Smarter Than The Average Studio: An Alternate History of Hanna-Barbera

[Otakuninja2006]

If Hanna-Barbera started dubbing anime in say the 70s then the anime boom could happen by the 80s as opposed to the 90s.
An earlier anime boom could be a double edged sword. If Nausicaä of the Valley of the Wind was properly dubbed and given a major theatrical release say by 1986 it would give The Great Mouse Detective some major competition potentially causing The Great Mouse Detective to bomb, ending Disney theatrical animated movies and preventing the Disney Renaissance. We'd lose out on the Disney renaissance (or at least delay it by a number of years), but it could also kill the Animation Age Ghetto and would allow smaller studios to rise up and fill the void left by Disney.

Personally I would love to see Yatterman get dubbed.

Right!

We will get earlier anime imports. It will be so successful it might just result in

Spoiler

a dead Woodpecker

Huh? Why you say a dead woodpecker?

As a Woody Woodpecker fan this reveal terrifies me

@Tacomaster in a nutshell
I fear no man but that thing
*Shows the therapist a picture of anime overtaking woody woodpecker in popularity
it scares me

I'm part of the PM discussions. It's not just the East that should scare you on that waterfront.

INVITE ME TO THE PM, I MUST KNOW

I also want to be invited as well.

Come the 80s HB will get a major license but it won't be Marvel. Marvel probably will do a few shows with other companies scattered throughout the years but nothing with HB. Also Superfriends won't be HB or Filmation but instead WB/DFE

Oh.........what could they get?

Hey, huge fan of your thread here, I couldn't post anything cause I got kicked but do you mind if I share some ideas with you?

Yeah. I hope you don't get kicked again......

So far it's been more of the same at this time but when you get to the superheroes what if instead of making the superfriends with dc comics characters Hanna barbera cuts a deal to make marvel cartoons?

They did make a fantastic four cartoon in the 60's after all, and with grantray-lawrence animation(who did sub-contracted work with hb on topcat and the Jetsons) goes bankrupt after their adaptations of the marvel superheroes and spiderman they'd want to work out a exclusivity deal with Martin Goodman or Stan lee or whoever is running it at the time to takeover production of their properties.

the superfriends would probably be an avengers show, with founding members captain america, iron man, thor, hulk, giant man and wasp as main cast with Hawkeye, quicksilver, scarlet witch, Hercules, black panther vision, black knight, sub mariner and captain marvel making guest appearances and having the masters of evil fill in for the legion of Doom.

The dc superfriends will probably still exist in the thread but would be made by filmation who was responsible for the new adventures of superman franchise instead to compete with hb's avengers,

Those could work, however, I'm thinking we could expand the Super Adventures universe....

Based on my own writing experiences, that's a good call. When I planned an alt-history too far into detail I ended up thinking of it as kind of a drudgery to write. (Although when I planned it too little I probably flailed about a bit thinking I didn't have a clue with what I was doing. )

And, no worries, I was only making a joke that Gamingguy010's "we'd lose out on the Disney Renaissance" is an acceptable loss for me, lol.

As long as we still get Jonny Quest I'm in!

If the Super Friends do stay with DC maybe they could improve the show by adapting some lesser known/older comic book characters rather than creating their own.

Yeah.

As for the scratchy animation of the xerox animation.
It may be that I grew up watching Sword in the Stone ever other weekend, but I always loved that look. And I still do.
It always felt like I was watching a moving comic book or something.
Maybe if they adopt that method, it could turn into its own animation style movement. Like a Western version of anime?

That would actually make for a great style!

you know I want TC, Jetsons, and Jonny to all be bigger hits but I don't want too many shows. Maybe outsourcing Quest over to Japan would be a good idea...

That could be a good way of getting the anime train going.....

I know this is probably too early for any MASSIVE changes, and it might seem out of character, but IOTL Disney liked the work of Tezuka (btw, the feeling was mutual). Sooo, what if Disney was the one who brought Tezuka’s later works to the states, post Astro Boy? Maybe a film or two together as well.

https://www.reddit.com/r/todayilearned/comments/i6vik7

That would actually make for a great way to save them after Walt dies.

 

[More Than A Feeling]

Right!

Huh? Why you say a dead woodpecker?




I also want to be invited as well.

Oh.........what could they get?

Yeah. I hope you don't get kicked again......

Those could work, however, I'm thinking we could expand the Super Adventures universe....


Yeah.

That would actually make for a great style!

That could be a good way of getting the anime train going.....

That would actually make for a great way to save them after Walt dies.

1. Could you not have mentioned the exact wording of the spoiler outside the spoiler box?
2. I'll invite you in.

 

[Otakuninja2006]

1. Could you not have mentioned the exact wording of the spoiler outside the spoiler box?

Sorry.........

2. I'll invite you in.

Ok.

 

[RandomDSdevel]

Spoiler

a dead Woodpecker

As a Woody Woodpecker fan this reveal terrifies me

@Tacomaster in a nutshell
I fear no man but that thing
*Shows the therapist a picture of anime overtaking woody woodpecker in popularity
it scares me

Huh? Why you say a dead woodpecker?

I don't have any particular attachment to Woody Woodpecker as a character, but this still seems…a bit extreme.

We will get earlier anime imports.

More anime imports/dubs earlier on will be nice, though. Maybe this timeline won't have to wait over 30 years for a Gunbuster dub. (Some of its VA cast would be different, though, of course, since not all of our timeline's voice talent for it will have been born yet.)

 

[More Than A Feeling]

I don't have any particular attachment to Woody Woodpecker as a character, but this still seems…a bit extreme.


More anime imports/dubs earlier on will be nice, though. Maybe this timeline won't have to wait over 30 years for a Gunbuster dub. (Some of its VA cast would be different, though, of course, since not all of our timeline's voice talent for it will have been born yet.)

1. It ends up being worth it. Woody does come back as an anime after all
2. All I have to say is a white lion will change everything at Lantz

 

[Otakuninja2006]

Finally, you're back! How are you?

 

[More Than A Feeling]

Finally, you're back! How are you?

I've been on Reddit, Discord, Toonzone, basically everywhere except the AH forums. I will probably be posting a few new threadmarked posts over the next few days

 

[TheFaultsofAlts]

1. It ends up being worth it. Woody does come back as an anime after all
2. All I have to say is a white lion will change everything at Lantz

A Woody Woodpecker anime has a good chance at being a flop. But having Osamu Tezuka be in cahoots with a different Walt in the animation scene would be something.

 

[Otakuninja2006]

I've been on Reddit, Discord, Toonzone, basically everywhere except the AH forums. I will probably be posting a few new threadmarked posts over the next few days

Wait for real?

 

[RandomDSdevel]

2. All I have to say is a white lion will change everything at Lantz

Grins and pets Kimba and gives him a treat.

 

[Sen]

I've been on Reddit, Discord, Toonzone, basically everywhere except the AH forums. I will probably be posting a few new threadmarked posts over the next few days

Nice, I thought you were busy IRL and stuff.

 

[More Than A Feeling]

Man time flies. 19 days since I said updates were "coming soon". Well here's one.

The Looney Tunes entered the 60s as a turbulent time. Animation was heavily going towards television and theatrical shorts were losing relevance. However, Termite Terrace were still producing quality shorts. In 1960 The Bugs Bunny Show debuted making the Looney Tunes popularity surge, in spite of the new cartoons just being okay instead of great.

There was one problem though. Around 62-63, WB questioned the value of making new shorts based on how much money they were making. More problems arose when Chuck Jones was fired for breaching his contract with the movie Gay Purr-ee. WB were scrambling on what to do with the Tunes. They made a decision: they would close the in house studio and then license the characters out to a new company. This company would be DePatie-Freleng (a company founded by ex-WB staff David DePatie, Friz Freleng, and Robert McKimson). WB let them use the entire Looney Tunes cast and were basically given free rein outside of "make sure the shorts need minimal editing for TV".

The first DFE cartoon "Mouse Wanted", one that matched up Speedy Gonzalez and Yosemite Sam, was released in October 1964 to a solid reception. The second and last DFE 1964 short was "Daffy's Aunt Pam" released in December where Daffy's aunt meets his friend Porky Pig and chaos ensues. Both shorts had a positive reception and showed DFE, with Freleng and McKimson's units nearly 100% intact from the 60s, could still make Looney shorts.

 

[More Than A Feeling]

1961-1962

Episodes: 52 episodes

Voices: Daws Butler, Don Messick, Julie Bennett

Segments: Yogi Bear, Snagglepuss, Wally Gator

Yogi Bear was just 1/3 of the Huckleberry Hound Show. However, HB quickly learned he couldn't just be "another segment", he was a STAR. Yogi was starting to replace Huck in the ad slots, Yogi was the one appearing on lunchboxes, Yogi was the one at the Macy's Thanksgiving Parade. It was clear that the pic-a-nic basket stealing bear needed to have his own show. Like Huck and QuickDraw, the show would still consist of three segments. However, it was clear that the other two were meant to be secondary acts

Yogi Bear: Yogi tries to steal picnic baskets with the assistance (and often criticism) of Boo Boo and combating Ranger Smith

Snagglepuss: Snagglepuss tries to make his life in his cavern better but always ends up in the same place or worse. The hunter Major Minor also tries regularly himself to make Snagglepuss become a fur coat. The series was also known for the protagonist's iconic quips like "Heavens to Murgatroyd!" and "Exit stage left!"

Wally Gator: Wally tries to escape the zoo but always ends up back either by his own decision or outside forces. A knight could chase him, he could fail to get a gorilla to escape, or a CONFEDERATE ARMY COULD SHOOT AT HIM OUT OF THE SOUTH. Just normal cartoon things

Hanna and Barbera didn't particularly care about the other two segments as much as the Yogi money printer. Then again if you had a billion dollar IP wouldn't you? The series gave 52 episodes to all three segments. All of them became regulars on television for decades to come and showed that they had a new mascot and face of the company.

 

[Tacomaster]

So even Bugs is still allowed?

 

[TheFaultsofAlts]

The first DFE cartoon "Mouse Wanted", one that matched up Speedy Gonzalez and Yosemite Sam, was released in October 1964 to a solid reception. The second and last DFE 1964 short was "Daffy's Aunt Pam" released in December where Daffy's aunt meets his friend Porky Pig and chaos ensues. Both shorts had a positive reception and showed DFE, with Freleng and McKimson's units nearly 100% intact from the 60s, could still make Looney shorts.

If these are what DFE starts cutting their teeth on with the Looney Tunes, I can understand why The Pink Panther is their only United Artists character. Because these are great!

Segments: Yogi Bear, Snagglepuss, Wally Gator

Yogi Bear: Yogi tries to steal picnic baskets with the assistance (and often criticism) of Boo Boo and combating Ranger Smith

Snagglepuss: Snagglepuss tries to make his life in his cavern better but always ends up in the same place or worse. The hunter Major Minor also tries regularly himself to make Snagglepuss become a fur coat. The series was also known for the protagonist's iconic quips like "Heavens to Murgatroyd!" and "Exit stage left!"

Wally Gator: Wally tries to escape the zoo but always ends up back either by his own decision or outside forces. A knight could chase him, he could fail to get a gorilla to escape, or a CONFEDERATE ARMY COULD SHOOT AT HIM OUT OF THE SOUTH. Just normal cartoon things

You say that Yogi's the star, but I think swapping Yakky Doodle for an earlier Wally Gator is an improvement. I just have two follow-up questions:
1: Does the Yogi segment on The Huckleberry Hound Show get swapped in for something else? If so, what is it?
2: Seeing as though the headliner of OTL's HB New Cartoon Series is a backup segment on Yogi's show, what happens to Touche Turtle and Lippy the Lion? Because I'm pretty sure their futures are unclear as of now.

 

[More Than A Feeling]

So even Bugs is still allowed?

Yes. By everyone I mean EVERYONE

If these are what DFE starts cutting their teeth on with the Looney Tunes, I can understand why The Pink Panther is their only United Artists character. Because these are great!

You say that Yogi's the star, but I think swapping Yakky Doodle for an earlier Wally Gator is an improvement. I just have two follow-up questions:
1: Does the Yogi segment on The Huckleberry Hound Show get swapped in for something else? If so, what is it?
2: Seeing as though the headliner of OTL's HB New Cartoon Series is a backup segment on Yogi's show, what happens to Touche Turtle and Lippy the Lion? Because I'm pretty sure their futures are unclear as of now.

1. Hokey Wolf who can basically be described as "poor man's Yogi Bear"
2. For the 3 people who care about those shows, they might still get made but they sure won't have 52 shorts. They also wouldn't be in a show that isn't really a show (the "New Cartoon Series" wasn't how they actually aired with each segment being syndicated by themselves).

 

[TheFaultsofAlts]

Yes. By everyone I mean EVERYONE

I expected as such with the examples you made.

1. Hokey Wolf who can basically be described as "poor man's Yogi Bear"

What a coincidence. He's described as such in our timeline.

2. For the 3 people who care about those shows, they might still get made but they sure won't have 52 shorts. They also wouldn't be in a show that isn't really a show (the "New Cartoon Series" wasn't how they actually aired with each segment being syndicated by themselves).

Good call.

 

[ArcticAurora2002]

Man time flies. 19 days since I said updates were "coming soon". Well here's one.

The Looney Tunes entered the 60s as a turbulent time. Animation was heavily going towards television and theatrical shorts were losing relevance. However, Termite Terrace were still producing quality shorts. In 1960 The Bugs Bunny Show debuted making the Looney Tunes popularity surge, in spite of the new cartoons just being okay instead of great.

There was one problem though. Around 62-63, WB questioned the value of making new shorts based on how much money they were making. More problems arose when Chuck Jones was fired for breaching his contract with the movie Gay Purr-ee. WB were scrambling on what to do with the Tunes. They made a decision: they would close the in house studio and then license the characters out to a new company. This company would be DePatie-Freleng (a company founded by ex-WB staff David DePatie, Friz Freleng, and Robert McKimson). WB let them use the entire Looney Tunes cast and were basically given free rein outside of "make sure the shorts need minimal editing for TV".

The first DFE cartoon "Mouse Wanted", one that matched up Speedy Gonzalez and Yosemite Sam, was released in October 1964 to a solid reception. The second and last DFE 1964 short was "Daffy's Aunt Pam" released in December where Daffy's aunt meets his friend Porky Pig and chaos ensues. Both shorts had a positive reception and showed DFE, with Freleng and McKimson's units nearly 100% intact from the 60s, could still make Looney shorts.

1961-1962

Episodes: 52 episodes

Voices: Daws Butler, Don Messick, Julie Bennett

Segments: Yogi Bear, Snagglepuss, Wally Gator

Yogi Bear was just 1/3 of the Huckleberry Hound Show. However, HB quickly learned he couldn't just be "another segment", he was a STAR. Yogi was starting to replace Huck in the ad slots, Yogi was the one appearing on lunchboxes, Yogi was the one at the Macy's Thanksgiving Parade. It was clear that the pic-a-nic basket stealing bear needed to have his own show. Like Huck and QuickDraw, the show would still consist of three segments. However, it was clear that the other two were meant to be secondary acts

Yogi Bear: Yogi tries to steal picnic baskets with the assistance (and often criticism) of Boo Boo and combating Ranger Smith

Snagglepuss: Snagglepuss tries to make his life in his cavern better but always ends up in the same place or worse. The hunter Major Minor also tries regularly himself to make Snagglepuss become a fur coat. The series was also known for the protagonist's iconic quips like "Heavens to Murgatroyd!" and "Exit stage left!"

Wally Gator: Wally tries to escape the zoo but always ends up back either by his own decision or outside forces. A knight could chase him, he could fail to get a gorilla to escape, or a CONFEDERATE ARMY COULD SHOOT AT HIM OUT OF THE SOUTH. Just normal cartoon things

Hanna and Barbera didn't particularly care about the other two segments as much as the Yogi money printer. Then again if you had a billion dollar IP wouldn't you? The series gave 52 episodes to all three segments. All of them became regulars on television for decades to come and showed that they had a new mascot and face of the company.

Yes. By everyone I mean EVERYONE

1. Hokey Wolf who can basically be described as "poor man's Yogi Bear"
2. For the 3 people who care about those shows, they might still get made but they sure won't have 52 shorts. They also wouldn't be in a show that isn't really a show (the "New Cartoon Series" wasn't how they actually aired with each segment being syndicated by themselves).

Honestly, these are some pretty good ideas on how to handle the 1965-1969 era of Looney Tunes and the three 52-episode cartoons that unofficially make up the "Hanna-Barbera New Cartoon Series".

I've actually been looking into ways to handle those two issues for my own timeline (more so the latter), and my own ideas so far are actually somewhat similar to yours (specifically, the part about DePatie-Freleng being allowed more freedom in how they approach the post-1964 Looney Tunes). Granted, I'm also trying to keep the number of animated characters/series relating to Warner Bros. Animation, DePatie-Freleng, MGM, and Hanna-Barbera that end up getting butterflied to a minimum, so my solutions won't be the exact same as yours. If you could give me some advice on the matter, I'd be glad to hear it!

Also, what happens to Yakky Doodle now that he's no longer one of Yogi's backup segments?

 

[Sen]

1. Hokey Wolf who can basically be described as "poor man's Yogi Bear"

Many Hanna-Barbera characters start off as a poor man's something or the other. Shit, I didn't even know Doggie Daddy's voice was a parody of Jimmy Durante until I read wikipedia

 

[More Than A Feeling]

Many Hanna-Barbera characters start off as a poor man's something or the other. Shit, I didn't even know Doggie Daddy's voice was a parody of Jimmy Durante until I read wikipedia

like half of their 70s output was just "Scooby Doo but with a car/shark/caveman/two dogs/ghost/a different ghost/very small man/whatever a Shmoo is"