A Son of Aragon - Henry VIII's Catholic Heir
- Thread starter Direwolf22
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Well, if you can pull it off from Norways position (their native nobility at this point was nonexsistant, being killed off by the Black Death and replaced by Danish Second Sons, and that they've already been under Danish rule for nearly 2 centuries ... well, at least it'll be an unique one
Sweden will win the danish where never as good in warfare as sweden and the hansa backing sweden easy win with some luck
Sweden was a bunch of peasants running around with crossbows, so at this point, yes the danish might win.
Never underestimate the power of a Swedish peasant...they can make magic with nothing but a crossbow and some ice.
Charles IX ultimately killed off Swedish Catholicism after he usurped throne from his Catholic nephew.
#10 Denmark and Sweden 1530-1560
In accordance with my views on butterflies and to avoid a Scandinavian flame war in the comments 
consider all events before 1530 (unless otherwise stated) to have proceeded OTL.
Also special thanks to @Bastiram for help on this chapter.
In Denmark itself Christian II had been deposed. His actions in Sweden and their fallout had been the latest in a line of aggregations resented by large elements of the Danish noble and merchant classes. Increasing autocratic measures and reforms (some in retrospect quite progressive) set Christian II at odds with the powerful Danish nobility, jealous of their rights and influences. However he did earn a degree of respect and support amongst the peasantry for his reforms. Freeing Denmark from Hanseatic commercial dominance had brought wealth to the country but had antagonised the great Baltic trading cities and left him exposed and without allies, resulting in his removal and exile in 1523. In exile he spent most of his time in the Netherlands, whilst also touring England and the German lands. He briefly corresponded with Martin Luther, but as Luther’s injury and declining influence in the Reformation complicated things Christian II soon lost interest and remained a Catholic[2]. His wife Isabella of Austria fell ill in 1525 but soon made a full recovery[3]. In 1531 Christian, with his replacement on the Danish throne Frederick becoming a Lutheran, tried to retake his kingdom but was defeated, he did however manage to evade capture fleeing back to the Netherlands.
Christian II of Denmark
Whilst in exile once more in the Netherlands, Christian would not abandon his struggle to reclaim the throne. He attempted to leverage support from his brother-in law, the Emperor Charles V, who although sympathetic was unable to offer anything serious enough to support a campaign distracted as he was. Instead therefore Christian and his family went to England, where they were welcomed by King Henry VIII and his court. Henry and Queen Catherine were supportive of this deposed Catholic monarch and Henry entertained Christian’s ambitions. Though he was unwilling to go to war over them. This changed in 1533.
Frederick, who had usurped Christian’s Danish crown, died in April 1533. The Jutland nobility moved to crown Frederick’s son Christian (now declared Christian III) as king. This was not uncontested and a movement led by Count Christoffer of Oldenburg, rallied Catholic forces, a scattering of Norwegian nobility and support from a collection of Free Cities (including Lubeck) declared for the exiled Christian II and triggered the Danish Succession Crisis. Suddenly the likelihood of Christian II regaining his throne did not look so remote. As the two sides in Denmark began clashing in and around Jutland. Christian II sought international aid and was determined to return to Denmark before his supporters collapsed. Henry VIII now moved to support his Catholic royal counterpart. Taking his title “Defender of the Faith” very seriously and with his militant Catholicism still burning Henry saw this as a religious struggle against heresy. More practically installing a friendly (and indebted) monarch across the North Sea would gain England great influence in the Baltic and help Henry in his bid to establish England as independent power apart from (but friendly to) the Habsburg Imperial bloc. Consequently Henry moved to betrothe Prince Arthur to Christian II’s daughter Dorothea to cement the alliance (Christian II wanted a full marriage but a betrothal was more easily broken if Christian II lost, Henry did not want to be stuck with a lost cause). Henry too wanted to try out his new warships and earn more military glory for himself and England - especially with a rare break in the Franco-Spanish Wars occurring simultaneously. In late 1534 an English fleet was prepared and joined with a small Catholic Danish force led by the naval officer Søren Norby who had been in England with Christian, and set sail for Denmark with Christian II at its head.
Support came from elsewhere too. With King Henry and England backing his cause suddenly Christian II had far more legitimacy behind him. Charles V, eager to re-assert Catholic rule whenever possible, arranged a small force of around 2,000 Dutch mercenaries to be ferried by the English to Denmark. Under English and Imperial lobbying the Pope also granted his blessing for the campaign which pressured the Norwegian Archbishops to support the cause as well. The fighting would continue until 1536. Many elements of local Danish nobility rallied against Christian II and they drew support from Lutheran Sweden, Holstein and Jutland. The Catholic forces led by Christian II, Duke Christoffer and the Anglo-Imperial forces led by the Duke of Norfolk, however outmatched and outfinanced their opponents, and had large support amongst the peasantry. The domestic conflict eventually ended with the Siege of Holstein and the execution, imprisonment and exile of leading rebel nobility including the notable commander Johann Rantzau. The larger war dragged on for a few months with Sweden which had opportunistically seized some Danish territory. Though Sweden was forced out of Skane the Swedes were able to seize the territory of Jamtland. Christian II’s rule over Denmark, Norway and Schleswig-Holstein however was secured.
In the next two decades Christian II would transform Denmark. With the confirmation of the marriage of his daughter to Arthur of England and of his son John to Maria daughter of Ferdinand of Austria, his and his dynasty’s rule was secured. Danish Baltic trade began to recover (with England gaining generous if not unacceptable concessions). Though their support had eventually come his way Christian resented the fairly ambivalent support of the clergy during the Succession crisis. Consequently Christian II imported the English style of Humanist Catholicism and began reforming the Church and closing down and seizing properties of “corrupt” ecclesiastical holdings. If he shut down some less corrupt ones and took maybe more land/wealth for the Crown than may have been necessary then so be it. The Papacy seeing Protestantism on the march everywhere was not going to come down on a Catholic king too hard. Counter-Reformation efforts in Holstein and Denmark (Norway was still strongly Catholic) were undertaken and many Protestants fled to Germany or Sweden. In 1542 he went to war with Sweden and was able to recover Jamatland but pushed Sweden ever closer to the Protestant German powers. With strong dynastic, commercial and personal links to the Netherlands however Christian oversaw the importation of Flemish manufacturing and merchants which would overtime greatly improve and modernize the Danish economy. Denmark’s fleet would draw on English and Imperial expertise and become a considerable military and commercial instrument. The Danish nobility saw their influence dramatically weakened and a form of proto-absolutism was instigated by Christian II who also enforced more direct dynastic succession. Christian II died in 1560 and was succeeded by his son John - leaving behind a controversial yet considerable legacy.
Gustav I of Sweden
Sweden meanwhile endured a very different few decades under Gustav Vasa (Gustav I). Gustav had successfully defeated and driven out the Danes in the Swedish War of Liberation and had by the end of 1524 secured himself as King of an independent Sweden. In the 1530s Guatv would oversee the Swedish Reformation. The Reformation had as much to do with the activity of preachers (such as the Petri brothers) as ongoing disputes between Gustav and the Pope and the former’s increasing frustration and desire to cement royal not Papal power. Notably the Swedes were one of the few countries to embrace Lutheran beliefs over the unified Reformed movement popular on the continent proper. Though the king, the nobility and the urban merchant classes were largely converted to Lutheranism by the end of his reign, a declining majority of the peasantry and rural populations remained true (if quietly) to the Catholic faith. Gustav, wary of the return of his old foe, intervened in the Danish Succession Crisis; ultimately unsuccessfully with Sweden outmatched by the coalition of Catholic powers arrayed against it. It’s only measurable gain that of the province of Jamtland were undone a decade later after defeat to Denmark. These setbacks however only encouraged Gustav to find allies elsewhere, notably in the northern Protestant German powers (such as Brandenburg and Pomerania) as well as close ties with Protestant nobility in Poland and in the west. These links would prove valuable later on.
Internally Gustav faced pressure from domestic rebellions over religion and taxation such as in Smaland in 1542. All risings were defeated however and Gustav’s rule was never seriously challenged. As Gustav sought to expand Sweden’s influence in the region he was inevitably drawn into conflict. Between 1554-1557 he fought an inconclusive struggle with Tsar Ivan of Russia over the eastern Baltic. Though no gains were made in this conflict lessons were learned and the Swedish military and state adapted before a second round of fighting in the newly declared Livonian War kicked off in 1558/9. Gustav died in 1560 and was followed by his son Erik (born 1534)[4]. Gustav had managed to forge a nation out of a rebellion, oversee the Protestant Reformation at home and secure foreign alliances and ties abroad. He had left his son a respectable inheritance and a Sweden with growing resources and ambitions. Though the way west was blocked by Denmark, the dramatic events of the 1560s that Erik would seek to capitalize on would show that opportunity and Sweden’s future lay to the east.
[1] This is the only slight change from OTL. Christian II here decides not to execute the clergymen for fear of Papal reaction and instead has them arrested and/or exiled. The rest of the war is OTL.
[2] Another change, Christian II converts to Lutheranism (briefly) in OTL. Here he does not.
[3] She died in OTL leading to a division in his family.
[4] Note this is a different Erik from OTL and he is not mad.
consider all events before 1530 (unless otherwise stated) to have proceeded OTL.Also special thanks to @Bastiram for help on this chapter.
Reformation and Restoration:
Denmark and Sweden (1520-1560)
In January 1521 Gustav Vasa began a rebellion in the province of Dalarna which would trigger the Swedish War of Liberation. The Kalmar Union, the dynastic Scandinavian estate, was unraveling. Decades of mounting tensions, disagreements and resentments had spilled over into the 1520 Stockholm Bloodbath. This massacre at the orders of Christian II of Denmark, ever after Christian the Tyrant in Sweden, triggered a final rising of the Swedish nobility who sought to separate themselves and their lands from the unequal union. Leading Swedish nobles, merchants and councilors were hanged and beheaded whilst anti-Danish clergymen were arrested, though not executed after a last hour change of heart[1]. Vasa’s rebellion sprung from the fury that followed. With the support of the wealthy German city of Lubeck and broad support amongst the Swedish peasantry and nobility, Vasa seized Stockholm and was crowned King of Sweden in 1523. The rest of Sweden, including the occupied areas of Finland, fell to Vasa and his supporters over the next year. The Danes were unable to restore order and in 1524 Swedish independence and the end of the Kalmar Union was officially recognised and a new era of Scandinavian history had begun.Denmark and Sweden (1520-1560)
In Denmark itself Christian II had been deposed. His actions in Sweden and their fallout had been the latest in a line of aggregations resented by large elements of the Danish noble and merchant classes. Increasing autocratic measures and reforms (some in retrospect quite progressive) set Christian II at odds with the powerful Danish nobility, jealous of their rights and influences. However he did earn a degree of respect and support amongst the peasantry for his reforms. Freeing Denmark from Hanseatic commercial dominance had brought wealth to the country but had antagonised the great Baltic trading cities and left him exposed and without allies, resulting in his removal and exile in 1523. In exile he spent most of his time in the Netherlands, whilst also touring England and the German lands. He briefly corresponded with Martin Luther, but as Luther’s injury and declining influence in the Reformation complicated things Christian II soon lost interest and remained a Catholic[2]. His wife Isabella of Austria fell ill in 1525 but soon made a full recovery[3]. In 1531 Christian, with his replacement on the Danish throne Frederick becoming a Lutheran, tried to retake his kingdom but was defeated, he did however manage to evade capture fleeing back to the Netherlands.
Christian II of Denmark
Whilst in exile once more in the Netherlands, Christian would not abandon his struggle to reclaim the throne. He attempted to leverage support from his brother-in law, the Emperor Charles V, who although sympathetic was unable to offer anything serious enough to support a campaign distracted as he was. Instead therefore Christian and his family went to England, where they were welcomed by King Henry VIII and his court. Henry and Queen Catherine were supportive of this deposed Catholic monarch and Henry entertained Christian’s ambitions. Though he was unwilling to go to war over them. This changed in 1533.
Frederick, who had usurped Christian’s Danish crown, died in April 1533. The Jutland nobility moved to crown Frederick’s son Christian (now declared Christian III) as king. This was not uncontested and a movement led by Count Christoffer of Oldenburg, rallied Catholic forces, a scattering of Norwegian nobility and support from a collection of Free Cities (including Lubeck) declared for the exiled Christian II and triggered the Danish Succession Crisis. Suddenly the likelihood of Christian II regaining his throne did not look so remote. As the two sides in Denmark began clashing in and around Jutland. Christian II sought international aid and was determined to return to Denmark before his supporters collapsed. Henry VIII now moved to support his Catholic royal counterpart. Taking his title “Defender of the Faith” very seriously and with his militant Catholicism still burning Henry saw this as a religious struggle against heresy. More practically installing a friendly (and indebted) monarch across the North Sea would gain England great influence in the Baltic and help Henry in his bid to establish England as independent power apart from (but friendly to) the Habsburg Imperial bloc. Consequently Henry moved to betrothe Prince Arthur to Christian II’s daughter Dorothea to cement the alliance (Christian II wanted a full marriage but a betrothal was more easily broken if Christian II lost, Henry did not want to be stuck with a lost cause). Henry too wanted to try out his new warships and earn more military glory for himself and England - especially with a rare break in the Franco-Spanish Wars occurring simultaneously. In late 1534 an English fleet was prepared and joined with a small Catholic Danish force led by the naval officer Søren Norby who had been in England with Christian, and set sail for Denmark with Christian II at its head.
Support came from elsewhere too. With King Henry and England backing his cause suddenly Christian II had far more legitimacy behind him. Charles V, eager to re-assert Catholic rule whenever possible, arranged a small force of around 2,000 Dutch mercenaries to be ferried by the English to Denmark. Under English and Imperial lobbying the Pope also granted his blessing for the campaign which pressured the Norwegian Archbishops to support the cause as well. The fighting would continue until 1536. Many elements of local Danish nobility rallied against Christian II and they drew support from Lutheran Sweden, Holstein and Jutland. The Catholic forces led by Christian II, Duke Christoffer and the Anglo-Imperial forces led by the Duke of Norfolk, however outmatched and outfinanced their opponents, and had large support amongst the peasantry. The domestic conflict eventually ended with the Siege of Holstein and the execution, imprisonment and exile of leading rebel nobility including the notable commander Johann Rantzau. The larger war dragged on for a few months with Sweden which had opportunistically seized some Danish territory. Though Sweden was forced out of Skane the Swedes were able to seize the territory of Jamtland. Christian II’s rule over Denmark, Norway and Schleswig-Holstein however was secured.
In the next two decades Christian II would transform Denmark. With the confirmation of the marriage of his daughter to Arthur of England and of his son John to Maria daughter of Ferdinand of Austria, his and his dynasty’s rule was secured. Danish Baltic trade began to recover (with England gaining generous if not unacceptable concessions). Though their support had eventually come his way Christian resented the fairly ambivalent support of the clergy during the Succession crisis. Consequently Christian II imported the English style of Humanist Catholicism and began reforming the Church and closing down and seizing properties of “corrupt” ecclesiastical holdings. If he shut down some less corrupt ones and took maybe more land/wealth for the Crown than may have been necessary then so be it. The Papacy seeing Protestantism on the march everywhere was not going to come down on a Catholic king too hard. Counter-Reformation efforts in Holstein and Denmark (Norway was still strongly Catholic) were undertaken and many Protestants fled to Germany or Sweden. In 1542 he went to war with Sweden and was able to recover Jamatland but pushed Sweden ever closer to the Protestant German powers. With strong dynastic, commercial and personal links to the Netherlands however Christian oversaw the importation of Flemish manufacturing and merchants which would overtime greatly improve and modernize the Danish economy. Denmark’s fleet would draw on English and Imperial expertise and become a considerable military and commercial instrument. The Danish nobility saw their influence dramatically weakened and a form of proto-absolutism was instigated by Christian II who also enforced more direct dynastic succession. Christian II died in 1560 and was succeeded by his son John - leaving behind a controversial yet considerable legacy.
Gustav I of Sweden
Internally Gustav faced pressure from domestic rebellions over religion and taxation such as in Smaland in 1542. All risings were defeated however and Gustav’s rule was never seriously challenged. As Gustav sought to expand Sweden’s influence in the region he was inevitably drawn into conflict. Between 1554-1557 he fought an inconclusive struggle with Tsar Ivan of Russia over the eastern Baltic. Though no gains were made in this conflict lessons were learned and the Swedish military and state adapted before a second round of fighting in the newly declared Livonian War kicked off in 1558/9. Gustav died in 1560 and was followed by his son Erik (born 1534)[4]. Gustav had managed to forge a nation out of a rebellion, oversee the Protestant Reformation at home and secure foreign alliances and ties abroad. He had left his son a respectable inheritance and a Sweden with growing resources and ambitions. Though the way west was blocked by Denmark, the dramatic events of the 1560s that Erik would seek to capitalize on would show that opportunity and Sweden’s future lay to the east.
[1] This is the only slight change from OTL. Christian II here decides not to execute the clergymen for fear of Papal reaction and instead has them arrested and/or exiled. The rest of the war is OTL.
[2] Another change, Christian II converts to Lutheranism (briefly) in OTL. Here he does not.
[3] She died in OTL leading to a division in his family.
[4] Note this is a different Erik from OTL and he is not mad.
Lot's of delicious butterflies right here.
What about Christina, the youngest sister of John and Dorothea, who will she marry. Considering the excellent matches of her siblings I'll be interested where she will end up.
Another question with Isabella surviving, (she died 24 years old OTL) is likely plenty more children, at the time of her death she had given birth to 6 children, with John, Dorothea and Christina surving, and twin boys (Maximilian and Ferdinand-Phillip 1519) and a unnamed boy (1523) not surviving. So I see no reason that more children would not appear.
I'll have to make a comment about all the Swedish comments about the military prowess of Sweden that happened earlier this month. remember Denmark had the upper hand for about a century more. The military machine that built the Swedish empire is not yet a thing. Plus if I understand the butterflies of a different Erik correct, the royal linage of Sweden will be different than OTL.
It's undeniable I think that Denmark and Sweden will end up in conflict, not only do we have different religious sides. But both sides have various beefs with the other. The Danish Kings are likely to to still claim the Swedish throne, and aspire to take it back. Furthermore the Danish king will keep using the Swedish coat of arms, as part of his. Sweden on the other hand will be annoyed by the Danish claims to the throne and usage of the coat of arms. Furthermore Sweden is no longer exempt from the sound dues and is probably annoyed by that.
Now the interesting part is, I can see the Danish king being more interested in the south, considering they have a considerable stronger hand there than OTL. First Christian II got some concessions OTL in Lübeck and Holstein. Secondly, Denmark in this TL have very close ties to the Habsburg Emperors. With two Danish Queens in a row are Habsburgs. Furthermore Danish Kings and their position as Dukes of Holstein (therefor a imperial prince) is probably very useful to the Habsburgs, with them being catholic and all in an area that OTL was dominated by protestants.
Looking forward to see this develop.
What about Christina, the youngest sister of John and Dorothea, who will she marry. Considering the excellent matches of her siblings I'll be interested where she will end up.
Another question with Isabella surviving, (she died 24 years old OTL) is likely plenty more children, at the time of her death she had given birth to 6 children, with John, Dorothea and Christina surving, and twin boys (Maximilian and Ferdinand-Phillip 1519) and a unnamed boy (1523) not surviving. So I see no reason that more children would not appear.
I'll have to make a comment about all the Swedish comments about the military prowess of Sweden that happened earlier this month. remember Denmark had the upper hand for about a century more. The military machine that built the Swedish empire is not yet a thing. Plus if I understand the butterflies of a different Erik correct, the royal linage of Sweden will be different than OTL.
It's undeniable I think that Denmark and Sweden will end up in conflict, not only do we have different religious sides. But both sides have various beefs with the other. The Danish Kings are likely to to still claim the Swedish throne, and aspire to take it back. Furthermore the Danish king will keep using the Swedish coat of arms, as part of his. Sweden on the other hand will be annoyed by the Danish claims to the throne and usage of the coat of arms. Furthermore Sweden is no longer exempt from the sound dues and is probably annoyed by that.
Now the interesting part is, I can see the Danish king being more interested in the south, considering they have a considerable stronger hand there than OTL. First Christian II got some concessions OTL in Lübeck and Holstein. Secondly, Denmark in this TL have very close ties to the Habsburg Emperors. With two Danish Queens in a row are Habsburgs. Furthermore Danish Kings and their position as Dukes of Holstein (therefor a imperial prince) is probably very useful to the Habsburgs, with them being catholic and all in an area that OTL was dominated by protestants.
Looking forward to see this develop.
*waves Flag of Three Crowns* WOOOOOHOOOOO! Damn, that update was awesome! And my Gustav stayed king in the end and a non-crazy Erik XIV is the best thing ever.
What happened to Catherine of Saxe-Lauenburg in this TL? Did she survive? Or did Gustav still wed Margareta Leijonhufvud?
And my Gustav stayed king in the end and a non-crazy Erik XIV is the best thing ever. What happened to Catherine of Saxe-Lauenburg in this TL? Did she survive? Or did Gustav still wed Margareta Leijonhufvud?
Yes the changes are really starting to come into their own now. Very different future for Scandinavia.
Catholicism has over OTL gained England and Denmark (at least for the time being). So perhaps in a cosmic sense it will balance out.. Perhaps.
Lot's of delicious butterflies right here.
What about Christina, the youngest sister of John and Dorothea, who will she marry. Considering the excellent matches of her siblings I'll be interested where she will end up.
Another question with Isabella surviving, (she died 24 years old OTL) is likely plenty more children, at the time of her death she had given birth to 6 children, with John, Dorothea and Christina surving, and twin boys (Maximilian and Ferdinand-Phillip 1519) and a unnamed boy (1523) not surviving. So I see no reason that more children would not appear.
I'll have to make a comment about all the Swedish comments about the military prowess of Sweden that happened earlier this month. remember Denmark had the upper hand for about a century more. The military machine that built the Swedish empire is not yet a thing. Plus if I understand the butterflies of a different Erik correct, the royal linage of Sweden will be different than OTL.
It's undeniable I think that Denmark and Sweden will end up in conflict, not only do we have different religious sides. But both sides have various beefs with the other. The Danish Kings are likely to to still claim the Swedish throne, and aspire to take it back. Furthermore the Danish king will keep using the Swedish coat of arms, as part of his. Sweden on the other hand will be annoyed by the Danish claims to the throne and usage of the coat of arms. Furthermore Sweden is no longer exempt from the sound dues and is probably annoyed by that.
Now the interesting part is, I can see the Danish king being more interested in the south, considering they have a considerable stronger hand there than OTL. First Christian II got some concessions OTL in Lübeck and Holstein. Secondly, Denmark in this TL have very close ties to the Habsburg Emperors. With two Danish Queens in a row are Habsburgs. Furthermore Danish Kings and their position as Dukes of Holstein (therefor a imperial prince) is probably very useful to the Habsburgs, with them being catholic and all in an area that OTL was dominated by protestants.
Looking forward to see this develop.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Denmark and Sweden will indeed have at least a few more rounds between them. But both will also have avenues for expansion and distraction elsewhere.
I decided Isabelle would not have more children (possible complications from her sickness) but I imagine Christina would have a good match. My initial instinct is maybe a domestic internal match to consolidate Christian II's hold perhaps with a loyal noble family. If not I reckon with a Catholic monarchy (likely Bavaria or maybe Hungary).
*waves Flag of Three Crowns* WOOOOOHOOOOO! Damn, that update was awesome!
What happened to Catherine of Saxe-Lauenburg in this TL? Did she survive? Or did Gustav still wed Margareta Leijonhufvud?
Yes and Erik is going to be very busy in his reign! She survives.