Well they're ostensibly (de jure) equal members of the federation, right? So I guess they should be the same color.
The Union Forever: A TL
- Thread starter Mac Gregor
- Start date
Well they're ostensibly (de jure) equal members of the federation, right? So I guess they should be the same color.
If I have understand correctly, Russia has same status as other parts of IEF so these all should have same color.
Hey guys, I am continuing to refine the map. Does anybody have any suggestions for what the Mexican state boundaries should be for the TL?
Always happy to see my Mexico maps get used.
They are infinitely useful.
If only I could get my language map efforts finished. . . But that's de-railing this wonderful thread. Though it does serve to bump it so, mixed bag?
Always happy to see my Mexico maps get used.
Very cool maps. Sadly I don't know enough about Mexican history to speculate on how butterflies would effect state development. Unless anybody has any ideas, I will probably start with the 1858-1863 map and make some random changes.
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Treaty of Manila
Treaty of Manila
With the war finally over, delegations from the former belligerent nations gathered in the Philippine capital of Manila. During the sweltering heat of the summer of 1980, diplomats squabbled and schemed to forge a lasting peace while satisfying their national interests.
Japanese Government
Having been instrumental in removing Hayashi and the corporatists from power, Emperor Nobuhito managed to enter into the Manila negotiations from a position of relative strength. Nevertheless, the peace treaty imposed several harsh conditions on the Japanese government. Japan was forced to apologize and accept blame for starting the war. The corporatist Kobushi party was permanently banned, and a new constitution providing for free multiparty elections was to be drafted. Nearly two dozen individuals were handed over to an Allied tribunal to be tried for war crimes. Japan was also saddled with a sizable indemnity of 75 billion British Pounds.
Military Restrictions
As in India, several limitations were placed on the Japanese military. At Manila, the Chinese delegation pushed for full demilitarization. Representatives from the British Commonwealth and the LAR however, wished for Japan to be able to defend itself against an ascendant China. After a series of tense negotiations an agreement was finally reached. Japan was prohibited form ever possessing nuclear, biological, or chemical weapons. The Imperial Navy was banned form operating aircraft carriers and limited to 150,000 tons for the next 30 years. The Imperial Army was capped at 500,000 troops including reservists for a similar length of time.
Territorial Changes
The Treaty of Manila made several important changes to the map of East Asia, essentially dismantling the Japanese Empire. In Southeast Asia, the Kingdom of Siam returned to its pre-1972 borders. Japan was to evacuate all South Pacific islands that belonged to the British Commonwealth before the war. Hainan, Formosa, Japan’s Antarctic territory, and a host of smaller islands including the Parcels and Senkakus were ceded to the Technate of China. Korea became an independent state for the first time in over 80 years with elections scheduled for 1982. After considerable debate, the United States gained control over the Bonin Islands. President Stewart was initially reluctant to gain any territory for her country’s part in the war, but the high price paid for the islands and their usefulness as a buffer for the Micronesian Territory changed her mind. One of the most contentious issues of the conference was the fate of the Ryukyu Islands. Despite never being captured during the war, the Chinese sought to annex all of the Ryukyu and Daito Islands. Britain, which wished to have something to show for its efforts in the Pacific, also made a claim for them. Eventually, a compromise was reached where the islands would remain part of Japan but be demilitarized. Over the years, many in China would view that the Western powers cheated them out of the Ryukyu Islands.
Spheres of Influence
As worked out in the Cape Town Conference during February of 1977, China gained a massively expanded sphere of influence after the war. By the end of the year, Vietnam, Laos, and Kampuchea had all declared themselves technates. Despite falling in China’s new area of influence, the United States and Britain fought hard for Korea to have a chance to pick its own government. Many in the West hoped that China would respect the Korean people’s decision when they went to the polls in 1982.
The World following the Treaty of Manila
September, 1980
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Asia-Pacific War: Casualties
(Be sure to see the update on the Treaty of Manila on the previous page.)
The Cost of War
In the months following the war, historians began the arduous process of tallying the dead. While the exact number is impossible to know, most put the figure somewhere between 32-35 million fatalities arguably making the Asia-Pacific War the world’s most deadly conflict since the Mongol conquests of the 13th and 14th centuries. The table below contains the most widely cited figures from the British Museum.
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That's a fairly ghastly death toll, but still far, far lower than OTL's WWII so that's a small mercy I suppose.
It will be interesting to see how the post-war world shapes up. China's neighbors are of course technates (willingly or unwillingly) but it will be interesting to see if China respects Korea's sovereignty.
In the immediate post-war balance of power East Asia has been completely shaken up, which will put Russia on edge since the new big kid on the block borders her protectorates and has a claim on some of her territory.
The Commonwealth will be licking its wounds for the foreseeable future but is certainly not going to be drawing down it's naval and air forces anytime soon. Probably covertly supporting Japan in case China gets too uppity, though they will also have US help now too.
The US has just accidentally inherited an mini-empire of its own. So we shall see what that future brings...
It will be interesting to see how the post-war world shapes up. China's neighbors are of course technates (willingly or unwillingly) but it will be interesting to see if China respects Korea's sovereignty.
In the immediate post-war balance of power East Asia has been completely shaken up, which will put Russia on edge since the new big kid on the block borders her protectorates and has a claim on some of her territory.
The Commonwealth will be licking its wounds for the foreseeable future but is certainly not going to be drawing down it's naval and air forces anytime soon. Probably covertly supporting Japan in case China gets too uppity, though they will also have US help now too.
The US has just accidentally inherited an mini-empire of its own. So we shall see what that future brings...
Did we ever get a peace treaty in Venezuela?
Anyway, way to go India and Japan.
Also I wouldn't be surprised if Korea gets a Technate party, win or not. China might try to aid it, as well.
Anyway, way to go India and Japan.
Also I wouldn't be surprised if Korea gets a Technate party, win or not. China might try to aid it, as well.
Eeee-youch, that's a pretty steep butcher's bill for this war. It makes sense given the kinda of fighting in Indochina and the Subcontinent (large populations in dense concentrations + ideologically-based motivation for many participants + large in-theater military forces= a high death toll). It's probably a contender for "bloodiest war in the 20th. Century" with the Great War and the Chinese Civil War, I'd wager, but at least it's done now hopefully. As in, the matter's as settled as it's gonna get.
Maybe indicative of a high disparity of firepower and technology that favors the Allies, leaving most of the Compact side's advantages to rest primarily in larger numbers and being closest to the theater of fighting?
Maybe indicative of a high disparity of firepower and technology that favors the Allies, leaving most of the Compact side's advantages to rest primarily in larger numbers and being closest to the theater of fighting?
Good comments y'all. To discuss a few points..
1) Indeed the Compact death toll was higher. This was due to a few reasons such as the Allies having better technology, some of the bloodiest fighting happening on their territory (Indochina, India, Hainan, Formosa, etc.), and starvation due to the Allied blockade.
2) While not discussed there was a peace treaty with Venezuela known as the Treaty of Mexico City. The treaty made minor border adjustments in favor of Colombia, outlawed corporatist parties, placed limitations on the Venezuelan military, called for democratic elections, and forbade Venezuela making a military alliance with a nation outside of the Western Hemisphere.
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Mac,
Just how many people on Formosa are happy about now being under Chinese rule? How many Japanese citizens (of Japanese descent) are there? Will China be looking at a restive population?
Just how many people on Formosa are happy about now being under Chinese rule? How many Japanese citizens (of Japanese descent) are there? Will China be looking at a restive population?
Good question. For the most part, the ethnic Han on Formosa are glad to see the backs of the Japanese. The vast majority of Japanese colonist on the island were either killed, evacuated, or deported so there are virtually none left to contest the take over. The Chinese government is already planning on resettling millions of ethnic Chinese who lost their homes during the war on Formosa.
Hrm. I don't know if the natives of the island would be that happy. If I recall correctly, there has always been a great deal of friction between the Taiwanese and the mainland Chinese. OTL, the natives were not happy when Republic of China relocated to the island. After 85 years, I would think that they would have gotten used to the Japanese. They will be restless against Chinese efforts to reeducate the natives to consider themselves the same as the mainlanders.