"Our Struggle": What If Hitler Had Been a Communist?

I think I might have to add "It's still Hitler" as a tag-line for this TL.
You keep saying that, but I have a feeling its not going to be that black and white. I2ve read your timelines for a long time Mr. Red, and if there's one thing I know, its that your. very good at creating illusions for readers. I think you have a few tricka up your sleeve here.
 
You keep saying that, but I have a feeling its not going to be that black and white. I2ve read your timelines for a long time Mr. Red, and if there's one thing I know, its that your. very good at creating illusions for readers. I think you have a few tricka up your sleeve here.

I have been accused of being deliberately ambiguous in the past but I couldn't possibly comment.
 
Not Chapter XXXVIII
Are we, perhaps, going to see a Red Otto Skorzeny?

Benito Mussolini's bed was shaking.

"Typical." he remarked to the empty room. Recently his life had been one headache after another, the fiasco that had been the attempted liberation of Austria, the Comintern's breach of the Alpine Wall, the uprising in the Po Valley, the fall of Milan and then Rome, why wouldn't an earthquake make it so that we couldn't even get a decent night's rest? No doubt an avalanche would soon follow.

That would just make things even more perfect,
the Italian dictator thought to himself. Messe and Wavell had insisted that this mountain lodge would allow him to stay near the frontline whilst out of the range of enemy artillery, as if they didn't just want him to leave them alone to the "real work". Was inspiring the Italian people not real work? Was inspiring the continued resistance for the glory of fascism not worth the time to the two generals? He couldn't help but feel that an avalanche would be an ironic punishment for the two of them, if he had to be killed by falling rocks, then at least he would embarrass those who had humiliated him so many times in this long, long retreat.

Mussolini could hear shouts of panic from outside, followed all too quickly by gun shots and screams.

His bed shook again, and all of the sudden it became clear that there had been no earthquake. Jumping out of bed, he ran to turn on the lights, only to realise the power had been cut. He tried to glimpse out of the window from the darkness, only to see his face reflect from the light of the full moon. For a moment, his old military training took over and he dived to the floor as a grenade flew through the window. A loud crump, and then only ringing, he realised that half of his room was in flames, as he noticed a large man in a coalscuttle helmet standing in the doorway.

Despite the ringing in his ears, he could hear the shadowed figure barking with laughter as the dictator realised that he was still in his pyjamas.

"Benito Mussolini, in the name of the Italian people, you are under arrest." The soldier sneered in a thick German accent.

Pyjama clad, Mussolini attempted to assert as much authority as he could muster, "You're not Italian! Who do you think you are to arrest me?!"

"My comrades have killed all of your blackshirts, this hotel is ours," the shadow from under the coalscuttle laughed again, "we are all the world to you right now."

That much was certainly true.

Mussolini looked around for a weapon, but there was nothing left that was useful, even the shards of glass had been caught up in the blaze. All that was left was to face the enemy, and die with some dignity. "If that's the case, then it's time for me to die. I would try to wrestle your weapon off of you but I'm much too tired. You've come at a rather late hour."

As the Austrian walked into the room, the shadow over his face was lifted, replaced with a horrific grin that was putting undue pressure an old but grevious scar. The fire reflected in his eyes all too well.

"My dear Duce, I'm afraid it's far worse than that."

---

Nah, not sure it would work.
 
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Nah, not sure it would work.
*puts on serious mask*

I dunno about that. Skorzeny is currently 12 years old in the TL and he only joined the Nazi party in 1931, so there is plenty of window for his personal views to change due to the different political situation in Germany right now. Perhaps, as a teenager, he could get captivated by Hitler's charisma and become a communist.

But then again, he was Austrian, so I don't think this path would work...
 
Honestly, it is my belief that if Hitler were to be a convert to Communism by the end of the Great War, I suppose he would remain largely himself as we know him OTL--ruthless, sociopathic, and with some nasty bees in his bonnet, but still the different intellectual ambiance of his chosen ideological surround would change him somewhat . (Specifically--OTL various bourgeois figures claimed they found him sometimes "charming." That I think would be completely gone, a thin facade accompanied by an honest echo of the pathetic remnant of him that just wanted to be liked and accepted. The latter, the authentic human part, would grow stronger but only in the specific comforts zone of those he judged sufficiently Red comrades; he'd forthrightly scorn bourgeois manners. He'd be more authentically and integrally his main self, not afraid to show it and not caring who it put off. OTL one crucial dimension of Nazi success was winning over the support of the established ruling classes--persuading Junkers he could be dealt with and handled, and was not one of those SA rabble himself; persuading rich businessmen to fork over lots of money for the Partei and for his own personal enrichment--anyone who thinks Hitler was less greedy than say Goering's infamous looting has fallen for the "charm" of his well-managed image. The "good, statesmanlike, almost gentlemanly" Hitler act is never developed here. He is what he is, one of those Red street thugs indeed; the worst wolf of the pack.

So I tend to regard this exercise of Hitler accumulating the same followers as OTL much the same way I did DValdron's stunt in Green Antarctica of coming up with sober rationalizations of 19th and 20th century horror tropes, in the fauna of the last continent and the societies of its peculiar Ts'alal inhabitants; yes, I see what you are doing and it is clever to work it so plausibly, but at the end of the day I don't think this is really what results plausibly from your OP; more likely it would be something quite different. As a general rule he should be rubbing shoulders mostly with people from OTL far left German circles, and most of OTL Nazis should be in their right wing comfort zones. Without Hitler to pull them together they'd all be in separate mutually rival groups but few would be drawn to Communism.
 
Honestly, it is my belief that if Hitler were to be a convert to Communism by the end of the Great War, I suppose he would remain largely himself as we know him OTL--ruthless, sociopathic, and with some nasty bees in his bonnet, but still the different intellectual ambiance of his chosen ideological surround would change him somewhat . (Specifically--OTL various bourgeois figures claimed they found him sometimes "charming." That I think would be completely gone, a thin facade accompanied by an honest echo of the pathetic remnant of him that just wanted to be liked and accepted. The latter, the authentic human part, would grow stronger but only in the specific comforts zone of those he judged sufficiently Red comrades; he'd forthrightly scorn bourgeois manners. He'd be more authentically and integrally his main self, not afraid to show it and not caring who it put off. OTL one crucial dimension of Nazi success was winning over the support of the established ruling classes--persuading Junkers he could be dealt with and handled, and was not one of those SA rabble himself; persuading rich businessmen to fork over lots of money for the Partei and for his own personal enrichment--anyone who thinks Hitler was less greedy than say Goering's infamous looting has fallen for the "charm" of his well-managed image. The "good, statesmanlike, almost gentlemanly" Hitler act is never developed here. He is what he is, one of those Red street thugs indeed; the worst wolf of the pack.

So I tend to regard this exercise of Hitler accumulating the same followers as OTL much the same way I did DValdron's stunt in Green Antarctica of coming up with sober rationalizations of 19th and 20th century horror tropes, in the fauna of the last continent and the societies of its peculiar Ts'alal inhabitants; yes, I see what you are doing and it is clever to work it so plausibly, but at the end of the day I don't think this is really what results plausibly from your OP; more likely it would be something quite different. As a general rule he should be rubbing shoulders mostly with people from OTL far left German circles, and most of OTL Nazis should be in their right wing comfort zones. Without Hitler to pull them together they'd all be in separate mutually rival groups but few would be drawn to Communism.
Other than Goebbels (who as far as we know Hitler has not even met yet, despite them both being communists), which OTL Nazis have featured? Perhaps I'm wrong, but I can't really remember any others who might be communist rather than far right in their ideology so far. I'm not sure why you would think they are going to be drawn to communism when that doesn't seem (to me at least so far) as being indicated. About the most I can see having been indicated is that some of them would fight for a communist Germany anyway.
 
It be ironic if some of Hitler's most loyal OTL Nazi henchmen like Göring and Himmler became ITTL's Hitler's most bitterest foes.
I can't imagine Göring becoming a communist, maybe Himmler.
 
So I tend to regard this exercise of Hitler accumulating the same followers as OTL much the same way I did DValdron's stunt in Green Antarctica of coming up with sober rationalizations of 19th and 20th century horror tropes, in the fauna of the last continent and the societies of its peculiar Ts'alal inhabitants; yes, I see what you are doing and it is clever to work it so plausibly, but at the end of the day I don't think this is really what results plausibly from your OP; more likely it would be something quite different.

Your analysis is always very considered and well-put, although here I think you're criticising a plotline that hasn't and isn't going to pan out. As I said a little while ago, it's not extremely difficult to make Goebbels a Communist. A stretch? Yes, but it is feasible. The Goerings and the Himmlers of this world just aren't going to be swayed by Marxist arguments, aside from perhaps a cynical conversion after the KPD have established a one party state.
 
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Deleted member 92121

Himmler seems more probable then Goring, in my opinion. The humble farmer seems like a better sell. And anti-semitism isn't really a problem as we've seem with Goebbels. Himmler occultism might be a problem though. Or a opportunity for some very interesting concepts to appear. "Mystical Socialism" has a fun ring to it.
 
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