Which dictator would you rather live under?

[Crazy Boris]

Random concept that popped into my head reading the new posts here: a Groundhog Day-like scenario where you wake up under a different dictator every day and live an average day in their regime.

That would certainly be a good way to make a decision with this question, and probably pretty interesting from a historical perspective, just to see life in these countries at these time periods first hand.

 

[Goingidle]

He Is considerer a dictator ? I know by his own quotes he admitted he wasn't a Saint , but isnt a bit of a Stretch?

Not really, I guess. His regime is authoritarian, so at least if it's the qualification for dictatorship, then Soeharto was one. Talking about dictator, I'm tempted to say that the first president may also qualify as one, but it is opening a can of worms given that he is held in high esteem there, and I don't want that.

 

[GSD310]

My dictator criteria are as follows:

Military dictator preferred

No particularly strong ideology

Only cares about power and trappings without much social engineering at most.

No freak/monster offspring (looking at you Udai Hussein)

No to limited freedom but not a totalitarian state.

There was one like that in Indonesia once.

Not really, I guess. His regime is authoritarian, so at least if it's the qualification for dictatorship, then Soeharto was one. Talking about dictator, I'm tempted to say that the first president may also qualify as one, but it is opening a can of worms given that he is held in high esteem there, and I don't want that.

Speaking from an Indonesian POV here, I do agree that somehow the first president seem to have an easier time getting away with his failures. People are ready to talk and criticize about the Indonesian economy in 1998 but not about the Indonesian economy in the early 1960s with triple digit inflation.

 

[Captain Homicide]

a Groundhog Day-like scenario where you wake up under a different dictator every day and live an average day in their regime.

This is extremely interesting and I’d love to see this as an actual story.

 

[Gokbay]

Speaking from an Indonesian POV here, I do agree that somehow the first president seem to have an easier time getting away with his failures. People are ready to talk and criticize about the Indonesian economy in 1998 but not about the Indonesian economy in the early 1960s with triple digit inflation.

People tend to have favorable views of first heads of state.

Like seriously, how many of those are unpopular anywhere? I am sure there are some but still.

 

[comrade cat]

Not really, I guess. His regime is authoritarian, so at least if it's the qualification for dictatorship, then Soeharto was one. Talking about dictator, I'm tempted to say that the first president may also qualify as one, but it is opening a can of worms given that he is held in high esteem there, and I don't want that.

Speaking from an Indonesian POV here, I do agree that somehow the first president seem to have an easier time getting away with his failures. People are ready to talk and criticize about the Indonesian economy in 1998 but not about the Indonesian economy in the early 1960s with triple digit inflation.

Agree with these. When you look at Indonesian history at the 1960s, it's not just the present day nostalgia, but at that time, he actually remained popular with the people even after all of the 1960s economic shenanigans, PKI's downfall, his own downfall, his eventual house arrest, and Soeharto's de-Soekarnoization effort

My favourite story is the one when he was allowed to come to his daughter's marriage during his house arrest (Megawati, I think?).

This story is no way verified, but allegedly, when folks on the neighborhood realized that Soekarno is there, crowds quickly gathered and they cheered for him "long live Bung Karno!".

Soekarno, ever familiar with this kind of thunderous welcoming, instinctively waved his hand to the crowds. But the guards quickly pulled his hand down and ushered him inside.

 

[GSD310]

People tend to have favorable views of first heads of state.

Like seriously, how many of those are unpopular anywhere? I am sure there are some but still.

You make a good point. I suppose that when someone’s led their nation to independence and then become that nation’s first leader, their legacy’s set even if they themselves threaten to undo said legacy. It’s like there’s something they’ve done that can never be disputed.

Agree with these. When you look at Indonesian history at the 1960s, it's not just the present day nostalgia, but at that time, he actually remained popular with the people even after all of the 1960s economic shenanigans, PKI's downfall, his own downfall, his eventual house arrest, and Soeharto's de-Soekarnoization effort

My favourite story is the one when he was allowed to come to his daughter's marriage during his house arrest (Megawati, I think?).

This story is no way verified, but allegedly, when folks on the neighborhood realized that Soekarno is there, crowds quickly gathered and they cheered for him "long live Bung Karno!".

Soekarno, ever familiar with this kind of thunderous welcoming, instinctively waved his hand to the crowds. But the guards quickly pulled his hand down and ushered him inside.

This is why Soeharto had to move carefully in 1965-1967 when it comes to Soekarno.

 

[AModestGent93]

Of those listed Mussolini, if unlisted probably one of the the various middle Eastern despots or those whole ruled Brazil

 

[SealTheRealDeal]

People tend to have favorable views of first heads of state.

Like seriously, how many of those are unpopular anywhere? I am sure there are some but still.

Two years ago I'd agree with you, but recently the popular view of John A. MacDonald went from "the frequently dunk but otherwise visionary father of Confederation" to "genocidal racist and a black mark on our history even by the low standards of colonial Canada". Though who knows, maybe opinions will turn positive once more as rapidly as they soured in the past couple years.

 

[Gokbay]

Two years ago I'd agree with you, but recently the popular view of John A. MacDonald went from "the frequently dunk but otherwise visionary father of Confederation" to "genocidal racist and a black mark on our history even by the low standards of colonial Canada". Though who knows, maybe opinions will turn positive once more as rapidly as they soured in the past couple years.

There are always exceptions to the rule friend.

 

[pattersonautobody]

Its a toss up between Mustafa Mond, the Benefactor, and Big Brother. I love Big Brother.

 

[ImperialxWarlord]

How good or bad would it be to live under Franco or Salazar?

 

[SealTheRealDeal]

How good or bad would it be to live under Franco or Salazar?

Depends who, where, and when you are. In the 1940s northern Portugal is a pretty nice place (by the standards of 1940s Eurasia), while living in parts of Spain would be rather unpleasant.

By the 60s Spain is enjoying unprecedented economic prosperity and there's a number of areas where Franco has relaxed his moral busybody routine in an effort to promote tourism, meanwhile in Portugal the economy has slowed significantly and you're liable to be drafted to serve in the Colonial War.

 

[ImperialxWarlord]

Depends who, where, and when you are. In the 1940s northern Portugal is a pretty nice place (by the standards of 1940s Eurasia), while living in parts of Spain would be rather unpleasant.

By the 60s Spain is enjoying unprecedented economic prosperity and there's a number of areas where Franco has relaxed his moral busybody routine in an effort to promote tourism, meanwhile in Portugal the economy has slowed significantly and you're liable to be drafted to serve in the Colonial War.

Interesting, Thankyou!

Could either of these regimes have survived? And if so what would they look like?

 

[SealTheRealDeal]

Interesting, Thankyou!

Could either of these regimes have survived? And if so what would they look like?

With completely different external factors, maybe. If so it's hard to say.

 

[PrinceofApathy]

I'm a Jew, so Chiang is really the only option I can muster.

 

[Emperor Norton I]

"Mussolini, he was good to the people. But he cheated on his wife, and they hung him like a dog" - my 8th grade history teacher's Italian father-in-law

 

[Gukpard]

Between these three? Chiang

Among all dictators? The legendary Guido Vildoso

This very well respected man ended the last bolivian military junta and reinstalled democracy in the country and it is highly regarded by locals

In a sense the only thing that makes him a dictator is that he wasn't elected, but he didn't do the generic things related to dictatorship and it is someone that the right and the left tends to like! He's alive and kicking by the way