Map Thread XVIII
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I think our intrepid jackal is going to need to revise these plans.
First of all this is a fantastic map but I do have a few questions, mainly about the Mediterranean world, which I understand isn't your area of interest, so it is fine if you don't have any specific answers.
What are the direct successor states of Rome?
Why aren't there any states in Iberia? (To my knowledge it had been settled extensively by this time)
How did the Hunnic Empire form? (who led it etc.)
What is the lime green state in Jordan?
How has Christianity developed without the Jewish revolts, is it still just a sect of Judaism or has it completely split?
Has this version of Christianity been influenced by Islam in any way?
Are the Parthava Empire a successor state to the Parthians or a completely different group?
Did the AD 79 Eruption of Mt Vesuvius also damage Romes ability to recover from the Plagues of Tiberius?
What is the status of Hellenic religion?
Thank you in advance, Once again you have created a truly fascinating world. Thank you for sharing it with us @Xianfeng Emperor
Well, despite the 4AD birth date for Jesus other commenters have alerted me about, the butterflies shouldn't have hit Palestine just yet. Jesus would have lived his life largely as per OTL, but might have seen the odd Malay expat (though not too many) on his knees praising the Prophet Isa. Suffice to say, this has made Jesus even more important in Malayan Islam than in the uptime version.
Mecca is under Singaporean control--Singapore was never comfortable with a religiously oriented state threatening her pet Parthian Empire, and so fought several wars to humiliate and eventually subjugate the Egyptians. That led to an annexation of Suez, Jerusalem and Mecca's environs. I am unfortunately at a loss regarding Arabia's pre-Islamic history--though giben I've been taking a pessimistic (perhaps overly so) view of the post-ISOT world, I doubt the Malay Muslims would be much amused by paganism.
Hong Kong's spread was mostly based on two things: Where China's most productive farmland is, and how to best guarantee access to the Middle East. That meant Hong Kong likely wanted a port on the Mediterranean and control of he Silk Road, amongst other things. I didn't put as much thought into Singapore, but the funding factor was still how best to reach the Middle East.
Re: Demographics
Here you go! I assumed an approximately 1.2% growth rate for almost all ethnic groups, which is probably a bit of a conservative estimate.
Thanks for the compliment! But to answer your question, I haven't considered making a guide just yet--I'm not that confident in my abilities. My mapmaking is pretty much based on the physical worlda and making excessively squiggly borders out of mountains.
As for colours, I use Skallagrim's excellent SUCK, though I've had to make minor changes here and there.
Hong Kong was simple to make--I've just played up the rampant plutocracy that plagues the city. Singapore is somewhere I'm far less acquainted with, so forgive me if I've just gone and turned it into your average totalitarian nightmare.
Not all are leaving, but a sizable amount are. Think maybe 60,000 emigrants. I was a bit iffy about the Caucasian States at first, and am open to alternative names, but here's my train of thought, if it'd help:
- given that Caucasians HKers/SGeans are forming communities of their own, they could potentially constitute an ethnic group with time.
- They'd be ostracized once the post-ISOT order sets in (as all non-Cantonese/SG Chinese ethnic groups are), and therefore reasonably seek to found their own distinct national identity.
- Eventually, Caucasians would found colonies to escape persecution, now considering Caucasian not to be a racial group--but an ethnic group. Significant intermarrying with the dominant Han Chinese ethnic group would also dilute the gene Pool and strengthen the "ethnic group" argument. Ultimately, killing the idea that Caucasians are foremost a race.
Well, I don't think the amount Hong Kong or Singapore from rainfall or other minor sources can feed all that many--they have a total of 12 million, and that is rather...tricky to deal with. The two cities depend upon China's Dongjiang Pipe Line and Malaysia's Tebrau River respectively for practically all their water, which would not exist following the ISOT.
As far as Hong Kong is concerned, to my knowledge agriculture is practically nonexistent and negatable, and the fisheries industry is not much better. Though Hong Kong might have a fish farm or two in Shenzhen Bay or otherwise.
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The heraldry is definetely not historic.
I remember somebody posting several future-history maps of Russia--very beautiful, actually--where the latter Russian state, ruled by a junta under the monicker of a National Salvation Council, employed it.
So essentially, I think he stole it from someone.
Hong Kong was simple to make--I've just played up the rampant plutocracy that plagues the city. Singapore is somewhere I'm far less acquainted with, so forgive me if I've just gone and turned it into your average totalitarian nightmare.
It's ok. To be honest, the only part I really found fault with was how the Malays were treated post-ISOT. I doubt the Indians would fare any better in a situation where Han nationalism goes full-blown here. I know Lee the First tried his Confucian studies in education, but the fact that it didn't take off is evidence enough that he at least recognized the dangers of doing so. But anything can happen in a post-apocalyptic scenario, so that's why I said it was chilling. :3
Here it is, my most recklessly crowded QBAM series yet! Two versions of Europe, one more centralized and one more balkanized, with political and linguistic maps, diverging after around 1815. Features Italian and German failure to unify, Austro-Hungarian and Ottoman failure to remain unified, France and Spain having lost wars at some point and getting territory shaved off as a punishment, more linguistic diversity as a result of more/different nationalisms at work, and Bigger Balkan Bois.
The idea for this one came from when I took a look at the worlda with longitude and latitude lines overlaid on the continents. I got to thinking that they would make for some pretty weird countries if they were used as national borders, then I wondered what exactly might happen to cause such borders. I ended up combining that with a rather grim idea I had for an alien-ruled state on a post-alien invasion Earth, and this happened.
This description was typed at 1 in the morning, so apologies if it isn't as coherent as it could be. As should be obvious, this doesn't represent my personal views in any way.
The end of the war between Earth and the Chrugiunf in 2014, nearly a decade after it began, left the planet battered, but not broken. Humanity had successfully beaten back the invaders on nearly every front, with the only remaining Chrugiunf forces doggedly holding out in the zones where they had first landed, so thoroughly entrenched that it it would be nigh-impossible to remove them. As a result, six Chrugiunf-controlled zones were established after the war's end, with the doctrine of mutually-assured destruction preventing the Chrugiunf from restarting the war.
Though many strange countries that had slim chances at best of coming into existence beforehand resulted from the war- the European Socialist Union, the English State, the Federation of Canada, and the French Republic-in-exile, to name a few- all of the Chrugiunf areas ended up as standard totalitarian dictatorships that wouldn't have really looked out of place on pre-invasion Earth, the only difference being that, instead of being controlled by humans with god complexes, they were controlled by towering reptilian aliens with god complexes.
Well, that is, all of them except the Mediterranean Sector. Not to say that it wasn't such a state as well, but it was the way that its leader went about securing Chrugiunfic dominance of the zone that made it far more of a hellhole than the other five.
The Balkans was one of the first areas where Chrugiunfic troops first put boots (well, talons, to be precise) on the ground, and remained so for a good deal of the war thanks to the Chrugiunf general (there is no equivalent term in English, but "general" is the closest) in charge of the zone, Jiunit Ir-ujus, exploiting preexisting ethnic tensions in the Balkans, and later manipulating rebel groups in Italy and northern Africa into fighting each other instead of the Chrugiunf as the Chrugiunfic troops slowly and systematically shifted outwards from the initial landing point in Serbia. When the ceasefire finally came, Ir-ujus ended up with the largest amount of territory under his control in the treaty, with the borders being drawn directly on the perfectly-straight front lines.
Since it had worked during the war, Ir-ujus figured it would keep working after the war and divided the occupied areas into territories with multiple ethnicities all shoved together. Ir-ujus proceeded to select whichever ethnic group had the largest population, handed them weapons, and told them that they were in charge now and could do essentially whatever they wanted as long as they didn't try to overthrow their new master. While this may have been a pragmatic decision on his part, it also came with horrific consequences- while the humans were now the ones paying the occupation bill instead of the Chrugiunf, most of them ended up seizing the excuse to carry out apartheid-esque segregation at best and outright genocide at worst. And while the humans were preoccupied with this, the Chrugiunf minority quietly reaped the sector’s resources and sent them back to their homeworld, along with the resources they clandestinely harvested from the asteroid belt and the system's moons.
The inhabitants of the Mediterranean Sector stopped caring about the Chrugiunf presence eventually, as the aliens didn’t interfere much with their day-to-day lives and they were more focused on oppressing/expelling/murdering the ethnic minorities, while said ethnic minorities spent most of their days desperately trying to stay alive. And that was just how Ir-ujus had planned it, because if there was one thing he had learned from his time on Earth, it was that nobody was better at oppressing humanity than humanity itself.
This description was typed at 1 in the morning, so apologies if it isn't as coherent as it could be. As should be obvious, this doesn't represent my personal views in any way.
The end of the war between Earth and the Chrugiunf in 2014, nearly a decade after it began, left the planet battered, but not broken. Humanity had successfully beaten back the invaders on nearly every front, with the only remaining Chrugiunf forces doggedly holding out in the zones where they had first landed, so thoroughly entrenched that it it would be nigh-impossible to remove them. As a result, six Chrugiunf-controlled zones were established after the war's end, with the doctrine of mutually-assured destruction preventing the Chrugiunf from restarting the war.
Though many strange countries that had slim chances at best of coming into existence beforehand resulted from the war- the European Socialist Union, the English State, the Federation of Canada, and the French Republic-in-exile, to name a few- all of the Chrugiunf areas ended up as standard totalitarian dictatorships that wouldn't have really looked out of place on pre-invasion Earth, the only difference being that, instead of being controlled by humans with god complexes, they were controlled by towering reptilian aliens with god complexes.
Well, that is, all of them except the Mediterranean Sector. Not to say that it wasn't such a state as well, but it was the way that its leader went about securing Chrugiunfic dominance of the zone that made it far more of a hellhole than the other five.
The Balkans was one of the first areas where Chrugiunfic troops first put boots (well, talons, to be precise) on the ground, and remained so for a good deal of the war thanks to the Chrugiunf general (there is no equivalent term in English, but "general" is the closest) in charge of the zone, Jiunit Ir-ujus, exploiting preexisting ethnic tensions in the Balkans, and later manipulating rebel groups in Italy and northern Africa into fighting each other instead of the Chrugiunf as the Chrugiunfic troops slowly and systematically shifted outwards from the initial landing point in Serbia. When the ceasefire finally came, Ir-ujus ended up with the largest amount of territory under his control in the treaty, with the borders being drawn directly on the perfectly-straight front lines.
Since it had worked during the war, Ir-ujus figured it would keep working after the war and divided the occupied areas into territories with multiple ethnicities all shoved together. Ir-ujus proceeded to select whichever ethnic group had the largest population, handed them weapons, and told them that they were in charge now and could do essentially whatever they wanted as long as they didn't try to overthrow their new master. While this may have been a pragmatic decision on his part, it also came with horrific consequences- while the humans were now the ones paying the occupation bill instead of the Chrugiunf, most of them ended up seizing the excuse to carry out apartheid-esque segregation at best and outright genocide at worst. And while the humans were preoccupied with this, the Chrugiunf minority quietly reaped the sector’s resources and sent them back to their homeworld, along with the resources they clandestinely harvested from the asteroid belt and the system's moons.
The inhabitants of the Mediterranean Sector stopped caring about the Chrugiunf presence eventually, as the aliens didn’t interfere much with their day-to-day lives and they were more focused on oppressing/expelling/murdering the ethnic minorities, while said ethnic minorities spent most of their days desperately trying to stay alive. And that was just how Ir-ujus had planned it, because if there was one thing he had learned from his time on Earth, it was that nobody was better at oppressing humanity than humanity itself.
Let me rephrase this. What is the ocean biunadsris of these two cities?
Thanks - i do make more maps, but the next one is 1815 and then onwards to 1880, 1914 and 1923 - thats all for the moment. I'm currently planning on adding
more of these maps inbetween the existing ones - but thats more the future and i'm sure it won't happen till next year.
Its rather difficult to depict more than one level of subservance/vassalage and so one in one map - esspecially in a series of maps. So i decided to make things a bit more plain and also easier for me.
I truly forgot to mark it as french - i'll add it right now. But to be honest, it will look much more like the small (seemingly) white hook on the right side of the
rhine (thats the black and white borders who look on small territories like i colored it that way).
And no, the map colors arent really that set but in a series of maps its quite difficult to colour everything and everyone not too similar.
Its also the heights who warp the original state colours rather much, atleast in mountainous areas.
Yes, it does seem a bit awkward to use your own people as forced laborers. Seems like they could just buy food form the nearby areas where hundreds of millions of people live. By the way, as I see you are from Singaporean, could you give a mention on how mutually intelligible various forms of Chinese are? As in can you speak with people from Taiwan, Hon Kong, Mainland China, or the various Chinese communities that have not been expelled from Southeast Asia. If there are many left. Pol Pot and the Japanese were rather rough, from what I can tell. I think a concept of sending loads of Chinese (in the Germanic versus German sense) back in time with an ISOT, though of course the date is somewhat inconvenient. Always best to avoid sending time travelers to the time of Jesus. Always going to be some people with cameras hurrying over. Anyways, time travel scenario for when Singapore and Hong Kong are sent back to this time. You think English, Mandarin, or another version of Chinese would become the lingua Franca?
Are EDIT muslims still allowed pilgrimage to Mecca? How did Singapore manage to defeat the Egyptians so far away from the homeland?
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To a Kabbah filled with statues, totems, and fetishes? I feel they might not want to go.
You do know Hajj is a pillar of Islam? When the Egyptians captured mecca, they would have destroyed the idols as the prophet SAW did. Now that it's under Singaporean control, i can see them trying to benefit of Hajj.
How has this affected Jesus? Do his teaching have a more Islamic flavour to them? How did he die? Where is he living?
I know it is a pillar. I must apologize as I now realize I missed the mention s about Singapore getting Mecca and had assumed it was a Haji happening early after the ISOT.
Generally speaking, we can understand Mandarin speakers from elsewhere. The only limitations to that are the accents, which can differ to an extent. However, dialects between the various Chinese subgroups, like Cantonese, Hokkien and Hainanese, are not mutually intelligible by speech. While writing can easily overcome that barrier (we all use the Mandarin script) it's not like we carry a pen and paper around at all times. That's why Mandarin was promoted as a lingua franca among the Chinese dialect groups, and English as a lingua franca among all Singaporeans.
It's occupied by Hungary at present - the portion marked "Ungarische Besatzung" is all de jure Czechoslovakia.
Don't worry, though! They get it back in the end.
EW SCENARIO- Allied World: Here's what happens to cause the world to look like this
1. Roosevelt lives out the rest of his 4th term and partitions Germany with his Roosevelt Plan. This infuriates Stalin.
2. Stalin wants to spread his influence elsewhere to make up for losing Germany, so he assassinates Tito and installs a Soviet Puppet Regime in Yugoslavia.
3. The people of Yugoslavia rebel and Stalin fights the rebellion, committing many atrocities. NATO and the USA condemn these crimes and threaten a war if Stalin does not stop.
4. Stalin refuses, ww3 starts, NATO wins, and this is the world after the treaty of Belgrade is signed
1. Roosevelt lives out the rest of his 4th term and partitions Germany with his Roosevelt Plan. This infuriates Stalin.
2. Stalin wants to spread his influence elsewhere to make up for losing Germany, so he assassinates Tito and installs a Soviet Puppet Regime in Yugoslavia.
3. The people of Yugoslavia rebel and Stalin fights the rebellion, committing many atrocities. NATO and the USA condemn these crimes and threaten a war if Stalin does not stop.
4. Stalin refuses, ww3 starts, NATO wins, and this is the world after the treaty of Belgrade is signed
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