The New Order: Last Days of Europe - An Axis Victory Cold War Mod for HoIIV

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chankljp

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Have you had any time?

This certainly took me a while, but here are some of the highlights from the Chinese TNO community's reaction to the more recent leaks:

- This is an infantry model for a 1970s' era Japanese soldier in the mod:
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A user quickly noticed that he was wearing WW2-style puttee leg wrappings to protect his feet, instead of the much more modern gaiters like the OTL Japan Ground Self-Defense Force of that same era did. This demonstrated a few things that could perhaps give us some insight into the TNO world's Japan:

(1) With TNO Japan having to maintain a garrison across the entire Pacific instead of only focusing on defending the Home Islands (Not to mention the lack of support from the US), unlike the SDF, the IJA will have to be much, much larger, meaning that even with all of East Asia under their heel, they could not afford to spend as much money on giving their individual soldiers the most modern equipment possible.

(2) While having gaiters are much more modern and easier to wear as foot protection, puttees are better at sealing your trousers to your boots, which is very important if you are going to engage in jungle warfare in say... Indonesia or Vietnam, Something that the OTL SDF does not have to deal with.

(3) Also, the OTL SDF have a doctrine based on high-tech mechanised warfare, taught to them by the Americans, in which infantryman would not be expected to march around on the battlefield as much with the extensive use of trucks and APCs, an approach that the TNO IJA might not have adopted.
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- On the Iberia breakup event, users have once again compared the dynamic between Franco and Salazar to that of a married couple, and that there needs to be a romantic drama based the two of them.
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- People complaining about the font of the mod hurting their eyes to read, with some jokes about it being a secret Burgundian plot of making untermenschs go blind.
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- Comments about Manchuria have the 5th largest GDP in the TNO world due to it being the Co-Prosperity Sphere's industrial core. With jokes that maybe Wang Jingwei and his collaborator government was correct after all.
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- With the leak about Persia and the country's status as a German puppet, some speculation about the CIA sending covert support to Khomeini and his Islamic fundamentalist so that they will overthrow the Shah...
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- The few users that commented on the US focus tree for a Barry Goldwater presidency actually having a positive opinion on him. Since in their eyes, no matter what his political views might have been, Goldwater is true believer, and someone that derive his policies from sincerely held first principles... Compared to modern day Western politicians, who are seen as a bunch of careerist that will say whatever the public wants them to say in order to get elected.
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- As as result of the focus tree about 'psychological revolution' on an unidentify left-wing Russian warlord, complete with experimentation involving the subconscious, lots of jokes about how one of the warlords is actually a puppet mind controlled by Yuri from the Red Alert series. With comment about building a genetic mutator to create brutes in order to beat back to Germans, using cloning vats to create a flood of conscripts in overwhelm RK Moskowien, or using a psychic dominator on Germania.
 
So considering how TNO deconstructs various althist and hoi4 tropes, the way the Heydrich route is set up,

I'm wondering if Heydrich is a deconstruction of ultra-evil routes in games. Like in most ultra-evil or negative karma routes in any game(ie: KOTOR, Jade Empire) you end up overthrowing the big bad and becoming the big bad yourself, and I know for a time people hoped Heydrich would do such a thing, but here he's just a puppet on a string that might think he has all the power and influence and his goals actually further the big bad's goals.

Essentially: Kicking a million dogs and picking the genocide option every time there is an option to do so, and accumulating "max evil points" does not make you the head honcho of all evil.
 
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Like in most ultra-evil or negative karma routes in any game(ie: KOTOR, Jade Empire) you end up overthrowing the big bad and becoming the big bad yourself as people hoped Heydrich would do, but here he's just a puppet on a string that might think he has all the power and influence and his goals actually further the big bad's goals.
And he ends up dooming the world.
 
And he ends up dooming the world.

Not just that, dooming the world for someone else rather than on the player's own terms or his own term. Like Bioshock's bad ending implies that you start a nuclear war, but you do so on your terms rather than say Andrew Ryan or Fontaine's terms. Similarly there are quite a few games where the PC destroys the world on their own terms or rules over it as a dark god for all eternity.

Here you don't even get to start WW3 on your own terms.
 
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chankljp

Donor
So considering how TNO deconstructs various althist and hoi4 tropes, the way the Heydrich route is set up,

I'm wondering if Heydrich is a deconstruction of ultra-evil routes in games. Like in most ultra-evil or negative karma routes in any game(ie: KOTOR, Jade Empire) you end up overthrowing the big bad and becoming the big bad yourself, and I know for a time people hoped Heydrich would do such a thing, but here he's just a puppet on a string that might think he has all the power and influence and his goals actually further the big bad's goals.

Essentially: Kicking a million dogs and picking the genocide option every time there is an option to do so, and accumulating "max evil points" does not make you the head honcho of all evil.

Not just that, dooming the world for someone else rather than on the player's own terms or his own term. Like Bioshock's bad ending implies that you start a nuclear war, but you do so on your terms rather than say Andrew Ryan or Fontaine's terms. Similarly there are quite a few games where the PC destroys the world on their own terms or rules over it as a dark god for all eternity.

Here you don't even get to start WW3 on your own terms.

On top of all that, compared this to say... The high chaos route in Dishonored, in which by being ruthless and evil, you will get to unlock all sort of super cool evil abilities that turns you into a one-man/woman mass killing machine (Almost giving you a 'Do Not Do This Cool Thing' vibe), when playing as Heydrich in TNO, as a result of him and the SS being too evil even for the low standards of most Nazis, instead of getting all sorts of amazing wunderwaffes powered by the souls of innocent civilians they murdered or some cool dark-sided SS abilities... He actually have the lowest chance of winning the Civil War, as a result of his evilness alienating almost everyone else.

And to add insult in injury, seeing as that after Heydrich's victory in the Civil War, the game will end within 2-3 years as a result of Himmler launching the nukes, you will not even be able to do most of those 'SUPER EVIL HYPERDEATH 666 2edgy4you!!!!' options that got hinted at in the focus tree. Heck, considering that Heydrich was said in the dev diary to have the longest post-Civil War recovery tree out of all the contenders, I am betting that he will not even be able to finish purging a single group of his opponents before the nukes fly and you get a game over. Meaning that the player will not even be able to 'enjoy' reading about all the mass graves being filled with students, bankers getting expropriated, militarist getting stripped of their ranks, or politicians getting rounded up and shot in front of their families.
 
And to add insult in injury, seeing as that after Heydrich's victory in the Civil War, the game will end within 2-3 years as a result of Himmler launching the nukes, you will not even be able to do most of those 'SUPER EVIL HYPERDEATH 666 2edgy4you!!!!' options that got hinted at in the focus tree. Heck, considering that Heydrich was said in the dev diary to have the longest post-Civil War recovery tree out of all the contenders, I am betting that he will not even be able to finish purging a single group of his opponents before the nukes fly and you get a game over. Meaning that the player will not even be able to 'enjoy' reading about all the mass graves being filled with students, bankers getting expropriated, militarist getting stripped of their ranks, or politicians getting rounded up and shot in front of their families.

I wonder how the slowy death of nazi Germany with Borman in the 1970s will be like, probably soul crushing like the 1980s in the Soviet Union =S
 

chankljp

Donor
You could get that by playing Goering's Reich.

Even then, compared to most video games with an evil path, these abilities that you unlock via taking the ‘Dark side’ option are not actually some OP steamrollers... But instead, they will be for the most part a bunch of money wasting POS that will not even work.
 

chankljp

Donor
I wonder how the slowy death of nazi Germany with Borman in the 1970s will be like, probably soul crushing like the 1980s in the Soviet Union =S

Seeing as that Borman have the option to go ‘diet-Speer’ by doing stuff like abolishing slavery (And just herd all the minorities into ghettos were they will be ‘guest workers’), I will be most curious to see what is the furthest that a conservative government under Borman can take things, and how long the Reich under him will be able to last.
 
Seeing as that Borman have the option to go ‘diet-Speer’ by doing stuff like abolishing slavery (And just herd all the minorities into ghettos were they will be ‘guest workers’), I will be most curious to see what is the furthest that a conservative government under Borman can take things, and how long the Reich under him will be able to last.

To be perfectly honest, thinking better I believe that the collapse of a Bormann Germany would be more like the collapse of salazarist portugal than the collapse of the soviet union

The soviet union economic collapse hardly would happen on a system like nazi germany, I believe it would be more like a massive gerentocracy, a lack of the support for the government on the youth and a aging leader that get's less and less capable of running, maybe Bormann is a figure like Marcello Caetano, different from Salazar who was a purist, Caetano was a technocrat and he rushed all the reforms he could (his government was nicknamed the Marcelline spring), but at the end the never ending war on the overseas, the regime support base getting more and more older, a complete rejection by the youth, meant that he couldn't continue and things collapsed

The difference from Portugal is that I believe that Bormann wouldn't collapse as Caetano, things would just continue, and continue, getting worse and worse, maybe he dies and it's replaced by a also aging nazi who is replaced by a second generation aging nazi, people begins to emigrate en masse to other countries on the process, there is this massive wave of public depression with the government, and the government still refuses to die
 

chankljp

Donor
The difference from Portugal is that I believe that Bormann wouldn't collapse as Caetano, things would just continue, and continue, getting worse and worse, maybe he dies and it's replaced by a also aging nazi who is replaced by a second generation aging nazi, people begins to emigrate en masse to other countries on the process, there is this massive wave of public depression with the government, and the government still refuses to die

Would the Nazis allow emigration to other countries? I can see them actively encouraging former slaves or 'hostile' ethnic groups to do so, in order to not have to deal with them anymore, but will that also apply to full blooded German citizens? I know that as of the mod's start date, there is a massive unemployment issue in Germany due to the economy, with lots of young people being NEETs, but if people, especially the few university educated professional start leaving, I imagine the Nazis will go full 'East Germany' on everyone.
 
 
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Would the Nazis allow emigration to other countries? I can see them actively encouraging former slaves or 'hostile' ethnic groups to do so, in order to not have to deal with them anymore, but will that also apply to full blooded German citizens? I know that as of the mod's start date, there is a massive unemployment issue in Germany due to the economy, with lots of young people being NEETs, but if people, especially the few university educated professional start leaving, I imagine the Nazis will go full 'East Germany' on everyone.

It would be like on the soviet union, there would be many rat lines to outside the block, since the system is very corrupt, while nazi officials would have massive swiss bank accounts and not care about enforcing their doctrine
 
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