Getting Ahead of Ourselves: A B-29 TL
- Thread starter Parmenion
- Start date
You're both right, both the cost of occupation and the cost of pushing the Red Army back to Moscow would be staggaring.
Win-win for the Allies. They can now smash the Red Army, and still retain not only the atomic option but also be in a far stronger position militarily if either Stalin wins or Zhukov is lying. Unless of course he is lying about the troop movements but that should be somewhat easy to verify.
muddyleathers
Banned
It would take some vetting, but if recon confirms the troop movements with the plans, then there would be an icebreaker. I wonder if the western leaders had an intuitive vision into stalins psychological profile. We use hind site to know he nuts, but did his contemporaries realize the depth of his psychosis? Would that give them reason to buy into Zhukov’s plot?
Zhukov is way more partiinost than to become leader. This is about the survival of nomenklatura power in a circumstance where Stalin is the danger to that power. Replicating such a danger through having the presiding party member being military would be beyond anyone. The leader will just have Zhukov standing behind and to the right continually for the imagery.
Molotov is likely to be killed in his assassination attempt which is likely to be 50/50. Stalin was paranoid, but that didn't mean no one was out to get him.
This could go horribly wrong, horribly fast.
If Stalin survives, then the NKVD will look for co-conspiritors and they will "find" them. They will also get "confessions" from them.
The question is, will those "confessions" implicate Zhukov?
If so, you'll see a short fight at the front as NKVD officers try to arrest Zhukov, followed swiftly by the NKVD officers being either detained or shot out of hand.
At this point, I can see Zhukov, Rokossovsky and Chuikov, turning around and making a drive on Moscow. Stalin either has to stand and fight, (and likely die), or make a run for it.
If he does the latter, don't be surprised if he ends up back in Georgia living a peasant life under an assumed name.
He'll be found one day though.
This could go horribly wrong, horribly fast.
If Stalin survives, then the NKVD will look for co-conspiritors and they will "find" them. They will also get "confessions" from them.
The question is, will those "confessions" implicate Zhukov?
If so, you'll see a short fight at the front as NKVD officers try to arrest Zhukov, followed swiftly by the NKVD officers being either detained or shot out of hand.
At this point, I can see Zhukov, Rokossovsky and Chuikov, turning around and making a drive on Moscow. Stalin either has to stand and fight, (and likely die), or make a run for it.
If he does the latter, don't be surprised if he ends up back in Georgia living a peasant life under an assumed name.
He'll be found one day though.
I'll leave that ambiguous, but suffice to say the man is not having a good time if he's still alive.
Part 97-Redrawing the Map
The White House, August 25th, 1945
"Thank you General" President Morganthau said, still processing what he'd heard "Is Operation Runningback still planned for Tuesday?" "Yes sir" The general's voice crackled from across the Atlantic "Well then I'll let you get back to work, godspeed." He hung up without waiting for a reply. He'd already assembled a fraction of his cabinet to discuss this, everyone whose offices had something to do with the situation. Vice President McNutt, Secretary of State Stettinious, and Secretary of War Stimson, had all been sunmoned for their imput. The room was tense, as the gravity of the words today became obvious.
"Regardless" Stimson said "We can't leave a strong Russia. If allowed, they will stir things up, god knows it, and we'll have a third war in ten years, tops." "Still though" countered the Secretary of State, leaning forward "We have to consider, I mean you're the one who delivered the estimation from Marshall. Three million dead to reach Minsk, another two to reach Chelybinsk, bomb or no bomb. Not to mention god knows how many civilians." "And that's another thing" McNutt spoke up "Who's to say Zhukov reallly stands down. As unorthodox as it sounds, a military leadership may be just what the Soviet Union needs right now."
"That's true." Nodded Stettinus "But if so we can just keep at it, I doubt Zhukov will be able to turn much around." "That much I agree with" Conceded Stimson "They're tapped out, unless they copy the Pole and draft all their women, they really can't put a man in uniform without taking him out of a field or factory. They're gonna buckle sooner or later." "And Tito, that could just give us the Balkans." "Hmm" Morganthau began to speak "What about Finland?" "What about it sir?"
"Stettinius, do you think Mannerhiem would sign up for short war to regain it's lost territory?" "Not a second time, no sir. Why do you ask?" "Picture this: The wee morning hours of September 2nd, Stalin has his morning briefing with his ministers/marrionettes. He goes over his plans to clean out the prisons and asylums for more conscripts. The door flies open, emergency from the front. Finland and Tito have both taken up war against the BT. Just then, as they go over the deteriorating situation in Leipzig and to the north. Zhukov bursts in, blows Stalins brains out, and with so many shocks in one day agree to follow him and call it off." The men sat stunned for a moment.
"So" Stettinius finally spoke "We put the pressure on Stalin, so when Zhukov squeezes he pops. That would go a ways towards a peace deal." " And would be worth saving 5 million lives. Exactly, as long as we have the bomb and they don't, we can swiftly trounce them. The only question now is what we do with the Balkans and Poland." "Oh" McNutt shot up "I had an idea for that. First, we engorge Poland. We give them the land from Germany, the land the reds took, plus Kaliningrad for good measure. They become the head of a Central European alliance, along with Romania and maybe the Czechs. The act as a wall between the East and West, neutral and armed, but not a huge threat to either side. It should placate Zhukov somewhat."
Morganthau nodded, as the men all came to the same conclusion slowly "Alright then, that's our play."
Oh boy what a convoluted path to an Intermarium this could be! But I don't see Poland being stable enough after all this to integrate many non-poles, and even if they just decide to ethnically cleanse East Prussia and other conquests that just means they stay at the same population they started, so not much stronger.
I would assume there would be a population transfer like OTL in what is now Kaliningrad
The US should definitely demand independence for the Balkans as well as a US-monitored plebiscite in Ukraine. And if the Soviets don’t like it, the US could always add Western Alaska, capital Vladivostok, to the list.