Rumsfeldia: Fear and Loathing in the Decade of Tears

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bookmark95

Banned
So what's Johnnie Cochran up to?

I bet he's the LA District Attorney, who makes Spiro Agnew style proclamations during cross examinations: "If a crime has occurred, let justice be served."

My impression of Cochran is that he's a self-serving opportunist with no clear alignment. I think he could have been one of Rumsfeld's stooges at first, since he would have the power to lock up high profile people to enhance his own reputation. But as Rumsfeld showed his true colors, I bet he join the nascent California republic so he could be on the winning side

In the war crimes trials that would come after the post-Rumsfeldia turmoil, he could very well be the prosecutor. But again, all this would mostly be for personal gain rather than any real desire to do justice.
 
In the war crimes trials that would come after the post-Rumsfeldia turmoil, he could very well be the prosecutor. But again, all this would mostly be for personal gain rather than any real desire to do justice.

I doubt California would be able to get their hands on Rummy's minions.
 

bookmark95

Banned
I doubt California would be able to get their hands on Rummy's minions.

In post-Rumsfeldia, the surviving US states would all have grievances against Rummy and the CVs. They would probably pool all their resources to bring down this common foe.

In California, there are plenty of suspects to go after: surviving Liberty Legions (I don't know if they remained in the state after they seceded, or if McCloskey expelled them under the threat of arrest), TRW and Hughes Network subsidiaries, CV chapters, Republican loyalists, and defense contractors that produced faulty weapons.

Cochran, as a prosecutor against Rummy and Coe, has a lot to work with.
 
I wonder what our old friend Rush Limbaugh is doing. The last we heard of him, Limbaugh was managing a burger joint or something.
 

bookmark95

Banned
I wonder what our old friend Rush Limbaugh is doing. The last we heard of him, Limbaugh was managing a burger joint or something.

In 84, a sign on the lawn in his house in Missouri would have read "Rumsfeld 84!". At this point, he's probably set that sign on fire.
 
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I am rather curious to know how world economics are managed at this point in time. Naturally the "Nixon Shocks" ended the fixed-exchange rates that were the hallmark of Bretton Woods in 1971, which was before the POD. However, since the neoliberal revolution was restricted to one state that went mad under a deranged leader, this means that the Uruguay Accords of OTL that laid the foundations of the World Trade Organization (WTO) and encouraged all nations to return to a pre-1930s way of doing things would never occur. Instead, I wonder of there has been a reform and expansion of Comecon (the Soviet-run equivalent to Bretton Woods) to fill the void at the centre of world economics that the US once held under Bretton Woods.
 
Tell me what you think.

Meanwhile,

Near Another Watering Hole Far Far Away...

London, United Kingdom, March 1988

Sheridan gave a distressing grunt as he trod knee-deep into a puddle on his way back from campus. They weren't his best trousers but it would now be a source of great discomfort for the next half hour or so until he arrived home.

Fortunately, the umbrella kept the rest of his person safe from the ongoing downpour. But then again, England would not be England without a little rain...or a lot of rain. At least it was something about national character that could never be changed he thought.

Naturally, pretty much all of the possible chat over the past couple months was about America. As an ambitious young university student, it was impossible to avoid meeting at least one of the "Lost Generation" of American expatriates. He recalled a government figure last December estimating that the current number of expatriateswas now about 1.6 million in Britain alone! He was close friends with eleven Americans, had met at least a hundred and was even lucky enough to attend a speech by the legendary German-born diplomat Henry Kissinger! For the rest of his life, he would recall how the speaking location was switched to Stamford Bridge Stadium at the last minute because the backlog of ticket purchasers was so huge. "Extraordinary...," he thought, "...that the world today is one where people show up in such hordes to admire the words of Henry Kissinger. It's not like he's a Beatle or something!"

But that was the state of the world today. The early-1980s stereotype of the "Lost Generation" consisted of eccentric bohemian types, the likenesses of whom fled the Vietnam draft in the 1960s and 1970s. Such grotesque caricatures used to decorate newspaper comics and late-night telly programmes like graffiti in Birmingham. Reality soon undermined this image as most of those that wereseen getting of the jet airliners at Heathrow from across the Atlantic tended to thrifty, tie-sporting toffs whose brains made them unwelcome in the Land of Stars and Stripes! Quite a few of those who Sheridan met even came fromtraditionally Republican family backgrounds. However, recent effects had convinced them to defect from not only their party but their country. It made sense he supposed as it was mostly only the "bourgeoisie" gents who could affordtickets for both them and their families. Poor folks who could no longer stand life in Rumsfeldia could only sneak across the borders of Canada, Mexico, or the now-independent California state. Many of those Americans who arrived in Britain had relatives. Former war-brides who once flocked across the Atlantic for love and a new life of prosperity and freedom now returned home with their families for pretty much the same reasons. To think that barely under a couple generations ago, America was the place to be and Europe was the place you wanted to get the hell away from.

He continued to stroll down the crowded and misty streets of old London town. These days, even the more respectable districts were patrolled by gangs of punks with their rough, hooliganishclothes and bizarre, tacky hairstyles.In this land of confusion, withdrawal into a realm of drugs, debauchery, and heavy rock was one escape, Sheridan supposed.In spite of petrol shortages, the roads were congested with traffic. Pedestrians had to yield constant caution with the ever-present threat ofgetting run over by a bicycle.

"If only those incompetent bureaucrats in Whitehall would install wider bicycle lanes..., " he thought, "...Well, at least those pipelines from the heart of Asia will start flowing any day now. "

As today was a Friday, the schoolchildren ran home even more gleefully than normal. It almost made him sad to think of the dark world into which these youngsters were being raised. Since Sheridan was born,five major regions of the world had descended into chaos and uncertainly and it looked like there would now be a sixth, America no less! Yet, they skipped and ran down the streets in their uniforms as carefree as sparrows. Well, perhaps not so carefree. It had become popular among parents to deter children's distaste for school but telling them stories of how they should consider themselves lucky as in America, only rich boys and girls could go to school. Ordinary children lived in poverty and were forced to sweep chimneys for little reward and little hope.

President Donald Rumsfeld had become the boogeyman for adults even more than children but a couple months ago, people across the world turned on their televisions to hear that Rumsfeld had been removed in an apparently bloodless coup. It seemed surreal how quietly he was removed.

Normally Sheridan would take the bus but the conductors were on strike, yet again.

On his way home, he came across the Blue Spyglass, a favourite pub of he and his fellow students. It was dimly lit but this was for the creation ofa serene atmosphere rather than strikes by electrical workers!Much to Sheridan's delight, his good friend Quentin was already seated at one of the tables.

After standard greetings, Sheridan took a seat at Quentin's table. They began to chat about their standard areas of interest. Quentin was always a whiz with keeping track of the newest machine or fad on the market. The Japanese were particularly prominent in his conversations. Sheridan meanwhile lookedat the state of architecture and town planning. After almost thirty years of those god-awful drab edifices of pure concrete, Sheridan felt it was too easy to start a revolution in British architectural aesthetics!

They momentarily paused to look at the horde of people gathered around the telly. In Sheridan's distant memory, the televisions in public houses seemed to be showing nothing but football games and horseracing. However, because of recent events across the pond, the only thing anyone seemed anxious to see on their way home from work was the news. The situation in America was somewhat shady but from what investigators could make out, militias of all flavours were raising all sorts of havoc across that once great nation. One particularly prominent group were those forces loyal to the religious zealots who already held great power in Washington.

"If you ask me, America may have its own Oliver Cromwell pretty soon, " Quentin remarked.

The implication from Quentin's comment that the USA was about to be thrown into civil war by the ambitions of its own roundheads who now controlled its parliament was chillingly apparent to Sheridan.

"Indeed, " he replied reluctantly. "What do you suppose really happened to ol' Rummy?"

" If you believe last night's Spitting Image show, he has been imprisoned in a giant hamster cage!"

The two men let out a few brief chuckles.

Sheridan thought he would try to change the subject to something slightly lighter, "Do you know that the buses are on strike again?"

"Yes...and the underground and the cabbies. You know the trouble with these unions is that their best chum is good ol' Rummy. If Whitehall puts any pressure at all on 'em, Scargill screams that Britain is on the 'Road to Rumsfeldism '."

It was too hard nowadays to completely avoid the subject so Sheridan figured he might as well go along, "Yes but the way that Tories talk nowadays, I can understand the concerns of even a Marxist loon like him."

"Careful now, Sheridan. Why do think the British government is importing so many Soviet goods? It is in those Marxists' pockets. "

Quentin came from a family that traditionally supported the Tories but the recent ascent of figures who flirted with Rumsfeldism had driven his preferences to the Liberals. Sheridan by contrast was never politically-minded. Such sensitive subjects made him uncomfortable. Describing the boringness of concrete tower blocks was a more comforting subject. It could never flame tempers the way that politics could!
 

bookmark95

Banned
Tell me what you think.

Meanwhile,

Near Another Watering Hole Far Far Away...

London, United Kingdom, March 1988

Sheridan gave a distressing grunt as he trod knee-deep into a puddle on his way back from campus. They weren't his best trousers but it would now be a source of great discomfort for the next half hour or so until he arrived home.

Fortunately, the umbrella kept the rest of his person safe from the ongoing downpour. But then again, England would not be England without a little rain...or a lot of rain. At least it was something about national character that could never be changed he thought.

Naturally, pretty much all of the possible chat over the past couple months was about America. As an ambitious young university student, it was impossible to avoid meeting at least one of the "Lost Generation" of American expatriates. He recalled a government figure last December estimating that the current number of expatriateswas now about 1.6 million in Britain alone! He was close friends with eleven Americans, had met at least a hundred and was even lucky enough to attend a speech by the legendary German-born diplomat Henry Kissinger! For the rest of his life, he would recall how the speaking location was switched to Stamford Bridge Stadium at the last minute because the backlog of ticket purchasers was so huge. "Extraordinary...," he thought, "...that the world today is one where people show up in such hordes to admire the words of Henry Kissinger. It's not like he's a Beatle or something!"

But that was the state of the world today. The early-1980s stereotype of the "Lost Generation" consisted of eccentric bohemian types, the likenesses of whom fled the Vietnam draft in the 1960s and 1970s. Such grotesque caricatures used to decorate newspaper comics and late-night telly programmes like graffiti in Birmingham. Reality soon undermined this image as most of those that wereseen getting of the jet airliners at Heathrow from across the Atlantic tended to thrifty, tie-sporting toffs whose brains made them unwelcome in the Land of Stars and Stripes! Quite a few of those who Sheridan met even came fromtraditionally Republican family backgrounds. However, recent effects had convinced them to defect from not only their party but their country. It made sense he supposed as it was mostly only the "bourgeoisie" gents who could affordtickets for both them and their families. Poor folks who could no longer stand life in Rumsfeldia could only sneak across the borders of Canada, Mexico, or the now-independent California state. Many of those Americans who arrived in Britain had relatives. Former war-brides who once flocked across the Atlantic for love and a new life of prosperity and freedom now returned home with their families for pretty much the same reasons. To think that barely under a couple generations ago, America was the place to be and Europe was the place you wanted to get the hell away from.

He continued to stroll down the crowded and misty streets of old London town. These days, even the more respectable districts were patrolled by gangs of punks with their rough, hooliganishclothes and bizarre, tacky hairstyles.In this land of confusion, withdrawal into a realm of drugs, debauchery, and heavy rock was one escape, Sheridan supposed.In spite of petrol shortages, the roads were congested with traffic. Pedestrians had to yield constant caution with the ever-present threat ofgetting run over by a bicycle.

"If only those incompetent bureaucrats in Whitehall would install wider bicycle lanes..., " he thought, "...Well, at least those pipelines from the heart of Asia will start flowing any day now. "

As today was a Friday, the schoolchildren ran home even more gleefully than normal. It almost made him sad to think of the dark world into which these youngsters were being raised. Since Sheridan was born,five major regions of the world had descended into chaos and uncertainly and it looked like there would now be a sixth, America no less! Yet, they skipped and ran down the streets in their uniforms as carefree as sparrows. Well, perhaps not so carefree. It had become popular among parents to deter children's distaste for school but telling them stories of how they should consider themselves lucky as in America, only rich boys and girls could go to school. Ordinary children lived in poverty and were forced to sweep chimneys for little reward and little hope.

President Donald Rumsfeld had become the boogeyman for adults even more than children but a couple months ago, people across the world turned on their televisions to hear that Rumsfeld had been removed in an apparently bloodless coup. It seemed surreal how quietly he was removed.

Normally Sheridan would take the bus but the conductors were on strike, yet again.

On his way home, he came across the Blue Spyglass, a favourite pub of he and his fellow students. It was dimly lit but this was for the creation ofa serene atmosphere rather than strikes by electrical workers!Much to Sheridan's delight, his good friend Quentin was already seated at one of the tables.

After standard greetings, Sheridan took a seat at Quentin's table. They began to chat about their standard areas of interest. Quentin was always a whiz with keeping track of the newest machine or fad on the market. The Japanese were particularly prominent in his conversations. Sheridan meanwhile lookedat the state of architecture and town planning. After almost thirty years of those god-awful drab edifices of pure concrete, Sheridan felt it was too easy to start a revolution in British architectural aesthetics!

They momentarily paused to look at the horde of people gathered around the telly. In Sheridan's distant memory, the televisions in public houses seemed to be showing nothing but football games and horseracing. However, because of recent events across the pond, the only thing anyone seemed anxious to see on their way home from work was the news. The situation in America was somewhat shady but from what investigators could make out, militias of all flavours were raising all sorts of havoc across that once great nation. One particularly prominent group were those forces loyal to the religious zealots who already held great power in Washington.

"If you ask me, America may have its own Oliver Cromwell pretty soon, " Quentin remarked.

The implication from Quentin's comment that the USA was about to be thrown into civil war by the ambitions of its own roundheads who now controlled its parliament was chillingly apparent to Sheridan.

"Indeed, " he replied reluctantly. "What do you suppose really happened to ol' Rummy?"

" If you believe last night's Spitting Image show, he has been imprisoned in a giant hamster cage!"

The two men let out a few brief chuckles.

Sheridan thought he would try to change the subject to something slightly lighter, "Do you know that the buses are on strike again?"

"Yes...and the underground and the cabbies. You know the trouble with these unions is that their best chum is good ol' Rummy. If Whitehall puts any pressure at all on 'em, Scargill screams that Britain is on the 'Road to Rumsfeldism '."

It was too hard nowadays to completely avoid the subject so Sheridan figured he might as well go along, "Yes but the way that Tories talk nowadays, I can understand the concerns of even a Marxist loon like him."

"Careful now, Sheridan. Why do think the British government is importing so many Soviet goods? It is in those Marxists' pockets. "

Quentin came from a family that traditionally supported the Tories but the recent ascent of figures who flirted with Rumsfeldism had driven his preferences to the Liberals. Sheridan by contrast was never politically-minded. Such sensitive subjects made him uncomfortable. Describing the boringness of concrete tower blocks was a more comforting subject. It could never flame tempers the way that politics could!

This is pretty interesting. I think you really captured the mood of England in 1988: an American exile scene, England and Russia more or less developing a working relationship, and a revival of liberalism across England.

I love your portrayal of "Spitting Image" Rumsfeld (although even if Rumsfeld didn't lose his mind, I still think that would be his portrayal). I laughed at the idea of him being "put in a hamster cage". :D The new British-Soviet relations also could make good material. I bet there would be a lot of hilarious interaction between a puppet Kinnock and a puppet Ryzkhov.

You mentioned people fleeing to independent California. That's interesting for a couple of reasons: It the 1930s all over again, only with "yuppies" instead of "Okies". :D It also means that while the Southeast and the Midwest are tanking, California might be prospering under Pete McCloskey. Would California prosper in this environment?
 
Would California prosper in this environment?


I think that all depends how stable California remains. If they manage to whether the coming storm without too much violence, I think they could easily prosper. Or at least, fare far better then the rest of the country, if only by being one of the few stable islands in a sea of chaos.
 
According to some sources, "Dubya" now blames Cheney for making a mess out of his Presidency, and Bush 41 has the same opinion. Both Bush41 and Gerald Ford are reported to have been surprised and disappointed by the Vice Presidential Cheney, who they saw as different from the man they knew when they were in the White House.

As far as I can tell, Rumsfeld was always that way (Nixon thought he was an SOB). It was one of the reasons that the Reagan people didn't want him holding any official position.

I haven't read it myself---I really should--but theres a "write it when I'm Gone" book Ford put out where he in essense says the Iraq War ws/is the greatest Foreign Policy mistake in 30 years:cool::eek:

Also, as crazy as it is, I still very much enjoy/ed this TL. I'm weird like that :)
 
I'm a long time lurker and first time poster and I want to chime in that I too loved this timeline.

Unlike all the lefties here, however, I actually considered it a utopia until around 1986 or so. I really wish I could be transported into this timeline around 1982 or so. It would be pure heaven living in an America untainted by the evils of socialism. I was only a toddler when the story takes place but if I were in my late teens or early twenties, I could see myself leading a Liberty Battalion.

That said, I want to salute Drew for imagining such a wonderful world (at least until the CV's take over)...
 
I'm a long time lurker and first time poster and I want to chime in that I too loved this timeline.

Unlike all the lefties here, however, I actually considered it a utopia until around 1986 or so. I really wish I could be transported into this timeline around 1982 or so. It would be pure heaven living in an America untainted by the evils of socialism. I was only a toddler when the story takes place but if I were in my late teens or early twenties, I could see myself leading a Liberty Battalion.

That said, I want to salute Drew for imagining such a wonderful world (at least until the CV's take over)...

If Rummy's America ia your idea of a utopia, then I'd really hate to see your idea of a dystopia.
 

Deleted member 87099

I'm a long time lurker and first time poster and I want to chime in that I too loved this timeline.

Unlike all the lefties here, however, I actually considered it a utopia until around 1986 or so. I really wish I could be transported into this timeline around 1982 or so. It would be pure heaven living in an America untainted by the evils of socialism. I was only a toddler when the story takes place but if I were in my late teens or early twenties, I could see myself leading a Liberty Battalion.

That said, I want to salute Drew for imagining such a wonderful world (at least until the CV's take over)...

Welcome to the board!

But, what is so appealing to you about Rumsfeld America?
 
I'm a long time lurker and first time poster and I want to chime in that I too loved this timeline.

Unlike all the lefties here, however, I actually considered it a utopia until around 1986 or so. I really wish I could be transported into this timeline around 1982 or so. It would be pure heaven living in an America untainted by the evils of socialism. I was only a toddler when the story takes place but if I were in my late teens or early twenties, I could see myself leading a Liberty Battalion.

That said, I want to salute Drew for imagining such a wonderful world (at least until the CV's take over)...

I certainly wouldn't call myself a lefty. If you look at my imaginative speculation on London of TTL 1988 on the last page, you may observed this. My purpose in creating it was to illustrate a couple things. Firstly, it was inspired by Drew's depressing "It's Not a Wonderful Life" update on life in TTL New York State around this time. What I liked about it is how it showed the close-up view of the "Man on the Street" rather than the big picture that virtually no individual in reality can be fully aware of. Secondly, I wanted to show that life in the left-wing countries of Western Europe would certainly be no paradise. Note how I implied or explicitly stated in my post that a Britain where the New Right (under Thatcher) never took power is burdened by frequent strike waves (the "British disease" as it was called in the 1970s), bureaucratic inefficiencies, and a growing popular perception that increased economic dependency on the USSR is gradually making the UK a Soviet satellite. I also noted a popular perception of the OTL 1970s that the unions really controlled the government. I also of course noted those awful architectural projects in Britain that were ugly enough to make Ceausescu comfortable!:D
 
I certainly wouldn't call myself a lefty. If you look at my imaginative speculation on London of TTL 1988 on the last page, you may observed this. My purpose in creating it was to illustrate a couple things. Firstly, it was inspired by Drew's depressing "It's Not a Wonderful Life" update on life in TTL New York State around this time. What I liked about it is how it showed the close-up view of the "Man on the Street" rather than the big picture that virtually no individual in reality can be fully aware of. Secondly, I wanted to show that life in the left-wing countries of Western Europe would certainly be no paradise. Note how I implied or explicitly stated in my post that a Britain where the New Right (under Thatcher) never took power is burdened by frequent strike waves (the "British disease" as it was called in the 1970s), bureaucratic inefficiencies, and a growing popular perception that increased economic dependency on the USSR is gradually making the UK a Soviet satellite. I also noted a popular perception of the OTL 1970s that the unions really controlled the government. I also of course noted those awful architectural projects in Britain that were ugly enough to make Ceausescu comfortable!:D


Well, one can consider that Western Europe is a paradise compared to the rest of this world (excluding Japan and a couple of other nations) and IMHO it's just that perception.
Europe will have taken back the lead on tecnological and cultural business due to what happened in the US and the american diaspora and left-wing or not they have remained liberal democracies as we intented today (even the OTL PCI was totally onboard regarding democracy and capitalist...except the usual hardliners and Berlinguer and successor will have dealt with them).
Hell more than a million and an half of americans only in the UK will create some huge change in the society and frankly a sense of renowal and grow can be played by some smart leader.

Being a Soviet Satellite it's relative; probably many Russian will think that they are becoming Europe sweatshop and resources bank and that's their money that really give order in the Kremlin.
Frankly many politicians and not in Western Europe will fear this and will probably work for a closer and integrated European community so to stand up to the URSS

Strike wawes and burocratic inefficiens are old problem of every goverment and you arrive to a point when this wild strike backfire and the general population had enough and will not support you anymore accusation of Rumsfield-like politcs or not.

Life will be perfect? Hell no. The european empires will return? Not without a time machine, Europe will be, due to necessity, more aggressive and present in the various world crisis and this mean influence.

In general Western Europe will see what happened in China, Brasil, India, South Africa and the USA and will say: Sorry, this century will have already paid our due in term of extremism and ideological nonsense
 
Welcome to the board!

But, what is so appealing to you about Rumsfeld America?

Speaking as a businessman, I love how the engine of the free market has been unshackled to an extant that even Reagan (decent as his policies were) didn't dare to go. To be fair, that might have only been because the political realities in OTL didn't permit him to.

I find it maddening that people want businesses to serve as some kind of glorified charities. We go into business to make money not to serve as a health care provider to employees. It is bad enough I have to pay my janitors (sorry... "custodians":rolleyes:) $7.25 an hour when they don't deserve more that $5 AT MOST and now Obamacare is forcing me to give the moochers health care too! Now, the Democrat Party wants me to pay them to stay home when they're sick too?! It grinds my gears!

I am dismayed that even the so-called "right wing" Republicans won't really push back hard on the creeping socialism in this country. For example, none of the Republicans would take a brave stand and advocate for at least reducing the minimum wage. The best they have to offer is holding the line. Except for Ted Cruz (which I wholeheartedly support), the message seems to be "this far and no further".

Take Obamacare for example. Healthcare is not a right. Granted, in certain cases, lack of health care will lead to death. That doesn't give the government the right to force ME to pay more in taxes in order to take care of someone who I don't even know! The problem is that Republicans basically surrendered the argument when they helped liberals like Ted Kennedy pass EMTALA and SCHIP.

Another thing I love about Rumsfeldia is how the unions were crushed to an extent that Thatcher could only dream of. Unions really seek to make job creators like myself and my friends into virtual slaves of their employees! Those janitors I were telling you about earlier? They aren't content with getting $7.25 ah hour! No, those greedy bastards want to get paid $10.50 an hour now. Why don't these lazy bums just get another job instead? One of my golf buddies owns a clothing company. His workers in Bangladesh work 14 or 16 hours a day and make less than $20 week and they are happy and always smiling when he visits
Chittagong to inspect his factory there! Why are American workers so damn greedy and lazy? They should feel lucky just to have a job!

I really love your timeline. It is a glimpse into a golden age that never was. I do disagree with how the story went towards the end but I won't let that sour me to the overall greatness of this timeline. :)
 
One thing I will concede however, is that Rummy went a LITTLE too far with privatization when he privatized parts of the military and supported privatizing the State a Department. I do think diplomacy and the military are worth finding as they provide the muscle for free market capitalism over socialism in all its insidious forms. I do think there is a role for private military contractors though...
 
Speaking as a businessman, I love how the engine of the free market has been unshackled to an extant that even Reagan (decent as his policies were) didn't dare to go. To be fair, that might have only been because the political realities in OTL didn't permit him to.

I find it maddening that people want businesses to serve as some kind of glorified charities. We go into business to make money not to serve as a health care provider to employees. It is bad enough I have to pay my janitors (sorry... "custodians":rolleyes:) $7.25 an hour when they don't deserve more that $5 AT MOST and now Obamacare is forcing me to give the moochers health care too! Now, the Democrat Party wants me to pay them to stay home when they're sick too?! It grinds my gears!

I am dismayed that even the so-called "right wing" Republicans won't really push back hard on the creeping socialism in this country. For example, none of the Republicans would take a brave stand and advocate for at least reducing the minimum wage. The best they have to offer is holding the line. Except for Ted Cruz (which I wholeheartedly support), the message seems to be "this far and no further".

Take Obamacare for example. Healthcare is not a right. Granted, in certain cases, lack of health care will lead to death. That doesn't give the government the right to force ME to pay more in taxes in order to take care of someone who I don't even know! The problem is that Republicans basically surrendered the argument when they helped liberals like Ted Kennedy pass EMTALA and SCHIP.

Another thing I love about Rumsfeldia is how the unions were crushed to an extent that Thatcher could only dream of. Unions really seek to make job creators like myself and my friends into virtual slaves of their employees! Those janitors I were telling you about earlier? They aren't content with getting $7.25 ah hour! No, those greedy bastards want to get paid $10.50 an hour now. Why don't these lazy bums just get another job instead? One of my golf buddies owns a clothing company. His workers in Bangladesh work 14 or 16 hours a day and make less than $20 week and they are happy and always smiling when he visits
Chittagong to inspect his factory there! Why are American workers so damn greedy and lazy? They should feel lucky just to have a job!

I really love your timeline. It is a glimpse into a golden age that never was. I do disagree with how the story went towards the end but I won't let that sour me to the overall greatness of this timeline. :)

Everything you said is disgusting.:mad:

1- social democracy, because that's what the American welfare state ultimately was, is not and never will be socialism. Maybe you should educate yourself in what socialism is and you will be surprised.

2-yours workers are moochers? You mean the guys that actually produce the wealth of whatever business you work in? Don't make me laugh. And failed CEOs who get paid millions for being fired, what are they? I tell you, they're not entrepreneurs. Those CEOs are the real moochers.

3-healthcare is not a right? What. the. fuck? People have the right to be unburdened by illness, because without health there's no life. But under your (lack of) logic I could say that private property is not right and that society should not feel obligated to protect your assets from theft. Not only that, you should be grateful for being allowed the entitlement of private property.

4-what you said about the smilling workers is so creepy, I just want to hurl the worst insults at you but I will restrain myself.
 
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manav95

Banned
Speaking as a businessman, I love how the engine of the free market has been unshackled to an extant that even Reagan (decent as his policies were) didn't dare to go. To be fair, that might have only been because the political realities in OTL didn't permit him to.

I find it maddening that people want businesses to serve as some kind of glorified charities. We go into business to make money not to serve as a health care provider to employees. It is bad enough I have to pay my janitors (sorry... "custodians":rolleyes:) $7.25 an hour when they don't deserve more that $5 AT MOST and now Obamacare is forcing me to give the moochers health care too! Now, the Democrat Party wants me to pay them to stay home when they're sick too?! It grinds my gears!

I am dismayed that even the so-called "right wing" Republicans won't really push back hard on the creeping socialism in this country. For example, none of the Republicans would take a brave stand and advocate for at least reducing the minimum wage. The best they have to offer is holding the line. Except for Ted Cruz (which I wholeheartedly support), the message seems to be "this far and no further".

Take Obamacare for example. Healthcare is not a right. Granted, in certain cases, lack of health care will lead to death. That doesn't give the government the right to force ME to pay more in taxes in order to take care of someone who I don't even know! The problem is that Republicans basically surrendered the argument when they helped liberals like Ted Kennedy pass EMTALA and SCHIP.

Another thing I love about Rumsfeldia is how the unions were crushed to an extent that Thatcher could only dream of. Unions really seek to make job creators like myself and my friends into virtual slaves of their employees! Those janitors I were telling you about earlier? They aren't content with getting $7.25 ah hour! No, those greedy bastards want to get paid $10.50 an hour now. Why don't these lazy bums just get another job instead? One of my golf buddies owns a clothing company. His workers in Bangladesh work 14 or 16 hours a day and make less than $20 week and they are happy and always smiling when he visits
Chittagong to inspect his factory there! Why are American workers so damn greedy and lazy? They should feel lucky just to have a job!

I really love your timeline. It is a glimpse into a golden age that never was. I do disagree with how the story went towards the end but I won't let that sour me to the overall greatness of this timeline. :)

Wait are you actually serious about these beliefs? I've never heard someone as conservative as you are before. Although judging by your support of Ted Cruz, I shouldn't be surprised.

Its gonna be interesting having you on board here. Especially since most people here are proud leftists and socialists; sometimes I feel like I'm a conservative here.
 
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