¡Por la Patria, Viva México Fuerte! A Mexican TL

3. Industrialization - how far will Mexico be able to progress? The USA has excellent reserves of coal in the Appalachians, but I am less sure about Mexico's coal. Oil as an energy source would still be very much in its infancy.

Although traces of coal have been detected in numerous states, there are three locally important coal regions. The most important is the Sabinas basin and Fuentes-Río Escondido of Coahuila and Nuevo León, covering approximately 12,000 km2. The next most important region is found in Oaxaca. The third field is located in Sonora.
For coal in today's USA, see:
http://www.mikalac.com/map/pho/uscoalfields.jpg
http://www.probertencyclopaedia.com/photolib/maps/Map of Coal Deposits in North America 1934.jpg
http://pubs.usgs.gov/of/1996/of96-092/map.htm

I strongly recomend the last link. BTW, I love your timeline enought to do my first post. Keep it coming. :D

mexican coal.png
 
Although traces of coal have been detected in numerous states, there are three locally important coal regions. The most important is the Sabinas basin and Fuentes-Río Escondido of Coahuila and Nuevo León, covering approximately 12,000 km2. The next most important region is found in Oaxaca. The third field is located in Sonora.
For coal in today's USA, see:
http://www.mikalac.com/map/pho/uscoalfields.jpg
http://www.probertencyclopaedia.com/photolib/maps/Map of Coal Deposits in North America 1934.jpg
http://pubs.usgs.gov/of/1996/of96-092/map.htm

I strongly recomend the last link. BTW, I love your timeline enought to do my first post. Keep it coming. :D

Thank you so much for the links and the map detailing coal deposits within Mexico, I've tried looking for one for quite some time to no avail. You sir, are awesome! :D
 
Concerning Bolivar, I guess that, instead of Haiti, he would go to Mexico.

Bump.

You are correct...or at least that's what I have planned. Bolívar left Cartagena to Jamaica in May 1815, and he stayed in Jamaica until December. In TTL Mexico runs the Spanish out in June 1815, so it's very likely that once Bolívar leaves the island, he'd go to Mexico instead. If nothing else, I'm sure Bolívar would want to meet Ignacio Allende, the man who was able to liberate New Spain.

This changes the dynamics of how the war in South America plays out. On the one hand, the Spanish can focus more there now that they are not exerting military power in Mexico. On the other hand, Bolívar no longer just has Haiti on his side (despite going to Mexico I think Bolívar would still accept any other nation willing to help, and Haiti was one of them), but Mexico as well. Then there is also the United States. In OTL the US spent most of the decade wavering on supporting Spanish America for risk of loosing any chance at getting Florida. In TTL the US isn't as worried about pissing Spain off...they already did that, and with Florida and Cuba in their grasp, I don't think the US has much to loose from pissing off King Fernando further.
 
Hehe thank you Zinc! :) The butterflies will be huge, which means more fun. lol :D

I think you'll all be happy to know I'll be back to work on the TL after next week (dreaded finals! grrr). This last quarter has been Brutal with a capital "B" but whenever I got the chance I kept on thinking up ideas for the timeline so as to mitigate any possible writers block that may come my way come quarter's end.
 
On the other hand, Bolívar no longer just has Haiti on his side (despite going to Mexico I think Bolívar would still accept any other nation willing to help, and Haiti was one of them), but Mexico as well. Then there is also the United States.

Dear Arkhangelsk,

In OTL Bolivar accepted Haiti’s help because they were the only ones offering help:rolleyes:. But on your timeline he has Mexico and possibly the USA as possible helpers. In OTL the revolution in Haiti was profoundly disliked, and Bolivar has to choose between Mexico/USA or Haiti. He cannot have it both ways;), and I have the feeling that he would rather forget about Haiti:(. The USA took decades to recognize the independent Haitian government. Slavery was very important, in OTL Mexico waited until 1829 to officially abolish slavery, and the USA in 1865. Do not underestimate the important of racial ideologies at the Atlantic World over the XIX Century. If you want to read about the subject, I can recommend some good sources:

I. Dubois, Laurent. Avengers of the New World: the story of the Haitian Revolution. Cambridge, Mass.: Belknap Press of Harvard University Press, 2004.
II. Garraway, Doris Lorraine. Tree of liberty: cultural legacies of the Haitian Revolution in the Atlantic world. Charlottesville: University of Virginia Press, 2008.
III. Geggus, David P.. The impact of the Haitian revolution in the Atlantic world. Columbia, SC: Univ. of South Carolina Press, 2003.
IV. Geggus, David Patrick, and Norman Fiering. The world of the Haitian Revolution. Bloomington: Indiana University Press, 2009.
V. James, C.L.R.. The Black Jacobins: Toussaint L’Ouverture and the San Domingo Revolution (New York, 1963).
VI. Geggus, David. Haitian Revolutionary Studies (Bloomington, IN, 2002).
VII. Fick, Carolyn. The Making of Haiti: The Saint Domingue Revolution from Below (Knoxville, TN, 1990).
VIII. Garrigus, John. Before Haiti: Race and Citizenship in French Saint-Domingue (New York, 2006).
IX. Reid, Patricia. "The Haitian Revolution, Black Petitioners and White Refugee Widows in Maryland, 1796-1820" Paper presented at the annual meeting of the 34th Annual National Council for Black Studies, Sheraton New Orleans Hotel, New Orleans, LA, Mar 17, 2010.
X. Popkin, Jeremy D.. You are all free: the Haitian revolution and the abolition of slavery. New York: Cambridge University Press, 2011.
 
The Beginnings of Revolution: Nueva Granada
Hey guys! sorry for the long time no update, been kinda busy these last few weeks since term ended, but don't worry, here's a little update to kick this girl off for the summer. :D

This installment kicks off what's going on in the rest of Spanish America, beginning with Venezuela and Nueva Granada (Colombia). This isn't much actually, its pretty much a summary of things that happened in OTL, but I figured to give a little background on the area before letting the butterflies do their magic. ;)

The Beginnings of Revolution: Nueva Granada

mnsJHIf.jpg

Simón Bolívar in 1812

The war in New Spain was by no means the only place to demand the fury of the Spanish Empire. Indeed by the end of 1810 nearly all of Spanish America had taken up arms against the metropolis. In events predating the Grito de Dolores, the Viceroyalty of Nueva Granada was already convulsing with revolutionary fervor, as autonomous juntas were sprouting all about the Viceroyalty, deposing the local Royal authorities. In August 1809 the very first autonomous junta overtook Quito, with similar juntas popping up across Nueva Granada over the next few months such as in Santa Fe de Bogotá and Cartagena. Unfortunately most of these juntas would be stamped out as the Spanish authorities tried to maintain order. In April 1810, however, the revolutionary spirit had crossed into the Captaincy General of Venezuela, with the deposition of both the Royal Governor and the Captain General in Caracas. Led by famed Venezuelan nationalist Francisco de Miranda and a young ambitious local criollo by the name of Simón Bolívar, the movement would band together similar juntas that had already followed Caracas’ lead. They convened a congress several months later, and in a bold move unseen anywhere else in Spanish America, declared complete and total independence from Spain, with the establishment of a republic on 5 July 1811.

Almost immediately the newborn republic was out of its league, as the Spanish began to fight back and retake the renegade territory. One did not have to search hard, as the Venezuelan intendancies of Guyana and Maracaibo held a strong Royalist element and did not react well to separation from Spain. Despite the Republican’s best efforts Venezuela remained divided as neither side refused to budge. It was then without warning that disaster struck the infant republic. On the afternoon of 26 March 1812 a devastating earthquake tore a path of death and destruction through Northern Venezuela, all but destroying Caracas and killing an estimated 15,000-20,000 people. The earthquake also proved to be the final nail for the coffin of the “First” Venezuelan Republic, as most of the devastation was centered among the provinces held by the Republicans. Taking this as a sign of divine retribution on their part, the Royalists went in for the kill, with the capitulation of Miranda’s forces on 25 July. Bolívar meanwhile escaped Venezuela and by the following year was leading a contingent of soldiers from the newly formed United Provinces of Nueva Granada in a campaign to retake Venezuela from the Spanish. True to his word Bolívar would triumphantly enter Caracas on 6 August 1813 and reestablish the Republic. Unfortunately for the Republicans they had no time to rejoice as a new threat emerged, charging out from the Llanos or southern plains. A seemingly ragtag, but ruthless, army of mestizo Llaneros (including many freed slaves) led by their blood thirsty leader José Boves set out across Venezuela to bring down the Republic, as they saw it as a sign of Criollo privilege. Unable to stop Boves and his hordes Bolívar relented once more, leaving Caracas to the Royalists a second time. Bolívar would return to Tunja, the capital of the UPNG, and once again lead its armies, this time against rebels in Bogotá and Santa Marta who refused to accept the authority of the UPNG. Bolívar managed to reel in Bogotá in December 1814, but Santa Marta resulted in a loss for the young general as Cartagena refused to allow Bolívar passage to Santa Marta, forcing Bolívar to attack Cartagena instead. After an inconclusive siege and the looming threat of Reconquista by the Spanish (fresh from combat in Europe, as well as from their recent defeat in Mexico) Bolívar resigned the Viceroyalty to its fate and left Cartagena for Jamaica in May 1815. There Bolívar would attempt to garner support for the Independence of Spanish America from the great powers (specifically Britain but without much to show for it). As 1815 drew to a close Bolívar would decide to cross the sea once more, leaving Jamaica in December for Veracruz, where he would hope to acquire any help from the new Mexican Republic.
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Questions? Comments? Suggestions?
 
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Good to see this back. With Bolívar traveling to Mexico for help, could we see an alliance between Mexico and the nascent South American countries?
 
Arkhangelsk

It is great that this is still going strong. It is seriously a great TL with incredible detail on early Latin America.
Hopefully we get to see Nueva Granadan independence. Is it going to keep the name Nueva Granada or change it? I don't think there is a single TL out there with has Colombia keep its old name.

Keep up the good work
 
Good to see this back. With Bolívar traveling to Mexico for help, could we see an alliance between Mexico and the nascent South American countries?

Thanks Capibara, there will definitely be an alliance between Mexico and other Revolutionaries across South America. Any aid will be slow in coming at first (as at the time of Bolívar's arrival to Mexico the country is just barely starting to form it's own government). Allende and Morelos will promise to do anything they can to help though, if nothing else to neutralize the threat of Spain trying to retake Mexico once again.

Arkhangelsk

It is great that this is still going strong. It is seriously a great TL with incredible detail on early Latin America.
Hopefully we get to see Nueva Granadan independence. Is it going to keep the name Nueva Granada or change it? I don't think there is a single TL out there with has Colombia keep its old name.

Keep up the good work

Thanks jycee, I'm really glad you're enjoying the TL, after all you're the best when it comes to Mexico! ;)

Trust me, independence is definitely going to happen for Nueva Granada, it's only a matter of time. As for the name I haven't given it a lot of thought yet, originally I wasn't sure of keeping Nueva Granada, but now that you mention it most people who do an Independent Colombia/Venezuela simply name it Gran Colombia or something. So Nueva Granada is a maybe, if nothing else I think pomegranates look cool on thier coat of arms and/or flag. :p

I'm also open to suggestions regarding the name. :)
 
I wonder if a stable Mexico will help other Latin American republics to remain stable and democratic, instead of the revolving-door dictatorships they often seemed to have installed. Hopefully, although the US does not give strong hope in this regard.
 
I wonder if a stable Mexico will help other Latin American republics to remain stable and democratic, instead of the revolving-door dictatorships they often seemed to have installed. Hopefully, although the US does not give strong hope in this regard.

I'm not sure if Mexico will be able to give any meaningful help to her sister republics* down south (at least not now, I don't plan for Mexico to have any great power projection until at least the 1870's). You do raise up one point on the United States, and I'll say from what I have planned the United States will have a much harder time meddling with the rest of the continent than they did in OTL.

*Mostly republics...I'm toying with the idea of installing a monarchy somewhere...just an idea though. :p
 
Argentina? Maybe Peru, can't really see a republic anywhere else.

Yeah the way I see it Peru would be the only possibility for a monarchy...though I'm wanting to make Peru into a special area where the Spanish are able to hold out and maybe survive as an autonomous region within the Spanish Empire...the reason I'm still unsure about this is Spain itself, and the plausibility of it accepting that sort of deal...I know for certain Fernando VII will have none of it. As for the Infante Carlos or anyone else within in Spain I'm uncertain.

jycee

Not an expert but with his prestige could Bolivar be persuaded to establish a monarchy somewhere?

Steve

Bolivarian monarchy is a possability I think...though I have other plans for Bolívar...;)
 
Nice! :) I wonder if Mexico's new situation here is beneficial or harmful to Bolivar's ultimate goals of independence in South America.
 
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