Save an extinct ethnic group

[Arkenfolm]

it would be interesting I think.

Neanderthals are white tough, so to europeans they could be considered less foreign then magreb or african decended people.
The biggest give away could have been the voice but who knows if todays representation is correct, funny thing that from all the jobs neanderthals could do producing a decend falsetto is one of them

I highly doubt that. If we're talking about scientific racism, Maghrebi people were always considered a branch of the white race (albeit with varying levels of black African ancestry otherwise found only in Southern Italians and some Iberians). Between their facial features and skin color (not the same as any European groups to my knowledge), Neanderthals would be correctly identified as incredibly "primitive" and probably labeled as some failed offshoot of the ancestors of humans. This is the same era that brought us this cartoon that portrayed the Irish as closer to Africans than good Englishmen and Germans on the basis of skull shape:

Other Europeans with "Asiatic" traits like Finns, Hungarians, and Slavs faced similar discrimination at times. There's absolutely no way a living Neanderthal wouldn't be portrayed as non-white in scientific racism, and probably on the same level as Africans or Australian Aboriginals were as closer to monkeys than white people. Undoubtedly there would've been a LONG history of discrimination against them since no matter which way you put it, there's something very "off" about that face, and that's the browline, cheekbones, and ears. The difficulties of hybridising with H. s. sapiens would also be known. IMO they'd probably have been a slave/servant race most of history given their muscles.

One has 1024 (Great)8 Grand-parents and 1,048,576 (Great)18 Grand-parents, the latter being only 560 years or the time of the (so-called) Wars of the Roses (watch Mary Worsley's show on said war), so statistically it's almost certain that I have Baltic Prussian ancestors.

One slight note, that's the maximum number, in practice almost everyone has far less because a limited number of marriage partners and practical concerns like inheritance made marriages between cousins relatively common.

 

[Abuela Danger]

There were a lot of Goths at my high school, don't think they're anywhere near extinct

JK, but seriously, it would be cool to have a surviving East Germanic culture. Also, I wonder how they would have influenced WWII, would Hitler have tried to draft them as "fellow Germanics" to fight against the Slavs in the USSR, or would he have viewed them as too Slavicized?

 

[Piave92]

Pannonian & African neolatins

 

[DUWANG]

There's absolutely no way a living Neanderthal wouldn't be portrayed as non-white in scientific racism, and probably on the same level as Africans or Australian Aboriginals were as closer to monkeys than white people. Undoubtedly there would've been a LONG history of discrimination against them since no matter which way you put it, there's something very "off" about that face, and that's the browline, cheekbones, and ears. The difficulties of hybridising with H. s. sapiens would also be known. IMO they'd probably have been a slave/servant race most of history given their muscles.

One slight note, that's the maximum number, in practice almost everyone has far less because a limited number of marriage partners and practical concerns like inheritance made marriages between cousins relatively common.

Interesting thought.
But how would the situation be if Neanderthals had powerful and prosperous states inside Europe? A state with the strenght of Sweden or the PLC instead of being a slave race?

 

[Orcot]

Interesting thought.
But how would the situation be if Neanderthals had powerful and prosperous states inside Europe? A state with the strenght of Sweden or the PLC instead of being a slave race?

honestly given their interaction what if they somehow settled Iceland and manged to keep homo sapiens ??sapiens?? out until at least the 1790's and had a relative stable 50 000 population, who knows how they got there they fought off the vikings (read they had very little to steal and they where big and mean) but they got sparsly introduced to europe on viking raids they had reasonable acces to metal tools starting the 800. It was the viking raids however that unified the country.
Priests came and iceland became catholic to unify against the viking raiders, some trade some black death reasonable isolated until 1790's afther that it isn't really possible to remain isolated I think

 

[Aghasverov]

Interesting thought.
But how would the situation be if Neanderthals had powerful and prosperous states inside Europe? A state with the strenght of Sweden or the PLC instead of being a slave race?

honestly given their interaction what if they somehow settled Iceland and manged to keep homo sapiens ??sapiens?? out until at least the 1790's and had a relative stable 50 000 population, who knows how they got there they fought off the vikings (read they had very little to steal and they where big and mean) but they got sparsly introduced to europe on viking raids they had reasonable acces to metal tools starting the 800. It was the viking raids however that unified the country.
Priests came and iceland became catholic to unify against the viking raiders, some trade some black death reasonable isolated until 1790's afther that it isn't really possible to remain isolated I think

Could be interesting, and something of a game-changer, if Neanderthals had a certain natural resistance to bubonic plague (and possibly other diseases) which modern humans lacked...

 

[aben]

Whatever group lived in Ireland before the Indo Europeans arrived because we know absolutely nothing about their language and religion and it would be interesting to study.

 

[Coivara]

Now you leave me wanting it!

It's like fried potatoes - french fries I mean - but different, either a bit more hard or softer, depending on how its made. Also the taste is similar but different - good different.
It's often something you eat as a Tira-Gosto or appetizer, I know this club/bar in my city which makes FANTASTIC macaxeiras fritas.

4. Lydians

Weren't the Romans descended from Lydians who fled the Bronze Age collapse?

 

[pandizzy]

It's like fried potatoes - french fries I mean - but different, either a bit more hard or softer, depending on how its made. Also the taste is similar but different - good different.

I know bro. I'm from São Paulo.

 

[Crazy Boris]

Weren't the Romans descended from Lydians who fled the Bronze Age collapse?

I think Lydia didn’t emerge until after the BAC, and as far as I know, the origins of the Romans are shrouded in myth and legend to the point where we can’t really say.

 

[Arkenfolm]

honestly given their interaction what if they somehow settled Iceland and manged to keep homo sapiens ??sapiens?? out until at least the 1790's and had a relative stable 50 000 population, who knows how they got there they fought off the vikings (read they had very little to steal and they where big and mean) but they got sparsly introduced to europe on viking raids they had reasonable acces to metal tools starting the 800. It was the viking raids however that unified the country.
Priests came and iceland became catholic to unify against the viking raiders, some trade some black death reasonable isolated until 1790's afther that it isn't really possible to remain isolated I think

50K people on Iceland means they'd need domesticated animals, and there's nothing to domesticate there. Although they might get it through some Lands of Ice and Mice-style Arctic agriculture compared with Inuit skinboat fishing/whaling. The Vikings would still want to enslave them and if you read early accounts of pretty much any northerly indigenous people, that's exactly what the Neanderthals of Iceland would be considered.

 

[Simreeve]

It's like fried potatoes - french fries I mean - but different, either a bit more hard or softer, depending on how its made. Also the taste is similar but different - good different.
It's often something you eat as a Tira-Gosto or appetizer, I know this club/bar in my city which makes FANTASTIC macaxeiras fritas.

Weren't the Romans descended from Lydians who fled the Bronze Age collapse?

That was a story told (by a Greek author?) about the Etruscans.

 

[Orcot]

50K people on Iceland means they'd need domesticated animals, and there's nothing to domesticate there. Although they might get it through some Lands of Ice and Mice-style Arctic agriculture compared with Inuit skinboat fishing/whaling. The Vikings would still want to enslave them and if you read early accounts of pretty much any northerly indigenous people, that's exactly what the Neanderthals of Iceland would be considered.

would fishing do they trick? Both spearfishing (whales) and fish traps.
essentialy a inuit diet . Their has been historicaly more inuit but they also had a far bigger hunting ground.

Enslaving yes perhaps but slavs are more likly to speak your language and can be transported more easly you can enslave some for sure but it seems hard to settle especialy if the locals want to bash your brains in.

 

[Arkenfolm]

would fishing do they trick? Both spearfishing (whales) and fish traps.
essentialy a inuit diet . Their has been historicaly more inuit but they also had a far bigger hunting ground.

The highest population density among Inuit peoples was found in Alaska thanks to ample wood, salmon runs, and predictable whale migrations. It's estimated in pre-contact times that the Yupik of southwest Alaska (including the Yukon Delta) had about 20-25K across their entire territory. The related Aleuts with a similar lifestyle had about 20K across the whole of the Aleutians and the Alaska Peninsula.

I'm not sure Iceland would be able to be as bountiful as that. The modern Inuit lifestyle didn't emerge until about 1,500 years ago, with the earliest elements about 2,500 years ago IIRC emerging in the context of maritime hunting-fishing peoples in far eastern Siberia. This would be an independent development of that. But if the stars aligned, it might be able to produce a population that dense, since archaeology shows that pre-contact St. Lawrence Island in Alaska had up to 4,000 people at times (yet was prone to famine and abandonment by its natives), which is a little under 1 person per km2.

Enslaving yes perhaps but slavs are more likly to speak your language and can be transported more easly you can enslave some for sure but it seems hard to settle especialy if the locals want to bash your brains in.

It would be similar to Ireland, as the Norse had many Irish slaves. Although Iceland is more out of the way, it does have walrus ivory as a draw.

 

[Remitonov]

There were a lot of Goths at my high school, don't think they're anywhere near extinct

JK, but seriously, it would be cool to have a surviving East Germanic culture. Also, I wonder how they would have influenced WWII, would Hitler have tried to draft them as "fellow Germanics" to fight against the Slavs in the USSR, or would he have viewed them as too Slavicized?

It really depends on how the Crimean Goths adapted, barring any other butterflies stemming from their survival. The very last ones had assimilated into the Crimean Tatar population IOTL, so even if they managed to maintain their identity to the modern age, they would likely be considered 'impure' by the Nazis regardless, given the length of time they spent living under Greek, Turkic and then Russian rule.

 

[Timthehuman]

Edomites, Native Tasmanians, Moriori people, Red Deer Cave People, Minoans.

 

[Chörnyj Orel]

All these groups also include linguistics:

--> Etrurians (make Rasenna great again!), Rhaetians/other Thyrssenians or at least an ethnic group that is very closely related to Thyrssenians
--> Northwestblock-indoeuropeans (maybe IE-Britain that didn't receive either celtification, nor romanisation nor germanification)
--> Anatolians
--> Sumerians or an ethic group that is closely related to Sumerians
--> Iberians
--> Dacians/Thracians
--> Continental Celts
--> Phrygians
--> Greenland-Norse people
--> African romance people

and if we go ASB-geographic:
--> Doggerland-people !!

 

[JanWellem]

It really depends on how the Crimean Goths adapted, barring any other butterflies stemming from their survival. The very last ones had assimilated into the Crimean Tatar population IOTL, so even if they managed to maintain their identity to the modern age, they would likely be considered 'impure' by the Nazis regardless, given the length of time they spent living under Greek, Turkic and then Russian rule.

Didn't exactly stop the Nazis from forming Tatar Waffen-SS legions IOTL. But had the Crimean Goths still been a seperate, clearly germanic ethnic group at the outbreak of WW2 it wouldn't have mattered since they would've most likely faced a fate similar to the one of the Volga Germans and would've been deported by Stalin to the east.

 

[Aguss]

I wonder if Neanderthals were still alive, would they be known as mighty warriors in the Middle Ages?
Some fame as the Swiss mercenaries.

After all, Neanderthals seem like they would be more muscular, stronger and tougher than the average human (but probably less smart), surely they would be strong warriors.

 

[Nelagend]

If I can stretch ethnicity to include religion - keep Egypt polytheistic forever. Islam can still come into existence but we get a 3 way crossing in the Middle East between Christianity, Islam, and all of Ra's family. This could lead to some real interesting literature and ideas around the Renaissance.