Acording your school of thought, is not that different of sunnas that the goverment come from consensus, is not that different
Middle Kingdom: Story of the Star Dynasty (Alternate History Chinese Muslim Dynasty Timeline)
- Thread starter EmperorBuaya
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*cries in Tang ambitions* so no china reaching the Caspian sea and pushing into Indochina.
BTW why do chinese dynasty have a direction in front of their names such as Eastern Han what does mean? It annoys wiki gice me no answer.
It's Hanafi. It won't be any different in ITTL from OTL. In particular, the Gedimu sect is the largest of all.
Yes, you could say that.
Well, to put it simply, the Han Dynasty period is divided into two:
- Western Han (206 BC to 9 AD)
- Capital : Chang An
- Eastern Han (25 to 220 AD)
- Capital: Luo Yang (with the exception of certain years)
The special incident is Wang Mang (王莽) usurp the power and the throne of former Han dynasty.
The reason why the “West” and “East” labels are used is because the capital of Western Han (Chang'an) is located in western part of China and the capital of Eastern Han (Luoyang) is located to the east of Chang An. So, it looks like the government moved to the east (from Chang An) for the restoration of the dynasty in 25 AD.
However, the Eastern Han government considers itself the continuation of the original Han state founded by Liu Bang in 206 BC.
The ITTL Uyghurs will be in much better positions than OTL. Once Xing conquered the land we know in OTL as Xinjiang, the Uyghurs will held high positions at the Xing Court and contributed their troops to served the Xing war machine, just like their ancestors in the Mongol Empire. It also helps with both Xing Emperors and Uyghurs are Muslims, not only that their ancestral origins as steppe nomads. That's what happens once the Xing freed Uyghurs from the Buddhist Dzunghars.
However, by the time of the story at the moment, the Uyghurs are still under rule of the Dzunghars as Muslim subjects. Xing will certainly acquired the territories of OTL Xinjiang.
Hey, what about this for China in 2019:
Population: 756,448,895
GDP: $26.37 trillion, or $34,860 per capita
Population: 756,448,895
GDP: $26.37 trillion, or $34,860 per capita
That is Lower in Pop? how? even if china hit a industrial peak early, i can still see them breaking Billion barrier before stabilize and collapse
No Mao, and also they decide that more prosperity=less babies needed, like in Europe. Hey, they'll still have a huge population, maybe one bigger than India's if India were to have OTL China's population density.
The less babies come very modern too, like since post WW2 and with second industrialization, so is 50/50 for me, breaking Billion and staying in that range till slowly eroding from 2000 onward
Not-so-different from OTL, but in much better positions.
However, radical Islamism are of course not welcomed by Xing.
Good inputs you have. Although, to be honesty, Mao or no, one-child policy or not, I honestly think China ITTL will hit over one billion, one way or another. Although, I haven't exactly decided which exact figures I could put in for my TL-China's pop. However, population is one of the factors deciding the country's development, I do believed history events decided the country's developments.
Anyway, heads-up, I'm going to doing some edits to my last posts in regards to the Imperial family. Just plain renaming, tis all. Oh, my next post is coming up.
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Trivia: House of Temutay - Xing Emperors of China
House of Temutay: Imperial clan of Xing Dynasty
House Temutay (Chinese: 铁木台, Pinyin: Tiěmùtái; Mongolian: Temutai; English plural: Temutays or Temutayids) is the ruling Imperial clan of the Xing Empire of China, a Sunni Muslim dynasty of Turco-Mongolian lineage descended from the younger son of Yuan Prince Ananda the King of Anxi and grandson of Kublai. The Temutays are the Qinghai Mongol clan who became a noble family after being legitimised by the Yuan Emperor, Buyantu Khan. The clan is named after the founder Temutai, a Mongol Muslim prince. However, due to his father Prince Anxi’s coup attempt in seizing the throne and lost. As well as his older brother Yerutömör for conspired against Jayaatu Khan. Temutai and his descendants were excluded from Yuan imperial succession in the light of offenses commited by his father and brother. But the clan established by Prince Temutai have retained their privileges as a high-ranking Yuan noble family for not siding with the rebellion and loyally served the ruling Yuan Emperors. He succeeded as King of Anxi and never have attempted to seize the throne for the rest of his life, his successors does the same until the end of the Yuan Dynasty.
Unlike much of their Buddhist cousins, the Temutayids have preserved their old Mongolian traditions at the same time embracing the Chinese high culture despite being of Muslim faith. The Temutayids played a large role in Islamisation and Sinicization of Mongol tribes inhabited in North-Western China and Inner Mongolia region. Nevertheless, the Temutayids have never forgotten their Mongolian roots. They’ve taken extra care in maintaining most of the customs of their Mongolian heritage from the days of Genghis Khan including the practise of Tengriist shamanism. It was up to the point; they are more closer to Tengriist beliefs than their Lamaist Buddhist brethren in Outer Mongolia. Therefore, members of the Temutay Dynasty were strongly influenced by Chinese culture and established the significant empire in history, the Xing Dynasty of China.
Portrait of Genghis Khan – ancestor of the Temutays
Portrait of Kublai Khan
The Temutay clan belonged to the Borjigid line traced back to Kublai Khan, grandson of the legendary Genghis Khan. They’ve served in the Yuan Dynasty as officials and warriors in virtue of their skills as well as their Parent house being Borjigin through Kublaid linage. Having a blood of ancient line, the Temutayids intermarried with their fellow Mongols and Turkic Muslim tribes into one of the powerful families in the Mongol Empire, a fact not mentioned in the historical documents by the likes of The Secret History of the Mongols until the Chinese Imperial family revealed their clan history records into public in 1974.
While they were one of the loyal families in the Yuan Dynasty but their defection to the Ming Dynasty has all started with the betrayal by the corrupt Yuan Court, who executed many of Temtayids in fear of their power and decided eliminate competition before they’re too much of the threat. Angered by treachery, the Temutayid survivors have joined forces with the Chinese Muslim rebels in revolt against the Yuan, later allying with the Ming. All of this is their acts of revenge on their kinsmen who betrayed them to avenged their wrong-doing.
For their efforts in expelling Yuan, Hongwu Emperor, founder of the Ming Dynasty, granted the Temutays nobility with their own fief in Xi’an under the name of Jinmao family, (Chinese: 金茂, Pinyin: Jīnmào; Literally: Golden prosperity). Like their Yuan ancestors, the Temutayids have produced generals, tacticians, officials and alchemists for the Ming Dynasty and considered to be one of the most loyal houses in the Great Ming. It is said some members of Temutayids served on Zheng He’s Treasure Fleet. Out of all the Mongol families’ subservience to the Ming Dynasty, the Temutays received privileges to retained their Mongolian cultural heritage and customs as rewards for their loyalty. Additionally, they were considered to be the most loyal Mongolian clan to the Ming Emperors.
Until the Temutayids defected to Qing when their last patriarch Baihu, his wife and his children have been executed by the corrupt Imperial court and attempted massacre of the whole clan during the dying days of the Ming Dynasty, who feared their power and influence. Succeeded the late patriarch’s position is the younger brother Maomu, he led the survivors into Inner Mongolia to rendezvous with their Inner Mongolian allies and kinsmen to recuperate. Maomu and his clan have sworn allegiance to the House of Aisin-Gioro, the ruling family of Qing Dynasty. Seeking revenge against their former Ming masters, the Temutays have assisted their Manchu overlords in the conquests of China and defeated the last of the Ming remnants as means to avenge their wrong-doings committed against them.
As a reward for their participation, the Aisin-Gioros rewarded the Temutayids with their large estates in Shaanxi and Qinghai. Like their ancestors before them in the Yuan and Ming dynasties, the Temutayids served as warrior-aristocracy who participated in many of Qing military campaigns including the conquest of Xinjiang in 1728. Until the Qing civil war which dissolute the Manchu Dynasty into series of bickering kingdoms ruled by pretenders.
By the time of Five Kingdoms period, the Temutays under Uman’s leadership have set up their own kingdom based in Xi’an and expanded their powerbase. It is said Uman is too ambitious to be loyal to any Qing princes who’re self-proclaimed emperors of China. Unwilling to repeat the past tragedies of his forefathers, he instead decided to became the next emperor of China, founding the Xing Dynasty. Oddly, Uman or known as Wuyi Emperor by his regnal name, claims it is his ancestor Prince Temutai who founded the Xing Dynasty. Regardless of the truth of the matter, Uman heavily credited his ancestor for setting foundations of the Xing Empire.
Royal sigil of House Temutay. The Blue Wolf is their royal symbol in references to their ancestor Genghis Khan and the Borjigid legendary origins of the union of the blue-grey Wolf and fallow Doe.
To those who’re intimate with Chinese history and its’ dynastic politics, it seems to be a clear irony that the former ruling families of Yuan, Ming and Qing – the Borjigins, the Zhus and the Aisin-Gioros became vassal houses of the House of Temutay, who’re once their retainers. They have ruled China, more so than most of previous Chinese dynasties. In terms of wealth and power, they are richest family in the world. The imperial family of China have married into Korea, Iran, Turkey, Hashemite Arabia and those of South-East Asia and vice-versa; maintaining good ties with each other which strongly influenced their bilateral relations.
Nevertheless, the Temutays today are rulers of the Middle Kingdom which is very well-known in the Western World as China.
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Author’s Notes: This post is pretty much the brief history and origins of the Imperial Clan of Xing. Indeed, the Temutays are descendants of Genghis Khan through lineage of Kublai. They’ve started small as a mere Turco-Mongolian Muslim clan who swore allegiance to the Yuan Emperors, from Mongol vassal to rulers of Imperial China and a modern-day superpower. With that said, they will rule one of the world’s superpowers in this timeline. Perhaps, the effects of Imperial China remaining strong under the different dynasty and leadership will lead to interesting divergences in this timeline, one way or another. Well, this is what happens if they ruled over a large part of the wealthiest regions in the world. Overall, it’ll be a best case-scenario for the world with a much powerful China around.
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Well with the butterflies, odds are an entirely different government appears in Japan...
last admiral
Banned
Maybe this time, Japan's Emperor being puppeted? I just wonder what would happen to Korea'a Imperial/Royal House?
Good, the less headache, the better.
Now, since China's muslim in better position, the Fall of Malacca shouldnt happen, or atleast we would able to take it back with China's help, right?
My understanding of OTL Japan would be they are in isolation until Meiji Restoration, which after rapid industrialization conquers Korea and Russia Far East then the military got cocky and took over the government in a fit of opportunity. ITTL there might be a moment of weakness in Xing rule where they lose control over Korea around the same time as that moment enabling Japan to get a foothold on the continent (no state would have eternal stability, that's just unrealistic and sueish) or since they can't attack Korea, they turn to RFE and be wildly successful acquiring large amounts of land with the same result of military government takeover, but a bit tempered because China is still quite strong to warrant caution instead of total arrogance IOTL.
Im think two major points from this that i ignored that raise two important questions.
1st Do chinese muslim princesses marry non muslim princes, as thats a move and have major repercussion for islam and muslim world.
2nd japan not on that list.........
Who knows. Wait till the story gets to Japan, sooner or later. I don't like to spoil too much but the existence of powerful China will definitely impact on Asia including Japan with interesting consequences.
However, keep in mind, OTL Imperial Japan attacked Pearl Harbour despite knowing the advantages the U.S. have over them yet they went ahead with provoking Uncle Sam. Why? it was a matter of saving face, because to heed their disadvantages would have resulted in a loss of face so immense that their society couldn't handle it. Even after knowing and even understood the American military strength. All of this led them to make some titanic mis-judgements and poorly thought out assumptions about the West, and when fuelled by a Bushido coloured view of themselves as being descended from gods they embarked on not one but two highly ill-advised campaigns that lead to nothing but ruin and despair.
In any case, don't expect Imperial Japan win against Xing China, let alone conquer the Chinese mainland. Besides, China is too big for Japan to conquer to be honest. One more thing, there'll be no North Korea ITTL but there'll be equivalents in their place. Just be patient. :3
Erm, the fall of Malacca happens in 1511. It's too late for Xing to liberate Malacca by the time of the story. However, fear not, I have some plans for the Malay Archipelago as a whole. It's just I do not wished to spoiler. Perhaps the so-called East Indies will be liberated much earlier than OTL, thanks to Xing help. Wait till we get to the point of 18th-19th century South-East Asia~.
Yes, ITTL Xing Chinese princesses will marry non-Muslim princes, no different from past Chinese dynasties. It's also the same case with Xing Chinese princes. However, this only applies to Asian and Middle-Eastern countries. By the time of modern-day, it's considerable acceptable for Xing royals to marry their spouses from all over the world. This also includes the West and Africa too. No doubt it will have inevitable repercussion for the Muslim world for better or worse.
As for Japan, there's a good reasons they're not on the list. One of it,is Japan under the rule of Tokugawa Shogunate were strictly isolationist, so it's unlikely to send their princesses frequently to Xing China save for political and diplomatic reasons. Even they did send their princes and princesses for marriage, it's unlikely it'll not would prevent tensions from arising between Xing China and ITTL Japan as great power rivalries in Asia.
A western example would be Britain, Romanov Russia and Hohenzollern Germany, a certain monarchs in spite having the same grandmother Queen Vicky, this doesn't stop their nations from competing and warred against each other.
Or other muslim dynasties itself too
For better, much better(reduce even more the innate racism there at times, specially with the saud and persian have at times)
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