Map Thread XVII
- Thread starter Upvoteanthology
- Start date
- Status
The only position I know is wrong here, bub, is defending Imperial Japan (which would know something about violating agreements, sovereignty, human rights...)
damein fisher
Banned
Okay, I can get behind a lot of this, as it is now not creative decision based criticism, but realism based criticism, thanks!
Basically, the American's were still pissed about the war of 1812, Jackson openly was against any form of British Immigration advocated for an Independent [possibly American influenced] Canada. The introduction of Michigan and OTL Wisconsin into British North America results in an earlier Canadian Rebellion [The Canadians thought they were to be doomed as minor colonies of British North America as well as the other cause of the 1837 rebellions], meaning Andrew Jackson was president when it started. As is generally a pattern in Presidents whose wars outlast their terms, Jackson becomes the first president to have a third term.
Also, I suppose I did word myself poorly, but the 'American Support' of the Canadians isn't as grand as it sounds, mostly they provide shelter, arms, etc to the Rebels. No official US military intervention occurred with only a few militia men here and there joining the fight. It was more of the idea that America tried to aid the Canadians that pissed of the UK. Sorry for my wording.
I agree, I imagine that similar to US support to Canada, the UK doesn't really supply the CS with men, rather money and weapons, maybe at most a few ships to prevent the US blockade. The French would probably be more likely to send men and even then I doubt that.
But again, this is my story and I just don't see the US justifying annexation after a few decades. Not even the cultural divide [though that is apart of it], the rebellions in the CS, the poor infrastructure, the poverty, the amount of uneducated, unemployed southerners whop wouldn't be of no use to the US until re-educated; it wouldn't be worth the price.
[I have no idea what you meant when you said South California should be a slave state, it was]
Basically the CSA is meant to be a sad lump in NA. The First World CSA is overdone and stupid, so I went with a third-second world CSA.
damein fisher
Banned
Good point. I still think the British immigrants would rather go somewhere they wouldn't be discriminated, especially since it's so close, but I can agree that Irish Immigration likely remains the same give or take.
Hm. I could back this some more now. (At least have the Union take Tennessee.)
I mean 'Still can't see Colorado/South California as a slave state, even if purely name only. "
damein fisher
Banned
Considering the peace deal CS goes to Kentucky in the north, I have the US re-annex Kentucky, west Virginia and Arkansas
Basically the reason that South Carolina is a slave state in name is because of an alternate compromise of 1850. New Mexico is made a free state [containing OTL New Mexico and Arizona] as well as California with Humboldt [Utah] being pre-declared as a future free state. So as a compromise, the New Rhineland [Rio Grande area] Territory is made into a slave state, and Colorado is defined as a slave states [with the Cortez territory being considered a slave territory that would eventually combine with Colorado]. Though the more you point it out, I agree that Colorado and Cortez are unlikely to secede. They probably just remain nuetral
Then why did you say the US "illegally declared economic war" on Japan? Cause that sounds like defending Japan to me.
Anyways, this is a map thread, so can we just post and talk about maps?
damein fisher
Banned
I agree, let's not bring drama into this and get someone kicked, If you must go to the public forum or chat.
[But in his defense, pointing out a problem of thing b doesn't mean you're defending thing a]
I must say that this is one of the best Alternate History Projects ever!!
Well, that really isn´t the most reallistic scenario I d ever seen... but damn, it is wank, isn t?
And I like it (have my own russian/panslavist/eurasianist wank in head, rather without concrete POD )Wow, that's a Russiawank! And it also isRussia as the democratic and America as the totalitarian side in the Cold War!
kreiviskai
Banned
But... Czechoslovakian government was a panslavic one (Karel Kramar, for example)
I wonder how whites won. You know, civil war in Russia was a war between two crowds of bums, exclude intervents and separatists, (I don't know how to properly translate бич https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/бич#Noun_2), and Reds won because their crowd was larger and cohesive.
Or you just take whites won as a fact?
Last edited:
Skallagrim
Banned
I'm wondering about the same things @kreiviskai mentioned, especially the Czechoslovakia bit. Also, wouldn't Russia be very eager to annex Romania outright? If they can absorb a lot of Turks, Arabs and Persians (and treat them well), they can absorb a bunch of Romanians, too (and treat them well - granting Bassarabia to the Romanian state would be a smart move).
The Whites winning always seems tricky to me, but I'm willing to roll with it just for the sake of having a cool scenario. Which this certainly is. I particularly like that the premise (the Whites winning) leads to a democratic state, rather than the authoriarian hell-hole that POD typically yields in almost all scenarios. It's nice to see Russia completely avoid both left-wing and right-wing dictatorship for once.
I'd be interested in seeing those flags!
Alex Richards
Donor
Excellent work again there @Upvoteanthology
Well it's artistically accomplished, but quite apart from Atlantropa (why that idea won't just die considering it's an awful idea nobody in power seriously considered adopting I don't know) there's a lot of minor issues, like using the French name for Bern (a majority German city) and consistently misplaced city locations.
Well it's artistically accomplished, but quite apart from Atlantropa (why that idea won't just die considering it's an awful idea nobody in power seriously considered adopting I don't know) there's a lot of minor issues, like using the French name for Bern (a majority German city) and consistently misplaced city locations.
The slotslen were a thing of supreme importance in Denmark as well, however there was a further distinction depending on the terms the fiefs were endowed (and until 1523 to whom). Arup's map was the closest thing I came to an academic source for the situation in Sweden. Alas, I must continue my search!
Interesting, it was pretty much the exact same situation in Denmark.
The map is OTL Qazaq UberBam map (I forgot to mention that) 1948 (as ATL).
Earlier operation typhoon was defeated by the Soviet Union due to Gerkan logistical troubles and better prepared defence than in OTL December when it was wasted on futile counterattacks. No Kiev encirclement saved million Soviet soldiers and the front stayed more on West than OTL. Winter counterattack from the south crippled Army Group Center, encircled large part of that and caused German to flee. Industry saved from the destruction (Eastern Ukraine and Western Russia) and front pushed more to the West than OTL caused spectacular successes of the Red Army in conquering Europe - after crossing Oder river and seizing Berlin Wehrmacht ceased to exist as formidable force and was easily crushed.
The Soviet Union conquered all of Korea and the United States established more permament presence on the Japanese soil.
Ah. I see.
How did the War in North Africa, and Western Europe for with all of this?
How the Cold War going?
That rump of Germany supported by France?
Plans for a squeal?
It's not even the most extreme version I considered! Originally I wanted Russia to conquer all of East Europe and much of the former British Empire.Well, that really isn´t the most reallistic scenario I d ever seen... but damn, it is wank, isn t?
- Status