things changed quite a lot since the last time I visited this thread.
What's happening in East Asia now? are we to get some updates?
still lovin' this TL....
I think perhaps you posted this in the wrong thread, zeppelinair? Since, you know, this TL has not mentioned East Asia even once...?
Maybe, just maybe without a British Canada breathing down it's neck there is actually room for two United States of North America: A Hamiltonian, industrial north and a Jeffersonian, slaveholding agrarian south. As two countries they can coexist peacefully. The north (New England) can abolish slavery as IOTL and the south can keep it until such time as slavery by it's own name or by any other name becomes seen as manifestly unjust and an international liability. Which might take until the 1990s judging by what happened to South Africa IOTL.
Dunno about the '90s for slavery, TBH(barring the rise of a dictatorship, maybe). You might be able to stretch it out to the '60s but there would be a world of *major* economic hurt on the horizon once it *is* forced to end; the longer they try to keep it, the worse they fall.
One more plausible situation that might develop in such a scenario, though, is that slavery peaks at about the turn of the 20th century, give or take a few years, and then it begins to dwindle until it finally disappears sometime in the late 1930s-late '40s, with something similar to *Apartheid takes its place. However, though, the latter *could* potentially last until at least the end of the '80s/early '90s unless a major political movement develops.
I would imagine that escaped slaves would be a big source of contention. Look how the Fugitive Slave laws caused trouble IOTL..
Interesting that you all expect things to turn out so bleak, in regards to slavery. I'm not going to give my plans away, but I've got the coming developments in regards to slavery all worked out. I can tell you that what I won't be doing is create an utter dystopia where one American nation turns into a slave-holding Empire of Evil that persists in its evil ways for a very long time. That's been done (in one of the best TLs I've ever laid eyes upon, I might add, namely Decades of Darkness) and I won't try to copy that idea.
It's very clear by now that there will be several North American nations ITTL, and that they will be ideologically incompatible, to some extent. IOTL, slavery was an issue that divided North and South. ITTL, North and South will be very different entities, and the issues that divide them will be different as well. To what extent, you'll have to wait and see.
I aim to keep you interested, and to keep you guessing. So when I see this...
Can't wait to see where you end up taking this whole scenario.....
Im looking forward to seeing how our Midwest and western expansion develops ITTL
...that makes me a happy camper. As for the issue of slavery itself... it will actually come up in the final installment of part V. So stay tuned for that.
First, though, let me present (for those who might find it of interest) the full text of the Continental Charter:
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To all to whom these Presents shall come, we, the Representatives of the United States of America, assembled in the Continental Congress, send greeting.
In order to better provide for the common Defence, establish firm Justice, and secure the Blessings of Liberty for ourselves and our Posterity, the Representatives of the United States of America, assembled in the Continental Congress, did on the fifteenth day of November in the year One Thousand Seven Hundred and Eighty-four, and in the Tenth Year of American Independence agree to alter and improve the existing articles of Confederation and voluntary Union.
Having done so, we hereby ordain the
CONTINENTAL CHARTER
of Confederation and voluntary Union
of Confederation and voluntary Union
Article I. The signatory states, by this Charter, voluntarily enter into a firm League of friendship with each other, for their common Defence and the security of their Liberties, pledging themselves to assist each other, against all force offered to, or attacks made upon them, or any of them, on account of religion, sovereignty, trade, or any other pretence whatsoever.
Article II. The Style of this Confederacy shall be “The United States of America.”
Article III. Each State retains its Sovereignty, Freedom and Independence, and every Power, Jurisdiction and Right, which is not by this Charter expressly delegated to the United States, assembled in the Continental Congress. Each State retains the right to withdraw from the Confederacy at any point.
Article IV. No new State shall be admitted into this Confederacy, unless such admission be agreed to by no less than two-thirds of the States.
Article V. The better to secure mutual Friendship among the People of the different States in this Confederacy, there shall be no restrictions of any kind on the free and unhindered Trade between the States, nor shall Taxes or Tariffs be levied on any kind of Trade between the States. The free inhabitants of each of these States, fugitives from Justice excepted, shall be entitled to all privileges and immunities of free citizens in the several States; and the people of each State shall have free ingress and regress to and from any other State, and shall enjoy therein all the privileges of Trade and Commerce, subject to the same duties, impositions and restrictions as the inhabitants thereof respectively, provided that such restrictions shall not extend so far as to prevent the removal of property imported into any State, to any other State of which the Owner is an inhabitant; provided also that no imposition, duties or restriction shall be laid by any State, on the property of the United States, or any of them.
If any Person guilty of, or charged with, treason, felony, or other high misdemeanor in any State, shall flee from Justice, and be found in any of the United States, he shall upon demand of the executive power of the State from which he fled, be delivered up, and removed to the State having jurisdiction of his offence.
Full faith and credit shall be given in each of these States to the records, acts and judicial proceedings of the courts and magistrates of every other State.
Article VI. The United States will assemble in a general Congress, the style of which shall be “The Continental Congress”. Representatives of the several States shall be annually appointed in such manner as the legislature of each State shall direct, to meet in Congress on the first Monday in November, in every Year, with a power reserved to each State to recall its Representatives, or any of them, at any time within the Year, and to send others in their stead, for the remainder of the Year.
No State shall be represented in Congress by less than two, nor by more than seven Members; nor shall any person, being a Representative, be capable of holding any office under the United States, for which he, or another for his benefit, receives any salary, fees or emolument of any kind.
The Continental Congress will remain in session all Year, with no recess.
In determining questions in the Continental Congress, each state shall have one vote.
Freedom of speech and debate in Congress shall not be impeached or questioned in any Court, or place out of Congress, and the members of Congress shall be protected in their persons from arrests and imprisonments, during the time of their going to and from, and attendance on Congress, except for treason, felony, or breach of the peace.
Article VII. For the more convenient management of the general interests of the United States, the executive power shall be vested in a Consul of the United States, who derives all his authority from the Continental Congress. He shall hold his office for a term of six years, and be elected by the Representatives of the several States, assembled in the Continental Congress.
In electing the Consul, each state shall have one vote.
This election shall be held on the first Monday in July, and the term of the Consulate shall commence on the first Monday of November of the same Year.
The Consul shall appoint a Finance Secretary, a War Secretary, a Foreign Secretary and a Domestic Secretary. Together with the Consul, they will form a cabinet of five.
Article VIII. The Continental Congress shall have the sole and exclusive Right and Power of determining on Peace and War, except in the cases mentioned in the Thirteenth article;
Of sending and receiving Ambassadors;
Of entering into Treaties and Alliances, provided that no Treaty shall be made, whereby the legislative power of the respective States shall be restrained from imposing such Imposts and Duties on foreigners, as their own people are subjected to, or from prohibiting the exportation or importation of any species of goods or commodities whatsoever;
Of establishing rules for deciding, in all cases, what captures on land or water shall be legal, and in what manner prizes taken by land or naval forces in the service of the United States, shall be divided or appropriated
Of granting letters of marque and reprisal in times of peace;
Of appointing courts for the trial of piracies and felonies committed on the high seas; and establishing courts for receiving and determining finally appeals in all cases of captures; provided that no Member of Congress shall be appointed a judge of any of the said courts;
Of providing and maintaining a Continental Navy, and in time of war, providing a Continental Army;
Of appointing the High Command of the Continental Army, and of appointing all the officers of the Continental Navy;
Of making rules for the government and regulation of the Continental Army and the Continental Navy, and directing their operations;
Of making those Laws without which the foregoing Powers, and all other Powers explicitly vested in the Continental Congress by this Charter, cannot be carried into Execution.
Article IX. The Continental Congress shall have the sole and exclusive Right and Power to regulate Commerce with foreign Nations and with the Indian Tribes—provided that the legislative right of any State, within its own limits, be not infringed or violated—and to lay Tariffs on any form of import or export. Any Tariffs shall be collected by the several States, to the benefit of their own Treasuries, but all Tariffs shall be uniform throughout the United States. No State shall lay any Tariffs or any other Imposts or Duties of its own on Commerce with foreign Nations and with the Indian Tribes.
The Continental Congress may order and enforce an Embargo on all Commerce with a foreign State, provided that the United States are at war with said State, and then only until such a time that Peace is signed.
Article X. The States of this Confederacy shall have the Right and Power to coin Money and to issue Bills of Credit. All Coin and all Bills of Credit issued by the authority of the States of this Confederacy must be fully backed by Gold. All inhabitants of the United States are free to use, if they will, any Medium of Exchange, including Money and Bills of Credit issued by any foreign Government or any other Party.
Article XI. The Continental Congress may under no circumstance borrow Money on the credit of the United States, nor shall it be allowed that the Continental Congress adopts the debt of any State of this Confederacy, in part or in full.
Likewise, no State may under any circumstance borrow Money on the credit of the United States, or any of them.
Article XII. No State of this Confederacy shall send any embassy to, or receive any embassy from, or enter into any conferrence, agreement, alliance, or treaty, with any king, prince or foreign state; nor shall any person holding any office of profit or trust under the United States, or any of them, accept of any present, emolument, office, or title of any kind whatever, from any king, prince, or foreign state; nor shall the United States, or any of them, grant any title of nobility.
Article XIII. No vessels of war shall be kept up in time of peace, by any State, except such number only, as shall be deemed necessary by the Continental Congress, for the Defence of such State, or its trade; nor shall any body of forces be kept up, by any State, in time of peace, except such number only as, in the judgment of the Continental Congress, shall be deemed requisite to garrison the forts necessary for the Defence of such State; but every State shall always keep up a well-regulated and disciplined Militia, sufficiently armed and accounted, and shall provide and constantly have ready for use, in public stores, a due number of field pieces and tents, and a proper quantity of arms, ammunition, and camp equipage.
No State shall engage in any War without the consent of the Continental Congress, unless such State be actually invaded by enemies, or shall have received certain advice of a resolution being formed by some enemy power to invade such State, and the danger is so imminent as not to admit of a delay till the Continental Congress can be consulted: nor shall any State grant commissions to any ships or vessels of war, nor letters of marque or reprisal, except it be after a Declaration of War by the Continental Congress, and then only against the kingdom or State, and the subjects thereof, against which War has been so declared, and under such regulations as shall be established by the Continental Congress, unless such State be infested by pirates, in which case vessels of war may be fitted out for that occasion, and kept so long as the danger shall continue, or until the Continental Congress shall determine otherwise.
Article XIV. When land forces are raised by any State, for the Common Defence, all officers of those forces shall be appointed by the legislature of each State respectively by whom such forces shall be raised, or in such manner as such State shall direct.
Article XV. All charges of war, and all other expenses that shall be incurred for the Common Defence or for the execution of other tasks explicitly mandated to the Continental Congress by this Charter, shall be defrayed out of a common Treasury, which shall be supplied by the several States. To this end, each State shall anually supply one percent of its total revenue to the Treasury of the United States, and in times of war, two percent. This tax will be levied by the authority of the legislatures of the several States, and under the direction of the Finance Secretary of the United States.
The States exclusively shall be tasked with the payment of pensions to veterans of the Continental Army, but specifically regarding the payment of pensions to veterans of the War that led to American Independence, the Continental Congress shall imburse the States with money equivalent to half the expense incurred in payment of such pensions. In return for this, the States shall, during the years 1785 through 1795, anually supply two percent of their total revenue to the Treasury of the United States. This tax will be levied by the authority of the legislatures of the several States, and under the direction of the Finance Secretary of the United States. The States of Plymouth and New York shall be exempt from this, and shall supply the Treasury of the United States, in times of peace, with one percent of their total revenue during the years 1785 through 1795. These two States will in addition expend at least one percent of their total revenue for the purpose of paying off their public debts, until these debts are eliminated in full.
Article XVI. The Continental Congress shall be the last resort on appeal, in all disputes and differences now subsisting, or that hereafter may arise between two or more States concerning boundary, jurisdiction, or any other cause whatsoever.
Article XVII. All territories of the United States, until such time that they may join this Confederacy in Statehood, will be administrated and organized by the Continental Congress.
Article XVIII. The Continental Congress shall never declare War, nor grant letters of marque and reprisal in time of peace, nor enter into any treaties or alliances, nor ascertain the sums and expenses necessary for the Defence and Welfare of the United States, or any of them, nor agree upon the number of vessels of war to be built or purchased, or the number of land or sea forces to be raised, nor appoint a Commander in Chief of the army or navy, nor lay a Tariff, nor order an Embargo on Commerce with any Nation, unless at least two-thirds of the States assent to the same, nor shall a question on any other point, except for adjourning from day to day, be determined, unless by the votes of a majority of the Continental Congress.
Article XIX. Any proposal of law, deemed by the Eighteenth Article to be determined by the votes of a majority of the Continental Congress, may, if no less than one-third of the States object to the law, be nullified by those States. As a result, the said law or its effects will not be implemented within their own territory. Any proposal of law that requires a majority of at least two-thirds of the States may not be nullified.
Article XX. Every State shall abide by the determinations of the Continental Congress, on all questions which by this Confederation are submitted to them. And the Charter of this Confederation shall be inviolably observed by every State, nor shall any alteration at any time hereafter be made in any of them, unless such alteration be agreed to in a Congress of the United States, and be afterwards confirmed by the legislatures of every State.
We, the Representatives of the United States of America, in general Congress assembled, by virtue of the Power and Authority given to us for that purpose by the People of the United States, do, by these presents fully and entirely ratify and confirm the Continental Charter of Confederation and voluntary Union, and all and singular the matters and things therein contained. And we do further solemnly plight and engage the faith of our respective constituents, that they shall abide by the determinations of the Continental Congress, on all questions, which by the said Confederation are submitted to them. And that the Charter thereof shall be inviolably observed by the States we respectively represent.
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And that, my friends, is what TTL's United States get instead of the Constitution we all know and love/hate [cross out whichever does not apply]. Needless to say, things are going to be very different.