An Alternate Trek

[High Plains Drifter]

Speaking as somebody who (for reasons too implausible to repeat) is committed to doing a timeline of a Canadian version of "Babylon 5" starting in 1989, I may have some useful insights here. They are

• If you are doing a British Star Trek in the 60's then you have to go the Roddenberry-meets-Lew-Grade route. This is problematic (you might end up butterflying away "Stingray"). But Lew was the only person who could realistically produce a military sci-fi series (in colour!) professionally enough for international distribution - contemporary BBC series like "Doctor Who" had to trade on things other than the efficacy of their SFX.
• If you are doing a special-effects show in England in the 60's then you have to have Derek Meddings involved at some point
• If you are doing a sci-fi show in England in the 60's then you have to have Shane Rimmer in a bit-part
• Look at the shows of the time. Are there any you could butterfly away to free up their cast? If you butterfly away "The Champions" for example, you free up Stuart Damon, Alexandra Bastedo and William Gaunt, who could easily be cast as Kirk/McCoy/Rand. If you butterfly away "Public Eye" you free up Alfred Burke (who was born to play Spock). And so on.
• Where is it filmed? Pinewood? Shepperton? Pick one, work out what else was being filmed there at the same time, and use their supporting cast and technical crew.
• Who is paying for this? Who is your producer, where is he getting the money from? He's the ringmaster and showrunner and has to get everybody to work together. Since your obvious choice is Lew Grade, that solves a lot right there but there will be ripples: if you cast Patrick McGoohan then eventually he (Patrick) will leave because he's too alpha male to cede control entirely
• What technical limits are there? Is this on film? (Crude) videotape?
• Bear in mind some choices will leave: Ian Hendry is a good choice but IOTL he left the Avengers to do films. People have ambitions which may not include a three-year contract
• It will eat up your life. I spent a couple of hours working out how the coordinates of a pointer on a Steadicam mount could be fed into a late-80's computer (the trick is to realise you capture angle and length of a telescopic rod on a rotating..er, rotaty thing). Just wait until you realise your main actor wants to work in the States...
• Who are the writers? DC Fontana invented the Vulcan mythos ab initio. Take her away, your pointy-eared green-blooded folk will be entirely different...

Good luck

Damn you reality!!!!

All excellent points, the only one of which I figured was the one about McGoohan. So probably based only on him, no more than two seasons of the show are possible in the 60s.

Of course I won't let reality stop my fantasy of British Star Trek wank.

 

[High Plains Drifter]

Fast forward 20 years. The beeb has finally shut down Dr Who and Sylvester McCoy and Sophie Aldred have wandered down that wooded path towards the Tardis for the last time. The ATV(or BBC) Star Trek was very popular and continually repeated (at least in the UK) especially on school holiday mornings and Sunday afternoons.(the US remake in the early 70s with William Shatner and Leonard Nimoy bombed). An ITV company,it probably would have to be Granada by this time, sees a gap in the market with Who gone and decides to resuscitate Star Trek. Do they go for a remake of the original with a new cast or do the equivalent of OTLs STNG? If the former who is now cast as the crew, if the latter firstly what is the crew and secondly who is cast?

1987. The Endeavor hovers in space near a beat up, old patrol destroyer alongside the Neutral Zone. The Captain (McGoohan) is talking through the view screen to a straight clean cut younger officer. They discuss the obstacles the Endeavor will encounter entering the Zone to rescue the Kobyashi Maru. The Endeavor flies off, the view screen retracts to reveal McGoohan sitting in the command chair of the beat up old tub, seeing his ex ship head off into danger. Standing next to him on the bridge are the Doctor (McKern) and the Engineer (Baker). The three of them discuss with yearning how good the old girl looks. Soon reports come in over sub space that the Endeavor has been ambushed and is being boarded.

Cue credits .... Space, the Final Frontier ....

 

[viewcode]

That's some good casting...

1965. Rejected by Hollywood, Roddenberry goes across the Pond to see if there is any interest at the BBC for his "space western" script.

One night, at a pub, he runs into none other than the Danger Man himself, Patrick McGoohan. After several pints, a confession by McGoohan that he longs to do something other than a spy show, and a long night's conversation between the writer and the actor about the Final Frontier, a dynamic team is born.

On 29 September, 1967, Star Trek, produced by ITC, first airs over ATV Midlands. The cast of the show includes:

The Captain - Patrick McGoohan.
The Gruff Doctor - Leo McKern.
The Female First Officer - Sian Phillips.
The Chief Engineer - George Baker.
The Alien Helmsman - Ian McKellen.
The Russian Navigator - Derek Jacobi.
The Communications Officer - Jacqueline Pearce.
The Unrequited Nurse - Margaret Tyzack.
The Lovely Yeoman - Caroline John.

That's some good casting: they're the right ages, and have a similar theater grounding. It's not perfect (George Baker is carved from finest oak) but still pretty good. Servalan (born 1943) may be too young for the Uhura part, but then again, how old was Nichelle Nichols?

PS: please, please, get Edward Woodward in for whatever part he wants...

 

[Nivek]

Hey what about a Sovie Star Trek? being a co-production between Soviet and American Companies during the early detente? with the token American named as Kennedy, how thing will unfold?

 

[Stolengood]

Captain Robert Kert -- Nicholas Courtney
"Number One" -- Jean Marsh
Spock -- Richard Bradford
Dr. Richmond "Hex" Noyce -- Peter Barkworth
Chief Engineer Walter McIntosh -- Patrick Troughton
Navigator Jon Tosh -- Frazer Hines
Communications Officer Viola Uhura -- Carmen Munroe
Nurse Victoria Prelate -- Rachel Herbert
Yeoman Roberta Lincoln -- Denise Buckley

Possible directors: David Tomblin, Douglas Camfield, Derek Martinus, (?, etc.)
Possible writers: David Whitaker, Dennis Spooner, Terry Nation, Nigel Kneale, Paul Erickson, Troy Kennedy Martin, Brian Hayles, Moris Farhi, John Wiles, (?, etc.)

 

[Mumby]

Since it sort of taps into similar notions, could you get Gerry Anderson involved? Some of the futuristic elements of Thunderbirds could get in there and would make set piece action sequences much cheaper.

 

[captain pugwash]

If Lew Grade was producing a British Star Trek, he would almost certainly recruit an American actor to play the lead to make the show more marketable to US networks. Robert Vaughan anyone?

 

[Analytical Engine]

The Alternate Trek Universe with analogues from OTL Star Trek

1.The Federation exists except it is called the Commonwealth of Planets
2.The Commonwealth headquarters are in New York, built on the ruins of the old UN building
3. Starfleet is the Commonwealth Navy and the Commonwealth Fleet, the Navy handles the defense of the Commonwealth whilst the Fleet handles exploration and research. There is some commonality of ship design and also some conflict of interest.(Think of the conlict between the RAF and Admiralty over the Fleet Air Arm- asimilar conflict exists between the navy and Science bureau of the Commonwealth.
4.The Navy is a PROPER Navy run by an Admiralty and with lots of tradition. It sees itself as the heir to the USN, RN,Russian Fleets etc that survived WWV). It is very traditional with respect to rank and chain of command.
5. The Fleet is far looser and closer to the approach of Starfleet in OTL Star Trek.
6. WWIII is the name now given to the cold war and decolonisation conflicts from the Suez crisis onwards to about 1980
7.WWIV is the anologue of the Eugenics Wars and happened in the mid 1990s
8.WWV is the analogue of Star Trek's WWIII and happened in the 2050s
9. First contact happened much as in OTL Star Trek (without the Borg) when Christopher Cochrane makes the First warp flight from Woomera in the Phoenix.
10 The Vulcans in this timeline are just as logical as in OTL Star Trek but not as controlling of Earth as implied in Star Trek Enterprise.
11. The Commonwealth is founded by Earth with surviving independent worlds of the collapsed Bajoran Empire in about 2180. (Bajor occupied by the Cardassians). This empire collapsed under attack from the Klingons, Rhihannaun and Cardassians much as the Terran Empire did in the Mirror universe. Also in the Commonwealth are Vulcan and Andor.
12.The Klingons are the honourable version from STNG but look like those from TOS (remember this is a British TV production, money is even tighter!)
13. The main enemy are the Rhihannaun(pronounced Rheenan which the Earth people hear as Roman!) Think of a cross between the TOS Klingons and STNG Romulans and nastier!
14. CSS Ark Royal is one of 7 Endeavor class heavy cruisers fitted for exploration as opposed to the 18 Illustrious Class Battleships in the navy which are identical in exterior design but with far more power devoted to weapon systems.

That's cool. I'd make the Andorians be like space Mughals/Ghurkas or something like that. The Vulcans could be divided into two factions, one being the Ancient Greek-like logical types and the others being Tibetan Buddhist-like spiritual types, making a bit of a secular vs. religious dynamic like we saw with the Bajorans in DS9. The Tellarites could be thinly-disguised Frenchmen, because this would be a British show, after all...

 

[Lindseyman]

I would love the BBC to have produced this (so it can cross over with Dr Who) but I have to accept that Lew Grade and ITC are more the more realistic option if this version of Star Trek is to fly. Gerry Anderson is involved again a good idea but it certainly butterflies away Thunderbirds, Captain Scarlet, Joe 90, UFO and Space 1999 and possibly Stingray(however it might be so far advanced that it's safe in this timeline). I personally am not too bothered about this list from Captain Scarlet onwards but I'm going to try and make sure that Thunderbirds survives in this timeline. As mentined before if Lew Grade is involved then the captain if it is not Patrick McGoohan will be an American , candidates are Ed Bishop and Robert Vaughn (but this butterflies the Man from Uncle!) but from left field how about those two Canadians who are doing quite well in the States Christopher Plummer and William Shatner?

 

[Mumby]

I would love the BBC to have produced this (so it can cross over with Dr Who) but I have to accept that Lew Grade and ITC are more the more realistic option if this version of Star Trek is to fly. Gerry Anderson is involved again a good idea but it certainly butterflies away Thunderbirds, Captain Scarlet, Joe 90, UFO and Space 1999 and possibly Stingray(however it might be so far advanced that it's safe in this timeline). I personally am not too bothered about this list from Captain Scarlet onwards but I'm going to try and make sure that Thunderbirds survives in this timeline. As mentined before if Lew Grade is involved then the captain if it is not Patrick McGoohan will be an American , candidates are Ed Bishop and Robert Vaughn (but this butterflies the Man from Uncle!) but from left field how about those two Canadians who are doing quite well in the States Christopher Plummer and William Shatner?

Since Thunderbirds was coming out a year before Star Trek OTL, you could have a sort of perfect storm in British TV. British Star Trek could be marketted as 'Thunderbirds, in space' with live action actors. Gerry Anderson always wanted to move into live action TV and this could be the gateway. I think with in put from those involved in Doctor Who, Gerry Anderson and of course Gene Roddenberry, British Star Trek could be pretty damn awesome. And of course during William Hartnell's years there was an intimation of a possible Star Trek sounding characters in the episode Mission to the Unknown.

 

[Stolengood]

...once again:

Captain Robert Kert -- Nicholas Courtney
"Number One" -- Jean Marsh
Sparck -- Richard Bradford
Dr. Richmond "Hex" Noyce -- Peter Barkworth
Chief Engineer Walter McIntosh -- Patrick Troughton
Navigator Jonny Tosh -- Frazer Hines
Communications Officer Viola Uhura -- Carmen Munroe
Nurse Victoria Prelate -- Rachel Herbert
Yeoman Roberta Lincoln -- Denise Buckley

Possible directors: David Tomblin, Douglas Camfield, Derek Martinus, (?, etc.)
Possible writers: David Whitaker, Dennis Spooner, Terry Nation, Nigel Kneale, Paul Erickson, Troy Kennedy Martin, Brian Hayles, Brian Aldiss, Moris Farhi, J. B. Priestly, John Wiles, (?, etc.)

 

[ColeMercury]

...once again:

Captain Robert Kert -- Nicholas Courtney
"Number One" -- Jean Marsh
Sparck -- Richard Bradford
Dr. Richmond "Hex" Noyce -- Peter Barkworth
Chief Engineer Walter McIntosh -- Patrick Troughton
Navigator Jonny Tosh -- Frazer Hines
Communications Officer Viola Uhura -- Carmen Munroe
Nurse Victoria Prelate -- Rachel Herbert
Yeoman Roberta Lincoln -- Denise Buckley

Possible directors: David Tomblin, Douglas Camfield, Derek Martinus, (?, etc.)
Possible writers: David Whitaker, Dennis Spooner, Terry Nation, Nigel Kneale, Paul Erickson, Troy Kennedy Martin, Brian Hayles, Brian Aldiss, Moris Farhi, J. B. Priestly, John Wiles, (?, etc.)

Hey, this actually looks fairly plausible.

I do have some nitpicks though:
-- Why "Kert"?
-- Why "Sparck"?
-- Why "Hex"? Is the term "sawbones" not used in the UK? Because that's where the nickname "Bones" comes from, and Roddenberry was going to use it for Boyce.
-- The name Uhura was partly made up by Nichelle Nichols herself: it was originally Uhuru and was going to be her one name rather than a surname, then Nichols changed the last letter to make it more feminine.

 

[Garrison]

Since Thunderbirds was coming out a year before Star Trek OTL, you could have a sort of perfect storm in British TV. British Star Trek could be marketted as 'Thunderbirds, in space' with live action actors. Gerry Anderson always wanted to move into live action TV and this could be the gateway.

Bear in mind he did branch out into live action with UFO and Space 1999 so the first rule must be to keep Sylvia away from the costume department.

Space 1999 and Star Trek TOS do have a connection in that both had Fred Freiberger involved, and the cast were pretty unhappy in both cases.

Also given the Star Trek is being made in the UK you realize that leaves US TV sci-fi in the hands of Irwin Allen right?

 

[Stolengood]

Hey, this actually looks fairly plausible.

Thanks, very much!

I do have some nitpicks though:

Oh?

-- Why "Kert"?

I figured Roddenberry wanted a name with K in it somewhere, as he did with Pike and Kirk IOTL; however, I think a UK producer would've wanted it more "futuristic-sounding", as they did with a number of other episodes and series' involving future people. From "Kirk" came "Kurt"; however, that probably looked too much like a first name, so a producer would've changed it to "Kert". Slight difference in pronounciation, too, comes into play in order to set them apart.

-- Why "Sparck"?

The British rhotic R brings it back to sounding like "Spahk"; plus, I thought it was a nice play on words on "spark", and gives viewers a little sense of what the character is; he has a spark of curiosity...

-- Why "Hex"? Is the term "sawbones" not used in the UK? Because that's where the nickname "Bones" comes from, and Roddenberry was going to use it for Boyce.

I think I had Colin Baker's Twitter handle on my mind. He goes by "Sawbones Hex", or "Doctor Six". "Hex" could also refer to a curse, which I thought was a nice play; to the people of non-Federation planets, Noyce's tech would render him something of a magical figure, or even a witch doctor... get it?

-- The name Uhura was partly made up by Nichelle Nichols herself: it was originally Uhuru and was going to be her one name rather than a surname, then Nichols changed the last letter to make it more feminine.

I figured Carmen Munroe would do something similar. Hmmmm... perhaps I should've changed it to Uhuri?

 

[Lindseyman]

...once again:

Captain Robert Kert -- Nicholas Courtney
"Number One" -- Jean Marsh
Sparck -- Richard Bradford
Dr. Richmond "Hex" Noyce -- Peter Barkworth
Chief Engineer Walter McIntosh -- Patrick Troughton
Navigator Jonny Tosh -- Frazer Hines
Communications Officer Viola Uhura -- Carmen Munroe
Nurse Victoria Prelate -- Rachel Herbert
Yeoman Roberta Lincoln -- Denise Buckley

Possible directors: David Tomblin, Douglas Camfield, Derek Martinus, (?, etc.)
Possible writers: David Whitaker, Dennis Spooner, Terry Nation, Nigel Kneale, Paul Erickson, Troy Kennedy Martin, Brian Hayles, Brian Aldiss, Moris Farhi, J. B. Priestly, John Wiles, (?, etc.)

Perfectly good cast, probably more like the cast list for a BBC version of Star Trek. However I'm inclined to go down the ITC/Lew Grade/Gerry Anderson route as then we can keep Dr Who as in OTL although a successful British Trek would affect it. Thunderbirds was made in 64/65 and so Gerry Anderson would be free to work on a British Trek that started being produced in late 65/ early 66.

So does this work as a production Timeline (we'll worry about the cast later)
1963/1964 Gene Roddenberry tries to get any US studio interested in his wagon train in space idea. They all dismiss it as being too cerebral with not enough action.
Early 1965 He comes to London. Out of pure reflex he visits the BBC, they do express an interest but do not want to run this alongside Dr Who. He then meets Lew Grade who is very interested as it seems the perfect live action follow up to Thunderbirds. Lew Grade introduces Gene to Gerry and they get on like a house on fire.
1966 Production gets underway at Shepperton Studios. It is a fraught process when the original lead Patrick McGoohan decided that he did not have enough influence and went off to produce the Prisoner. The search for a replacement took some little time as Lew Grade wanted a fairly well known American Actor so he could sell the series to the States, although Lew,Gene and Gerry all liked Stuart Damon, they did not consider him well enough known, in the end they persuaded Canadian Actor Christopher Plummer to take the role of Christopher Pike the captain of the Endeavour(Ark Royal had been the original choice, but on reflection it was felt that American audiences would prefer a single name and the ship was supposed to be an exploratory vessel not a warship)
1967 Finally on Saturday 7th January 1967 Star Trek appears on all the ITV channels at 7:30pm GMT.

 

[ColeMercury]

I figured Roddenberry wanted a name with K in it somewhere, as he did with Pike and Kirk IOTL; however, I think a UK producer would've wanted it more "futuristic-sounding", as they did with a number of other episodes and series' involving future people. From "Kirk" came "Kurt"; however, that probably looked too much like a first name, so a producer would've changed it to "Kert". Slight difference in pronounciation, too, comes into play in order to set them apart.

It just looks weird to me.

For what it's worth, the Captain's name could be basically anything. They proposed a whole bunch of very different names: Hunter, Timber, Boone, Flagg, Drake, Raintree...

I think I had Colin Baker's Twitter handle on my mind. He goes by "Sawbones Hex", or "Doctor Six". "Hex" could also refer to a curse, which I thought was a nice play; to the people of non-Federation planets, Noyce's tech would render him something of a magical figure, or even a witch doctor... get it?

I just prefer Bones. It's iconic for Star Trek. (I do actually like changing Boyce to Noyce, which sounds more English.)

I figured Carmen Munroe would do something similar. Hmmmm... perhaps I should've changed it to Uhuri?

Another issue is that Uhura originated as an African mononym, so matching it with the first name Viola just doesn't seem to fit. If the character has two names both of them will probably be African (or African-ish, like Uhura is).

 

[Lindseyman]

Here is my suggested cast. Thanks to all of you who have suggested actors they all have their merits:
Captain Christopher Pike: Christopher Plummer
Number One: Sian Phillips (Name of Character still not decided)
Chief Science Officer Spock:Stuart Damon
Chief Helmsman Erik Eisen: Ian McKellen
Chief Navigator Leo Chekoverek Jacobi
Chief Security Officer Norman Stiles: Edward Woodward
Chief Engineer Montgomery Scott: Michael Sheard
Chief Medical Officer Phillip Noyce:Leo McKern
Chief Communications Officer Esther McKenzie: Carmen Munroe

 

[High Plains Drifter]

Here is my suggested cast. Thanks to all of you who have suggested actors they all have their merits:
Captain Christopher Pike: Christopher Plummer
Number One: Sian Phillips (Name of Character still not decided)
Chief Science Officer Spock:Stuart Damon
Chief Helmsman Erik Eisen: Ian McKellen
Chief Navigator Leo Chekoverek Jacobi
Chief Security Officer Norman Stiles: Edward Woodward
Chief Engineer Montgomery Scott: Michael Sheard
Chief Medical Officer Phillip Noyce:Leo McKern
Chief Communications Officer Esther McKenzie: Carmen Munroe

My only quibble is whether Plummer would be available/willing after making such a huge name for himself with 1965's The Sound of Music. Granted he wasn't exactly hitting it out of the park with his choice of roles/movies in 66, 67, and 68.

 

[Stolengood]

Chief Helmsman Erik Eisen -- Ian McKellen
Chief Navigator Leo Chekov -- Derek Jacobi

No way in hell these two would be interested in TV, much less sci-fi TV, much less continuing roles in sci-fi TV, at this point. Sorry, but that's really ASB.

 

[sitalkes]

Yes!
I could easily see it working. And going for a lot more than 4 seasons. And yes, it could even work if it starts out as an Australian show ABC and gets picked up by BBC A number of Aussie shows have made it big in the UK. Any Aussies want to work it out that way who might be cast as whom?
And OZ has some very interesting "alien" locations that would be good for filming that nobody from any place else would have ever seen. Everything from the Blue Mountains to Wollemi Pine country to wilderness coasts to grasslands and that's just around Sydney.
And yes, you could get a very interesting bunch of kangaroo-like aliens. The only movie I ever heard about that being tried was on "Tank Girl". And some of the quirkiest plots on TV. Aussies are known for that.

Yes, I can see Skippy meeting a strange woman on a far away planet who dances the Locomotion and hypnotises the local people into watching a soap opera.