, Bolivia's claims over the Chaco region, Ireland's claim over Northern Ireland, Romania's claims over Bessarabia... and Argentina's claim over the Falklands (return Malvinas!). Looping back to point one, this ties in nicely to wanting prettier-looking borders.
- Most importantly, I envision this map's PoD date to be post-1900, given the fact that I used a HoI4 1936 political map as the base of my little alt-history exercise. So although virtually every country on the planet has been altered in some way or another, the continental United States (plus Alaska) has been left untouched (mostly because I'm a lazy American); the USA wasn't completely unchanged, however, as it lost Puerto Rico to a Caribbean Federation, but got a number of Pacific islands in exchange, so it all balances out.
- EDIT: oh, and as I mentioned in a previous post, I made the Gibraltar and Bosporus Straits, the Suez and Panama Canals, and the West Bank/Jerusalem all into International Zones, as my own naive solution to border disputes over sea-access and territorial claims.
Cool map! If your gonna do that kind of map tho I’d suggest using the Victoria II map instead. Still good thoNew guy here: name's WhiteDragon25, long-time lurker from Sufficient Velocity; finally decided to join up so I can share some of my own (meager) creations, such as this map I 'made' using a Hearts of Iron 4 pixel-map as a base:
I just recolored each of the individual provinces to make or reshape whatever new country I wanted; this is the 5th iteration, this and the previous three before it being mostly minor adjustments to the first version I made.
Something I've been wanting and trying to do is come up with some alternate-history timeline to justify all the changes I made to the world map, which I might try to do in its own thread at some point... and probably ask someone to create a higher-quality non-amateur version of it... but for now, enjoy (or mock) it and feel free to ask me for any details about it.
Thanks for the comment!
I'll probably take that into account next time. I was planning to add names for every "SSR" and
But anyways, here's an approximate guide:
Pinkish Red: All the peoples of the fatherland are brothers, equal, indivisible and fully devoted towards the world revolution. Therefore, each "brother" is granted their own RLF (República Laborista Federativa), with the largest being the Colombian RLF; and the smallest being the Uruguayan RLF. There are 12 labourist republics in total.
Dark Pink: Provincia autónoma, sub-national entities. Comprising mostly of native American peoples (sans the various Incan peoples--fairly well integrated into Hispanic society), they are afforded a large degree of autonomy, and life in these regions has changed very little since la Revolución except for the extra school or red banner here or there. One oddity is the Mayan PA, which while autonomous is so large Mayan RSF status has been voted on multiple times--though rejected by a La Platan-Peruvian coalition. As a compromise, the Mayan PA has 0.5 votes in the Grand Council of the Republics.
Pink: Fraternal Labourist Republics. Following the end of the Gran Colombian Civil War and the founding of la Patria Grande, the People's Liberationary Army would become the strongest force in the Americas. Following the Great Patriotic War and the subjugation of the former United States, puppet states would be set up across the Americas. There range from the overgrown PLA military barracks in Patagonia to the fiercely independent anarchist communes that dot New Afrika.
On matters of national importance, such as the incorporation of a new RSF (talks have begun in Mexico), the Grand Council of the Republics, (which represents the interests of the induvidual RSFs, separate from the House of Representatives and Central Worker's Congress) the RSFs have to put it to a vote amongst themselves. Each RSF has one vote, though this is inherently unfair: the Louisianan, Caribbean, Hispaniolan, Magellan, Mayan and Colombian RSFs form a massive voting blocks that can strongarm a great many proposals. This however has pushed the Southern RSFs, most importantly La Plata and Peru to antagonize Bogota.
Brick Red: Canada and her sphere. Canada practices a less radical version of labourism, with a great many capitalist-democratic institutions having been preserved under what they term "socialism". Chavez and his regime are, however, pragmatists and care little for ideology.
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So, do the Lutruwitans have a problem with inbreeding like the OTL Tasmanians, or...?
Isaac Beach
Banned
Thanks a heap, that’s very reaffirming, especially as I thought the map was a bit underwhelming, personally. It’s a lot of fun, undeveloped tribes basically give you a blank slate to work with.
Indeed he does, although he and I are from here so it’s more relevant to us. A variety of things, you got your straightforward crops like rice and gourds, and on top of that native plants like pig face, native peppers, and cider gum and a slew of natural oils, all of which would have been bred over time to grant larger harvests. Then there's your introduced crops like the aforementioned water lilies, viticulturalists (who I think would be Römisch - Germanic Italians), potatoes, wheat and apples; apples especially are very profitable (IOTL it is called the Apple Isle). I also like to imagine there's a healthy aquatic industry; seaweed, corals, and an abundance of fish, albeit heavily regulated as we over-fished the orange roughy with a population of half a million, imagine what several million could do.
It still exists, albeit heavily syncretized with Buddhist mythology, particularly aspects of reincarnation. It's still generally believed that humans were fashioned from kangaroos, and circuitously kangaroos are often thought to be the reincarnated spirits of the dead. As such there's a taboo on eating them and they're often allowed to roam about freely through Lutruwitan cities. This brings the Palawa into conflict with their mainland counterparts who have no such problem with eating kangaroo. Basically it forms their foundational myth and informs a lot of religious customs, but is then lost among the much more complicated cosmology thereafter, fairies and ghosts and bone talismans, etc. Of particular note is that many Tasmanian animals (and a few introduced ones like the peacock) constitute the Tasmanian equivalent of the Zodiac, and being born in the year of the Kangaroo is very, very auspicious, and are considered natural leaders, warriors and inventors. Although like most cosmology this falls apart the moment you go into a classroom full of Kangaroo-year children and observe that some are meek, frail and sheep-like.
So, do the Lutruwitans have a problem with inbreeding like the OTL Tasmanians, or...?
so whats the pod and can there be a world map?Thanks a heap, that’s very reaffirming, especially as I thought the map was a bit underwhelming, personally. It’s a lot of fun, undeveloped tribes basically give you a blank slate to work with.
Indeed he does, although he and I are from here so it’s more relevant to us. A variety of things, you got your straightforward crops like rice and gourds, and on top of that native plants like pig face, native peppers, and cider gum and a slew of natural oils, all of which would have been bred over time to grant larger harvests. Then there's your introduced crops like the aforementioned water lilies, viticulturalists (who I think would be Römisch - Germanic Italians), potatoes, wheat and apples; apples especially are very profitable (IOTL it is called the Apple Isle). I also like to imagine there's a healthy aquatic industry; seaweed, corals, and an abundance of fish, albeit heavily regulated as we over-fished the orange roughy with a population of half a million, imagine what several million could do.
It still exists, albeit heavily syncretized with Buddhist mythology, particularly aspects of reincarnation. It's still generally believed that humans were fashioned from kangaroos, and circuitously kangaroos are often thought to be the reincarnated spirits of the dead. As such there's a taboo on eating them and they're often allowed to roam about freely through Lutruwitan cities. This brings the Palawa into conflict with their mainland counterparts who have no such problem with eating kangaroo. Basically it forms their foundational myth and informs a lot of religious customs, but is then lost among the much more complicated cosmology thereafter, fairies and ghosts and bone talismans, etc. Of particular note is that many Tasmanian animals (and a few introduced ones like the peacock) constitute the Tasmanian equivalent of the Zodiac, and being born in the year of the Kangaroo is very, very auspicious, and are considered natural leaders, warriors and inventors. Although like most cosmology this falls apart the moment you go into a classroom full of Kangaroo-year children and observe that some are meek, frail and sheep-like.
Are there still thylacines/Tasmanian tigers around?Thanks a heap, that’s very reaffirming, especially as I thought the map was a bit underwhelming, personally. It’s a lot of fun, undeveloped tribes basically give you a blank slate to work with.
Indeed he does, although he and I are from here so it’s more relevant to us. A variety of things, you got your straightforward crops like rice and gourds, and on top of that native plants like pig face, native peppers, and cider gum and a slew of natural oils, all of which would have been bred over time to grant larger harvests. Then there's your introduced crops like the aforementioned water lilies, viticulturalists (who I think would be Römisch - Germanic Italians), potatoes, wheat and apples; apples especially are very profitable (IOTL it is called the Apple Isle). I also like to imagine there's a healthy aquatic industry; seaweed, corals, and an abundance of fish, albeit heavily regulated as we over-fished the orange roughy with a population of half a million, imagine what several million could do.
It still exists, albeit heavily syncretized with Buddhist mythology, particularly aspects of reincarnation. It's still generally believed that humans were fashioned from kangaroos, and circuitously kangaroos are often thought to be the reincarnated spirits of the dead. As such there's a taboo on eating them and they're often allowed to roam about freely through Lutruwitan cities. This brings the Palawa into conflict with their mainland counterparts who have no such problem with eating kangaroo. Basically it forms their foundational myth and informs a lot of religious customs, but is then lost among the much more complicated cosmology thereafter, fairies and ghosts and bone talismans, etc. Of particular note is that many Tasmanian animals (and a few introduced ones like the peacock) constitute the Tasmanian equivalent of the Zodiac, and being born in the year of the Kangaroo is very, very auspicious, and are considered natural leaders, warriors and inventors. Although like most cosmology this falls apart the moment you go into a classroom full of Kangaroo-year children and observe that some are meek, frail and sheep-like.
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