To Prove A History Teacher Wrong

[LittleSpeer]

No. All you were doing was wasting your class’s time and driving your teacher to drink.

Just suck it up, accept you were wrong and move on.

Ok i will but the class is horrible anyway as its a christian school and heavily slanted that way.

What are some ways i could make the class more interactive and bring a few minds to our side maybe? Its a United States history class and we are just getting to the United States involvement in World War 2.

 

[Cook]

You seem to be confused as to what your role in the class actually is; you are the student, not the teacher. You are there in order to hopefully learn something, not to hijack the class from the teacher. Ask questions so that you may have a better understanding of the whys and hows of events, not to enhance the interactivity of the class.

 

[LittleSpeer]

You seem to be confused as to what your role in the class actually is; you are the student, not the teacher. You are there in order to hopefully learn something, not to hijack the class from the teacher. Ask questions so that you may have a better understanding of the whys and hows of events, not to enhance the interactivity of the class.

yes but its his first year and hes a great guy but doing a bad job. Not his fault but he gives barely enough for us to know what actually happened in those events.

 

[Emperor Norton I]

You seem to be confused as to what your role in the class actually is; you are the student, not the teacher. You are there in order to hopefully learn something, not to hijack the class from the teacher. Ask questions so that you may have a better understanding of the whys and hows of events, not to enhance the interactivity of the class.

Or doodle and scope out boobies. Either or.

 

[Cook]

Or doodle and scope out boobies. Either or.

That was me in history class; sitting up the back, one row behind and to the right of Samantha (can’t remember her sir name) who always wore her extremely short netball skirt to history class because it was straight after P.T. and last class of the day.

She’d then proceed to put her feet up on the desk and spread her legs wide.

No wonder I did so badly in that class.

 

[LittleSpeer]

Or doodle and scope out boobies. Either or.

That was me in history class; sitting up the back, one row behind and to the right of Samantha (can’t remember her sir name) who always wore her extremely short netball skirt to history class because it was straight after P.T. and last class of the day.

She’d then proceed to put her feet up on the desk and spread her legs wide.

No wonder I did so badly in that class.

Intelligent conversation through critical thinking the hardest "what if" questions in history and this. This is why i love this website so much!

 

[trekchu]

Well, FDR did not know about Pearl Harbour.

This is probably more a personal opinion, but the US Government may have been aware that something was going to happen, but not this. For one military wisdom said that Pearl was too shallow for a Taranto-style attack and in any case the USN knew now that it was at least theoretically possible and of all potential Targets Pearl was the farthest from Japan. This is more one for the resident Pac-War experts, but if you ask them they'll probably say that if you were to ask anyone at the War Department before 7th December they'd make a case for a Japanese attack against the Phillipines or, say Guam.

 

[Aussie Dingbat]

yes but its his first year and hes a great guy but doing a bad job. Not his fault but he gives barely enough for us to know what actually happened in those events.

Thank god for the internet then, feel free to learn whatever you want outside of class.

Remember, when the Teacher asks you a question, almost 100% of the time they don't want the "correct" answer, they want the answer they've taught you.

 

[Matt Wiser]

The pre-7 Dec 41 thinking was that the Japanese would attack the Philippines, Thailand, Malaya, Borneo, and the Dutch East Indies, along with U.S. and British possessions in the Pacific. Nobody in D.C. (let alone Hawaii) expected an attack in Hawaii, and Japanese security (code and physical) was very good.

 

[Malice]

Did Roosevelt Know?

The question of whether Roosevelt knew that Pearl Harbour would be attacked by the Japanese is quite simple: he knew nothing.

Whether the military knew anything on the other hand is a matter of considerable debate. It is known they had broken Japanese diplomatic and naval codes but the problem with the Americans was that the Japanese naval fleet maintained a strictly enforced radio silence from the time they left their ports so the Americans had no idea where they would strike. Pearl Harbour was a possibility but so, too, were the Philippines, the British and Dutch colonies in southeast Asia and even Alaska.

Pearl Harbour was warned to be on full alert and to be prepared for a possibility of an attack but the order arrived too late. Even if it had arrived in time it is unlikely they could've done more than inflict heavier losses on the Japanese. Like 9/11 Pearl Harbour had many warning signs but none of them painted a complete picture and the Americans made many mistakes which contributed towards making the disaster even worse.

 

[The Red]

If Roosevelt wants war why would he have the opening attack allow the Japanese to attack an unaware Pearl Harbour and not a fully prepared one?

It seems to resemble this strategy. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9gC4FSwYHCo

 

[Grey Wolf]

Arguing with a teacher in front of his class is risky. I hope you knew what you were doing.

Why is it risky? Even if you're wrong it shows you're interested, which is probably more than half or three quarters of the rest of the class

Best Regards
Grey Wolf

 

[Shimbo]

I think there are several things that are known:
1) FDR wanted into the war because he believed that a Nazi Germany in control of the bulk of Eurasia was a potential threat to the USA.
2) He knew he couldn't get a declaration of war through Congress.
3) He had tried provoking the Germans in the N. Atlantic, but they wouldn't bite.
4) The US in negotiations with the Japanese presented them with humiliating terms, which there was no chance of them accepting.
4) When the Japanese rejected the terms and the US embargo was imposed, FDR knew very well that it would lead to war.
6) The US military was expecting war with Japan (there was a 'general war warning' sent on 27th November, so the attack was very far from being a 'bolt from the blue'.)
5) The US knew that Japan was going to attack US interests on the 7th Dec because the declaration of an end to diplomatic relations was intercepted and decoded the day before before it was presented by the Japanese ambassador.
6) Some intelligence officers recognised that the timing of the Japanese declaration coincided with dawn in Hawaii but failed to persuade more senior officers to pass on warnings until it was too late.

The above isn't necessarily a 'conspiracy' though.

The evidence that FDR knew of the attack on Peal Harbor and deliberately sacrificed it is thin at best, but the theory at least has a basis of fact in that the generally held 'bolt from the blue' legend isn't true.

This article reviews the evidence often brought up by revisionists.

 

[Lord Grattan]

Ok i will but the class is horrible anyway as its a christian school and heavily slanted that way.

What are some ways i could make the class more interactive and bring a few minds to our side maybe? Its a United States history class and we are just getting to the United States involvement in World War 2.

yes but its his first year and hes a great guy but doing a bad job. Not his fault but he gives barely enough for us to know what actually happened in those events.

I suggest that you speak with your teacher in private.

 

[abc123]

FDR did not know about ahead of time, nor did anyone really, there were so many places upon which an attack could come that you could always try and guess but you can only fortify so many places with the best naval forces and anti-air equipment, a lot of military folks thought it would come at the Philippines, they were wrong.

Not trying to start a huge argument with you here but your teacher's in the right on this one.

I agree. Roosevelt did know that the attack will happen, but they expected attack on Phillipines, not on Pearl Harbour.

Besides, I don't know how old are you, but there's big difference between a school history ( for kids, simplified and using only generally accepted facts ) and higher history for historians...

 

[abc123]

and driving your teacher to drink.

LOL
LOL

 

[abc123]

yes but its his first year and hes a great guy but doing a bad job. Not his fault but he gives barely enough for us to know what actually happened in those events.

So you can better do the job for what he is trained and educated in college than he can?

 

[abc123]

I think there are several things that are known:
1) FDR wanted into the war because he believed that a Nazi Germany in control of the bulk of Eurasia was a potential threat to the USA.
2) He knew he couldn't get a declaration of war through Congress.
3) He had tried provoking the Germans in the N. Atlantic, but they wouldn't bite.
4) The US in negotiations with the Japanese presented them with humiliating terms, which there was no chance of them accepting.
4) When the Japanese rejected the terms and the US embargo was imposed, FDR knew very well that it would lead to war.
6) The US military was expecting war with Japan (there was a 'general war warning' sent on 27th November, so the attack was very far from being a 'bolt from the blue'.)
5) The US knew that Japan was going to attack US interests on the 7th Dec because the declaration of an end to diplomatic relations was intercepted and decoded the day before before it was presented by the Japanese ambassador.
6) Some intelligence officers recognised that the timing of the Japanese declaration coincided with dawn in Hawaii but failed to persuade more senior officers to pass on warnings until it was too late.

The above isn't necessarily a 'conspiracy' though.

I agree. Good post.

 

[Snake Featherston]

By December 1941 the USA was expecting an attack aimed at most at Guam, Wake, and the Philippines. To the point of the Battle of Pearl Harbor a trans-oceanic assault with a carrier fleet had not been done, and it was something completely without precedent. If FDR was angling to get into the war with anyone it was with Nazi Germany and they weren't biting at the bait.

 

[Falkenburg]

If, as the OP states, his school is a 'Christian' institution it may be that his Teacher is constrained in how he interacts with his class.

It may be the case that the Teacher WANTS somebody to engage more proactively.
After all, it seems the Teacher was willing to continue the debate for 15 minutes. If the bell had not wrung he may have been happy to explore the issue further.

Charitably, the poor sod may just have been happy to have anyone in his class prepared to open their mouth.

Even if the basis of the argument is flawed it still shows a willingness to take an active role.

If you have the opportunity perhaps you can go back to your Teacher and tell him you've looked into the issue raised in his class, done your own research and changed your mind.

You may just make his day.
Just make sure that there's someone who knows CPR on stand-by to resuscitate him.

Falkenburg