Map Thread XVII

[Baconheimer]

Well, that sucks for just about everyone. Makes OTL politics look totally calm and sane, really. My biggest doubts about realism concern the idea that the Democrats would go for a national unity ticket just because they can't win (I don't see that happening: national unity typically occurs only when the nation faces existential peril) and the notion that Prince's coup could just succeed without ending in a messy civil war. No way the generals are happy taking orders from a damned mercenary, so the Republicans who had intended to use him as a puppet only need to get some hadline military leaders on their side, and they've got a counter-coup that Prince really can't beat. Result: military junta controls the US, de facto or de jure. (The insane foreign policy can still end up the same way, even!)

Anyway, despite those minor points, it's certainly a very interesting scenario. One wonders how long this kind of imperialism can last. It's bound to be unsustainable in the long term. If we look at the fiscal realities of the USA in OTL, this ATL will see the USA collapse before long. Either the costs of the imperialist policies become unsustainable and the USA has to withdraw (likely following up militaritic imperialism with despotic isolationism), or the imperialism is maintained by cutting all other expenditures and raising taxes incredibly, thus turning the USA into a autocratic command economy army-with-a-country(-and-no-social-security-at-all-in-spite-of-really-high-taxes). Which spells messy revolution.

And after the US occupation ends, I can see the Islamic world turning into ISIS writ large. Very large.

I'm glad we're not living in this ATL!

Yeah, the National Union Party is a little bit forced, though I've tried to chock it up to intense fear of more terrorist attacks. Regarding Prince being allowed to stay in power, my thought was that PMCs have so permeated the US intelligence agencies and military that they know everything that's happening in the country, and the civil war to remove them would be very, very bloody because of that.

My thinking is that the Prince regime is eventually overthrown, which would cause mass US withdrawal, and yeah, a massive power vortex.

Regarding the nature of the Prince regime, it's much more traditionally Republican, so in favor of free trade and government programs than the OTL 2017 party.

 

[DPKdebator]

How did you achieve that pattern effect?

Just create a crossing pattern with two different colors, an easy way to do this is to create a line with one width in a color (and hold shift to keep it at an angle), a line with the other color, and repeat.

 

[Black]

I can't tell if you're joking or not, but I'm pretty sure he means 1861.

No no, I am curious how all that happened in 50 years, there is probably a pretty cool/unique explanation.

 

[GauchoBadger]

No no, I am curious how all that happened in 50 years, there is probably a pretty cool/unique explanation.

Nah, it's an 1875 map with an 1861 PoD.
I actually helped him make the map.

 

[Gwrtheyrn Annwn]

Nah, it's an 1875 map with an 1861 PoD.
I actually helped him make the map.

So I was right!

 

[Oliveia]

So I was right!

Heh, stupid typo on my part. Sorry all.

 

[TickTock The Witch's Dead]

15 riffs on a post-scarcity world, ranging from the utopian to the hellish. "Not all happy families are alike, but neither are all unhappy families." You have happy and extroverted Latin Americans alongside happy and introverted Finns, Balts, and Russians, and the dystopias range from tribal and religious to cyberpunk, sin city, Black Mirror, and Muh Capitalism (TM).

That brings the meaning of the phrase “The South shall rise again” a whole new meaning.

 

[damein fisher]

The Republic of Indian Stream

A little passion project of mine, I wanted to do a short timeline of the Republic of Indian Stream. So instead of doing stuff for the Eagle and the Lion like I should be doing, I did this.

The history of the Republic of Indian Stream is one of peaceful disinterest. The area was originally settled by Europeans under a land grant from St. Francis Indian chief, called King Philip. Following the American Revolutionary War, the land was surveyed and land grants were issued to many competing settlers, often with over lapping claims.

The establishment of Indian Stream as an independent nation was the result of the ill-defined border between the United States of America and the British province of Lower Canada [Modern day Quebec] in the 1783 Treaty of Paris. As the above map can attest, there were three interpretations of what the definition, "the northwesternmost head of the Connecticut River", meant. As a result of this, the area of these rivers were not definitively under the jurisdiction of either the United States or Lower Canada

While Lower Canada claimed the southeastern most river as the border, the United States claimed the northwestern most river. With both sides sending their own tax-collectors and debt-collecting sheriffs. Being forced to live under 'double taxation' angered the population within the rivers and the citizens declared independence until such a time that the US and Great Britain could settle the border. Note that some citizens of the republic at the time still considered themselves to be a part of the US, but not New Hampshire. The Indian Stream assembly declared independence on July 9, 1832, and produced a constitution.

The Constitution of Indian Stream, Part Second - Form of Government";

"The people inhabiting the Territory formerly called Indian Stream Territory do hereby solemnly and mutually agree with each other to form themselves into a body politic by the name of Indian Stream and in that capacity to exercise all the powers of a free, sovereign and independent state, so far as it relates to our own internal Government till such time as we can ascertain to what government we properly belong."

However, the independence declaration did not cause the sheriff of Coos County to cease his involvement in affairs, with later events leading to an impending invasion by New Hampshire. However, the militia of the surrounding areas would refuse to fight, as was common among the US militia at the time; especially when they thought the fight foolish, unjust, or impractical. He would later appeal to higher ups who, hesitant to start a war over an insignificant piece of territory, put an end to any future aggression.

Additionally, each side of the dispute would go on to make it clear that acting against the claim would mean war, the US would make this declaration in June of 1839 and Great Britain would repeat the claim a few months later. Indian Stream states this date, August 7 1839 as the de facto recognition of their independence. Over time, it became natural that the region was neither controlled by Canada, nor the US; additionally the lack of the consequences of Indian Stream's independence meant the leadership of both sides wouldn't be anxious to change the situation.

Furthermore, the inhabitants of the republic would become involved in many feats [Streamist soldiers joining the Union Army as 'foreign volunteers in the Civil War, Streamist explorers navigating the northwest territories, etc] that would lead to them gaining international publicity.

 

[Petros >Peter Fergus<]

A little passion project of mine, I wanted to do a short timeline of the Republic of Indian Stream.

Beautiful idea and map and write-up.

 

[SpicyJuan]

It is easy to do, create it as a pattern on gimp and then simply fill the area you want with that pattern. or just create it once and copy and paste it where needed.

How do I create or find that pattern in the first place?

 

[Matthew Housham]

View attachment 357950

I'm sorry if this seems presumptuous and demanding of me, but can you please get back to Bijou. I'm loving it, and I want to see if the Brits and French get into a fight over the continent.

 

[Danube Mapper]

I've noticed that this scenario bears more than a passing resemblance to the 'New American Century' map by @rvbomally@The-Artist-64. I assure you that that is accidental, and that I've been working on this for a long time.

Patriotpunk, or if the War on Terror Never Ended​

• The exact POD of this world is unknown, but divergences become noticeable around the time of the 2003 Invasion of Iraq, with an even more trigger-happy Bush administration than OTL. These changes are enough to allow Bob Graham to win the Democratic primary in 2004. Ultimately, Bush wins reelection.
• As a lame-duck after 2004, George Bush goes hog-wild in his expansion of the War on Terror. In early 2005, American, British, and Australian forces swarm into Iran, quickly toppling the Islamist regime there. In response, levels of anti-American sentiment across the Arab world, and anti-Western terrorism skyrocket, causing US occupation of the increasingly unstable Libya, Syria, and Yemen.
• In Bush’s second term, Arnold Schwarzenegger becomes heir apparent for the Republican Party. Spearheaded by Senator Orrin Hatch, the 28th Amendment to the Constitution was ratified. The 28th Amendment, also known as the Equal Opportunity to Govern Amendment or Hatch Amendment allowed non-natural born citizens who had held American citizenship for 20 years to be serve as President. Though a number of political figures would become eligible for the Presidency under the Hatch Amendment, it was clear to nearly everyone that the bill was simply an attempt to get Arnold Schwarzenegger into the White House.
• In early January 2008, to discuss American-led and Israeli military engagements across the Arab world, a Conference is scheduled held in Beirut (one of the few “stable” Middle Eastern states) between Western and Israeli delegates. Included in the list of attendees was Vice President Dick Cheney. Being Lebanon, threats to the security of the attendees were taken seriously and upwards of a dozen plots were foiled. However, it was not enough. Air Force Two narrowly escaped being shot down by Al-Qaeda-aligned insurgents over the Eastern Mediterranean. But the American delegation was not out of the woodwork yet. After landing, the motorcade carrying Vice President Cheney was the target of a suicide helicopter attack. Cheney was killed instantly when the helicopter crashed into the Humvee carrying him, while Secretary of State Rice suffered from several injuries. Unsurprisingly, the American populace was furious. An ultimatum that would allow limited American occupation was delivered to Lebanon within 24 hours. The stubborn Lebanese government refused to accept the terms of the agreement, and within 48 hours, the United States and its allies had begun to occupy yet another Arab state.
• The United States was forced into yet another conflict in May 2008, when the North Koreans invaded the South. The Second Korean War proved to be the most conventional warfare for American forces since 1991, and fighting continued into the next year. War in Korea, as well as half a dozen Middle Eastern states was the backdrop to the Democratic and Republican conventions of 2008. Arnold Schwarzenegger had entered the 2008 primary season as the front-runner, and though other names appeared below his on the ballot, the primaries were hardly competitive, with only Governor Schwarzenegger and Representative Ron Paul receiving any notable number of votes. Schwarzenegger and Paul represented the pro- and anti-war factions of the Republican Party, respectively. At their convention, the Democrats recognized the clear advantage held by the Republicans going into the general election, and, in a move of national unity decided to endorse Arnold Schwarzenegger for President, while giving Democratic primary victor Senator John Edwards the slot of running-mate. The Republicans so liked the National Union ticket idea that they also selected Schwarzenegger/Edwards. In the face of the new National Union ticket, two candidates launched campaigns. Ron Paul, reprising his role of twenty years before, successfully sought the Libertarian nomination while Democratic Representative Marcy Kaptur went independent alongside comedian Al Franken. Both these candidates were radically opposed to the War on Terror, but agreed on little else. Unsurprisingly, the National Union ticket went on to victory, winning all but three states and the District of Columbia.
• The Schwarzenegger Administration was very similar to the Bush administration. In 2012, the President again faced only marginal opposition: Ron Paul again as a Libertarian and the actor Roseanne Barr as a member of the Peace and Freedom Party. Though all three candidates won states in the electoral college, Schwarzenegger was throughout the entire race the clear frontrunner. From 2009 to 2016, the United States expanded the list of enemies of the war on Terror. Following, the Colombian-requested invasion of Venezuela, the United States went to war with left-wing governments in Latin America. As expected, anti-American regimes in the Muslim world were toppled.
• On Christmas Day, 2009, the United States was rocked once again by a series of terrorist attacks. Using underwear bombs and other newly improvised weapons, six planes were brought down by Al-Qaeda that day, with another having been shot down by overly jumpy elements of the United States Air Force. The Christmas Day Bombings were used as an excuse by the Schwarzenegger regime to invade Nigeria alongside the British (who experienced the loss of a plane of their own the same day). When the targets of the American invasion were not found in Afghanistan, war was expanded to other countries believed to be holding the masterminds of the attacks. The Christmas Day Bombings also proved to be the nail in the coffin for commercial air traffic as the opinion the American people viewed it as simply unsafe. Early the next year, the Schwarzenegger administration pushed a bill through Congress to revitalize American railroads. At the present time, trains have become the transport of choice for American vacationers, while the old airline companies have begun to fall into bankruptcy.
• India and Pakistan went to war in 2010, and, despite attempts by every major nation to mediate the conflict before it went nuclear, nuclear weapons were used in warfare for the first time since 1945. Both competing states collapsed nearly instantaneously, and in their place were a host of different states, many of which were occupied by the United States on the grounds of harboring terrorists (which many actually did, though the ability of these new states to actually hunt them down is questionable)
• In 2016, the combined effort of a freshman class of anti-war Senators and grassroots activists led the Democratic Party to nominate its own candidate for the first time in over a decade. Barack Obama on Illinois rode a wave of anti-war sentiment to capture the nomination and then the White House in a four-way race against establishment Republican Governor Karyn Polito, Libertarian CEO John Donahoe of eBay, and radical leftist anti-war activist Cindy Sheehan. While campaigning, Obama promised an end to unnecessary foreign engagements, a position, that, while popular with the electorate, was not widely supported by members of the Republican Party and military-industrial complex. When Obama won the election in November, a plot was set in motion to remove him from power. The plot was first devised by the Republican Party, but they enlisted the assistance of the PMCs that had grown so powerful since 2001. On November 10th, 2017, the White House was stormed by Blackwater Security forces personally loyal to Erik Prince. Obama was deposed, and went into hiding in Switzerland. A new emergency regime was set up, with Erik Prince as acting administrator. An unprecedented crackdown on dissidents quickly occurred, as the very institutions designed to protect Americans for the last decade suddenly were turned against them. The original plan called for Prince to step down after Obama possible loyalists were disposed of, but Prince had other ideas. In spring 2018, Erik Prince declared himself President. The party plotters were furious and considered removing Prince from power by force, but realized it could not be done without a bloody, unpopular civil war. In the end, an olive branch was extended to the Republican Party, as one of their own was given the Vice-Presidential slot. A number of moderate, anti-war Republicans fled the country or disappeared from public life when they criticized the new government.
• In 2013, war came to South America. The attempted bombing of the Capitol by an anti-capitalist leftist resulted in the invasion of communist Colombia. The United States found itself opposed to the pink tide leftist states, and, alongside old allies and new ones (Colombia, Chile, and Ecuador) quickly defeated and occupied their enemies. Mexico was subject to American occupation as well, though as part of the war on drugs. American-aligned governors have set up their own de facto states in American-occupied areas throughout the country, and listen more to Washington than Mexico City.
• The United States of 2022 is a de facto police state, though the trappings of the old democratic republic are kept around as a façade. Erik Prince sits in the White House as the 46th President. The government is dominated by the Republican Party (the party of Prince), which largely follows the President’s commands for fear of the near-omniscient surveillance organizations digging up some dubious anecdote from their past. Though the United States functions as a dictatorship, the populace is largely docile. Whether this is because they truly believe the constant fearmongering from the government and largely pro-administration media, or because they fear internment in detention camps is up to debate. Whatever the reason, the United States is no longer the home of the free (though the still large numbers of men enlisting in the military prove the title land of the brave is as relevant as ever)
• The United States continues to occupy vast swathes of the world, and there is no sign that they will pack up anytime soon. The US military is large, but Private Military forces (Blackwater, Bancroft Global, and Transportation Security Associates among them) make up a good proportion of the occupation forces. In most of the occupied territories, the United States has created pro-American puppet governments, but it is clear that the real power lies in the hands of the American forces stationed there.
• The United States and its bloc are powerful in the world, and, to combat them, Russia and the European Union formed a loose alliance, the Rome Compact to oppose America. It is not incorrect to say that there is something of a cold war throughout the world, pitting the United States and its allies against the Eurasian bloc. However, while the two blocs are opposed, their conflict is really a war of words and ideas rather than actions. The United Nations General Assembly is in the frontlines of this war, as French-led delegates spend hours howling about American imperialism, while the United States tries to paint their opponents as too light on terrorism.
• While the United States occupies vast swathes of the world under false pretenses and the French howl of American imperialism in the United Nations, and as terrorists devise increasingly complex methods of massacring innocents and disrupting the infrastructure of the west sneaking bombs past the monolithic security agencies of their worn adversaries, the world is slowly sinking beneath the waves. Climate change is as big an issue as ever, and world governments are loath to do anything about. It’s not that science of rising seas and increasing temperatures are being hidden (well, except in the US where many researchers have been detained for other reasons) most simply find it hard to care about the workings of the environment when the United States is occupying millions of square miles of the Earth and being blown up by radical Islamists or communists is a (real or imagined) concern.
• Culturally, this world is surprisingly different from OTL. Patriotism is more widespread in the United States, and the population is more conservative (keep weed illegal! Gay marriage legal!?) Ideologies like democratic socialism have not caught on in the United States, likely because the internet has not developed nearly as much as it did IOTL. This can partly be attributed to surveillance and censorship. Social media never really took off, while a scare of smartphones being turned into bombs effectively ended technological advances in that direction. Even in 2022, email is the primary method of communication among citizens of the first world while mobile phones that don’t flip out are, like, so uncool.

And, as a bonus to flesh out the universe, some infoboxes of the US Presidential elections of 2016 and 2020.

Spoiler: Infoboxes

Is that a president Schwarzenegger?! My life is complete. One question though. How? Foreign born people cannot become president of the US.

 

[fashbasher]

Is that a president Schwarzenegger?! My life is complete. One question though. How? Foreign born people cannot become president of the US.

• In Bush’s second term, Arnold Schwarzenegger becomes heir apparent for the Republican Party. Spearheaded by Senator Orrin Hatch, the 28th Amendment to the Constitution was ratified. The 28th Amendment, also known as the Equal Opportunity to Govern Amendment or Hatch Amendment allowed non-natural born citizens who had held American citizenship for 20 years to be serve as President. Though a number of political figures would become eligible for the Presidency under the Hatch Amendment, it was clear to nearly everyone that the bill was simply an attempt to get Arnold Schwarzenegger into the White House.

 

[Baconheimer]

Is that a president Schwarzenegger?! My life is complete. One question though. How? Foreign born people cannot become president of the US.

IOTL, Orrin Hatch did introduce an amendment to get rid of the natural-born citizens clause. In this universe, the amendment was successfully ratified because of a stronger Republican Party. Even IOTL, the Hatch Amendment was largely viewed as a way to get Schwarzenenegger to the presidency.

 

[Clandango]

I've noticed that this scenario bears more than a passing resemblance to the 'New American Century' map by @rvbomally@The-Artist-64. I assure you that that is accidental, and that I've been working on this for a long time.

Patriotpunk, or if the War on Terror Never Ended​

A tad unrealistic with Eric Prince. I don't see how there would even be a threat of a civil war just because the country decides to kick out some armed men who literally broke into the White House. Not as if Prince (yah, no way he is going to get made fun of with Queen, Princess, and Little Mermaid jokes) had any elected position. I suggest having him be Secretary of the Interior, and having him use the security guards form various national monuments to storm the building and making it a Historical Landmark.

 

[Baconheimer]

A tad unrealistic with Eric Prince. I don't see how there would even be a threat of a civil war just because the country decides to kick out some armed men who literally broke into the White House. Not as if Prince (yah, no way he is going to get made fun of with Queen, Princess, and Little Mermaid jokes) had any elected position. I suggest having him be Secretary of the Interior, and having him use the security guards form various national monuments to storm the building and making it a Historical Landmark.

Admittedly, the coup is about the least plausible part of the timeline. The justification is that Prince has the support of the Republican Party and military, and that he is only meant as an interim leader. As to why the American people would have more loyalty to him than some military figure in a counter-coup, well, that just requires some suspension of disbelief.

Yout idea for a Secretary of Interior-led coup is certainly novel, and an interesting idea, but it's just not the route I want to go.

 

[gxblt]

D&D- esque map of my surroundings in my childhood - every name is translated as possible. Mostly a proof-of-concept seeing how different stuff would go together - ties in, however, with an anachronistic wold I've been developing for some time now.

Here we see the Lordships of Keele and Eskilstead, both rather small in their category. Lordships comprise of a manor house under which each individual 'stead' operates. A stead usually includes the extended family of the house master in addition to the houses of servants. Within the boundaries of a stead one can usually find lease farmers practising small scale agriculture in exchange for goods and services - the entire system is a multi-tiered feudal one.

The crests of Keele and Eskilstead both reflect the tradition and livelihood of the small Lordships - the golden boat of Keele symbolizes the island nature and skill of fishing and seafaring. Keele lays claim to the relatively lucrative Kettle Straits to their North - a steady source of income from taxing and monitoring boat traffic along the Great Yokewater.
The crest of Eskilstead features the windmill at Eskilmanor - the only one around, and thus further weakening the meager agricultural power of Keele. Another feature is the blackcurrant, a crop taking up nearly a third of all farmed land in the Lordship. Tradition of winemaking is kept well secret - perhaps the ships of Keele and wine and grain of Eskilstead shall one day lead to a greater peace and cooperation?

 

[CalBear]

I'm sorry if this seems presumptuous and demanding of me, but can you please get back to Bijou. I'm loving it, and I want to see if the Brits and French get into a fight over the continent.

Don't.

 

[xmoose]

Thank to Midnight-Blue766 who remind me how much I like austrowanks
This one is completely anachronic/ASB (yeah, there will be sequel maybe, at least rest of H-sphere)

 

[Clandango]

Admittedly, the coup is about the least plausible part of the timeline. The justification is that Prince has the support of the Republican Party and military, and that he is only meant as an interim leader. As to why the American people would have more loyalty to him than some military figure in a counter-coup, well, that just requires some suspension of disbelief.

Yout idea for a Secretary of Interior-led coup is certainly novel, and an interesting idea, but it's just not the route I want to go.

Alas, someday I will see a timeline with Smokey the Bear and the Boy Scouts storming government buildings. Ahh well, at least Eric Prince looks good on a poster.