Map Thread XVII

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The British simply colonize the area after hearing about the riches of the New World. That would still bring people to America, just not Puritans. Since the French and the English still exist, the Seven Year's war still happens, the British still tax America, and they still revolt.
OK?
It's just that if the Reconquista fails, then that will affect the lives of thousands of people, first in Iberia and the Atlas Mountains, then in the rest of Europe, and then in the rest of the world. People would change people would change people would change people until, in two or three generations, the geopolitical world would be significantly changed from OTL. The specifics leading up to the American Revolution were extremely detailed, and the specifics of the foundation of a republic even more so. There are so many hundreds and hundreds of years between the Reconquista and English colonization that anything could happen. However, the USA being founded, from anger st taxation after the same war, having the exact people and state borders, to have the same Civil War, to then lead to a Confederate-wank (with all the same problems behind such a wank) is horrendously implausible, to the point of "almost guaranteed not to happen." There are threads on this board about the butterfly effect for a more in-depth explanation, but, suffice to say, your map is, while aesthetically pleasing, far too convergent literally everywhere outside of Spain to be the result of a failed Reconquista.
 
Hi. I finished the scenario, finally.

I take it you've never heard of a little thing called the Butterfly effect?

Long story short, with a POD 700 years ago any small changes will have accumulated, built up and been amplified to such a level that basically nothing would be the same as OTL.

For a start, why is you're hyper-power Bolivia even called Bolivia. IOTL, Bolivia got its name from the South American revolutionary Simon Bolivar, who was one of the leading lights of Latin America's quest to break away from Spain. A person 500 years removed from the POD is definitely going to be butterflied. There is no question about that. There will be no one in this Universe called Simon Bolivar, after which Bolivia can take its name.

And that's just one example. Basically every border in Africa and Asia is based off the situation OTL just before the First World War.

Why.

All these borders were defined for very specific reasons and circumstances, and thus they're highly unlikely to pop up identically in a world 600 years removed from OTL (and most of those borders were defined in the 19th Century), where those specific circumstances are missing.

Granted, a few of those borders were based on Geography; following the course of major rivers, mountain ranges, watershed divides, or whatever, so a few may be expected to turn up across many ATL's, but even then, why not use a different river, or a different mountain range, or a different watershed divide?

Borders are highly butterfliable things, and are highly susceptible to change. Identical borders showing up in such divergent TL's is simply never going to happen.

I could list all the other things that would never occur in in a TL so far removed from our own, but that would take way too long, and anyway, others are already pointing them out.

Believe me, there are many, many, many more.

EDIT; Bugger, someone else beat me to the butterflies lecture.
 

ST15RM

Banned
I take it you've never heard of a little thing called the Butterfly effect?

Long story short, with a POD 700 years ago any small changes will have accumulated, built up and been amplified to such a level that basically nothing would be the same as OTL.

For a start, why is you're hyper-power Bolivia even called Bolivia. IOTL, Bolivia got its name from the South American revolutionary Simon Bolivar, who was one of the leading lights of Latin America's quest to break away from Spain. A person 500 years removed from the POD is definitely going to be butterflied. There is no question about that. There will be no one in this Universe called Simon Bolivar, after which Bolivia can take its name.

And that's just one example. Basically every border in Africa and Asia is based off the situation OTL just before the First World War.

Why.

All these borders were defined for very specific reasons and circumstances, and thus they're highly unlikely to pop up identically in a world 600 years removed from OTL (and most of those borders were defined in the 19th Century), where those specific circumstances are missing.

Granted, a few of those borders were based on Geography; following the course of major rivers, mountain ranges, watershed divides, or whatever, so a few may be expected to turn up across many ATL's, but even then, why not use a different river, or a different mountain range, or a different watershed divide?

Borders are highly butterfliable things, and are highly susceptible to change. Identical borders showing up in such divergent TL's is simply never going to happen.

I could list all the other things that would never occur in in a TL so far removed from our own, but that would take way too long, and anyway, others are already pointing them out.

Believe me, there are many, many, many more.

EDIT; Bugger, someone else beat me to the butterflies lecture.
It's just that if the Reconquista fails, then that will affect the lives of thousands of people, first in Iberia and the Atlas Mountains, then in the rest of Europe, and then in the rest of the world. People would change people would change people would change people until, in two or three generations, the geopolitical world would be significantly changed from OTL. The specifics leading up to the American Revolution were extremely detailed, and the specifics of the foundation of a republic even more so. There are so many hundreds and hundreds of years between the Reconquista and English colonization that anything could happen. However, the USA being founded, from anger st taxation after the same war, having the exact people and state borders, to have the same Civil War, to then lead to a Confederate-wank (with all the same problems behind such a wank) is horrendously implausible, to the point of "almost guaranteed not to happen." There are threads on this board about the butterfly effect for a more in-depth explanation, but, suffice to say, your map is, while aesthetically pleasing, far too convergent literally everywhere outside of Spain to be the result of a failed Reconquista.
So are you saying my TL is impossible?
 
So are you saying my TL is impossible?
They are saying it is highly unlikely, because Spain after the reqonquista was a mayor player in the world. In your defense it is possible that the pod is unclear. If i look at your map. It looks more that the reconquista didn't finish, not fail. If Granada somehow miracously survives, it must become some sort of Super-Switzerland not to influence the world around it. Let's look at finances for instance. Spain under Phillips II waged war on at least 3 fronts, Netherlands, France and the Turks. If he had an enemy at his gate, he certainly would have had to abandon one of those others, because he didn't have the money. In OTL Spain went bankrupt at least twice.
And i see that Spain doesn't have his southern ports. Think about the consequences for America. No Columbus sailing from Cadiz.
 
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boroughs of new druk city map present day.PNG

boroughs of new druk city map present day deprivation.PNG

Measuring relative average household income levels in New Druk City

dragon kingdom local government divisions communes present day census 546 AC.PNG

dragon kingdom local government divisions cantons present day census 546 AC.PNG

Census, 546 After Catherine, by commune level then canton level
 

ST15RM

Banned
They are saying it is highly unlikely, because Spain after the reqonquista was a mayor player in the world. In your defense it is possible that the pod is unclear. If i look at your map. It looks more that the reconquista didn't finish, not fail. If Granada somehow miracously survives, it must become some sort of Super-Switzerland not to influence the world around it. Let's look at finances for instance. Spain under Phillips II waged war on at least 3 fronts, Netherlands, France and the Turks. If he had an enemy at his gate, he certainly would have had to abandon one of those others, because he didn't have the money. In OTL Spain went bankrupt at least twice.
And i see that Spain doesn't have his southern ports. Think about the consequences for America. No Columbus sailing from Cadiz.
He could possibly go from a northern port nstead.
I'm actually calling Bolivia Upper Peru, which makes a lil more sense.
 

ST15RM

Banned
Also, portugal will be the one who controlled Latin America, so the Rio de la Plata federation, the Rio da Prata.
 

fashbasher

Banned
Either a Cubawank or a New Orleanswank, depending on whether the tail is wagging the dog:

s0Nns6W.png


POD: The Captaincy General of Cuba somehow stays united, and the Louisiana Purchase fails due to Napoleon falling before he can work out the deal with Jefferson. The colonial Filipino populations of Louisiana, together with brethren from Cuba and immigrants from Spain proper, are able to fight off French loyalists to such an extent that Cuba is able to gain independence as a whole. And yes, those two giant northern states are called West Mooseland and East Mooseland.
 
He could possibly go from a northern port nstead.
I'm actually calling Bolivia Upper Peru, which makes a lil more sense.
250px-Henrican_navigation_routes.gif

These are the usual winds and the currents in the area. Columbus got in America because he could use these. If he would start in the northern ports he would go against the currents. There is a geographical reason why Spain and Portugal had a headstart in the age of discovery. Their ports were on an ideal spot and you ignore that.
Hey, you're free to write what you want of course and ignore these (subjective) rules. I like my alternate history cooked up with plausability and i'm not alone. SoIf you ask here for comments, you may expect its about plausability. But i admit there are also some highly unlikely enjoyable alternate histories written, so please do continue writing.
 
View attachment 350231
Map Legend #27-
Note: No colors are repeated
Union of North American States
Quebec
Union of Britain
Scandinavian Union
La France Nationaliste
Socialist Republic of Germany
Polish Union
Finnish Empire
Kingdom of Italy
Austria-Hungary
Lithuania
Russian Empire
Kingdom of Spain
Romania
Greece
Brazil Commune
Gran Colombia
Portagul
Bulgaria
Illyria
Arabia
Yemen(Arab Vassal)
Mali
Sultanate of Egypt
India
Ethopia
Greater Liberia
Chinese Republic
Korea(Chinese Puppet)
Japan
Thailand
Australasian Federation
La Plata
Peru

Please Ask Questions!

Causes of Chinese Republicanism?
 
Safavids wouldn't be around and neither would the Mughals so I removed them.

In place of the Safavids are the Ag Qoyunlu and the Timurids.

In place of the Mughals are the Delhi sultanate, the Bengali sultanate, Gujarat and the Vijayanagara Empire.

Less of a change and more of a clarification. The Mad War of the 1480s ended in a rebel victory and Charles VIII was executed and Louis II of Orleans is the reigning monarch.

I made it more clear that the Hafsids are a protectorate.

To the south of the Mamluks is Alodia and the Aksumite Kingdom.

On the Arab Penninsula are the Tahrid Dynasty in Yemen and the Fartak Sultanate.

Added colors to Phagmodrupa Tibet, Mongolia, Ming China, Joseon Korea and Ashikaga Japan.

The treaty of Danzig returned lands to the Livonian order that had occupied by Poland since the Peace of Thorn.

Added various other African nations.

Added the near east countries (mostly khanates)
LionAndEagleV2.png
 
Loverly! Bit surprised they managed to absorb the Viets, given how much trouble they gave the Chinese OTL: and the Sulu Republic is missing, well, Sulu [1]. :p

Is "Porto" some sort of alt-Portugal?

[1] The island group, not the Star Trek character.

Viets were aided by the T'ais when they rebelled. If you notice their state, in the main map, is a separate province- self governing.


Sulu was lost to the Mindao Hegemony
[or- ain't it awful when you can't admit you made a mistake.]
 
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