He would be senator or Representative representing Vermont. He might have become president.
DBWI: What if the United States had survived into the 21st Century?
Wasn't he a Socialist from a very young age? That doesn't exactly make for a successful political career in a country that has capitalism as an official ideology.
If he wanted to get elected to something, he certainly couldn't keep talking like this:
Sorry if this is offtopic but, since some of us are discussing the merits and flaws of the EF and their system, what's your opinion on the present situation in Catalonia? It's already been a few months since independentist militias aided by CNT-FAI have taken control of the country. The referendum held last sunday showed us that 90% of the population favoured seceeding from Spain, leaving the EF and joining Comecon as an independent people's republic. Many are comparing this to what Portugal did back in the 70s, but it's a little different since Portugal didn't really secceed from any sovereign country, they just had a regime change and opted out of the EF.
(OOC: I figure this EF was probably founded sooner than the OTL EU and included fascist Spain and Portugal from the beggining because it was intended as a defensive alliance against communism or something.)
(OOC: I figure this EF was probably founded sooner than the OTL EU and included fascist Spain and Portugal from the beggining because it was intended as a defensive alliance against communism or something.)
Well, Europe's leadership is divided on the issue with the French, Germans, and British calling for peaceful negotiation and the Italians and Spanish wanting to send in the troops (well, Italy has it's own seccessionist problems, so I can understand why)
And speaking of the EF, one of it's major flaws IMHO is that it is a bit too decentralized. True, there is a single pan-European President and Parliament with responsibilities over defense and foreign policy and there is full integration economically within the EF but most laws are still made in Amsterdam, Bonn, London, Paris, Madrid, Rome, or Brussels and not in Strassbourg.
OOC: Well, I said Tennessee, but it was a bit ramdom to be honest
I just chose an American which seemed like it would be somewhere in the border of the new CSA.I don't see that being flaw. One of major reasons why it not be more centralised is that nationalism is not down enough. EF couldn't has been possible if most of legistature would be in Brussels. Any nation just not give its own legistature too much for someone else. And Switzerland too is pretty decentralised.
Well, it would probably depend on whether it survives via ratcheting up oppression or via EF-style reforms.
samcster94
Banned
They'd probably be fighting over the flag the CSA uses in OTL and running around with guns. Maybe they'd have an incompetent leader as well.
FBKampfer
Banned
I'm curious how Germany would have developed. Reunification sentiment was really strong long before they started to collapse, and the Germans have always been a tad bit domineering on the continent.
Do you think they'd be heading the EF and EUROPAC, or even leading NATO constituent if the US had stuck around and the treaty hadn't fallen apart?
Do you think they'd be heading the EF and EUROPAC, or even leading NATO constituent if the US had stuck around and the treaty hadn't fallen apart?
Great.
I honestly am just disgusted with all of you about this. Maybe this is just because of my heresy, but the worshipping of social democratic regimes in this thread has got to stop. Communism is not red flags and planned economies, it's the "real movement to abolish the present state of things".
I know that there's all the stereotypes about Left Communists and couches obnoxiously judging the rest of the socialist world, but honestly. You're all cheering that NATO fell, but in the end there really isn't much difference between the Warsaw Pact and NATO from where I'm sitting.
It seems like people like me are the only ones who remember that socialism is not a state of affairs to be established but the real movement of the workers.
Capitalism still hasn't fallen, it's just picked up red flags.
I honestly am just disgusted with all of you about this. Maybe this is just because of my heresy, but the worshipping of social democratic regimes in this thread has got to stop. Communism is not red flags and planned economies, it's the "real movement to abolish the present state of things".
I know that there's all the stereotypes about Left Communists and couches obnoxiously judging the rest of the socialist world, but honestly. You're all cheering that NATO fell, but in the end there really isn't much difference between the Warsaw Pact and NATO from where I'm sitting.
It seems like people like me are the only ones who remember that socialism is not a state of affairs to be established but the real movement of the workers.
Capitalism still hasn't fallen, it's just picked up red flags.
FBKampfer
Banned
Honestly still don't think communism will work. I mean somebody has to figure out how much of stuff needs to be produced, organize emergency services, etc.
And if your answer is "the village soviet will do it comrade, xaxaxa!", consider that's basically the exact same answer as those super right wing libertarians. The only difference is that they say you should do it because it makes the most sense, and you say you should do it because it makes the most sense..... But one of you just wants to cut out the middle man of money.
Government isn't a bad thing. It's just another tool for the people to use to help shape their communities and country. Hell, even capitalism makes some sense. There's a reason people started using money in the first place.
And if your answer is "the village soviet will do it comrade, xaxaxa!", consider that's basically the exact same answer as those super right wing libertarians. The only difference is that they say you should do it because it makes the most sense, and you say you should do it because it makes the most sense..... But one of you just wants to cut out the middle man of money.
Government isn't a bad thing. It's just another tool for the people to use to help shape their communities and country. Hell, even capitalism makes some sense. There's a reason people started using money in the first place.
So, @GDIS Pathe, any thoughts on what could have made the US survive until the 21st century?
But my point here is that all of these "socialist" societies are little more than glorified social democracies often at the barrel of a gun, and that the entire world seems to be intentionally misquoting Marx to justify all of their inherently capitalist societies.
At that point, why even "abolish" capitalism if you're going to replace it with more capitalism?
European Community's Golden Milestone Project.
A significant threat it is. They want to revive Inca Empire..
They're yet another tinpot dictatorship, I guess.
They're nothing special save for the dynasty and their stupid Inca plans, and they're not the only horrifically repressive state on the planet, but since they're one of the last capitalist powers I think everyone makes a big deal out of them due to the gold scare.
The world's more complicated than that.
I'm not saying they're good, far from it, they're utterly horrible and as soon as the Pinochets are taken out of power, the better, but I really dislike this practice of "Let's side with nation x's bourgeoisie against nation y because nation y is worse. I see a lot of so-called "communists" talking about how they need to be dealt with by their favorite red capitalist regime.
Whatever happened to proletarian internationalism?