Update today. Remember Jesus died so that you could live to force Jesus upon other people
The Sons of Inti Shall Not Perish
- Thread starter King of the Uzbeks
- Start date
Chapter 2.4: Demands
A missionary
Quisipe-Tupac thought he had already fulfilled his end of the bargain. The Spanish were allowed to worship freely in their homes in Qusqo. They were exempt from much of the pomp that surrounded the office of Sapa Inka as they did not revere Quisipe-Tupac as the son of a god. To the Tawantinsuyu this was an enormous concession, the divine status of the Sapa Inka was a central part of their faith. These privileges had never been granted to anyone else and only because of the time of need. To many these were in fact more rewards then the Spaniards deserved.
The Spanish however saw only limitations in the set up. Missionaries were barred from preaching near important religious sites. Pagan rituals were still practiced in the presence of Christians and when the subject of the exact legal status of their faith arose Qusipe-Tupac always found a way to change the subject. Thus Castro, hearing these reports from Qusqo, waited for an opportunity to press the issue of religion.
Mullihambato proved a perfect opportunity. The Spaniards who now ruled from Tumbez were a divided group, and not always the most adept at staying true to Christian virtues. But such a massacre of innocent Christians united them and offended even the worst sinners amongst them. Castro prepared a list of demands as soon as he got word of the massacre and then waited until some reports of brutality emerged from the lands controlled from Qusqo. On April 23rd a priest was beaten up near Qusqo by some overzealous Tawantisuyu who had probably engaged in a little too much partying. It was what Castro had been waiting for.
He sent to Qusqo several armed men, bearing demands for the Sapa Inka regarding the future of religion in the Tawantinsuyu. He did demand an end to human sacrifices, but he mainly focused on Christianity and the need for it to be protected.
Castro demanded complete religious freedom for Catholics inside the empire. The right of Christians to worship would be unquestioned in the Tawantinsuyu if he had his way, (it is worth noting that he was simultaneously surpressing native faiths in New Oaxoca). Castro wanted any crimes against Christians to instantly become capital offenses, regardless of how severe they were. Crimes by Christian Spaniards would naturally be tried by the Spanish under Spanish law and custom, but this was already practiced from existing treaties. However, Castro argued that local officials would never be able to fairly try crimes against Christians and so demanded that anyone accused of crimes against Christians be handed over to his government in Tumbez. To enforce this Castro proposed that his men be granted rights to enter the Tawantinsuyu and retrieve people who had committed crimes against Christians. Effectively Castro was using the issue to try and end the independence of the Tawantinsuyu in the name of protecting Christianity. Castro also claimed that any Christian converts had submitted themselves to his authority and that the Spanish had full rights to mediate any disputes
Castro also demanded that the Tawantinsuyu not only open the doors for missionaries but actively support them. Castro demanded that when a missionary entered a town they be accompanied by banners of the Sapa Inka and that at any religious event Priests be allowed to speak. Churches were to be built by government labor with government funds. The Catholic faith, wrote Castro, was accustomed to having the support of the state and so needed the funding in order to be viable.
These demands were completely outrageous, and Castro must have known this. The foundation of the Tawantinsuyu was the divinity of the Sapa Inka and the religious practices that sprung up around him. Elevating Christianity to equal status inside the Empire would be an all-out attack on the foundation of the rule of the Sapa Inkas. Castro was no expert in the workings of his nominal ally, but he had to have understood just how aggressive his demands were. There were several factors in play as Castro made his demands besides an honest desire to spread the Catholic Faith.
JESUS LOVES YOU
Firstly, it would expand Spanish rule. Although declarations of eternal peace had of course been declared between Spain and the Tawantinsuyu it was no secret that there were many Spaniards who wanted more. Spain had been on the rise since 1492, and being stopped by a pagan, American, empire was a blow to the pride of the Conquistadores. Castro’s demands would expand Spanish powers no matter what happened. If they were accepted Spain would have a major foothold in the still independent Tawantinsuyu lands and have near total freedom to do what they wished even in areas nominally under rule from Qusqo.
Secondly was the prospect of uniting the factions of New Oaxaca behind him. Castro had somewhat placated the landowners with his organization of the colony, but he could placate them more by pressing for more land. He had forever made an enemy of the merchants of Panama and their allies, but even their schemes would begin to wane if he possessed the full wealth of the Tawantinsuyu. Even a prolonged war would help him avoid internal dissent, since a war would give him a far greater leeway in prosecuting treasonous activities.
Castro so felt he had a strong position to push his demands onto the Tawantinsuyu. The ball was now in Quisipe-Tupac’s court.
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That's an interesting question, but I don't see how that'd help the Inka in their current problem. Absent a miracle, they wouldn't be interested in Protestantism or Eastern Orthodoxy for their own sakes, and in this era of religious wars, neither faith would help stop the Spaniards even if the Inka did adopt them.
Qusipe-Tupac might be a stooge, but even he can't be that spineless to sign away Tawantinsuyu sovereignty, and against such blatant demands.
Is he?
Is he?
I doubt Tupac would do it, even he can’t be that much of a dumbass. If he does, the Quitians and his uncle will come knocking, and hopefully be enough to knockout the rotted timbers of Nuevo Oaxaca.
Update...today. But like at a reasonable hour in Ohio not early in the morning.
The Welsers will never again be able to exert full control over Kleine Alpen (if they ever had full control in the first place), but Hutten has promised reinforcements at some point. And of course they have one crucial advantage Castro lacks. A complete lack of loyalty to any sort of principles whatsoever.
They know that other forms of Christianity exist, if only because some of the less bright Spanish still ramble about them despite their lack of relevance on the continent. They are wholey uninterested, no tangible benefit is to be gained and as stated the structure of the Tawantinsuyu is built entirely around the premise that the Sapa Inka is a god.
The next update has some sweet sweet Manco Capac in it!
He's a stooge of Cusco for now. Which means he values the empire's independence. Not so much people from not-Cusco though.
Tune in later today.
The Welsers will never again be able to exert full control over Kleine Alpen (if they ever had full control in the first place), but Hutten has promised reinforcements at some point. And of course they have one crucial advantage Castro lacks. A complete lack of loyalty to any sort of principles whatsoever.
They know that other forms of Christianity exist, if only because some of the less bright Spanish still ramble about them despite their lack of relevance on the continent. They are wholey uninterested, no tangible benefit is to be gained and as stated the structure of the Tawantinsuyu is built entirely around the premise that the Sapa Inka is a god.
The next update has some sweet sweet Manco Capac in it!
Qusipe-Tupac might be a stooge, but even he can't be that spineless to sign away Tawantinsuyu sovereignty, and against such blatant demands.
Is he?
He's a stooge of Cusco for now. Which means he values the empire's independence. Not so much people from not-Cusco though.
Tune in later today.
Chapter 2.5: Of Gods and Suyus
The Nobles of Qusqo
Quisipe-Tupac hemmed and he hawed. He was aware of just how damaging accepting Castro’s offer would be to his position as Sapa Inka and to the empire as a whole. His court, normally divided amongst itself was unanimous in recommending a refusal of the terms presented to Castro. But the question was how to avoid war while rejecting the demands. There were competing viewpoints on how to do this.
One group, comprised mostly of those dabbling in Christianity behind the scenes or those sympathetic to the dabblers, advocating accepting the religious demands while rejecting the demands about Spanish enforcement. They contended that the real threat was Spanish encroachment, not any foreign religion. This group noted that the Spanish used Christianity to support their empire and said that Quisipe-Tupac could do the same. With no Spanish oversight he could turn Christianity into a cult in his favor.
The other group was more nebulous in composition and more nebulous in proposed response. They rejected acceptance of Christianity and any Spanish encroachment. They proposed vague compromises to appease Castro while maintaining independence. It was from this group that young Titu Cusi made his first foray into the politics of his cousin’s court. He gave a stirring attack on creeping Christianity in the empire and made thinly veiled insinuations that his father would not allow it. He then turned towards the Spanish representatives and gave the same speech in Spanish. It was a bold statement of defiance that signaled that Manco Capac was emerging from the south.
Despite the theatrics Quisipe-Tupac did not refuse the deal with promises of concessions. Neither did he accept the Christianity demands from Castro. This was probably for the better, neither option truly presented a viable way to avoid war with Spain. Neither offered a capitulation that would truly offset the lost gains for Spain from a rejected deal. Quisipe-Tupac did find a way to reject the majority of the ultimatum, while averting war with Spain. It was not a pretty solution.
Quisipe-Tupac took a page out of his father’s book and promised massive amounts of precious metals to the Spaniards. Bribing the Spanish to go away had worked for Atawallpa and Quisipe-Tupac was determined to make it work again. He, through gritted teeth, offered an annual tribute to the Crown of Spain. Enough Gold to fill a liter and enough Silver to fill a ship. Every year for the foreseeable future. Little mention was made of the actual demands put forward by Castro in the response.
Castro did not accept the offer. He legitimately sought to protect and expand Christianity in the Twantinsuyu. He was however open to the idea of loosening his demands in exchange for concessions in other fields. However, Gold and Silver was not enough, he claimed that the shipments were too easily stolen or tampered with. Castro wanted something more substantial. He wanted land.
The Spanish returned in mid-July with Castro’s reply. The prospect of giving up more land was not met with much enthusiasm by the court, and some suggested simply raising the amount of gold promised every year. But the Sapa Inka did not have an endless supply of gold, his empire was rich in the metal, but did not have the capacity to mine it in the huge quantities needed to appease Spain’s lust for gold. The monopoly imposed by generations of Sapa Inkas had guaranteed that Quisipe-Tupac had a large on hand supply of gold, but even that was depleting. Years of trade with the Spanish, who invariably set extremely high prices, had begun to put a dent in the Sapa Inka’s gold. It was nowhere near to being gone, but it could not sustain years of being shipped endlessly to Spain. The Tawantinsuyu had plenty of silver on hand and was unknowingly sitting on an entire mountain of it, but it was not as appealing to the Spanish as gold, and Castro would still object to not getting any land.
So Quisipe-Tupac sent forth his reply, accepting the loss of territory, along with a reduced tribute. Castro was delighted and prepared the final terms of what would come to be known as the Cessation of Faith. He took a method from the Treaty of Tordesillas and used an arbitrary line on a map to determine the new borders, though in this case it was latitude instead of longitude. The 12th Parallel South would now be the barrier between the Tawantinsuyu and the Spanish Empires, though actually drawing the line would take some time. In addition, Qusqo immediately began stalling for time because the Tawantinsuyu had only a limited understanding of latitude and longitude and needed time to figure it all out to avoid being cheated out of land by the Spanish. A ship’s worth of treasure, an assortment of silver and gold, would be given to the Spanish by the Tawantinsuyu every year starting in 1553. As for the religious issues, which had precipitated the crisis in the first place, a compromise was reached that would not have been possible save the extreme concessions given by Quisipe-Tupac. The Spanish would have the right to defend missionaries and try those accused of attacking Christians, however they would have to gain permission from the Tawantinsuyu to enter and make arrests, permission that was widely understood to be impossible to obtain except for extreme cases.
Peace had been preserved. However, Qusqo rumbled at the territory lost, the enemy was now dangerously close to the capital, and they saw little gain. And the Cessation of Faith unintentionally began to tip the balance of power inside the empire.
Since the conquests of Pachacuti there had been four suyus ruled from Qusqo[1]. Chinchasuyu in the Northwest, Antisuyu in the Northeast, Kuntisuyu in the Southwest, and Qullasuyu in the Southeast. At the time they had been of equal size but as the Empire had grown in size Chinchasuyu and Quallasuyu had grown larger, while the two had stagnated in terms of territory. Bu the 1500’s Chinchasuyu and Qullasuyu were afforded double the representation at any gathering of the nobles compared to the other two suyus, though Qusqo still had a sizable, and more influential under Quisipe-Tupac, contingent. However, the Spaniards had come form the north, and the loss of territory reflected that. Chinchasuyu had been reduced by over half. This was decent politically for Qusqo as it got rid of the troublesome northerners who had backed Atawallpa, but it was a substantial loss of wealth and manpower. It also left Qullasuyu the only large province in the empire.
The same Qullasuyu that Manco Capac currently controlled.
Manco Capac shared his name with the mythical founder of his people. SYMBOLISM ALERT
Manco Capac had come south with an army and largely been left there to keep him out of the way. The soldiers he had kept under his control were northerners and had nowhere left to go. The nobles of Qusqo had sold their homes away to invaders. Manco Capac had done his best to integrate them into the new lands conquered from the Mapuche and had gained loyalty. Local nobles kept their privileges from before Manco’s arrival, so long as they remained loyal to him. Outside observers were not exactly welcomed into Manco Capac’s residence in Quillota but if they had been they would have noticed that he was acting much more like an emperor organizing his empire then a loyal governor ruling a province in the name of his nephew. Since Quisipe-Tupac’s rise Qullasuyu had technically been as open as any other region to the Spaniards but in practice those who wandered too far south found themselves imprisoned and declared “killed by bandits”. Castro was aware that this was likely not true he seems to have assumed that this was Manco Capac turning a blind eye towards local violence, not a campaign to stamp out foreign influence. These captives were helpful in finding sites with a high possibility of iron, and sure enough some of the sites did in fact have iron.
Soon there were iron mines sending their products to Quillota, where the process was quickly discovered for making iron weapons. Steel proved a much harder invention to find, with many captured Spaniards knowing how to work steel, but not how to make it. By 1553 Manco Capac had steel, it was not very good steel and would not stand up to Toledo steel, but it was a start and better then plain bronze weapons. Attempts to unlock the power of gunpowder met with mixed success, Manco Capac’s men found ways to make some small pops and crackles and even some nice-looking explosions. But it was not consistently produced and was not very good at propelling the shot needed to be used in guns or cannons. So, like his brother before him Manco Capac was forced to carefully conserve captured European powder, his hostility towards any foreigners leaving preventing any mass purchases from the Spanish.
With his new weapons and the sting of the Cessation of Faith spurring him on Manco Capac began more or less openly flouting any and all treaties with Spain. Missonaries caught in Qullasuyu were dumped into other provinces if they were found. Spaniards with things of more immediate value were brought to Quillota and were only released with exorbitant ransoms in steel weapons or gunpowder. Under the Cessation of Faith, the Spanish appealed to Quisipe-Tupac, who ordered those responsible turned over to the Spanish. Manco Capac refused. Despite having Titu Cusi as a nominal hostage Quisipe-Tupac did nothing more, out of fear for provoking his uncle’s wrath. Despite his provocative actions Manco Inca still dutifully sent taxes north, and Quisipe-Tupac thus had no reason to trifle with a man whose army was now the most powerful native force on the continent. Quisipe-Tupac did grant the Spanish authority to go and retrieve the accused, but this would have required a full-scale expedition.
Castro for now held off on challenging Manco Capac. He was far to the south and Castro was trying to appease the various factions under his control with land.
And his forces were better served looking to the north, where the Mummy Rebellion entered a new phase of violence after a brief lull.
1: Four being Tawa. Suyu being region. Tawantinuyu being the four regions.
Either he's waiting until his power is sufficient to supplant Quisipe and stave of Castro at the same time, or he is loyal to the Empire and doesn't want to carve the Empire further. Regardless, as he bides his time, Manco become the powerbroker of the Inca, I feel their future lies with him.
Manco Capac is doing very well it seems. I'm impressed by how his forces have managed to unlock (sorta) the secrets of steel and gunpowder at least partially under their own power. Sounds like he's got at least a rudimentary understanding of the experimental method, if they've gotten that far. If they can keep that mentality up once the Spanish are dealt with, it will prove useful in catching up to europe.
How old is manco right now, since that's a big factor in how long he has to build his power?
How old is manco right now, since that's a big factor in how long he has to build his power?
Yay the new update! I cannot wait for Manco to make Tawantinsuyu great again or whatever. Also, I low key want to hear more chess updates.
Love the story !
Does Manco Capac tried to learn to read from the captured spanish men ?
How does the indigenous coastal peoples from south Colombia and Ecuador fare ?
Does Manco Capac tried to learn to read from the captured spanish men ?
How does the indigenous coastal peoples from south Colombia and Ecuador fare ?