Blue Skies in Camelot: An Alternate 60's and Beyond
- Thread starter President_Lincoln
- Start date
You can say that again. There's nothing quite like a fellow brother in arms who helps you survive imprisonment.
Thank you, @historybuff!
I'm glad you enjoyed the update. Yeah Dubya is in a bad situation here, but we'll be sure to keep up with him as the TL moves forward.
Oh no, not George!!!!
Also as a side note it’d be interesting if one of Dubya’s captors was a certain Cambodian of high office.
Also as a side note it’d be interesting if one of Dubya’s captors was a certain Cambodian of high office.
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BP Booker
Banned
I cant tell if everything is falling apart, or falling in place for President Romney. I have a question, is Laos an officially communist state like North Vietnam or is it that there is significat communist insurgent presence in the country side that allows the North Vietnamese and Khmer Rouge to pass against the authority of the Laotian government? Because if its the latter, Washington can very much just say that they are supporting the rightful government of Laos against marxist guerillas
Man, if I was Al Gore Sr I wouldnt have it in me to fight for another term and decline to run for "family reasons". Then again maybe he wants to but Lyndon B Johnson will not let that seat be lost goddamit so suck it up Al or Ill swear to God I will send I riot outside your office
Man, if I was Al Gore Sr I wouldnt have it in me to fight for another term and decline to run for "family reasons". Then again maybe he wants to but Lyndon B Johnson will not let that seat be lost goddamit so suck it up Al or Ill swear to God I will send I riot outside your office
The government of Laos is currently communist, thus complicating the situation there further.
Wait, what?! Since when did the Pathet Lao take power?!
I neglected to cover this in any update, so my apologies for that! D: This was an oversight where my planning outpaced my actual writing, I think. Near the beginning of 1970 Pathet Lao insurgents seized Laos' capital. The former government is still fighting in the countryside, but the Communists definitely have the upper hand in the Civil War at the moment.
Im sorry but i don't know how the Kent state massacre arose ittl,OTL it was caused by the unique events of College takeovers and riots across the 60s, which fueled National guard paranoia (they legitimately thought it was only a matter of time before someone started taking shots at them), not to mention a series of evermore violent protests on campus culminating in the burning of the ROTC building.Also a false rumor that the Guardsmen were carrying blanks not real bullets, made the protestors overly bold to the point where they deliberately trying to piss off and scare the guard. Now I TTL, the culture for the riot doesn't exist due to the calm 60s, Race riots and college takeovers haven't happened so the guard aren't so paranoid, Radical college groups are not in the vogue so students have not yet lost faith in the democratic process (meaning they never had big violent protests and never ever got anywhere near to the point where the ROTC was burned down and the rumor about the guard having only blanks would of been butterflied away (it was a unique order in some states stemming from concern of police riots, it was not issued in Ohio though). In short besides the fact their is a war in south east asia and possibly cultural disgust and ailenation from the guardsmen in the face of students who seem to be throwing their luck for this hippe movment while they never had the chance to go to college, none of the factors which led to the massacre otl are there.
Good update; the friendship between Bush and Gore sounds interesting...
Sad to hear that the Kent State massacre still happened, though. And Bush being captured was something I didn't see coming at all...
Hope Manson and his crew go down (wouldn't it be funny if the Canadians assisted in their capture?) hard for what they did to Trudeau...
"War" was a song sung by the Temptations originally, but the most famous version was released by Edwin Starr in June of 1970, so congrats for continuing the pattern, @President_Lincoln. I wonder what triggered Kent State ITTL...
Sad to hear that the Kent State massacre still happened, though. And Bush being captured was something I didn't see coming at all...
Hope Manson and his crew go down (wouldn't it be funny if the Canadians assisted in their capture?) hard for what they did to Trudeau...
"War" was a song sung by the Temptations originally, but the most famous version was released by Edwin Starr in June of 1970, so congrats for continuing the pattern, @President_Lincoln. I wonder what triggered Kent State ITTL...
I think a more realistic situation for Kent may be a interstudent clash and someone gets killed or just have right wing vigilanties go in(their was alot of that sort of thing directed aganst the peace movment) Wouldn't strike the tone your looking for but it be more plausible.
Thank you, Unknown!
I'm glad you enjoyed the update and that the streak lives! Allow me to answer you and President Warren's concerns/thoughts about Kent State at the same time.Thank you for the forthright and fair criticism, Mr. President. I apologise if the inclusion of Kent State still happening here strikes you as particularly unlikely or unrealistic. I realize that the circumstances which led to the Kent State of OTL are largely absent here, but believed that residual tensions, misunderstandings between the Guardsmen and the Protesters as you mentioned, and renewed anger at Nixon and Romney's decision to bomb Laos would be enough to result in major protests, with some (such as Kent State) still turning violent.
Remember that ITTL, President Kennedy brought everyone home from Vietnam and it seemed like peace and freedom had won in Southeast Asia, only for the new Administration to reverse course and escalate again. That strikes the anti-war crowd as particularly shameful.
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This is a very solid idea. I'll have to think about whether I want to make changes to this update. But you've certainly given me a lot to think about, and I appreciate that .
One problem with this is that I don't think their would be an anti war movemen, at least not a very strong just yet one because Vietnam and the other wars in South East Asia never entered the American conscience due to Kennedys withdrawals. At most anti war stuff would be for Eggheads who are very keen on these sorts of things and hippies who are just in it to stick it to the older generation.
Thank you, @Hot Dad!
Much obliged. The 70's add some new strife to this Timeline, though there are definitely still sparks of hope. I agree completely that the anti-war movement wouldn't be as large or "mainstream" as IOTL, but there is still a draft in effect, and 100,000 U.S. troops in Cambodia. That number could grow as well if situation deteriorates and the "Triumvirate" can convince the President that more men is the solution.
Why thank you, I personally prefer student clashes myself,better to show the divides are not just generational. Perhaps the YAF and the Jocks on campus come out in a March to support the fight aganst Communism, due to a scheduling error both groups run into each other and after some taunting,which escalates to rock throwing and finally a fight which unfortunately involves the trampling of several people and mysteriously the knifing of one more.
They we're not mainstream until 1970 and even then they always had the hippie association hanging around for the whole time.
I definitely see your reasoning there.
As I said before, I'm slow to retcon things ITTL, not out of stubborn devotion to my original ideas, but because I want to carefully consider changes before I make them. Once Canon has been changed, we start having multiple versions of what happened moving about, which I'm personally against in writing a TL. I still believe that a series of protests could have occurred ITTL against the expansion of the War into Laos and the continuation of the draft, which became violent, led to the Guard being called in, and a fatality resulting. Maybe we can combine the ideas and say that the Guard were called in as a response to the violent student on student clashes?