I doubt he'd be able to rise up as high as he did IOTL with the old Prussian elites dominant in the German milItary to a greater degree than OTL. I would't be surprised if he, like in Kaiserreich where he's in Vietnam/German East Asia, ends up in a colonial posting here.
The Fire Never Dies: Labor's Star Ascendant
- Thread starter Meshakhad
- Start date
-
- Tags
- iww socialist america
I can see veterans clubs associated with various white regiments (especially in/associated with Texas and the Plains) a couple of decades down the line. People in the back of the bigger meetings taking notes for the Counter-Intelligence/Internal Security Commissariats would be a safe bet, but in general they would be considered harmless.
Anything, and I do mean anything, smelling remotely of the Klan in rhetoric or trappings? The authorities come down on them like a ton of bricks assuming their neighbors leave anything to drag off in chains.
Prioritizing political reliability over skill at/experience in fighting people equipped to fight back, I see....
If this guy ends up on the General Staff and/or a compromise candidate for Reichstag leadership, I swear....
That is NOT necessarily a bad thing: considering the Imperial Germany government managed to keep their african colonies ITTL, Rommel could very well be sent in German East Africa (current Tanzania + Rwanda + Burundi + Kionga Triangle) and know Paul von Lettow-Vorbeck, an Imperial Germany general known as the Lion of Africa (German: Löwe von Afrika) who for four years, with a force of about 14,000 (3,000 Germans and 11,000 Africans), he held in check a much larger force of 300,000 British, Indian, Belgian, and Portuguese troops (he agreed to surrender only AFTER he found out Imperial Germany had surrendered 3 days before) AND was the only German commander to successfully invade a part of the British Empire during the First World War, undefeated in the field during the whole conflict. Rommel in IOTL was already an excellent military commander, but if he gets end up tutored by one of Germany's greatest military, tactical and strategy leaders?
Also, I hope @Meshakhad will show us how von Lettow-Vorbeck will be treated ITTL, since Imperial Germany is still standing and German East Africa is safe again too...
EDIT: here's a reference link if you wanna know more: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_von_Lettow-Vorbeck
Also, I hope @Meshakhad will show us how von Lettow-Vorbeck will be treated ITTL, since Imperial Germany is still standing and German East Africa is safe again too...
EDIT: here's a reference link if you wanna know more: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_von_Lettow-Vorbeck
I mean, as much as he held the loyalty of the native troops under his command he was still an imperial commander in the colonies who caused a massive famine and arguably exacerbated the Spanish/American flu by his actions and orders. It's hard to say where he'll end up, but he's not exactly on the right side of history even though he "told Hitler to go fuck himself" as Miller put it. Maybe he goes completely native and works toward colonial independence, but I doubt it.
I am not saying he is Saint, just that he could be an excellent mentor for Rommel and open him the chance to become a respected German Imperial Officer ITTL.
I know even Imperial german Officers couldact like WW2 German ones (see Herero for more info)...
that would be a really bonkers turn of events, you know what, i want it
Actually, if the German government keep the "smart ball", it can release those African colonies (who I have the impression are very little worthy of their conquest, even so after seeing how easy they were conquered IOTL expect one) and thus gain control over their independence process, thus putting loyal governments in there to protect Germany interest while at the same time reducing in a great way the expense for maintaining their colonial empire.
Also, I have a question: now that the war is over with Germany and Austria-Hungary "don't lose", will Mr. Schicklgruber don't feel the need for a political career and instead re-try (with better success) an artistic career?
Realistically, there will probably be a "Veterans of the United States Army" organization. Some of its work, especially early on, will be wholly legitimate, such as cataloguing war dead and mutual aid for White veterans. Of course, such an organization will inevitably become a mouthpiece for conservatism. And just as inevitably, it will be heavily infiltrated by domestic security organs.
Simmons believes that only the pure Anglo-Saxon race can triumph.
He won't go anywhere in German politics. However, I do plan on another OTL high-ranking US military officer becoming Premier down the line.
I have some plans already for Rommel, but Lettow-Vorbeck wouldn't be a bad choice for a mentor. I have plans for him too. I could also see Eisenhower ending up there.
Nothing to see here...
For now, the Austrian painter is heading back to Vienna. He is still thinking in terms of an artistic career, but politics has a way of intervening...
Well, IOTL just after the war hitler did lean left, and the pro-labor rhetoric of the proto-nazi party is what initially drew him in, so at this time ittl he can probably be described as a Social Democrat with relatively positive views on American socialism but probably rejects starting a violent revolution in Germany
97. Red Stormtroopers
…Officially, Benjamin Hanford’s appearance at the Basel Conference was the first diplomatic outreach by the Reds to Europe. In reality, the Reds began their outreach as soon as the armistice was in place. IWW organizers were sent to every country in Europe, almost invariably those they had emigrated from. Their purpose was twofold: reestablish ties with European socialist organizations and learn all they could about European tactics in the war…
…Overall, the Red Army had been considerably less sophisticated in its tactics than the European armies. Few of its officers had any military experience, and those who did were almost invariably former enlisted men or junior officers (the most prominent being Omar Bradley). They had been fully aware of this fact, with most seeking to remedy their lack of experience by devouring books on military history to supplement their “on the job learning”. But whatever contempt they had for the aristocratic officer corps of Europe, they were eager to learn what they could from how the Great War had proceeded, and especially how it ended…
…One of the major inspirations the Red Army took was from the legendary Kaiserschlacht offensive. The concept of transferring troops from other theaters was obvious enough, but the Germans had also trained those troops as stormtroopers, equipping them with superior weapons and using them to exploit breakthroughs. Bronstein established a similar system for the Armies of Denver and the Cascades. The training schedules were disrupted by the second wave, but by the start of November, significant numbers of Red stormtroopers were arriving in the Potomac Basin…
…The first use of these stormtroopers was on November 14 at the Battle of Burr Hill. At 2:53 AM, Haywood’s stormtroopers, led by the Red Samurai Brigade, advanced on White positions following a heavy artillery barrage. Within hours, they were pursuing the Whites across the Wilderness Battlefield, reaching Chancellorsville by dusk. Two days later, they were pounding Fredericksburg. The Idahoans were similarly effective, breaking south of Manassas toward Minnieville and the Potomac. By November 20, the greater D.C. area was cut off. Those who tried to flee by water were usually captured by Red gunboats…
…The Third Battle of Manassas was a more protracted affair. The Whites were now expecting a major assault and were able to maintain cohesion as they slowly retreated through Arlington. A few Marines tried to make a last stand at Arlington National Cemetery, but they were soon forced to surrender due to running out of ammunition, Simmons having refused to spare any more supplies from the upcoming defense of Washington. The last pockets of resistance west of the Potomac surrendered on November 29. Bradley and Haywood were now positioned less than two miles from the White House…
…Simmons refused all pleas to surrender. His speeches and dispatches took on apocalyptic tones. This was his Armageddon, a valiant last stand against the forces of darkness. He ordered that new arrivals be given a tour of the National Mall, believing that the sight of the nation’s monuments would inspire them to win against overwhelming odds. Of course, one of these monuments was the Nathan Bedford Forrest Memorial, hastily built on the site of the incomplete Lincoln Memorial[1]. It was a vile metaphor for how Simmons perverted the legacy of the United States to fit his white supremacist vision…
- From Red Star Rising: A History of the Second American Revolution by Tom Clancy
[1] Construction on the Lincoln Memorial began in 1914 but was not finished until 1922.
…Overall, the Red Army had been considerably less sophisticated in its tactics than the European armies. Few of its officers had any military experience, and those who did were almost invariably former enlisted men or junior officers (the most prominent being Omar Bradley). They had been fully aware of this fact, with most seeking to remedy their lack of experience by devouring books on military history to supplement their “on the job learning”. But whatever contempt they had for the aristocratic officer corps of Europe, they were eager to learn what they could from how the Great War had proceeded, and especially how it ended…
…One of the major inspirations the Red Army took was from the legendary Kaiserschlacht offensive. The concept of transferring troops from other theaters was obvious enough, but the Germans had also trained those troops as stormtroopers, equipping them with superior weapons and using them to exploit breakthroughs. Bronstein established a similar system for the Armies of Denver and the Cascades. The training schedules were disrupted by the second wave, but by the start of November, significant numbers of Red stormtroopers were arriving in the Potomac Basin…
…The first use of these stormtroopers was on November 14 at the Battle of Burr Hill. At 2:53 AM, Haywood’s stormtroopers, led by the Red Samurai Brigade, advanced on White positions following a heavy artillery barrage. Within hours, they were pursuing the Whites across the Wilderness Battlefield, reaching Chancellorsville by dusk. Two days later, they were pounding Fredericksburg. The Idahoans were similarly effective, breaking south of Manassas toward Minnieville and the Potomac. By November 20, the greater D.C. area was cut off. Those who tried to flee by water were usually captured by Red gunboats…
…The Third Battle of Manassas was a more protracted affair. The Whites were now expecting a major assault and were able to maintain cohesion as they slowly retreated through Arlington. A few Marines tried to make a last stand at Arlington National Cemetery, but they were soon forced to surrender due to running out of ammunition, Simmons having refused to spare any more supplies from the upcoming defense of Washington. The last pockets of resistance west of the Potomac surrendered on November 29. Bradley and Haywood were now positioned less than two miles from the White House…
…Simmons refused all pleas to surrender. His speeches and dispatches took on apocalyptic tones. This was his Armageddon, a valiant last stand against the forces of darkness. He ordered that new arrivals be given a tour of the National Mall, believing that the sight of the nation’s monuments would inspire them to win against overwhelming odds. Of course, one of these monuments was the Nathan Bedford Forrest Memorial, hastily built on the site of the incomplete Lincoln Memorial[1]. It was a vile metaphor for how Simmons perverted the legacy of the United States to fit his white supremacist vision…
- From Red Star Rising: A History of the Second American Revolution by Tom Clancy
[1] Construction on the Lincoln Memorial began in 1914 but was not finished until 1922.
I hope Simmons does realize the Reds do not need to conquer Washington in an assault: just cut it oof from any supply route, and let them starve as the Prussians did to Paris in 1871...
Except that as long as Simmons holds Washington, he retains nominal legitimacy. On paper, Wilson is still the President. Simmons is just running the government until Wilson recovers. And Wilson is recovering. Given time, he would be able to return to the Oval Office.
Legitimacy over what country, though? The Reds can continue occupying the rest of the South, and leave him with little control over anything but Washington, the charnel house. It wasn't as big as today's city, of course, but it was more than big enough to starve fairly quickly...
Then, I hope the Reds have a plan to take Washington without givin in Simmon's Thermopylae Last Stand-like fantasy...
That legitimacy is the only thing the White forces elsewhere have going for them. The hope is that once that legitimacy is completely gone, the remaining Whites will give up.
They do. After all, the Persians didn't have heavy artillery...
Yes, but a big city like Washington can turn into a nightmare and bleed a whole army, as Stalingrad have taught us IOTL, and heavy artillery fire can destroy many buildings but can also make "clearing" city blocks harder;
Besides, if Simmons manages to push the Reds into bombarding the White House and other famous buildings in the city, it will achieve (even partially) what he wants...
Here is hoping the balance of this is bored informers passing along notes about 'Marshallist' spitballing on what Free Markets(tm) could do even better than the new Status Quo.
IOW: CONTELPRO Bad.
Way Too Many Jews. I am given to understand he was exceptionally Anti-Semetic from rather early in his adulthood.
Meanwhile, a number of Elderly were going "AGAIN?"
Now which of those two managed what again Simmons?
Odds of Woodrow being permitted to do either? Especially if he has the sense to look around going "Not As Planned" and the imprudence to say so aloud?
DC has an unhealthy concentration of True Believers at this point, but I imagine a good chunk of the remaining civilian population would be willing to open any proverbial postern gates if they could get to it.
There is that. At least there are likely copies of the City Plans elsewhere.
I wonder if wilson will have a moment of horrified clarity when he wakes up, realizing that he could have prevented this
All you had to do, was cave to the damn strikers, woody!