For All Mankind (AH Tv series at Apple TV)

IRL, KAL007 lead to Reagan to open the USA's GPS system to the rest of the world for navigation aid. I wonder if that will even still happen here.
 
The birth records (one dated 1966, the other 1974) are definitely South Vietnamese, with the father's occupation being an ARVN interpreter and the distinctive hyphenation between syllables of the same word (i.e. Việt-Nam instead of Việt Nam, a Southern practice phased out completely after reunification). The postage stamps are all OTL post-unification designs, though, and the ink stamps and sender's address clearly reads "Thành phố Hồ Chí Minh" (in constrast to the birth records, which reads "Saigon"); either a glaring oversight or a hint that the North took over in ATL as well. That the ARVN father emigrated to Texas is probably evidence for the latter.

Thank you for the clarification.

I am inclined to say that South Vietnam also fell ITTL.

I didn’t know about the name Vietnam being written differently, even if the difference was minimal.

I still think that is Korolev. Glushko was sentenced to Gulag. However, he was put to work on various aircraft projects with other arrested scientists [https://www.planetary.org/profiles/valentin-glushko]. Besides that, as I said in my anterior post, that flag conversation was probably something that an N1-L3 project leader would say. I don't see Glushko (who was the leader of the soviet space effort in 1983 in our timeline) saying the things about the flag in the way that the "Old Engineer" did, and Mishin (who would probably be the leader in the show timeline if Korolev was dead) didn't go to a gulag.

As for the actor likeness, I don't' know if I am breaking any forum rules posting screen capture of the show here, but here is a comparison with Korolev:

View attachment 638830

Maybe the credits from that specific episode gives us the name of the Soviet man who talked to Poole?

IRL, KAL007 lead to Reagan to open the USA's GPS system to the rest of the world for navigation aid. I wonder if that will even still happen here.

Oh, wow, I didn’t know that.
...

I have a late question.

It doesn’t really affect the main story, but after reading the Wikipedia article on Sadat’s assassination, I’m surprised it still happened ITTL (albeit he survived). Wasn’t the motive for his death was because of the successful Camp David Accords? I know it failed in For All Mankind, but would there even be another strong reason for someone to kill Sadat, besides wanting a more progressive Egypt?
 
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Sadat’s assassination, I’m surprised it still happened ITTL (albeit he survived). Wasn’t the motive for his death was because of the successful Camp David Accords?
There were another reason, Extrem Islamist
Sadat try them Integration into the liberal Egypt society
That din't work and Omar Abdel-Rahman, (yes the guy of WTC bombing) issue a fatwa on Sadat
in ITTL there was extremist Islamic uprise trying to kill Sadat and install a Islamist state like Iran

Since Sadat survived this have allot consequence in rise of extremist Islam
He will hunt down the extremist and exterminate them, like Omar Abdel-Rahman, (in cooperation with his allies USA)
like wise will happen in Saudi Arabia a purge against extremist in aftermath of the Grand Mosque seizure of 1979
Since the soviets NEVER invaded Afganistan ITTL there is no mujahideen means not rise to power for Osama bin Laden ?

I guess the Extremist could find in Civil war Libanon a base of operation and try to establish a "Islamist state" there
This could prolong the Civil war for decades to come
 
There were another reason, Extrem Islamist
Sadat try them Integration into the liberal Egypt society
That din't work and Omar Abdel-Rahman, (yes the guy of WTC bombing) issue a fatwa on Sadat
in ITTL there was extremist Islamic uprise trying to kill Sadat and install a Islamist state like Iran

Since Sadat survived this have allot consequence in rise of extremist Islam
He will hunt down the extremist and exterminate them, like Omar Abdel-Rahman, (in cooperation with his allies USA)
like wise will happen in Saudi Arabia a purge against extremist in aftermath of the Grand Mosque seizure of 1979
Since the soviets NEVER invaded Afganistan ITTL there is no mujahideen means not rise to power for Osama bin Laden ?

I guess the Extremist could find in Civil war Libanon a base of operation and try to establish a "Islamist state" there
This could prolong the Civil war for decades to come
Lebanon’s probably not as fertile ground for them as OTL, either. With Egypt still a threat, Israeli intervention in Lebanon seems unlikely. That’s going to change the dynamic on the ground. Likely less aggressive Christian extremists, so less provocative to the Muslim population and more defensive. The fratricidal Camp Wars continue based on the gain of personal power rather than ideology. And Syrian-style Baathism is the plurality force in the country.

There are probably pockets for extremists to find, but fewer than OTL without the uniting events of the Israeli intervention and rising violence from Mr Lebanon.

Beirut will be a mess. Wonder if the international forces are there...
 
I feel that Margo will have some bad outcomes at NASA for her decision to tell Sergei Nikulov the problem. Still, I believe that was an "in character" move on her part. This action guarantees a successful soviet shuttle in the show context. However, I expect a positive outcome from the bond she formed with Sergei Nikulov, maybe in the season finale.

In the latest episode, Ellen's father alluded to the idea of Ellen taking over the family aerospace company. That obviously won't happen, since the more dramatic arc is for a closeted Ellen to remain running NASA. But Ellen's "life lesson" this season is to intentionally present different sides of herself to different people.

So, I'm wondering if the Reagan administration will debate what to do about Margo possibly leaking the O-ring issue... Ellen will step up and go nuclear, saying she'll axe Margo even if they don't have proof. But to Margo, Ellen will give the golden parachute of running a major aerospace company, presenting a friendly face of "I know why you did it, and I support it but can't say so for the good of NASA. If I resign with you, the Pentagon will totally annex us."

Dramatically, in future seasons that keeps Margo around as a supporting character... but it also helps establish her as a domestic rival to NASA. So when the show hits the 1990s in Season 3, we'll have a female version of Elon Musk. Which could fill the void of "NASA antagonist" if/when the Soviets collapse, since Apple TV has an unwritten policy not to offend China and no other country could really fill that narrative void.
 
Alternative possible arc for Margo: she and Sergei are the future of US/Russian cooperation as the Cold War ends.

It does seem likely that the military guard on the Russians would have been charged to relay any conversation they have to his superiors; that is if the office isn't outright bugged. There's still a chance that that's not the case, though. If her convo with the Russians goes unreported, there's not going to be any strong evidence that she did anything wrong. If the shuttle fails to blow up, what does that prove? As general Bradford said, "They've got smart engineers in Russia; I'm sure they'll spot the problem."

So if she's still a big deal at NASA and Sergei manages to thread the needle and come out on top in the post-Soviet Russian program, that's a strong personal relationship to build on going forward.

It would require a moderate and low-hanging intelligence flaw for this to happen, but it's the kind of thing that gets missed in intel gathering all the time.
 
Does anyone know who could be Reagan's successor for the 1984 Presidential Election? I have my money on Bush.
For the GOP nomination: his VP Richard Schweiker.

The actual winner is likely to be Gary Hart as the show teased him in a similar fashion. Reagan also narrowly won his two races so the GOP won't be getting a third term in '84.
 
How far ahead do you think season 3 will skip? I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s a longer leap than season 2. Maybe late 90s and the first Mars colony is in the works.
 
There were another reason, Extrem Islamist
Sadat try them Integration into the liberal Egypt society
That din't work and Omar Abdel-Rahman, (yes the guy of WTC bombing) issue a fatwa on Sadat
in ITTL there was extremist Islamic uprise trying to kill Sadat and install a Islamist state like Iran

Since Sadat survived this have allot consequence in rise of extremist Islam
He will hunt down the extremist and exterminate them, like Omar Abdel-Rahman, (in cooperation with his allies USA)
like wise will happen in Saudi Arabia a purge against extremist in aftermath of the Grand Mosque seizure of 1979
Since the soviets NEVER invaded Afganistan ITTL there is no mujahideen means not rise to power for Osama bin Laden ?

I guess the Extremist could find in Civil war Libanon a base of operation and try to establish a "Islamist state" there
This could prolong the Civil war for decades to come

Lebanon’s probably not as fertile ground for them as OTL, either. With Egypt still a threat, Israeli intervention in Lebanon seems unlikely. That’s going to change the dynamic on the ground. Likely less aggressive Christian extremists, so less provocative to the Muslim population and more defensive. The fratricidal Camp Wars continue based on the gain of personal power rather than ideology. And Syrian-style Baathism is the plurality force in the country.

There are probably pockets for extremists to find, but fewer than OTL without the uniting events of the Israeli intervention and rising violence from Mr Lebanon.

Beirut will be a mess. Wonder if the international forces are there...

So with no Camp David Acord, does that mean that Israel will not withdraw from the Sinai Peninsula.

Very interesting.

If FAM won't give us more details on these events, then it would be great if some fan-fiction did it for us.
 
How far ahead do you think season 3 will skip? I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s a longer leap than season 2. Maybe late 90s and the first Mars colony is in the works.
I would hope nothing farther than say 1992. That allows them to have basically most of the next presidency off screen and pick up with a new generation ready to take office and go to Mars ? The question will be who are they ? Also I hope they plan on giving us another primer about major events that happened in the ensuing years...
 
I would hope nothing farther than say 1992. That allows them to have basically most of the next presidency off screen and pick up with a new generation ready to take office and go to Mars ? The question will be who are they ? Also I hope they plan on giving us another primer about major events that happened in the ensuing years...
I thought this was going to be like the first when we cover years but it seems it's much more just over a year. In season three we would likely jump to the 1990s. If I had to guess the mid to late 90s. With how fast tech is happening here TTL 2000s should be about what we have now. I don't think we had laptops in 1983 and if we did they were not as portable as in the show.

Jamestown should be a fair bit bigger by that point and the first crew should be training for Mars by TTL 2000.
 
I would hope nothing farther than say 1992. That allows them to have basically most of the next presidency off screen and pick up with a new generation ready to take office and go to Mars ? The question will be who are they ? Also I hope they plan on giving us another primer about major events that happened in the ensuing years...
I'll certainly watch whatever they put out and likely enjoy it. But honestly I'd be just as happy if they move things along at a faster pace. We know they've got at least one more season, but no promise of more yet. Hopefully we'll make it to six seasons and a movie, but who knows? If it is only three, I'd prefer to see a more-developed (re: cooler) program rather than more interstitial developments.

I do think you're on to something with politics, though. They might start to abstract it a bit more, use more non-OTL politicians charting paths no one would consider IOTL. Like if it is Hart (or Carter or Clinton or Gore or Glenn or even Schweiker or Bush) is the audience really going to be all that excited about that? They're just not as interesting as Reagan or Ted Kennedy in the public imagination. Better to skip who's next and give us a fictional facsimile president. (Part of me still thinks this is where Ellen is headed, but less so than before the current season started.)
 
I thought this was going to be like the first when we cover years but it seems it's much more just over a year. In season three we would likely jump to the 1990s. If I had to guess the mid to late 90s. With how fast tech is happening here TTL 2000s should be about what we have now. I don't think we had laptops in 1983 and if we did they were not as portable as in the show.

Jamestown should be a fair bit bigger by that point and the first crew should be training for Mars by TTL 2000.
In several interviews that I've listened to, Ronald D. Moore has indicated that the original plan for the show was to have each season roughly set in succeeding decades. A good chunk of the first season was in the 1970s, this one is in the 1980s, and so season three will be sometime in the 1990s. I wonder if in the last episode or so of this season, it might jump a few years so that the next season can be the late 1990s.
 
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