An Age of Miracles Continues: The Empire of Rhomania
- Thread starter Basileus444
- Start date
Agreed. It makes this seem more like a real account of historical events as opposed to a story or a timeline about alternative happenings.
Isn't making sure the cycle isn't broken now (but a damn good start) great for forging a kind of nationalism/solidarity in opposing the latins and also for justifying to the population future conflicts or administrative reforms? Using this reason economic/military/national innovations can advance at a high rate with a just cause and a great reason to keep pumping resources and time into them. Also diplomatically all enemies of the latins would feel a good pull to the roman sphere (just not ottomans but they will be crushed and occupied hopefully). I say keeping the cycle unbroken for now can be a good investment for the future, lots of potential.
Evilprodigy
Donor
That more or less already exists though. The same update that explained the wars of Latin aggression as a concept said that all Demetrios III's book did was put academic weight and legitimacy behind a feeling of anti-latin xenophobia already prevalent among the Rhoman population.
And even if it wasn't is that the sort of thing Demetrios III as a character would do? I don't think so. His life goal, or at least the goal of his administration, is to see the end of his invented threat of the Wars of Latin Aggression. It would be out of character for him to exploit it like you outline, even if what you say may make logical sense for national development.
@JSC: Power dynamics are certainly changing quite a bit. I’d say the biggest changes are the collapse in power of the HRE, which has dominated central Europe for the last two hundred years ITTL, and the rise of the Accord. The Triunes and Rhomania are the two titans now, with the Accord acting as a fuzzy smaller third.
Ottomans are definitely really concerned.
@RogueTraderEnthusiast: Thanks.
The danger of massacring nobles vis-à-vis the Accord is more in terms of presenting Rhomania as a rabid state, one that can’t be trusted.
@Grammar Kaiser: Triunes will definitely be coming out of this more than fine.
@Donald Reaver: Well, if said German prince can’t repay his debt, I guess the “bank” will need to repossess his “home”, if you know what I mean. The Triunes have taken losses, but they pale in comparison to what Munich and Constantinople have taken. Henri II said at the beginning of all this that he might lose ten thousand, but the HRE and Rhomania would lose a hundred thousand each. The ratio may not be exactly accurate, but the gist certainly is.
@Evilprodigy: I’m going to be bringing this up in latter updates but it is going to be important in looking at Roman policy in the next few years. There is the ‘break the cycle’ element, to be nasty and brutal and scary, in Demetrios’ mind. But there is also the ‘business as usual’ element, the one playing realpolitik, willing to play the game of diplomacy and intrigue, as well. The two are both present and never reconciled, which means Demetrios’ policy wobbles.
@Tirion: Numbers-wise, the Hungarians didn’t contribute much. A Hungary that was fully loyal to the Wittelsbachs and not being coy might mean the Allies are caught less flat-footed at Thessaloniki. But the odds are so stacked against the Allies that the end result would be the same, albeit perhaps with a few more Roman casualties.
@kaizerfox: Indeed. A lot of the inspiration for Demetrios’ ‘Wars of Latin Aggression’ came from me imagining a TTL Roman scholar looking back at the OTL Crusades + TTL events. The Crusaders frequently rolled out their own ‘stabbed-in-the-back’ myths blaming the Byzantines IOTL when they were beaten by the Muslims.
@Antony444: The Roman-German aspect of the war is going to be winding down soon. But things are rarely that simple.
@Aristomenes: A Roman general and army washing their swords in the Rhine River has a nice ring to it.
Thanks for the name. I want the descendants of her to be prominent down the road.
@Khaine: Yup. Austria’s fairly safe because of the Hungarian interest, and the Hungarians will probably use the ‘surrender to us, or deal with them’ tactic to get the rest of Austria to fall into line fairly quick.
@Lascaris: Agreed. Wholesale post-surrender massacre crosses the line from ruthless to rabid. During the raid into Germany, the Romans had itchy trigger fingers, but the villages that surrendered promptly enough weren’t massacred. They were forced to pay contributions, but that’s nothing unusual for this period.
@Arrix85: The Triune threat is looming very large in Demetrios’ mind.
@Babyrage: The difficulty of logistics is the main defense the HRE has against Rhomania now. Vienna being the high-water mark of the Ottomans has less to do with the incredible fortifications of Vienna (which it didn’t have) and much more with the logistical constraints of the Ottomans. Plus there’s always the risk a threatened German prince might go running to Henri II to help, and in a contest to see who can project power best into Germany, the Triunes will beat the Romans.
@Cryostorm: Henri could get a decent of German states under his umbrella, particularly if a bloodthirsty Rhomania is barreling down on them. Ottokar is also a good possibility provided Henri firstly stays away from the HRE crown and doesn’t fish around in eastern Germany, but there are tension points there certainly. The EAN is also a good possibility since there’s a royal marriage there and the EAN has grievances with both the Lotharingians and the Wittelsbachs, who hold Schleswig-Holstein.
@HanEmpire: It’s on the level of ‘unsubstantiated rumor heard from somewhere, but nobody can remember exactly where and from whom they heard it’. The accuracy is a bit unnerving; Demetrios III is going to have a bit of a posthumous reputation as a sorcerer and it comes from this. (In one of the top-of-the-update quotes a while back, ITTL’s version of Doctor Strange, there’s a reference to a book written by Demetrios III in the library of the training institution.)
Elizabeth really hated Demetrios back when she was Roman Empress, but she (distinctly unlike her brother) never thought he was stupid, just unambitious. The Bavarian vulnerability is definitely much more of a surprise. But there’s not much at this stage she can do about it.
@Vince: I’ll be going into much more detail in an upcoming update, but in Demetrios III’s mind the Hungarian ‘flip’ was much more important in terms of the post-war world he wants to build rather than its effects on the war proper. At best, a Hungary that doesn’t flip means that Thessaloniki is a bit more expensive for the Romans, but doesn’t change the outcome.
@Sceonn: His insanity is based off of OTL King Charles VI, who had lucid bouts in between those of insanity (I really feel sorry for the guy; he definitely didn’t deserve it). Theodor will have bouts of lucidity too.
@ImperatorAlexander: The war will continue, but it’s radically going to change in 1635, with a very different dynamic. Just look at the difference IOTL between the Thirty Years War in 1620, 1630, and 1640. Although having just made an OTL comparison, I must point out that this conflict has long lost any conscious connection to an OTL war.
@Βοανηργές: Blitzkrieg in 1935 should be possible, but that’s a bit long of a wait…
Italy’s definitely going to have some ‘cartographical adjustments’.
@Curtain Jerker: Glad you enjoyed it and good to know. I’ll try to work in more tidbits like that.
@emperor joe: Such a great site. You can get everything there, even ‘Andreas Niketas condoms: Because you don’t need a Time of Troubles in the bedroom’.
…I should be sorry, but I’m not.
@Bergioyn: It does make for a more ‘lived-in’ feel to things.
@boringasian: Realistically, I don’t think the cycle will ever be broken (because I think it’s a pattern that doesn’t really exist save in Roman/Demetrios III’s historiography-there are certainly suggestions toward it, including from OTL, but what’s the term for people’s tendencies to see patterns out of what are really unrelated phenomena? That’s strongly at play here). The Latins will always exist, and as such always be at least a theoretical threat to Rhomania.
Ottomans are definitely really concerned.
@RogueTraderEnthusiast: Thanks.
The danger of massacring nobles vis-à-vis the Accord is more in terms of presenting Rhomania as a rabid state, one that can’t be trusted.
@Grammar Kaiser: Triunes will definitely be coming out of this more than fine.
@Donald Reaver: Well, if said German prince can’t repay his debt, I guess the “bank” will need to repossess his “home”, if you know what I mean. The Triunes have taken losses, but they pale in comparison to what Munich and Constantinople have taken. Henri II said at the beginning of all this that he might lose ten thousand, but the HRE and Rhomania would lose a hundred thousand each. The ratio may not be exactly accurate, but the gist certainly is.
@Evilprodigy: I’m going to be bringing this up in latter updates but it is going to be important in looking at Roman policy in the next few years. There is the ‘break the cycle’ element, to be nasty and brutal and scary, in Demetrios’ mind. But there is also the ‘business as usual’ element, the one playing realpolitik, willing to play the game of diplomacy and intrigue, as well. The two are both present and never reconciled, which means Demetrios’ policy wobbles.
@Tirion: Numbers-wise, the Hungarians didn’t contribute much. A Hungary that was fully loyal to the Wittelsbachs and not being coy might mean the Allies are caught less flat-footed at Thessaloniki. But the odds are so stacked against the Allies that the end result would be the same, albeit perhaps with a few more Roman casualties.
@kaizerfox: Indeed. A lot of the inspiration for Demetrios’ ‘Wars of Latin Aggression’ came from me imagining a TTL Roman scholar looking back at the OTL Crusades + TTL events. The Crusaders frequently rolled out their own ‘stabbed-in-the-back’ myths blaming the Byzantines IOTL when they were beaten by the Muslims.
@Antony444: The Roman-German aspect of the war is going to be winding down soon. But things are rarely that simple.
@Aristomenes: A Roman general and army washing their swords in the Rhine River has a nice ring to it.
Thanks for the name. I want the descendants of her to be prominent down the road.
@Khaine: Yup. Austria’s fairly safe because of the Hungarian interest, and the Hungarians will probably use the ‘surrender to us, or deal with them’ tactic to get the rest of Austria to fall into line fairly quick.
@Lascaris: Agreed. Wholesale post-surrender massacre crosses the line from ruthless to rabid. During the raid into Germany, the Romans had itchy trigger fingers, but the villages that surrendered promptly enough weren’t massacred. They were forced to pay contributions, but that’s nothing unusual for this period.
@Arrix85: The Triune threat is looming very large in Demetrios’ mind.
@Babyrage: The difficulty of logistics is the main defense the HRE has against Rhomania now. Vienna being the high-water mark of the Ottomans has less to do with the incredible fortifications of Vienna (which it didn’t have) and much more with the logistical constraints of the Ottomans. Plus there’s always the risk a threatened German prince might go running to Henri II to help, and in a contest to see who can project power best into Germany, the Triunes will beat the Romans.
@Cryostorm: Henri could get a decent of German states under his umbrella, particularly if a bloodthirsty Rhomania is barreling down on them. Ottokar is also a good possibility provided Henri firstly stays away from the HRE crown and doesn’t fish around in eastern Germany, but there are tension points there certainly. The EAN is also a good possibility since there’s a royal marriage there and the EAN has grievances with both the Lotharingians and the Wittelsbachs, who hold Schleswig-Holstein.
@HanEmpire: It’s on the level of ‘unsubstantiated rumor heard from somewhere, but nobody can remember exactly where and from whom they heard it’. The accuracy is a bit unnerving; Demetrios III is going to have a bit of a posthumous reputation as a sorcerer and it comes from this. (In one of the top-of-the-update quotes a while back, ITTL’s version of Doctor Strange, there’s a reference to a book written by Demetrios III in the library of the training institution.)
Elizabeth really hated Demetrios back when she was Roman Empress, but she (distinctly unlike her brother) never thought he was stupid, just unambitious. The Bavarian vulnerability is definitely much more of a surprise. But there’s not much at this stage she can do about it.
@Vince: I’ll be going into much more detail in an upcoming update, but in Demetrios III’s mind the Hungarian ‘flip’ was much more important in terms of the post-war world he wants to build rather than its effects on the war proper. At best, a Hungary that doesn’t flip means that Thessaloniki is a bit more expensive for the Romans, but doesn’t change the outcome.
@Sceonn: His insanity is based off of OTL King Charles VI, who had lucid bouts in between those of insanity (I really feel sorry for the guy; he definitely didn’t deserve it). Theodor will have bouts of lucidity too.
@ImperatorAlexander: The war will continue, but it’s radically going to change in 1635, with a very different dynamic. Just look at the difference IOTL between the Thirty Years War in 1620, 1630, and 1640. Although having just made an OTL comparison, I must point out that this conflict has long lost any conscious connection to an OTL war.
@Βοανηργές: Blitzkrieg in 1935 should be possible, but that’s a bit long of a wait…
Italy’s definitely going to have some ‘cartographical adjustments’.
@Curtain Jerker: Glad you enjoyed it and good to know. I’ll try to work in more tidbits like that.
@emperor joe: Such a great site. You can get everything there, even ‘Andreas Niketas condoms: Because you don’t need a Time of Troubles in the bedroom’.
…I should be sorry, but I’m not.
@Bergioyn: It does make for a more ‘lived-in’ feel to things.
@boringasian: Realistically, I don’t think the cycle will ever be broken (because I think it’s a pattern that doesn’t really exist save in Roman/Demetrios III’s historiography-there are certainly suggestions toward it, including from OTL, but what’s the term for people’s tendencies to see patterns out of what are really unrelated phenomena? That’s strongly at play here). The Latins will always exist, and as such always be at least a theoretical threat to Rhomania.
I've mentioned before somewhere but I wouldn't use Ottoman force projection as necessarily the same as Roman force projection. The Ottomans had to have an army form in Thrace because the entirety of the Balkans was not their ethnic/religious kin. In contrast the Romans would be able to form armies at Skoupoi/Vidin/Thessaloniki and march from there. I gives them an extra couple hundred kilometres reach into Germany. This is even before you factor in that the Adriatic is a Roman Lake and will help with supply immensely. I'd put the Roman equivalent of Vienna around the line of Munich/Prague. The Romans should be able to sustain an army and campaign actively throughout Austria/Czechia/South Bavaria in a way the OTL Ottomans could not and though a Roman army washing their swords in the Rhine is not possible at this time, a Roman flying column of a couple hundred doing so would be within the realm of possibility depending on the situation.
Roman control over the Danube is likely much better as well with the Vlachs as allies and the Hungarians at least cooperative. That would be very useful for the lines of supply as well though I'm no sure how much better Roman control over it here is better than Ottoman control in the real world.
Even if a third of the great legion that wiped out the Allied army was left standing that would be enough to wreck southern Germany. I don't think though that will be needed, as for the first time in a very long time, there is a Roman army in the Upper Danube. The Tagma of Germania and Hungary gobbling what it can of Austria, keeping the momentum on Rhomes side. A less distracting Italy is going to compound what that really means, especially after a healthy addition to the Venetian hinterlands, to possibly include Verona, Trent & Triviso. I don't see any grand Justinian reborn stuff, but D3 is going to make sure it is understood that if needed, Rhome can hit where she wants with conviction, to preserve her sovereignty. 200k in Thessaloniki with half moved from the East? Surely incredible, but almost 90k with the TofG included roving in half the Wittelsbach lands with Munich under a dedicated siege? Terrifying.
But, how far does D3 want to push the message? Austria looks like she's going to be eaten at least halfway by Hungry, maybe some territory in the Adriatic for Rhome.
But, how far does D3 want to push the message? Austria looks like she's going to be eaten at least halfway by Hungry, maybe some territory in the Adriatic for Rhome.
Honestly I think it’s a prime opportunity for another German prince to rally others to his banner and form a third power in the Reich.
With the Bohemians and Wittelsbachs at each other’s throats and the Triunes rolling through the Western border, chaos is a ladder.
Maybe the Duke of Württemberg but his fate seems to be tied to the Wittelsbachs, perhaps even the Welfs?
With the Bohemians and Wittelsbachs at each other’s throats and the Triunes rolling through the Western border, chaos is a ladder.
Maybe the Duke of Württemberg but his fate seems to be tied to the Wittelsbachs, perhaps even the Welfs?
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Or maybe this is where the House of Habsburg finds the opportunity to raise its banner.
better ideia,use the chaos has opportunatie to create the despote of Germania.
Impossible. Aside from the power projection (one thing is sending an army to smash stuff, another is to hold it), EVERYONE in Europe would turn on them.
Yeah, nah. You seriously expect a German Despot when the Romans aren’t even willing to annex Serbia?
What would be interesting is if every major power backs someone in the Reich. The Triunes try to set up a puppet Emperor in a small western duchy, the Romans/Hungarians back the Bohemians in exchange for Austria and a free pass to deal with the Lombards, the EAN back the Wittelsbachs in exchange for Schleswig-Holstein (and to serve as a strong counterbalance to the Triunes), maybe the Accord backs a southern Duke too?
A free for all to remake the HRE.
Cryostorm
Monthly Donor
That is one way to make a very ATL 30 Years War where everyone gets to play and strange alliances end up getting made.
Glad people liked my condom joke. So not sorry…
@JSC: All very good points, but Anatolia is also a much bigger player for the Romans than the Ottomans. If a Roman Emperor was assembling a mega-army, they’d need troops from the west Anatolian themes, and that time needed for transfer would eat up a chunk of the campaigning season. However if said Emperor was willing to stick to troops already in Europe, the European tagmata plus the guard tagmata in the capital, these would have a head-start compared to an OTL Ottoman army or a TTL Roman one that was pulling from Anatolian tagmata.
(This is all predicated on the assumption of a standing start to the campaign, which obviously isn’t the case here.)
@TheCataphract: I’m not sure how much better it is either. Vlachia is much more loyal to Rhomania than Wallachia was as a vassal to the Ottomans, but it’s not something I can quantify.
@Duke of Nova Scotia: If one took d’Este’s 10K + 20K Hungarians + 20K Roman reinforcements, that alone would make for a 50K army. The HRE in 1630 would have to take such a force seriously, but wouldn’t have any real difficulty in smacking that back. The situation in 1635 is obviously rather different.
That is the big question. There’s always the risk of pushing too far and running into Triunes, and the Triunes can project power into the bulk of Germany far more easily than the Romans.
@ImperatorAlexander: There’ll be a bit more on them later but the Welfs are the next contender after the Wittelsbachs and Premyslids.
@MarshalofMontival: That’d be a good twist. If they could get backing from the Accord proper, as opposed to just the Bernese League, they’d have a good chance.
@sebastiao: Germany’s too far away and too big and populous for that to work. Bites out of the southeast are possible, and raids further afield too, but anything more that even managed to be created wouldn’t last very long under pressure from the Triunes.
@Arrix85: Precisely. The Triunes can project power into Germany much more easily than Rhomania (except for the southeast), so they’d be able to destroy said Despotate even without any help.
@JohnSmith: The Imperial throne is vacant, rebellion and war having driven out the ruling family. The Houses of Premyslid, Welf, Hohenzollern, and Habsburg battle over the rule of the western empire, while to the east the last female scion of the once-mighty House of Wittelsbach plots to return to the land of her forefathers, to reclaim her birthright by fire and blood…
Seems vaguely familiar.
@Cryostorm: My favorite is the OTL War of the League of Cambrai, where Venice, the Papacy, and France all take turns allying and fighting the other two, all in the same war.
So not sorry…@JSC: All very good points, but Anatolia is also a much bigger player for the Romans than the Ottomans. If a Roman Emperor was assembling a mega-army, they’d need troops from the west Anatolian themes, and that time needed for transfer would eat up a chunk of the campaigning season. However if said Emperor was willing to stick to troops already in Europe, the European tagmata plus the guard tagmata in the capital, these would have a head-start compared to an OTL Ottoman army or a TTL Roman one that was pulling from Anatolian tagmata.
(This is all predicated on the assumption of a standing start to the campaign, which obviously isn’t the case here.)
@TheCataphract: I’m not sure how much better it is either. Vlachia is much more loyal to Rhomania than Wallachia was as a vassal to the Ottomans, but it’s not something I can quantify.
@Duke of Nova Scotia: If one took d’Este’s 10K + 20K Hungarians + 20K Roman reinforcements, that alone would make for a 50K army. The HRE in 1630 would have to take such a force seriously, but wouldn’t have any real difficulty in smacking that back. The situation in 1635 is obviously rather different.
That is the big question. There’s always the risk of pushing too far and running into Triunes, and the Triunes can project power into the bulk of Germany far more easily than the Romans.
@ImperatorAlexander: There’ll be a bit more on them later but the Welfs are the next contender after the Wittelsbachs and Premyslids.
@MarshalofMontival: That’d be a good twist. If they could get backing from the Accord proper, as opposed to just the Bernese League, they’d have a good chance.
@sebastiao: Germany’s too far away and too big and populous for that to work. Bites out of the southeast are possible, and raids further afield too, but anything more that even managed to be created wouldn’t last very long under pressure from the Triunes.
@Arrix85: Precisely. The Triunes can project power into Germany much more easily than Rhomania (except for the southeast), so they’d be able to destroy said Despotate even without any help.
@JohnSmith: The Imperial throne is vacant, rebellion and war having driven out the ruling family. The Houses of Premyslid, Welf, Hohenzollern, and Habsburg battle over the rule of the western empire, while to the east the last female scion of the once-mighty House of Wittelsbach plots to return to the land of her forefathers, to reclaim her birthright by fire and blood…
Seems vaguely familiar.
@Cryostorm: My favorite is the OTL War of the League of Cambrai, where Venice, the Papacy, and France all take turns allying and fighting the other two, all in the same war.
1634: The Treaty of Belgrade
1634 continued: Prior to the summit at Belgrade, there is some ‘housekeeping’ to be done in Serbia. King Durad and Emperor Demetrios certainly agree that Despot Lazar needs to go. The Serbian people, whether from an honest preference for Durad or a desire to be on the winning side, feel the same way.
Durad, to emphasize that he is not a Roman puppet, marches into Serbia with just the Serbs originally under his command, plus new additions. The various Serbian defectors and prisoners gathered in over the summer and fall, both in Macedonia and those taken by Mauromanikos, were all remanded to Durad’s custody. He made a simple offer, join him and receive food and pay as soldiers in his army, or they can die as traitors. Few quibbled. But nevertheless all in Serbia know that if needed, there is a scarily-large army behind him.
Lazar knows of the might behind his younger brother. For good reason, he does not come off well in the history books; at best he is impetuous and prone to panic at the sign of trouble. But the prospect of impending doom here concentrates his mind wonderfully. Fleeing to the Holy Roman Empire isn’t practical or even promising, and knowing his brother he is unlikely to survive long in his custody. Yet he is not inclined to go out meekly.
No one in Serbia is going to support him now against Durad and Lazar knows it, planning accordingly. When members of his own personal guard come to arrest him in Durad’s name, he is seated at a table in his personal study, wearing his usual baggy clothing. He hurls curses upon them as oath-breakers, for they swore allegiance to him on his accession to the throne. While some look embarrassed, others seem less bothered.
The captain of the guard, whom Lazar had appointed just a few days into his reign, starts lecturing Lazar on his failings as a ruler. The Despot/King seems to agree, and then pulls a kyzikos out from under the table and shoots the captain in the face. He is dead before he hits the floor. Pulling out more weapons from under the table, he attacks the rest of the surprised guards.
Not expecting any resistance, much less this, the guards are even more surprised when they find out that under his baggy clothing Lazar is wearing Macedonian plate armor, impervious to their swords. Aside from the captain, Lazar kills or wounds four more guards before he is cut down, but his final words before he dies are that he will report their betrayal of a king to the King of Kings.
As an exit, it certainly has its advantages compared to the fate of the rest of his family. His three young children, two boys and a girl, none of whom are more than nine, and his wife were to be smuggled out of the country. Lazar had stayed behind deliberately to divert attention away from them. An Arletian ship has been chartered, with the assistance of the Prince-Bishop of the Black Mountain, to carry them to safety. But the children’s personal tutor betrays them, pocketing a sizeable fee for his troubles. By the end of 1635, all of Lazar’s family are dead, reportedly of illnesses contracted in captivity. Given the young age of the children, there is some plausibility to this, but more than a few then and now suspect foul play.
As for the tutor, in 1637 he travels on a business trip to Constantinople. Three days after arriving, his body is found lying face-first in a ditch with multiple stab wounds. Apparently there had been an argument in a nearby gambling house over accusations of cheating and things had escalated.
The conference at Belgrade is not just between Emperor Demetrios III and King Stephan VII. Both King Durad I of Serbia and King Roman I of Vlachia are also present, plus a representative of the Sovereign Prince-Bishop of the Black Mountain.
Demetrios wants security on Rhomania’s European frontier. As the War of Mohacs and now this have clearly shown, the current system needs to be changed from Constantinople’s perspective. Many have called for the annexation of territory in the west, as a buffer zone against future Latin aggression. Yet Demetrios, for all his desire to ‘break the cycle’, is not in that number.
With Serbia, he has already opted for a friendly independent neighbor as opposed to a disgruntled vassal, electing against conquest. Hungary would’ve been far worse. The Serbians were at least Orthodox, there are 3 times more Hungarians than Serbians, and Hungary is far better placed to receive aid from co-religionists. In short, it’d be another and bigger Syria, and the Emperor wants nothing to do with that.
Demetrios sees another way. While he included Hungarian attacks in his wars of Latin aggression, he is also aware that those are of fairly recent occurrence, and were not always the case. In 1396 the Roman Empire and Kingdom of Hungary signed the Treaty of Dyrrachium, which had outlined spheres of influence and the maintenance of Serbia and Bulgaria as buffer states, to ensure that the two powers never came to blows.
The Treaty had been fundamental to good Hungarian-Roman relations throughout the 1400s. It was a Hungarian attack on Venetian territory that broke the Venetian siege of Constantinople in 1456. When Pope Julius II had called for the Tenth Crusade against Rhomania, Hungary had refused to join the call. But the treaty has been dead for a long time now, and it must be admitted that it was the Romans that broke it, not the Hungarians.
Demetrios wants to create a new Treaty of Dyrrachium, but better and more durable, which is why he wants the Serbians and Vlachs on board as well. And right now he has very good leverage.
The first step is to soothe the ruffled feathers of the Vlachs. They’ve done excellent service as a Roman ally and naturally expect rewards for it. Plus the Hungarians are their historical enemies and much of the Vlach war effort was spent raiding the Hungarians and vice-versa. The tool used is naturally money, firstly subsidies to Targoviste in recognition of her war efforts. Demetrios also grants King Roman several Roman titles that come with yearly retainers that he can distribute to his notables as rewards and recognition as he sees fit, plus some granted directly to Vlach commanders by the Emperor. Demetrios also makes promises regarding Galicia.
For starters, all four states agree to recognize the antebellum borders of all the parties in the Haemic (Balkan) peninsula. Furthermore all signatories will guarantee said borders against any power violating said frontiers, whether that be one of the signatories or a non-Haemic power. This is a great boon to Hungary, Serbia, and Vlachia as it gets them formal Roman backing, while the Romans now have a cordon of buffer states.
Demetrios’ greatest concern for the stability of this treaty is the Hungarians and Vlachs coming to blows. Also the antebellum borders are unfavorable to the Hungarians and the Basileus is well aware of the resentment still felt by the Magyars against the Romans.
During the negotiations, Demetrios agrees to provide men, material, and money for a Vlach re-conquest of Galicia, controlled by Targoviste between the Tenth Crusade and the Time of Troubles, and a Hungarian re-conquest of Austria. Once retaken, both Galicia and Austria shall be included in the territories guaranteed by the treaty. This has the advantage of focusing both powers’ attentions away from each other.
To help secure those conquests, the Empire also pledges to provide a two-thousand-strong garrison for both Vienna and Halych, which had served as the capital of Vlach Galicia. Rhomania shall provide the men and pay, while the Hungarians or Vlachs will provide provisions. Demetrios views both Austria and Galicia as ‘forward bastions’ for European Rhomania, while the Hungarians and Vlachs like the idea as it serves as a tripwire that will ensure Roman intervention in the case another power tries to retake said lands.
In a side negotiation with Durad, Demetrios also ‘convinces’ the Serbian king to lease the Belgrade citadel to a Roman garrison. The Romans will repair the Belgrade city defenses and citadel at their own cost, and start paying an annual installment for the lease of the citadel in 1639. The Empire shall be responsible for paying and provisioning the garrison, but any provisions for the garrison imported into Serbia shall be exempt from any Serbian customs. Durad isn’t happy about these, but he can’t refuse and Demetrios is insistent; Belgrade is too strategically important. There are the face-saving gestures though that the Serbian banner will still fly above the fortress at equal level to the Roman tetragram and that the Roman kastrophylax will personally present the annual installment at the Serbian court.
King Stephan had not been aware of Demetrios’ exact plans prior to the summit. The terms for Hungary’s change of alliance had merely been that Hungary would not forfeit any territory, including in Croatia, and that any Roman armies marching through Hungary would be disciplined and orderly and pay for provisions and lodging at fair rates. So while the confirmation of the losses from the War of Mohacs is painful, this is a welcome surprise.
But he had an inkling. King Stephan is commonly known now as “the Silent”, not just for his laconic nature, but also ability to keep secrets and to hide his feelings. He’d been sidelined ever since he became King at the tender age of seven in 1614 after the disaster of Mohacs, overshadowed by his regents. Used to being ignored and underestimated, he’d turned that into a strength. He’d also learned to carefully research potential allies and enemies, and that included one Demetrios III Sideros.
It was Demetrios’ treatment of King, not Despot, Durad that convinced Stephan he could get a fair treatment from the Roman Emperor. And Stephan had brought up the Treaty of Dyrrachium when discussing the post-war order, although Demetrios seems to have already been thinking around those lines.
Stephan also sent Demetrios, as gifts, several histories and also texts on the latest astronomical discoveries, having heard of the Emperor’s stellar observations with Athena. They include the first work to document sunspots, a description of Saturn’s ring system and recently discovered moon Titan, and also a star that is later revealed to be the planet Uranus. Reciprocating, Demetrios at Belgrade returns some of the books and artwork looted from the Royal Palace in Buda, with the promise to return the remainder in the spring, a gesture which pleases Stephan and the Patriots greatly. They view those losses as a national disgrace and humiliation; that is a sentiment the Romans, looking back at 1204, can easily understand and appreciate.
That is not the only thing to be returning to Hungary in the spring. While all Hungarian prisoners are kept at their work stations, dating from the battle of Thessaloniki they are paid the going rate for that labor as done by Roman workers. In the springtime they will be released and provided transport to return to Hungary.
Finally, the Treaty of Belgrade includes provisions to improve navigation along the Danube, with reduced “most-favored-nation” tariff levels on certain products shipped along the waterway, and an agreement to bar merchants from non-signatory powers (Dalmatia is listed as a signatory for this purpose). Many of these are agricultural and animal products in high demand in the cities of the Aegean basin. This is another effort by Demetrios to tug the other R-SHV (Rhomania, Serbia, Hungary, Vlachia) powers into the Roman orbit, but with a light touch, in the way Vlachia already, plus Scythia and also Georgia, became Roman satellites.
Demetrios III uses an astronomical analogy to illustrate his goal. “The Empire shall be like Jupiter, the lord of the planets, with the signatory powers, alongside the Despotates, vassals, Russian principalities, and Georgia, as a greater number of Avashvilian [Galilean] moons. The exact nature of their orbits are determined by their distance from Jupiter and their own innate mass, but they are indisputably satellites of some nature.”
Continuing, he says “But there are other planets as well within the universe. Perhaps the Triple Monarchy can be represented by triple-bodied Saturn. (Early observations of Saturn with a dalnovzor were unable to identify the rings of Saturn as such, Saturn appearing as one large central and two smaller adjacent objects. Demetrios had not yet read the book explaining Saturn’s form as a ring system that had been sent by King Stephan when he wrote this.) It has its own path and place, and so long as it does not cross paths with Jupiter or attempt to steal its satellites, all will be well.
And finally, it must be noted that both Jupiter and Saturn, and the other planets as well, orbit the Sun, as far above Jupiter as Jupiter is above the Avashvilian moons. A reminder that for all the mightiness of Empire, there is always at least one being greater.”
Durad, to emphasize that he is not a Roman puppet, marches into Serbia with just the Serbs originally under his command, plus new additions. The various Serbian defectors and prisoners gathered in over the summer and fall, both in Macedonia and those taken by Mauromanikos, were all remanded to Durad’s custody. He made a simple offer, join him and receive food and pay as soldiers in his army, or they can die as traitors. Few quibbled. But nevertheless all in Serbia know that if needed, there is a scarily-large army behind him.
Lazar knows of the might behind his younger brother. For good reason, he does not come off well in the history books; at best he is impetuous and prone to panic at the sign of trouble. But the prospect of impending doom here concentrates his mind wonderfully. Fleeing to the Holy Roman Empire isn’t practical or even promising, and knowing his brother he is unlikely to survive long in his custody. Yet he is not inclined to go out meekly.
No one in Serbia is going to support him now against Durad and Lazar knows it, planning accordingly. When members of his own personal guard come to arrest him in Durad’s name, he is seated at a table in his personal study, wearing his usual baggy clothing. He hurls curses upon them as oath-breakers, for they swore allegiance to him on his accession to the throne. While some look embarrassed, others seem less bothered.
The captain of the guard, whom Lazar had appointed just a few days into his reign, starts lecturing Lazar on his failings as a ruler. The Despot/King seems to agree, and then pulls a kyzikos out from under the table and shoots the captain in the face. He is dead before he hits the floor. Pulling out more weapons from under the table, he attacks the rest of the surprised guards.
Not expecting any resistance, much less this, the guards are even more surprised when they find out that under his baggy clothing Lazar is wearing Macedonian plate armor, impervious to their swords. Aside from the captain, Lazar kills or wounds four more guards before he is cut down, but his final words before he dies are that he will report their betrayal of a king to the King of Kings.
As an exit, it certainly has its advantages compared to the fate of the rest of his family. His three young children, two boys and a girl, none of whom are more than nine, and his wife were to be smuggled out of the country. Lazar had stayed behind deliberately to divert attention away from them. An Arletian ship has been chartered, with the assistance of the Prince-Bishop of the Black Mountain, to carry them to safety. But the children’s personal tutor betrays them, pocketing a sizeable fee for his troubles. By the end of 1635, all of Lazar’s family are dead, reportedly of illnesses contracted in captivity. Given the young age of the children, there is some plausibility to this, but more than a few then and now suspect foul play.
As for the tutor, in 1637 he travels on a business trip to Constantinople. Three days after arriving, his body is found lying face-first in a ditch with multiple stab wounds. Apparently there had been an argument in a nearby gambling house over accusations of cheating and things had escalated.
The conference at Belgrade is not just between Emperor Demetrios III and King Stephan VII. Both King Durad I of Serbia and King Roman I of Vlachia are also present, plus a representative of the Sovereign Prince-Bishop of the Black Mountain.
Demetrios wants security on Rhomania’s European frontier. As the War of Mohacs and now this have clearly shown, the current system needs to be changed from Constantinople’s perspective. Many have called for the annexation of territory in the west, as a buffer zone against future Latin aggression. Yet Demetrios, for all his desire to ‘break the cycle’, is not in that number.
With Serbia, he has already opted for a friendly independent neighbor as opposed to a disgruntled vassal, electing against conquest. Hungary would’ve been far worse. The Serbians were at least Orthodox, there are 3 times more Hungarians than Serbians, and Hungary is far better placed to receive aid from co-religionists. In short, it’d be another and bigger Syria, and the Emperor wants nothing to do with that.
Demetrios sees another way. While he included Hungarian attacks in his wars of Latin aggression, he is also aware that those are of fairly recent occurrence, and were not always the case. In 1396 the Roman Empire and Kingdom of Hungary signed the Treaty of Dyrrachium, which had outlined spheres of influence and the maintenance of Serbia and Bulgaria as buffer states, to ensure that the two powers never came to blows.
The Treaty had been fundamental to good Hungarian-Roman relations throughout the 1400s. It was a Hungarian attack on Venetian territory that broke the Venetian siege of Constantinople in 1456. When Pope Julius II had called for the Tenth Crusade against Rhomania, Hungary had refused to join the call. But the treaty has been dead for a long time now, and it must be admitted that it was the Romans that broke it, not the Hungarians.
Demetrios wants to create a new Treaty of Dyrrachium, but better and more durable, which is why he wants the Serbians and Vlachs on board as well. And right now he has very good leverage.
The first step is to soothe the ruffled feathers of the Vlachs. They’ve done excellent service as a Roman ally and naturally expect rewards for it. Plus the Hungarians are their historical enemies and much of the Vlach war effort was spent raiding the Hungarians and vice-versa. The tool used is naturally money, firstly subsidies to Targoviste in recognition of her war efforts. Demetrios also grants King Roman several Roman titles that come with yearly retainers that he can distribute to his notables as rewards and recognition as he sees fit, plus some granted directly to Vlach commanders by the Emperor. Demetrios also makes promises regarding Galicia.
For starters, all four states agree to recognize the antebellum borders of all the parties in the Haemic (Balkan) peninsula. Furthermore all signatories will guarantee said borders against any power violating said frontiers, whether that be one of the signatories or a non-Haemic power. This is a great boon to Hungary, Serbia, and Vlachia as it gets them formal Roman backing, while the Romans now have a cordon of buffer states.
Demetrios’ greatest concern for the stability of this treaty is the Hungarians and Vlachs coming to blows. Also the antebellum borders are unfavorable to the Hungarians and the Basileus is well aware of the resentment still felt by the Magyars against the Romans.
During the negotiations, Demetrios agrees to provide men, material, and money for a Vlach re-conquest of Galicia, controlled by Targoviste between the Tenth Crusade and the Time of Troubles, and a Hungarian re-conquest of Austria. Once retaken, both Galicia and Austria shall be included in the territories guaranteed by the treaty. This has the advantage of focusing both powers’ attentions away from each other.
To help secure those conquests, the Empire also pledges to provide a two-thousand-strong garrison for both Vienna and Halych, which had served as the capital of Vlach Galicia. Rhomania shall provide the men and pay, while the Hungarians or Vlachs will provide provisions. Demetrios views both Austria and Galicia as ‘forward bastions’ for European Rhomania, while the Hungarians and Vlachs like the idea as it serves as a tripwire that will ensure Roman intervention in the case another power tries to retake said lands.
In a side negotiation with Durad, Demetrios also ‘convinces’ the Serbian king to lease the Belgrade citadel to a Roman garrison. The Romans will repair the Belgrade city defenses and citadel at their own cost, and start paying an annual installment for the lease of the citadel in 1639. The Empire shall be responsible for paying and provisioning the garrison, but any provisions for the garrison imported into Serbia shall be exempt from any Serbian customs. Durad isn’t happy about these, but he can’t refuse and Demetrios is insistent; Belgrade is too strategically important. There are the face-saving gestures though that the Serbian banner will still fly above the fortress at equal level to the Roman tetragram and that the Roman kastrophylax will personally present the annual installment at the Serbian court.
King Stephan had not been aware of Demetrios’ exact plans prior to the summit. The terms for Hungary’s change of alliance had merely been that Hungary would not forfeit any territory, including in Croatia, and that any Roman armies marching through Hungary would be disciplined and orderly and pay for provisions and lodging at fair rates. So while the confirmation of the losses from the War of Mohacs is painful, this is a welcome surprise.
But he had an inkling. King Stephan is commonly known now as “the Silent”, not just for his laconic nature, but also ability to keep secrets and to hide his feelings. He’d been sidelined ever since he became King at the tender age of seven in 1614 after the disaster of Mohacs, overshadowed by his regents. Used to being ignored and underestimated, he’d turned that into a strength. He’d also learned to carefully research potential allies and enemies, and that included one Demetrios III Sideros.
It was Demetrios’ treatment of King, not Despot, Durad that convinced Stephan he could get a fair treatment from the Roman Emperor. And Stephan had brought up the Treaty of Dyrrachium when discussing the post-war order, although Demetrios seems to have already been thinking around those lines.
Stephan also sent Demetrios, as gifts, several histories and also texts on the latest astronomical discoveries, having heard of the Emperor’s stellar observations with Athena. They include the first work to document sunspots, a description of Saturn’s ring system and recently discovered moon Titan, and also a star that is later revealed to be the planet Uranus. Reciprocating, Demetrios at Belgrade returns some of the books and artwork looted from the Royal Palace in Buda, with the promise to return the remainder in the spring, a gesture which pleases Stephan and the Patriots greatly. They view those losses as a national disgrace and humiliation; that is a sentiment the Romans, looking back at 1204, can easily understand and appreciate.
That is not the only thing to be returning to Hungary in the spring. While all Hungarian prisoners are kept at their work stations, dating from the battle of Thessaloniki they are paid the going rate for that labor as done by Roman workers. In the springtime they will be released and provided transport to return to Hungary.
Finally, the Treaty of Belgrade includes provisions to improve navigation along the Danube, with reduced “most-favored-nation” tariff levels on certain products shipped along the waterway, and an agreement to bar merchants from non-signatory powers (Dalmatia is listed as a signatory for this purpose). Many of these are agricultural and animal products in high demand in the cities of the Aegean basin. This is another effort by Demetrios to tug the other R-SHV (Rhomania, Serbia, Hungary, Vlachia) powers into the Roman orbit, but with a light touch, in the way Vlachia already, plus Scythia and also Georgia, became Roman satellites.
Demetrios III uses an astronomical analogy to illustrate his goal. “The Empire shall be like Jupiter, the lord of the planets, with the signatory powers, alongside the Despotates, vassals, Russian principalities, and Georgia, as a greater number of Avashvilian [Galilean] moons. The exact nature of their orbits are determined by their distance from Jupiter and their own innate mass, but they are indisputably satellites of some nature.”
Continuing, he says “But there are other planets as well within the universe. Perhaps the Triple Monarchy can be represented by triple-bodied Saturn. (Early observations of Saturn with a dalnovzor were unable to identify the rings of Saturn as such, Saturn appearing as one large central and two smaller adjacent objects. Demetrios had not yet read the book explaining Saturn’s form as a ring system that had been sent by King Stephan when he wrote this.) It has its own path and place, and so long as it does not cross paths with Jupiter or attempt to steal its satellites, all will be well.
And finally, it must be noted that both Jupiter and Saturn, and the other planets as well, orbit the Sun, as far above Jupiter as Jupiter is above the Avashvilian moons. A reminder that for all the mightiness of Empire, there is always at least one being greater.”