Sir John Valentine Carden Survives. Part 2.
- Thread starter allanpcameron
- Start date
The 15 cm sFH 18 could, with rocket-assisted ammunition, though I can't figure out when said ammunition actually came into service.
The germans other than the already existing logistics issues had to also overcome the different railway gauges in Russian railways since it means you have to unload and reload multiple times assuming the railways were intact.
Additionally you have to deal with Partisans which tie up more logistics and troop capacity playing a game of wake a mole. Also doesn't help they have no real way to disrupt soviet industry once they moved it behind the Urals.
Factor on lend lease giving the Soviets gear and add on to it the way British Armour is so much better in this timeline the soviets have it better.
Also helps that the Nazis really made a mess of the German economy to boot.
Additionally you have to deal with Partisans which tie up more logistics and troop capacity playing a game of wake a mole. Also doesn't help they have no real way to disrupt soviet industry once they moved it behind the Urals.
Factor on lend lease giving the Soviets gear and add on to it the way British Armour is so much better in this timeline the soviets have it better.
Also helps that the Nazis really made a mess of the German economy to boot.
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Ramp-Rat
Monthly Donor
So while events in Malaya progress slowly towards a British victory, even if the Japanese managed to break through the present front line. They will be facing three experienced divisions, that in addition to being by Far East standards well equipped, are acclimatised and have a good idea of how to fight against the Japanese in local conditions. And the retention of Malaya is going to have a major effect on the future of the war in the Far East. However while all this is happening, the war in general is progressing elsewhere, as Malaya is just one part in a very complex whole. And while recent events especially in North Africa, mean that Malaya is not as far down the priority list as Burma was IOTL, it is not at the Top of the list, it’s not even among the first three. Top of the list is the Atlantic campaign, and it is this that will have the most impact on the recent Hayling Island trials. Britain at this time has despite the increases in production, only limited resources when it comes to shipbuilding, and the production of amphibious units is low on the list.
While it good to see that the British are trying out a number of options in regards to amphibious operations, involving tanks, from dedicated Tank landing craft, through amphibious tanks and tanks capable of deep wading. And are as a result of the trials, are realising that they are going to require a lot more specialist armour, if they are to carry out a successful invasion. However as already stated, Britain at this time has only so much protection capability, and most of it is already allocated. The shipyards that are suitable to produce amphibious ships such as LST’s and LCT’s, are already dedicated to producing, merchant shipping, and convoy escorts. While the boatyards that could be producing minor amphibious craft, are busy building minesweepers, motorboats, and MTB’s. As for Britains factories, first they have to build the tanks and armoured vehicles to equip the proposed armoured devisions, and then they have to produce for the Soviets. Only once these commitments have been fulfilled, can resources be diverted to the production of the specialist armour required for an invasion.
The basic idea of continuing to conduct trials in Britain is valid, as is Mountbatten's plan to go out to the Mediterranean, and observe the projected invasion of various islands culminating in the invasion of Rhodes. Along with bringing back to the UK, a number of the officers involved in both the planning and implementation. He is also correct in that the chances of getting the amphibious equipment and shipping produced in the UK, is at the present time slim. Ideally he needs to get a number of Americans involved in the trials, and thus get them to demand the production of the needed shipping from American yards. Plus by involving Americans in the process, he will receive a number of different views, which is at this stage is all to the better. And might convince some Americans that an amphibious landing in Northern France, at this time is not a good idea. While Winston is getting twitchy, and desperate to do something anything now today. There should be enough strength in the British High Command, to basically sit on him, until the situation in North Africa, Malaya, Burma and the DEI, has been resolved.
He will of course demand that the British forces in the Far East make every effort to relieve/support the Americans in the Philippines. This however has major political implications, as while to an extent FDR, will welcome anything that reduces the political fallout of the upcoming defeat in the Philippines. Both King and Marshal, and not going to be happy about the dam Limies, being seen to be the ones providing relief to Americans, when the Americans are not able to do so themselves. And the British command structure in the region, would much prefer to expend their efforts on securing the DEI, and defending Australia. Britain will make efforts to provide relief to the Americans in the Philippines, but not at the expense of their efforts in the DEI and around Australia. And once the situation in Malaya has been resolved, the British will provide assistance to the Americans, in conducting humanitarian, extraction of refugees, and military operations, supporting insurgence. While the distances are too great for aircraft unless Borneo is recaptured, submarines operating out of Singapore, will be able to affect landings in the Philippines. Now whether the submarines are British or American, is something that is in question, and will need to be resolved.
RR.
While it good to see that the British are trying out a number of options in regards to amphibious operations, involving tanks, from dedicated Tank landing craft, through amphibious tanks and tanks capable of deep wading. And are as a result of the trials, are realising that they are going to require a lot more specialist armour, if they are to carry out a successful invasion. However as already stated, Britain at this time has only so much protection capability, and most of it is already allocated. The shipyards that are suitable to produce amphibious ships such as LST’s and LCT’s, are already dedicated to producing, merchant shipping, and convoy escorts. While the boatyards that could be producing minor amphibious craft, are busy building minesweepers, motorboats, and MTB’s. As for Britains factories, first they have to build the tanks and armoured vehicles to equip the proposed armoured devisions, and then they have to produce for the Soviets. Only once these commitments have been fulfilled, can resources be diverted to the production of the specialist armour required for an invasion.
The basic idea of continuing to conduct trials in Britain is valid, as is Mountbatten's plan to go out to the Mediterranean, and observe the projected invasion of various islands culminating in the invasion of Rhodes. Along with bringing back to the UK, a number of the officers involved in both the planning and implementation. He is also correct in that the chances of getting the amphibious equipment and shipping produced in the UK, is at the present time slim. Ideally he needs to get a number of Americans involved in the trials, and thus get them to demand the production of the needed shipping from American yards. Plus by involving Americans in the process, he will receive a number of different views, which is at this stage is all to the better. And might convince some Americans that an amphibious landing in Northern France, at this time is not a good idea. While Winston is getting twitchy, and desperate to do something anything now today. There should be enough strength in the British High Command, to basically sit on him, until the situation in North Africa, Malaya, Burma and the DEI, has been resolved.
He will of course demand that the British forces in the Far East make every effort to relieve/support the Americans in the Philippines. This however has major political implications, as while to an extent FDR, will welcome anything that reduces the political fallout of the upcoming defeat in the Philippines. Both King and Marshal, and not going to be happy about the dam Limies, being seen to be the ones providing relief to Americans, when the Americans are not able to do so themselves. And the British command structure in the region, would much prefer to expend their efforts on securing the DEI, and defending Australia. Britain will make efforts to provide relief to the Americans in the Philippines, but not at the expense of their efforts in the DEI and around Australia. And once the situation in Malaya has been resolved, the British will provide assistance to the Americans, in conducting humanitarian, extraction of refugees, and military operations, supporting insurgence. While the distances are too great for aircraft unless Borneo is recaptured, submarines operating out of Singapore, will be able to affect landings in the Philippines. Now whether the submarines are British or American, is something that is in question, and will need to be resolved.
RR.
Allanbrooke has do his duty to King and Country and say "No Prime Minister".
As far as the Phillippines are concerned, if a separate command can be set up on Mindanao there's a good likelihood that that island could be held, putting another rod in the spokes of the Japanese planning bicycle. Moving American submarines to Singapore places them a lot closer as well.
Dug out Dug would never agree to another command in his territory
There is a war on, remember? Accidents (and bombing raids) happen. Just saying.
Or just plain enough incompetence that even his political connections can't save him and he's quietly sent to the retired list.
Note: using the language of the time no offence intended
Never did in OTL....
However this time
Questioner: Those dammed limeys managed to hold the Japs.........
DoD: McArthur did not have enough true Americans
Q: They held them with Indian Divisions - colonial troops - are you saying their indians were better that philipio's under US comand - under 'YOUR' command
DoD Colonial troops, many of who had already been at war for two years. They were also backed up by veteran Australian Divisions and experienced tankers.
TBF Indian troops did have a strong martial reputation but yeah that sounds about right.
He did a p*** poor job of building the Philippine Army like he was hired to do after retiring from the US Army, even taking his budget into account.
Ramontxo
Donor
If its true that Mac Arthur was very good at being very bad, lets not forget that he was also quite good at being not bad. Yes he should have prepared for and retired to Bataan quite before he did. And after Inchon he should have been in any other place than commanding Allied forces in Korea. But I don't see who could have done his work in reconstructing Japan
All this talk of generals made me a bit curious, who would succeed O'Connor as commander of the 8th Army?
Depends who has the seniority maybe Monty? But it looks like he is being kept at home to run training which if I'm honest is probably a very good use of him.
After him not sure maybe Alan Cunningham or Jumbo?
Ramp-Rat
Monthly Donor
The question of who will take over from O’Conner, is difficult, as unlike IOTL, there is ITTL, a large number of competent British Generals to choose from. It should be noted that Britain doesn’t need a brilliant general, to replace O’Conner in North Africa, as its doubtful that there is going to be any major campaigning to do. What is most needed right now is someone who is capable of conducting the negotiations with the Vichy French regimes in North Africa and the Levent. Ideally he should be able to speak French, and be sensitive to French pride, a very touchy subject. And that in my opinion rules out, Montgomery, unless you want to end up fighting the Vichy French. Montgomery was notoriously difficult, and being a teetotaller anti smoker and highly self opinionated, and none diplomatic, is just the man to rub the French up the wrong way. If I had my choice, I would pick Alexander, a man who had excellent diplomatic skills, was urbane and who’s principal hobby of painting would appeal to the French. This if he is available is just the man for such a sensitive position at this time.
RR.
RR.