Why the Chinese play cricket (The Pax Imperialis)
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This is actual alternate history wich is actually rather rare considering forums title. So im very impreseed, will follow this for updates .
The brits going into the federation without trouble seems abit unrealistic but maybe can be explained by expanding the local goverments in the proposed ireland solution bill of sorts to make any sense at all being the replacement. I do like the idea of avoiding total indian domination by breaking up the massive country into regions of sorts as one of the most realistic solutions to it staying british and it not devolving into the indian empire eventually.
I dont know that the british chinese faction not reconquering the warlords before their unification seems abit of a plot device by the way and the modernish chinese state with access to the empires cast offs should be doing alot better in the china campaign to be honest and they are trained properly aswell before the japanese joined especially is my thought . And the explanation seems to be that they didnt notice that the warlords were reunited into a central state and didnt react at all to that wich isnt super realistic.
Also an actual invasion of canada wich isnt part of some strange timeline is interesting to read , the campaign has gone abit to well for the empire side sofar to be honest altough with massive help from the empire to explain things.
The brits going into the federation without trouble seems abit unrealistic but maybe can be explained by expanding the local goverments in the proposed ireland solution bill of sorts to make any sense at all being the replacement. I do like the idea of avoiding total indian domination by breaking up the massive country into regions of sorts as one of the most realistic solutions to it staying british and it not devolving into the indian empire eventually.
I dont know that the british chinese faction not reconquering the warlords before their unification seems abit of a plot device by the way and the modernish chinese state with access to the empires cast offs should be doing alot better in the china campaign to be honest and they are trained properly aswell before the japanese joined especially is my thought . And the explanation seems to be that they didnt notice that the warlords were reunited into a central state and didnt react at all to that wich isnt super realistic.
Also an actual invasion of canada wich isnt part of some strange timeline is interesting to read , the campaign has gone abit to well for the empire side sofar to be honest altough with massive help from the empire to explain things.
thank you, I am trying to work on this faster but life is a bit hectic of late (last two years actually) and as you point out below, a lot of the earlier material could do with some work.
Getting the white Dominions into a federation probably wouldn't have been too hard, around the turn of the century there was a lot of support for it. The big issues will come with the incorporation of the non-white especially the African colonies into it. Those issues will start to come up now.
The Gaige Chinese long had a policy of expecting reunification to happen peacefully by some kind of organic process. Yes it was unrealistic but sometimes people and states do develop unrealistic theories. Likewise missing the Yao build up was basic incompetence on the part of the Gaige and CW.
Yeah the North American campaign needs work, but in defence, the CW is throwing at least one third of their resources into defending Eastern Canada.
But it is one of the first invasions of canada in any timeline that is interesting and isnt a usa rolling over them i have ever read.
And yeah ur freindly china part is strangest part of the timeline to be honest and i do agree with ur explanation but i still think they should have done better before the japanese were thrown in was a point unless u had the japanese helping the warlords alot more than what was mentioned i guess.
altough considering history the japanese and american alliance is one of the first time i have ever remember reading about before a war solves their conflict first so thats interesting aswell but considering my thought that this is an actual alternate history and not slight pod/s and its consuqence then it is even welcome of sorts but i still find it abit strange.
And yeah ur freindly china part is strangest part of the timeline to be honest and i do agree with ur explanation but i still think they should have done better before the japanese were thrown in was a point unless u had the japanese helping the warlords alot more than what was mentioned i guess.
altough considering history the japanese and american alliance is one of the first time i have ever remember reading about before a war solves their conflict first so thats interesting aswell but considering my thought that this is an actual alternate history and not slight pod/s and its consuqence then it is even welcome of sorts but i still find it abit strange.
When you look at it, Canada is actually quite hard to invade. The Pacific coast has nightmarish terrain, the mid west is simply too huge to attach and in the east the St Lawerance is a formidable barrier. Give the defenders a decent number of troops and it's not going to be easy.
One of the key elements of the timeline is the change in focus of Britain to the east. To the extent they'll sacrifice European concerns for it. It's on of the fundamentals of the TL and why the Federation works. The British fairly early on put the Empire before Europe, developing it and China as viable trade partners rather than just captive markets. But yes I probably need to revisit the early Chinese campaign.
When you look at it closely you find even prior to the OTL 2nd WW, the Japanese and US have a lot to gain from cooperation. And oddly enough you don't need to change much to make it possible. You need to get rid of Japanese Ultranationalism and preserve the Tasho democracy, plus remove US isolationism, their anti-japanese racism and slightly increase their imperialistic tendencies. It's not actually that big a change on either side. Tie the two together in TTLs Great War and you've pretty much got it.
The first two attempts I had at this timeline were just the OTL with the serial numbers filed off. Thing I like about this iteration is how far it's diverged. It's almost got a life of it's own now.
I am slowly slugging on with this, working on the last quarter of 1942 in Europe. I have a "question for the panel" Does anyone know the intended air group for the French Joffre class carriers? And how hard would it be to transit the Straits of Gibraltar if the Spanish coast was in hostile hands?
I understand that the British had one 9.2" gun at Gib which are a 'threat' to most ships below battleship transiting the straights but without the then latest radar and Fire control its unlikely that a fast moving ship is going to be hit.
I think the British only ever sunk 6 ships from the Dover batteries and the Germans 2 from batteries in the Calais area throughout the entire war.
Op Cerberus is a pretty good example of not being able to hit fast moving ships with a shore battery
So I am going to call it and say that a warship is likely to be fairly safe especially if transiting at night time.
Derek Pullem
Donor
Unreliable but air group seems to have been 40 aircraft consisting of 15 navalised Dewoitine D.520 (aka D.790) and 25 twin engined (!) navalised Bregeut Br 693 (aka Br 810) torpedo bombers.
On the subject of air group for the Joffre
She was still several years from completion and French carrier aviation was by far the worst of the 4 carrier operating nations in 1940
But French aircraft development was looking like it was on the cusp of some very nice aircraft when the Armistice was signed in June 1940 which killed any such designs.
So it is hard to say what they might have ended up using.
Had they not stopped development in 1940 its very likely that they would have produced a home grown selection of Aircraft
Aircraft waiting in the wings such as the LN.401 and I would imagine that the D520 would make for a suitable carrier fighter.
Hello! I ran across this TL a while back, but I'm just now embarking on a full readthrough. Despite being a Yankee (in the original New England sense), I really enjoy your narrative and the work that's obviously gone into exploring alternative paths for the British empire, the US, and other world nations to follow. And as a fan of naval history I do appreciate the ship construction and strategy notes.
1942d Europe
~October to December 1942 (European War): Winter follies
October 1942: The Warsaw Pact forms a provisional government in Greece. The new government is dominated by the anarchist Dimofilés Ergatikó Kínima (Popular Labour Front) and communist Ethnikó Apeleftherotikó Métopo (National Liberation Front).
October 1942: The Luftwaffe begins concentrating it's strategic bombing campaign on the French transportation network. The first raids are also conducted over Luxembourg.
October 1942: With the Nationalist position on Spain rapidly deteriorating, French troops are diverted from the Rhine front in order to prevent a Nationalist collapse. These reinforcements are able to halt the Republican offensive but not before the Republicans have made significant advances along the Mediterranean coast, taking Almeria. The Republicans take the opportunity to rest and resupply in preparation for 1943.
October 1942: Evidence of the Turkish persecution of their local Greek minority surfaces in the CW and democratic members of the Warsaw Pact. This evidence leads to widespread public condemnation and forces the new Turkish government to begin to scale down the persecution. However many Greeks continue to be forced from their homes in Symra.
November 1942: The CW loans the obsolete Australia class light carrier Zealandia to the Kriegsmarine as the Alder to enable the Germans to gain familiarity with carrier operations.
November 1942: The Russians form collaborationist governments in the Baltic states. These new governments are dominated by the suppressed communist resistance movements the Entente has long been supporting. These new governments begin recruiting local militias to fight alongside the Russians.
November 1942: The Warsaw Pact leaders meet in Rome to discuss their strategy for 1943. It is recognised the war has stablised and is beginning to turn in the Pact's favour. With the Balkans and Eastern Mediterranean now secure the focus can now be shifted to forcing the Russians from their gains in the east. To avoid overstretching resources it is agreed the offensives should be limited. After fierce opposition from the Baltic States it is finally agreed the primary focus should be on regaining lost Polish territory. In the west the Germans will launch an offensive to reestablish the defensive line on the Rhine while the Italians will begin planning for a landing on the French Mediterranean coast. However any such landing should be conditional on the clearing of Tunisia and Algeria, along with ehe establishment of naval supremacy in the Western Mediterranean. To this end, the Italians will launch an amphibious assault on Algeria in March. In Spain the Republican forces will launch a limited offensive aimed at taking Cartagena while focusing their primary attention of securing Spanish Morocco to complete the conquest of Entente territory in North Africa.
November 1942: The French renew their offensive in Germany with a drive toward Frankfurt with the aim of outflanking German defences around Dortmund and opening a route to the North German Plain. The winter offensive proves to be poorly organised and immediately runs into heavy German resistance. However it does force the Warsaw Pact to divert Italian reinforcements to support the Germans.
December 1942: The CW allows Warsaw Pact naval architects to make a detailed examination of the Russians warships now interned in Alexandria.
December 1942: Fighting between anarchist and communist groups breaks out in Greece. Warsaw Pact forces quickly move to impose a truce, though low level political violence continues.
October 1942: The Warsaw Pact forms a provisional government in Greece. The new government is dominated by the anarchist Dimofilés Ergatikó Kínima (Popular Labour Front) and communist Ethnikó Apeleftherotikó Métopo (National Liberation Front).
October 1942: The Luftwaffe begins concentrating it's strategic bombing campaign on the French transportation network. The first raids are also conducted over Luxembourg.
October 1942: With the Nationalist position on Spain rapidly deteriorating, French troops are diverted from the Rhine front in order to prevent a Nationalist collapse. These reinforcements are able to halt the Republican offensive but not before the Republicans have made significant advances along the Mediterranean coast, taking Almeria. The Republicans take the opportunity to rest and resupply in preparation for 1943.
October 1942: Evidence of the Turkish persecution of their local Greek minority surfaces in the CW and democratic members of the Warsaw Pact. This evidence leads to widespread public condemnation and forces the new Turkish government to begin to scale down the persecution. However many Greeks continue to be forced from their homes in Symra.
November 1942: The CW loans the obsolete Australia class light carrier Zealandia to the Kriegsmarine as the Alder to enable the Germans to gain familiarity with carrier operations.
November 1942: The Russians form collaborationist governments in the Baltic states. These new governments are dominated by the suppressed communist resistance movements the Entente has long been supporting. These new governments begin recruiting local militias to fight alongside the Russians.
November 1942: The Warsaw Pact leaders meet in Rome to discuss their strategy for 1943. It is recognised the war has stablised and is beginning to turn in the Pact's favour. With the Balkans and Eastern Mediterranean now secure the focus can now be shifted to forcing the Russians from their gains in the east. To avoid overstretching resources it is agreed the offensives should be limited. After fierce opposition from the Baltic States it is finally agreed the primary focus should be on regaining lost Polish territory. In the west the Germans will launch an offensive to reestablish the defensive line on the Rhine while the Italians will begin planning for a landing on the French Mediterranean coast. However any such landing should be conditional on the clearing of Tunisia and Algeria, along with ehe establishment of naval supremacy in the Western Mediterranean. To this end, the Italians will launch an amphibious assault on Algeria in March. In Spain the Republican forces will launch a limited offensive aimed at taking Cartagena while focusing their primary attention of securing Spanish Morocco to complete the conquest of Entente territory in North Africa.
November 1942: The French renew their offensive in Germany with a drive toward Frankfurt with the aim of outflanking German defences around Dortmund and opening a route to the North German Plain. The winter offensive proves to be poorly organised and immediately runs into heavy German resistance. However it does force the Warsaw Pact to divert Italian reinforcements to support the Germans.
December 1942: The CW allows Warsaw Pact naval architects to make a detailed examination of the Russians warships now interned in Alexandria.
December 1942: Fighting between anarchist and communist groups breaks out in Greece. Warsaw Pact forces quickly move to impose a truce, though low level political violence continues.
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Great to see you back. Wonder if we might see the wars expanding further such as the CW being pulled into the European conflict or vice versa. Regardless, keep up the good work!
It is a distinct possibility the European and Transpacific Wars might merge. There are a considerable number of points where it could happen. New Caledonia, French Indochina, the Low Countries, the French Transatlantic supply lines spring to mind. The CW don't want it to happen, neither does the Entente (the Warsaw Pact on the other hand would be quite keen). However French and CW have already clashed and the CW are blatantly supporting the WP (around 20% of the WP war budget is actually a direct CW subsidy), but both sides are holding back.
A minor addition since it seems the most important rail lines between France and Germany seem to run through Luxembourg
February 1941: The French, citing the Austrian and Hungarian entry into the war as justification, launch an invasion of Germany and Luxembourg. Expecting the Germans to be able to field at most 12 divisions, commit 30 divisions to the attack. President Wittelsbach orders a mobilisation and with the 200,000 troops training in Poland as part of the KC, Germany is able to field 25 divisions. The Germans abandon the Rheinland and form a defensive line along the Rhine. Also recruiting is extremely brisk with well over 200,000 volunteers, including 40,000 Jews coming forward in the first week.
October 1942: The Luftwaffe begins concentrating it's strategic bombing campaign on the French transportation network. The first raids are also conducted over Luxembourg.
February 1941: The French, citing the Austrian and Hungarian entry into the war as justification, launch an invasion of Germany and Luxembourg. Expecting the Germans to be able to field at most 12 divisions, commit 30 divisions to the attack. President Wittelsbach orders a mobilisation and with the 200,000 troops training in Poland as part of the KC, Germany is able to field 25 divisions. The Germans abandon the Rheinland and form a defensive line along the Rhine. Also recruiting is extremely brisk with well over 200,000 volunteers, including 40,000 Jews coming forward in the first week.
October 1942: The Luftwaffe begins concentrating it's strategic bombing campaign on the French transportation network. The first raids are also conducted over Luxembourg.
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This is a more general observation, but the TTL Commonwealth Conferences have to be quite a sight to see 
. Rotating the location is a good idea, to make all members of the CW feel like they're actually partners. They probably cause a frenzy of activity in the chosen city as the conference date draws near, rather like the Olympics. Cleaners and architects to make the city look more impressive, businesspeople hoping to network or lobby for their interests, and of course the overworked security staff.
. Rotating the location is a good idea, to make all members of the CW feel like they're actually partners. They probably cause a frenzy of activity in the chosen city as the conference date draws near, rather like the Olympics. Cleaners and architects to make the city look more impressive, businesspeople hoping to network or lobby for their interests, and of course the overworked security staff.Apologies for the double post, but a question occurred to me: is there any chance of a better helmet for CW troops? From my limited understanding, the OTL Brodie helmets introduced for British forces in WW1 were phased out by the Mark III because of their low head coverage, but this didn't happen until quite late in the war.
I am aware I haven't updated this timeline for almost two years. Nonetheless I haven't stopped working on it. However I've done a LOT more research over those two years and am no longer happy with it, especially the pre 20th century portion and the First Great War. Plus it's too much of a britwank in my opinion, so that needs to change too. I'm planning on restarting it yet again. However I'll post it initially in the before 1900 forum this time, at least for the first part. I'll include a link when I do. So is anyone still interested in this?