Moonlight in a Jar: An Al-Andalus Timeline
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- al-andalus cordoba timeline
Great chapter, just what if when the Bataids are weak a clan named Osman take power and start either a policy of peace ,Reconciliation and industrialization or be like the Ottoman Empire otl expansionist power
I didn't expect the chapter to be released so quickly! This chapter was definitely unpredictable to me at least, but no less engaging.
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(Sidenote: Has this actually happened in OTL under the Ottomans when it came to the Shia?)
Another thing to think about is that this will probably at least hamper trade in the Mediterranean between the two powers, as merchants might be afraid to head towards the Eastern Med lest they be taxed to death simply for being the wrong Muslim, even if they're not going on the Hajj. The shift of pilgrims towards the Sudan route could also prove fruitful towards the expansion of shipbuilding across Western Islam, since places like Ubinu, NiKongo or the Simala Emirate might be incentivized towards providing more ships for pilgrims and merchants trying to make their way across Africa.
I thought that it would take some pretty major battle like the Bataids marching on Rome against a combined Christian-Muslim alliance before the Bataids would call the people of Western Islam apostates, but this happened far earlier, albeit justified since the Asmarids have now allied with a Christian power against the faithful. While the schism has already been pretty divided ever since that fatwa a century back or so, the war probably serves as the breaking point between any semblance of unity or peace between the Umayyads and the Abbasids.
There's definitely no point of return, and we can definitely see some more inter-Caliphal wars happening between the Asmarids and the Bataids happening soon. Perhaps even this rift will affect the common Muslim, with Western Muslims attacking Arabs, Persians, or Romans for being heretics against the true Umayyad Caliphs and vice versa.
Now that I think about it, the Abbasid Revolution itself is probably viewed extremely negatively by Western Sunni, whereas the Eastern Sunni view it as a justified revolution in order to end the discrimination and racism that the Umayyads practiced over their non-Arab Muslim subjects. Historiography of Muslim history in this timeline is definitely going to be more complicated indeed with the presence of both Caliphs.
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This was probably inevitable given the friction between the two Islamic juggernauts and the Bataids' control over the two holiest cities, but I wonder if this will give the Bataids pretext to actually begin enforcing their rule over the Hejaz once they hear of the Hashemite's lack of enforcement over the Nifaq Tax.
(Sidenote: Has this actually happened in OTL under the Ottomans when it came to the Shia?)
Another thing to think about is that this will probably at least hamper trade in the Mediterranean between the two powers, as merchants might be afraid to head towards the Eastern Med lest they be taxed to death simply for being the wrong Muslim, even if they're not going on the Hajj. The shift of pilgrims towards the Sudan route could also prove fruitful towards the expansion of shipbuilding across Western Islam, since places like Ubinu, NiKongo or the Simala Emirate might be incentivized towards providing more ships for pilgrims and merchants trying to make their way across Africa.
I definitely think Iskender's move to try to bring Meridiana under Bataid control without taking over Egypt first will probably bite him in the long run. While I don't think it will be ruinous to the Roman Empire, Egypt was definitely a vital trade link and is now a hostile power allied to the Asmarids. Any future conflict between them and a Bayadhid-Asmarid alliance will become extremely messy to say the least, even if the Romans win out over the Andalusi-Maghrebi.
I thought a HRE-Asmarid alliance would be more likely but both Guilhem and Al-Nasr were very smart to ally each other at this current time, as both have a shared interest in stopping the Bataids from taking over Meridiana, which could severely clamp down on Western trade to the East. This is also the first Muslim-Christian alliance between two major powers, not unlike the OTL Franco-Ottoman alliance, but this time, they actually fought together against their common enemy. I expect this sort of interfaith partnership to continue over the centuries as geopolitics will probably take precedence over the differences in faith, especially with Western Islam and Christianity, even if this alliance will not last the Meridiana War.
The Battle of Santa Maria di Leuca definitely sounds like a proto-Lepanto to me, hahahaha. I don't think that Mediterranean naval combat will change drastically after the battle, as Andalusi safinas are probably far weaker than the Spanish galleon in terms of pure firepower, so it won't mark a drastic shift away from galleys and infantry combat. Although the use of blackpowder in this naval battle will be a portent as to what's to come in this age of Sail and Steam.
I thought that it would take some pretty major battle like the Bataids marching on Rome against a combined Christian-Muslim alliance before the Bataids would call the people of Western Islam apostates, but this happened far earlier, albeit justified since the Asmarids have now allied with a Christian power against the faithful. While the schism has already been pretty divided ever since that fatwa a century back or so, the war probably serves as the breaking point between any semblance of unity or peace between the Umayyads and the Abbasids.
There's definitely no point of return, and we can definitely see some more inter-Caliphal wars happening between the Asmarids and the Bataids happening soon. Perhaps even this rift will affect the common Muslim, with Western Muslims attacking Arabs, Persians, or Romans for being heretics against the true Umayyad Caliphs and vice versa.
Now that I think about it, the Abbasid Revolution itself is probably viewed extremely negatively by Western Sunni, whereas the Eastern Sunni view it as a justified revolution in order to end the discrimination and racism that the Umayyads practiced over their non-Arab Muslim subjects. Historiography of Muslim history in this timeline is definitely going to be more complicated indeed with the presence of both Caliphs.
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oh okay *cries in the corner*I don't think so
Hope we can maybe get some peace for a while tho
This is the typical, The Enemy of my enemy..is the Enemy of my Enemy, no more or less.oh okay *cries in the corner*
Hope we can maybe get some peace for a while tho
While both asmarids and bataids hate each other i think neither really want each other to to collapse so their wars will never be total wars, asmarids will not like tye HRE taking the balkans as Constantinople will be in threat while bataids don't want hispania to fall to christians. So the alliances makes sense allying with a major Christian power os unlikely as neither wish to see the other fall to them. Honestly i would like to see the bataids win.
Im suprised andalusia doesn't see france as the natural allies due to romania having a strong army. Also bataid propaganda will have field day persia and india learning of the Christian alliance will see the bataids as the right side.
Im suprised andalusia doesn't see france as the natural allies due to romania having a strong army. Also bataid propaganda will have field day persia and india learning of the Christian alliance will see the bataids as the right side.
Neither really have the power to take down each other anyways due to the huge distance between them and the difficulty in actually conquering both of their huge empires, especially in the pre-Industrial era. I also doubt that the core of Al-Andalus and Rhomania will be under threat either since Islam is so entrenched in both regions, unlike in OTL. They're both essentially Muslim regions in Europe, similar to how Greece or Spain are ostensibly Christian.
The reason why France and Andalus haven't allied yet is because France is not involved in the conflict and it is within both Romania and Andalus's interests to contain the Bataid threat in Meridiana. I assume once relations sour between them again, the Asmarids will probably look towards the HRE or France as new allies since the diplomatic barrier between Muslim and Christian nations is weakening.
As for India and Persia, I definitely agree that they'll probably remain with the Abbasids since Persians/Persianate people were influential in elevating the Abbasids to the Caliphate in the first place and the alignment of the Umayyads towards the infidels would be good enough reason for them to stay, even though they hate the Romans. As for other nations like Kilwa or Warsheikh, I think they'll change allegiance because friendly relations with the Umayyads will bring in more trade from Western Muslim nations which probably provides more goods than the old Arab trade. If Aceh removes itself from the Chinese yoke, most likely with Andalusi help, then they could also change to the Umayyads.
Ok I've just refreshed my memory of OTL what was happening in the HRE reform wise, as this is the period where it achieved the form it would essentially keep til Napoleon. I think the HRE merits some discussion because more than any other state in Europe, the HRE does its own thing and comes up with unique solutions, and how it reacts to it's changed situation could be cool to theorise about.
First of all, reform proposals had been circulating since the 1440s, with the desire to reach a wider audience reflected in the fact they're in german- now that Italy's part of the empire, does Latin remain a or more competitive option? That could weaken the German linguistic community and perhaps allow the development of multiple literary standards into separate languages. Or do most negotiations still happen in german, because that could mean that the representative assemblies are different in the different kingdoms and not for the entire empire as otl. Also in the imperial arelat, do they use Franco-provencal as their language or is the elite more germanized?
Now onto the actual reforms. First of all you've got the eternal public peace- all estates swear to combine against any estate that uses violence to resolve conflicts with another estate. This solidified the empires status hierarchy and fixed mediate vassals as assistants to the immediate vassals. I don't see why this wouldn't happen eventually, but depending on when it happens, things could solidify in different ways.
The reichskammergericht and reichshofrat were both courts that emerged during this period, the reichskammergericht to adjudicate between estates and their subjects and the reichshofrat for the emperors prerogatives. With Italy and even burgundy as part of the empire, do they each get their own reichskammergericht equivalent or are they all under the same one?
On a similar vein, are kreise associations present in Italy, where otl the states tended to be larger than in Germany and so more able to sort things out on their own without needing institutions for regional cooperation? Bohemia was excluded from the kreise otl, but the Netherlands were included, so I'm not sure how the old arelat would be treated?
Another super important thing- Money. Up until this point otl, there hadn't really been any major institutional changes in tax collection since the Carolingians. I'm assuming here that in MiaJ, the Empire underwent similar trends to otl of emperors selling off and pawning imperial territory (land belonging to the emperor by right of being elected emperor) and focusing on adding to their own hereditary territory, so that a smaller pool of families have the resources to submit a candidate for the crown. It was quickly agreed otl that it would be impossible to revive the old imperial territory, and instead each estate should submit a portion of its cash revenue to the empire. Ittl, what with the Geroldsecks riding roughshod all over the imperial church in Strasbourg, and the papacy being thrashed, is there a chance they decide that the imperial lands can be revived, just take land from the imperial church? In that case, you might return to the situation where any middling count thinks they might have a shot at being emperor because when he's emperor he'll have all the funds he needs to reward supporters, instead of as otl where being emperor was an expensive business that only the richest dynasties could afford (Luxemburg and Habsburgs and later just the Habsburgs).
At first otl, they went for the Common Penny tax, which was just you know a standard tax on estates based on your income. This proved difficult because not enough estates had actual registers recording their income, and more than that they didnt want that knowledge to become public information- especially free cities were concerned that if neighbouring princes really knew how rich they were then they'd take away their immediacy. If there are fewer imperial free cities as Swabia still exists, maybe the common penny has more of a shot? Or would alternate free cities in the Arelat and Austria replace those lost in Swabia?
Otl In order to conceal their wealth, the matricular system was agreed- each estate has to provide a fixed quota of cash based on the status of their estate. Thus all electors pay the same whatever their income, all prince bishops are basically the same etc. Side note, do we even still have electors here? We haven't heard anything from them since the 11th century, I'd be interested to know who they are now that presumably their number has become more or less fixed. Are there any Burgundian electors or are they all from the kingdom of Germany?
Otl the electors tried to exclude all other estates from having representation at meetings with the monarch, so if there are enough rich electors we might not even get a Reichstag as we know it.
Maybe in that course of events, representation in the empire could end up going more down the standard route of you get representation because you belong to a particular social group (lords, clergy, commons) instead of you get representation because you own an immediate estate.
First of all, reform proposals had been circulating since the 1440s, with the desire to reach a wider audience reflected in the fact they're in german- now that Italy's part of the empire, does Latin remain a or more competitive option? That could weaken the German linguistic community and perhaps allow the development of multiple literary standards into separate languages. Or do most negotiations still happen in german, because that could mean that the representative assemblies are different in the different kingdoms and not for the entire empire as otl. Also in the imperial arelat, do they use Franco-provencal as their language or is the elite more germanized?
Now onto the actual reforms. First of all you've got the eternal public peace- all estates swear to combine against any estate that uses violence to resolve conflicts with another estate. This solidified the empires status hierarchy and fixed mediate vassals as assistants to the immediate vassals. I don't see why this wouldn't happen eventually, but depending on when it happens, things could solidify in different ways.
The reichskammergericht and reichshofrat were both courts that emerged during this period, the reichskammergericht to adjudicate between estates and their subjects and the reichshofrat for the emperors prerogatives. With Italy and even burgundy as part of the empire, do they each get their own reichskammergericht equivalent or are they all under the same one?
On a similar vein, are kreise associations present in Italy, where otl the states tended to be larger than in Germany and so more able to sort things out on their own without needing institutions for regional cooperation? Bohemia was excluded from the kreise otl, but the Netherlands were included, so I'm not sure how the old arelat would be treated?
Another super important thing- Money. Up until this point otl, there hadn't really been any major institutional changes in tax collection since the Carolingians. I'm assuming here that in MiaJ, the Empire underwent similar trends to otl of emperors selling off and pawning imperial territory (land belonging to the emperor by right of being elected emperor) and focusing on adding to their own hereditary territory, so that a smaller pool of families have the resources to submit a candidate for the crown. It was quickly agreed otl that it would be impossible to revive the old imperial territory, and instead each estate should submit a portion of its cash revenue to the empire. Ittl, what with the Geroldsecks riding roughshod all over the imperial church in Strasbourg, and the papacy being thrashed, is there a chance they decide that the imperial lands can be revived, just take land from the imperial church? In that case, you might return to the situation where any middling count thinks they might have a shot at being emperor because when he's emperor he'll have all the funds he needs to reward supporters, instead of as otl where being emperor was an expensive business that only the richest dynasties could afford (Luxemburg and Habsburgs and later just the Habsburgs).
At first otl, they went for the Common Penny tax, which was just you know a standard tax on estates based on your income. This proved difficult because not enough estates had actual registers recording their income, and more than that they didnt want that knowledge to become public information- especially free cities were concerned that if neighbouring princes really knew how rich they were then they'd take away their immediacy. If there are fewer imperial free cities as Swabia still exists, maybe the common penny has more of a shot? Or would alternate free cities in the Arelat and Austria replace those lost in Swabia?
Otl In order to conceal their wealth, the matricular system was agreed- each estate has to provide a fixed quota of cash based on the status of their estate. Thus all electors pay the same whatever their income, all prince bishops are basically the same etc. Side note, do we even still have electors here? We haven't heard anything from them since the 11th century, I'd be interested to know who they are now that presumably their number has become more or less fixed. Are there any Burgundian electors or are they all from the kingdom of Germany?
Otl the electors tried to exclude all other estates from having representation at meetings with the monarch, so if there are enough rich electors we might not even get a Reichstag as we know it.
Maybe in that course of events, representation in the empire could end up going more down the standard route of you get representation because you belong to a particular social group (lords, clergy, commons) instead of you get representation because you own an immediate estate.
The hajj route could shift to Egypt as was historically done when the Crusaders took the Holy Land. It followed the North Africa/Med-Indian Ocean trade route through Egypt (Alexandria > Cairo > Red Sea). This route would allow the pilgrims to bypass Bataid territory until their ship on the Red Sea reach Jeddah. Certainly, the issue with Bataid piracy/raiding would interfere with this, but I do not think the tax would completely disrupt the trans-Mediterranean hajj route as long as Bayadhid Egypt remains independent and capable of receiving pilgrims and traders in Alexandria. In fact, I would think the Bayadhid ruler would see the nifaq tax as a boon for the Egyptian economy as pilgrims and traders shift over to the Alexandria-Red Sea route, and that would annoy Iskender II even more. He'd be more than likely planning to conquer Egypt later on, not only for that reason but also because Egypt is an incredibly rich land due to the agriculture along the Nile and because it'd allow him control over the Med-Indian Ocean trade. With that in mind, I can see Iskender attempt to dominate the straits between Italy and Tunisia so he'd try to make overtures to the Nasrid rulers of Tunisia or bully them into acquiescing to his demands. The Asmarids, in turn, would try to make sure that the Nasrids remain within the Umayyad orbit. With that in mind, Mahdia may be full of agents and spies from both sides, probably similar to OTL Constantinople prior to and during the First World War with agents and spies from both sides of the war maneuvering against each other and trying to get their claws into the Ottoman sultan due to the Istanbul straits.
It's logical, really. It's right across the Adriatic from the Haemus/Balkans and it would allow them to have a stranglehold on Venice's access to the rest of the Mediterranean Sea in addition to helping them to dominate the central Med. This is why Venice joined against the Ottomans in OTL during their attempted invasion of Italy and this is likely why Venice joined Romania's coalition against the Bataids.
Crazymachines
Banned
long, looong term, I wonder whether the eastern or western caliph will last longer
I assume that the HRE still has the original prince electors since there hasn't been any mention that the Geroldsecks removed it in their ascension to power across all of the mapdates. Not like they need to though, as the Geroldsecks do control Bohemia and if Imperial Church lands are now part of the Emperor's property, it's fairly possible that the Geroldsecks have enough lands (Bohemia, Swabia, and etc.) and funds to keep electors under their thumb without needing extraordinary amounts of money.
The Geroldsecks might end up being a more successful dynasty than the Habsburgs in centralizing power over the HRE because of this, in addition to the Emperor's victory over the Pope in the Council of Imola. With this, they can focus more of their time in consolidating their power and actually enforcing their vassals' loyalty so things like Brandenburg-Prussia opposing the Emperor would not be a reality. A Habsburg Spain kind of scenario also doesn't exist for the Geroldsecks so that helps them manage affairs in their own demesne as well as other parts of the Empire.
Whether Burgundy or Italy will be integrated into the core of the HRE is anyone's guess but I think Burgundy/Arles will be more Germanized than in OTL. Italy most likely will not follow in the footsteps of the Wends or the Burgundians/Arletians, even with the annexation of Italy back into the empire. This is most likely due to linguistic and cultural divides between the Germans and Italians and the presence of the Alps.
I definitely agree that an increase of an inland route towards Egypt would certainly benefit the Egyptians a lot more, especially after the Nifaq Tax on the Eastern Med and Levant would push traders or pilgrims either towards Bayadhid lands or through the Sudan route (which Egypt also has more influence in) in order to reach the East. The Bayadhids are definitely not neutral though, as they're definitely within the Umayyad sphere of influence, much to Iskender II's chagrin, which is probably why he even made that move towards Meridiana in the first place.
Espionage in lands of Western and Eastern Sunni nations would certainly be interesting as agents try to persuade leaders to align their side. While the Nasrids or the Bayadhids would be notable battlegrounds, I would also like to add Kilwa and Warsheikh as they're still Eastern Sunni but I believe that they will change towards the Umayyad Caliph fairly soon, which is not something the Bataids would want in the long run since Asmarid dominance in the Indian Ocean trade would severely cripple their ability to trade with Hindustan and Sin through the sea and it means that they've conceded much of East Asia such as Ryukyu, Sin, and Nusantara to Umayyad loyalists.
I want both the Abbasids and the Umayyads to survive to the modern day but I bet more on the Umayyads maintaining themselves as ceremonial rulers of Andalus because of how the existence of the Hajib-Caliph system is quite stable and not likely to be changed at a fundamental level since the Hajib relies on the Caliph for legitimacy.
The Romans on the other hand, treat the Abbasids as a puppet or an accessory to their rule, not really needing them to maintain their hold over the Empire proper. People have been discussing the likelihood of a Roman Emperor overthrowing the Abbasids to take over the Caliphate and I still agree that it could potentially happen given enough time.
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Since the Western-Eastern split has been mostly formalized, I've been inspired to make logos on each split on Sunni Islam:
- Left: Western Sunni symbol based on the Rub el-Hizb used by most Andalusi states.
- Middle: Eastern Sunni symbol based on Roman designs on the star and crescent.
- Right: A united symbol of Sunni Islam, combining both the Umayyad and Abbasid symbols of Islam.
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But the identity of the electors only solidified in the 14th century otl. Before that it was a lot more fluid. In 983, for example, election as Italian king was separate from election as German king as Otto II wanted greater integration. From Otto I to about 1198, most bishops and abbots participated, but after this point only west German bishops retained electoral privileges and abbots lost it entirely. In 1152, the universal right of all lords to participate in elections was still proclaimed, though in practice the number had narrowed. The messy elections of 1198 and 1246/7 showed that the number of electors should be reduced to a small elite. The number of ecclesiastical electors stabilised at 3 in 1237 when Cologne, Trier and Mainz combined to exclude the eastern prince bishoprics of Magdeburg and Salzburg.
It was Rudolf I who limited the secular electors to those who held arch offices in his administration, his son in laws.
Obviously none of that's happened ittl and given that the Arelat has continuously been part of the empire, there's a decent chance that at some point Burgundian lords were allowed to either hold their own election confirming the German one or to just join in on the German one themselves.
Well that's a big if, but if that's true then surely the electors can just elect whoever they want, knowing that they'll be able to use imperial lands to pay them back.
Yeah Italy especially has a recent tradition of political independence and presumably common institutions to administer the realm separate from imperial institutions- does this mean the kingdom is now hereditary territory of the Geroldsecks, or someone else? Has it been split up and common institutions broken down?
I think Franco provençales future depends entirely on whether it is administered as a separate kingdom within the empire, with its own separate nobility or whether it's been incorporated into the German kingdom and so it's nobility have no corporate identity separate to German princes.
I think it's going to depend on whether the HRE's electoral system is going to be more inclusive towards the different lords surrounding the Empire than OTL, as you said that it was more fluid in the past. It could be likely that it will be bigger in MiaJ as the Golden Bull was averted. Still, I believe it will just be a singular electoral system with a select group of prince-electors across the Empire instead of separate groups like Germany, Burgundy, and Italy holding their own elections but anything is possible.
With the end of the House of Florence, Italy is a huge question mark, since while it's possible that the Geroldsecks could annex this territory for themselves, I think it's unlikely that they could do it since much of the HRE's electors already think that they are accruing far too much power already with just Bohemia, Swabia, and Burgundy. Trying to push it by taking over Italy might just up backfiring on them.
The alternative is probably just leaving Italy as a region full of city states and small counties similar to OTL, since central authority was already breaking down by the time the Geroldsecks were arriving. It's probably for the best as a divided Italy is much less of a threat than a united front trying to remove the Geroldsecks from being King of Italy.
As for the Burgundians, the region could've been thoroughly Germanized since the HRE subsumed Arles quite early and neither France or Provencia/Romania actually held that territory for centuries, even if there are a substantial amounts of Occitan/Romance or French speaking populations in the region. It's possible that Burgundy and the Dauphine are absorbed into the "Kingdom of Germany" portion of the empire, since there's no mention of any restoration of a separate Kingdom of Burgundy or Arelat iirc and it is split between the Geroldsecks and some minor landowners.
Since the Bataids are so hellenized, how likely is it that the Abbasids could be plotting against them? Maybe plan a coup with help of other turkic, kurdish or arab leaders/dynasties to overthrow them.
Also would the Asmarids demand a trading port in Italy as paymant for their support of the christians?
Also would the Asmarids demand a trading port in Italy as paymant for their support of the christians?
If they could even try they would have done it now, if anything show how weak the Abbasids are now, as i mentioned too, i was suprised the Bataids just don't assimilated them via marriage and just Unify the Caliph title alongside Basileus.
If they didn't them the got Swindled by the south french them.
While the duchy of Savoy was later incorporated into the German kingdom and present in the Reichstag, I'd venture thats mostly because there wasn't much of any arelat left by that point. It wouldnt be a question of restoring a separate kingdom, it would be a question of just maintaining the personal union between the kingdom of burgundy and the kingdom of germany. I'd venture there's a fair chance the Burgundian nobility have by this point really elevated Franco provencal into a proper literary language, given that it's an entirely separate branch of Gallo romance to both the langues d'oil and the lengua d'oc.
Eventually most likely, but I would assume that at some point the italians at least would protest that even if all their electors voted for a candidate, he would still be beaten by a candidate with the support of the Germans so the system doesn't represent them. I'm assuming, given how it was a separate kingdom until recently, that there are no Italian electors at least up until this point so as we get to imperial reform that will be a demand they make.
Perhaps after imperial reform each of the three kingdoms all have the same number of electors, let's call it five. This prevents a tie as its an odd number, and allows all the kingdoms to be equally represented. Of course Bohemia wasn't originally a kingdom of the empire but its been one for a while by the time imperial reform gets going and as I understand has for centuries been in personal union with the imperial crown, so what you could do is give them an equal number of electors to burgundy and Italy (maybe each has three in this reform proposal) but give Germany more (four or six in this proposal) so that the largest kingdom has the most representation and acts as a tie breaker but can't dominate the other three kingdoms on its own. Of course that would require some vassals in Bohemia getting imperial immediacy and a corresponding decentralisation of bohemian royal authority but if it delivers a more centralised empire overall it could be seen as worth it.
definitely don't think Italy will agree to abide by adjudication from a German Reichstag, and depending on how Arpitanophone the Burgundian lords are, they might want their own court. I guess there are just too many unknowns at the moment.
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I agree with Nivek that if the Abbasids were plotting against the Bataids, they would've done so already. With the probable death of the old Abbasid Caliph, the pretender line is most likely what's left of the Abbasid dynasty, so that means they're just the puppet of the Roman Emperors. They're also in Constantinople, so any chance of trying to ally with any Arab tribes or emirs is futile since they're stuck there.
If the Asmarids received a treaty port/makzan, I'm thinking it might be at Amalfi, Syracuse, Palermo, or even Bari. In my opinion, Syracuse would be a pretty good deal out of them since it's closer to Mahdia and Melita and it isn't a large city like Amalfi, Naples, or Bari. Not to mention it's closer to the central Med to facilitate trade between the two halves of the Mediterranean.
Burgundy could be seen as a distinct region in Europe due to the use of Franco-Provencal/Burgundian as a common language within the Empire, although I think that's going to depend if the Geroldsecks are going to tolerate Burgundy's separate status as a third kingdom or if they treat it as Germany proper like the Duchy of Pomerania or the Duchy of Rugen.
Considering the HRE might play a larger role in this act, we could see more insights into the HRE's electoral system and how it's organized. We'll just have to see, I suppose.
Planet of Hats
Donor
I'd say that the Asmarids are definitely interested in some sort of concession from Romania. Al-Nasr may have a broader goal of keeping the Bataids out of Italy, but he's no fool, and he's pragmatic. While Andalusian and Berber traders frequent Melita, that's still not a lot - he'd love a makzan city.
Amalfi is probably the one he's eyeing. It has historically been a stopover for Moorish traders but was badly damaged in an earthquake awhile back and hasn't recovered its prestige and wealth.
Amalfi is probably the one he's eyeing. It has historically been a stopover for Moorish traders but was badly damaged in an earthquake awhile back and hasn't recovered its prestige and wealth.
That would be a nice Prize and one allow Asmarids to keep an eye on the bataids too