Just wondering, but would Theodore Roosevelt have been ever been elected President if Mackinley wasn't assassinated? Some people say he would have been to radical to get on the ticket in 1904 otherwise, if he hadn't been Vice-President.
Would Teddy Roosevelt Have Been Elected President If Mackinely Wasn't Assassinated?
- Thread starter theReturner
- Start date
I think his chances might have been excellent. Of course, I'm a TDR-wankster to the nth power, and I couldn't imagine a planet without him as president.
He was quite progressive, and, to appeal to the "red meat" types, he was the stormer of St. Juan Hill.
He was quite progressive, and, to appeal to the "red meat" types, he was the stormer of St. Juan Hill.
Well, I'm kind of biased on this subject, given that my current timeline project for a socialist America begins with the POD that McKinley isn't assassinated. That being said, the way that Presidents nominations occurred in the early 1900s is totally different than it is now. Party bosses controlled the process, and Roosevelt was not very popular among the party bosses.
He probably would end up taking the white house in 1904. I feel that since TR wouldnt have had to deal with the whole assassination effect he probably would have been free to pursue his own policies from day one.
I highly doubt it. The party bosses gave him the Vice Presidency because they saw it as a position where he couldn't do to much damage. A lot of people were horrified when he became President. I could see him trying to run in 1904 as a third party candidate just based solely on his own personal popularity, but it would take a miracle to get him the Republican nomination.
To back up what's already been said:
They don't call Boss Tweed, boss for nothing. As for PA my distant cousin Senator Matthew S. Quay was the republican pulling all of the strings getting my distant cousin on my other side of the family tree, Samuel W. Pennypacker, elected governor.
So yeah, there were party bosses, and they usually controlled state regions.
~Salamon2
They don't call Boss Tweed, boss for nothing. As for PA my distant cousin Senator Matthew S. Quay was the republican pulling all of the strings getting my distant cousin on my other side of the family tree, Samuel W. Pennypacker, elected governor.
So yeah, there were party bosses, and they usually controlled state regions.
~Salamon2
Probably not. He was too radical for the Republicans who as others have said probably shoved him into the Vice Presidency to shut him up. The New York Republicans have had a radical tradition which is howe he built up a power base as they were also the clean government party in New York.
Could he have stood a better chance with the Democrats? His policies are very similar to those of FDR and he would have done a better job than Woodrow Wilson but might have lost out to Bryan earlier on due to Bryans silver tongued oratory even if it was largely crap
Could he have stood a better chance with the Democrats? His policies are very similar to those of FDR and he would have done a better job than Woodrow Wilson but might have lost out to Bryan earlier on due to Bryans silver tongued oratory even if it was largely crap
I am inclined to agree TR was too radical to get nominated on his own in 1904; he needed incumbency. Think of the impact on America's rise to world power status, the Panama Canal, his stand against monopolies, etc. What if the changes butterfly away Woodrow Wilson's ability to push his 14 points after WWI? Or the impact of US involvement in WWI?
Bill Cameron
Banned
theReturner,
Simply, no.
Unless death, assassination, or resignation enter the picture, the Vice Presidency is not a route to the Presidency. Quite the opposite in fact.
Of the 47 holders of the office, only 13 became president and eight of those were a result of death, assassination, or resignation.
Of the remaining five, only three won election to the presidency immediately following their vice presidential terms. Adams was elected before the party system formed, van Buren was Jackson's designated successor, and George H.W. Bush won in 1988.
The final two, Jefferson and Nixon, served in the office and then won the presidency at a later date.
People are nominated for the office to either to "balance" national tickets, to park them out of the way, or to reward them for long service as a political hack. Lyndon Johnson is an example of the first, Teddy Roosevelt an example of the second, and Joe Biden an example of the last. Whatever the reason, the office is not seen as a route to the Oval Office.
Regards,
Bill
I think the odds are definitely against him and for any other US President after the Founding Fathers I'd say "no way." That said, TR was an amazingly crafty sumbitch with massive grassroots popularity, serious ambition, and a freight train's momentum. If anyone could pull it off it'd be TR.
So while the probability is still low, for him it's far from zero, IMHO. I'd mark any TR ascendancy as "plausible" at least.
So while the probability is still low, for him it's far from zero, IMHO. I'd mark any TR ascendancy as "plausible" at least.
Wasn't Jefferson VP under Adams, making Nixon the only ex-VP to get elected president later?
I can think of one case where a VP was likely chosen with the distinct though of succession to the presidency: 1944 when the health problems of FDR became noticeable.
When the ticket is balanced with a much younger VP (Eisenhower-Nixon, Bush-Quayle, McCain-Palin) the public will automatically perceive a goal of providing limelight to an up and coming player.
Bill Cameron
Banned
Mark,
Remember, it was before the 12th Amendment.
Jefferson ran for president in 1796 and, because he came in second in Electoral College voting, he became the vice-president instead.
So, he ran for president, lost and received the office of vice-president as a consolation prize, then ran for president again and won that second time.
Regards,
Bill
Assuming TR doesn't get renominated in 1904 what does he do?
3rd party bid?
Gov of New York again?
Senator?
Congressman?
Naturalist/Hunter?
I just don't see the 3rd party thing. I would imagine naturalist that was his first passion
3rd party bid?
Gov of New York again?
Senator?
Congressman?
Naturalist/Hunter?
I just don't see the 3rd party thing. I would imagine naturalist that was his first passion
I agree about the 3rd party. He only started a third party for 1912 because he was angry at Taft for supposedly screwing up as his successor, so I'd say that I think naturalist/adventurer/generally awesome dude would be a plausible career path for him.
Boss Tweed was defeated and destroyed in 1874. Roosevelt was 14 years old.
I think this is all on the opinions of the alternate historian. Roosevelt would not have won the nomination in 1904 regardless of his personal popularity. The point is that he was liked enough to get the nomination and it had really nothing to do with the assassination.
Case in point: John Tyler. Harrison dies, Tyler assumes the Presidency. He's immediately ousted by both Whigs and Democrats. Essentially, he was our only third party President.
So you could write a TL both ways really. One where McKinley's second term is a success, TR plays a big part, McKinley boosts TR as his successor, TR wins in 1904. Otherwise you could write that TR is virtually ignored during McKinley's second term, he does little (since he's TR, I find that incredible ASB), and 1904 rolls around and his bid is shot down. It all depends on the writer though.
For Bill, When Comes Back:
But, that Applies to Adams as Well then, Doesn't it ...
I Mean, Perhaps The Point can be Made that he Ran SOLELY at Washington's Behest ...
However, The Legality of it would Still have Been The Same as Jefferson's Bid, No?