¡Por la Patria, Viva México Fuerte! A Mexican TL

[Arkhangelsk]

As always, awesome update Arkhangelsk! Certainly liking where this is heading for Mexico. Though I am a bit worried with the Iturbide serving 16 years? I am guessing that by the end of his rule Mexico will reform a bit with term limits and executive powers. 16 years of centralist rule might not be too great for the country.



I'm guessing it will since the TL is about a "Mexico Fuerte!" And it seems the US will be butting heads with Britain at roughly the same time.




Prospects for the US certainly don't look too good. Unless the US wins this war - somehow - and ends with a good chunk of Canada. Then you will have a super Mexico and an supper US butting heads soon after. Still awesome!

Thanks jycee!

Yeah, Iturbide may be a tad bit better TTL, but he's still Iturbide. I will say that his clinging onto power for so long is partly due to the war with the US happening though the end of his second and all of his third term. After the war his hold on power shakes up significantly and he's unable to hold onto the presidency...not to mention he'd be pushing 70, so his age will certainly be a major factor in his eventual stepping down. Nearly two decades of Centralist rule will also set the ground work for TTL's "Reforma," complete with more reform and less French intervention.

I'll be covering the details concerning the US in the next update, but yes, there will be a major war between the United States and the UK, and the results will be...interesting.

 

[stevep]

Arkhangelsk

Interesting update and the problem of the rebelling peripheries is resolved, at least at the moment. Although with war in the north elements might seek to change that. Can't remember what the state of play is with the northern territories, especially Tejas and how much American settlement there has been in the region.

Like B_Munro I noticed that comment about an Anglo-American conflict in 1839. Presumably fairly short because the US is able and willing to go to war in 1845. Also that I presume the US feels that Britain won't aid Mexico, despite the 1839 conflict or is it insane enough to risk a two front war. [Alternatively partly its moving now because Britain is heavily tied up elsewhere, say serious internal problems or an earlier Crimean conflict/Indian mutiny say].

At this point in time, unless the US has powerful European allies, it has very little change against Britain and is likely to suffer a serious stomping in an extended war. On the other hand that could clear out so dead wood in the military of both sides so could make the US a more formidable enemy in some ways.

Anyway, looking forward to seeing what has happened elsewhere in the world then the great conflict.

Steve

 

[ZincOxide]

Yay! An update!

I like the way Iturbide has steered things, and it sounds like the war will end favorably for Mexico, especially if Great Britain and the USA have fought each other to a draw already, which will have sapped some American troop strength.

I suggest that Iturbide refrain from trying to grab for lots of territory, especially avoiding annexation of parts of the USA. Status quo ante bellum with the promise of no further hostilities will probably work well, especially as Mexico Fuerte can ill afford to draw out an occupation, I think.

 

[stevep]

Yay! An update!

I like the way Iturbide has steered things, and it sounds like the war will end favorably for Mexico, especially if Great Britain and the USA have fought each other to a draw already, which will have sapped some American troop strength.

I suggest that Iturbide refrain from trying to grab for lots of territory, especially avoiding annexation of parts of the USA. Status quo ante bellum with the promise of no further hostilities will probably work well, especially as Mexico Fuerte can ill afford to draw out an occupation, I think.

ZincOxide

The potential down-side for Mexico is that the Anglo-American war might have given the US a chance to clear out dead wood and learn a few lessons, making them markedly tougher opponents. It all depends on what has happened in that conflict and why the Americans are going for another war so soon.

Steve

 

[ZincOxide]

Say, is there any chance we could see a map while we wait?

 

[Arkhangelsk]

Say, is there any chance we could see a map while we wait?

I've been mulling over some maps, as soon as I return home Sunday night ill get a map up.

 

[Dan1988]

Hmm, je finis lire cette TL, et j'adore ça! I'm liking it - keep it up!

 

[Arkhangelsk]

Hmm, je finis lire cette TL, et j'adore ça! I'm liking it - keep it up!

Thanks Dan, I'll try my best!

I still have a ways to go before the next update is up, but in the meantime, here's a map of the world as of 1845, on the eve of the Mexican-American War.

 

[Dan1988]

Just a quick question - I'm noticing Spain holding onto Puerto Rico. Is there a reason for that? Will it be embellished in an update?

 

[Arkhangelsk]

Just a quick question - I'm noticing Spain holding onto Puerto Rico. Is there a reason for that? Will it be embellished in an update?

Yup Puerto Rico was retained by Spain...as for the reason, I haven't given it much thought, it was an area that the Spanish were somehow able to hold onto during the Wars of Independence. For that matter it's future is still a bit foggy

Probably not the next update, but I'll eventually flesh out that little detail.

 

[The Uchronian]

Thanks Dan, I'll try my best!

I still have a ways to go before the next update is up, but in the meantime, here's a map of the world as of 1845, on the eve of the Mexican-American War.

Hey man, it's been a while and I thought I'd check on this TL since it came up on the first page.....btw, what's the name of *Texas, if changed any from OTL?

 

[Arkhangelsk]

Hey man, it's been a while and I thought I'd check on this TL since it came up on the first page.....btw, what's the name of *Texas, if changed any from OTL?

Well thanks for stopping by

Texas, in relation to OTL, is split between the American state of Texas (same name as OTL), and the Mexican state of Tejas. The border was established at the Colorado River after Mexico gained it's independence.

 

[stevep]

Yup Puerto Rico was retained by Spain...as for the reason, I haven't given it much thought, it was an area that the Spanish were somehow able to hold onto during the Wars of Independence. For that matter it's future is still a bit foggy

Probably not the next update, but I'll eventually flesh out that little detail.

Arkhangelsk

I think I remember hearing somewhere that Puerto Rico was strongly loyal to Spain even as late as the Cuban rebellion. In fact that it was more hostile to becoming a US protectorate than Cuba would have been. If true and this was the case earlier it might still hang onto it.

I'm more concerned that all the Oregon region is coloured as if its a US territory in 1845, which is after the hinted Anglo-American war in 1839. Is this a typo or have they managed to gain it somehow? [I would be doubtful of this unless Britain was seriously tied down in Europe or exceptionally badly led at virtually all levels.]

Glad to see this TL seems to be coming out of its hiatus.

Steve

 

[othyrsyde]

Arkhangelsk

I think I remember hearing somewhere that Puerto Rico was strongly loyal to Spain even as late as the Cuban rebellion. In fact that it was more hostile to becoming a US protectorate than Cuba would have been. If true and this was the case earlier it might still hang onto it.

I'm more concerned that all the Oregon region is coloured as if its a US territory in 1845, which is after the hinted Anglo-American war in 1839. Is this a typo or have they managed to gain it somehow? [I would be doubtful of this unless Britain was seriously tied down in Europe or exceptionally badly led at virtually all levels.]

Glad to see this TL seems to be coming out of its hiatus.

Steve

A big reason this loyalty to Spain was because after the failure of the Gritto de Larres (big revolt against Spain), the island was allowed to have a representative in the Spanish government. When the US took over, it just appointed a military governor with no input from the populace.

 

[Arkhangelsk]

Arkhangelsk

I think I remember hearing somewhere that Puerto Rico was strongly loyal to Spain even as late as the Cuban rebellion. In fact that it was more hostile to becoming a US protectorate than Cuba would have been. If true and this was the case earlier it might still hang onto it.

I'm more concerned that all the Oregon region is coloured as if its a US territory in 1845, which is after the hinted Anglo-American war in 1839. Is this a typo or have they managed to gain it somehow? [I would be doubtful of this unless Britain was seriously tied down in Europe or exceptionally badly led at virtually all levels.]

Glad to see this TL seems to be coming out of its hiatus.

Steve

Actually I believe you're right Steve, either way it works out

As for Oregon, it will all be fleshed out in the next update, but what I will say is it's not *quite* a territory yet. It's under American control but it still has a significant bit of autonomy. Also the US got quite a bit of Oregon at the peace, but at a price (the British take half of Maine and the border at the 49th parallel North as been brought down two degrees).

 

[stevep]

Actually I believe you're right Steve, either way it works out

As for Oregon, it will all be fleshed out in the next update, but what I will say is it's not *quite* a territory yet. It's under American control but it still has a significant bit of autonomy. Also the US got quite a bit of Oregon at the peace, but at a price (the British take half of Maine and the border at the 49th parallel North as been brought down two degrees).

Arkhangelsk

I must admit I hadn't noticed those other changes. Furthermore the proto-Canada still has a small Pacific coastline. Although this does still sound like the war went worse for Britain than for the US. Still possibly with a Mexican-American war that sees the former doing a lot better some of this can be rectified.

Did Oregon have that blob of land to the SE in OTL or is that another effect of the conflict?

Anyway looking forward to the next update. Even if less so than I might have been.

Steve

 

[B_Munro]

Did Oregon have that blob of land to the SE in OTL or is that another effect of the conflict?

Here's OTL:

Since it includes the Great Salt Lake, it definitely extends further south than OTL. Presumeably the extra territory was incorporated into Oregon territory as a result of whatever negotiations gave the US a slice of northern Mexican territory.


Bruce

 

[ZincOxide]

yay! mappage!

 

[othyrsyde]

This is pretty tight. It's nice to see a TL where Mexico isn't gobbled up by the US. I won't be able to really read more until tonight since I'm only on my lunch break.

 

[edvardas]

I may have missed something, but when did France get Natal and Swan River? And is that Sicilly controlling Madagascar?