Twilight of the Valkyries: A 20 July Plot TL (Redux)
- Thread starter LumineVonReuental
- Start date
One would think that, at this stage of the war, loosing the Kriegsmarine was not quite irksome for the course of the war, methinks.
Think you misspelled “Apostle”.
“Long-range fighters”?
It’s still called SHAEF. “SHAPE” is for postwar NATO.
Did you mean “undertake futile efforts”?
Great to see you back.
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So Norway was liberated - now i would like to see what they can contribute to the war (I'm imagening a squadron of Avro Lancasters 
)
)They know that (Germany is a continental power after all so all the vital stuff is on land) and losing the bases will ensure Donitz isn't wasting resources on his obsessions. Donut of course is furious since it's his side show force that just got shut down rather lethally.
Indeed, which is why Guderian can make the call with only the Kriesgmarine complaining about it. It is not dissimilar to Admiral Toyoda's dilemma before Leyte Gulf: do you preserve the surface fleet in spite of it potentially becoming useless, or do you gamble it in pursuit of a larger strategic goal? Guderian gambles, and though he sacrifices most of what's left in the process, he at least gets the extra 300,000 men to man the Eastern Front. At the same time, he makes a not insignificant enemy in the process.
I don't think I'll get to cover Leyte Gulf - or its equivalent - until "Hagen" (which is to say, Part Three), but it will be interesting to see this dilemma repeated and what the Japanese make of it.
Thanks so much! I wrote this one after a sudden surge of inspiration last night, so it's filled with such mistakes. Will correct.
A few hundred at most for each side. Greater German casualties due to the lower quality and morale of troops left behind, and greater Resistance casualties on account of being underequipped and/or Rendulic's harsh methods. Allied casualties would be the lowest in spite of the bulk of Thorne's forces lacking experience - minus the 6th Airborne -, so, all in all, a fairly cheap enterprise for the Allies in terms of men. Not so much in terms of - as it will only became clear later - overinvestment of airborne resources.
I think there's a good case that it's worth the tradeoff to Guderian. Having Norway securely under Reich control in April 1945 OTL wasn't much help with Soviet tanks rolling into Berlin and Yanks dancing on the banks of the Elbe.
The real problem is that it can only delay Germany's defeat a little, not avert it.
Thanks!Great update.
What happened to Tirpitz? Was she sunk, scuttled, abandoned?
Most definetly sunk:
"Although it manages to cross half the required distance after leaving Tromso, Tirpitz enters a veritable aerial kill zone on October 7th, and is sunk within 15 minutes, taking hundreds of sailors to their graves right within sight of Occupied Denmark."
I toyed with having Tirpitz make it, but at that point in time the ship was just too damaged from earlier British raids to pull off a "Channel Dash 2: Electric Boogaloo".
With the Tirpitz sunk (as well as most of the remaining Kriegsmarine), will he see the British Pacific Fleet been formed and deployed much earlier?
Will Sweden give their Danish Brigade to the Allies?
Will the Allies also use Norway to bomb Germany? (Since with airbases there, they are in a better position to bomb parts of Germany and supply the Polish Home Army than in either the in UK or Italy)
Will Sweden give their Danish Brigade to the Allies?
Will the Allies also use Norway to bomb Germany? (Since with airbases there, they are in a better position to bomb parts of Germany and supply the Polish Home Army than in either the in UK or Italy)
The USSR has not defeated Finland? (OTL, Karelia fell in June and Finland capitulated 2 September.)
The Soviets have taken the Estonian archipelago? (OTL in October/November.)
Has there been a Slovak uprising? (OTL, elements of the Slovak satellite regime rebelled against German control on 29 August; it took over six weeks for the Germans to suppress the rebels - while holding off Soviet forces that were breaking through the Carpathians into eastern Slovakia.)