Two Lucky Princes: A TL

SavoyTruffle

SavoyTruffle

Burnt House Avenger said:
Alas, it is already written. Let Savoy continue his excellent timeline however he wants and stop calling ASB on everything. I find it rather plausible that the Miguellines do well and Poland does not get back Schlesien.

[rant]Besides, its not as if you yourself have not messed with marriages of European monarchs, wanked the Catalans and Occitans and tried to get Singaporean leader Yew to revive the Tang dynasty. Its like a pot calling the kettle black.[/rant]

Savoy, excellent job. I hope to read more on Europe, etc. I'm rooting for Protestants everywhere, personally (OTL seems like a Pope-wank, a bit). Will Poland go Calvinist as in OTL?
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Not really, but due to the Jagiellons' policies Poland won't be more Catholic than the Vatican TTL; plus most of the Hungarian nobles are Calvinist. And more importantly, France will be breaking from Rome in exchange for England not doing it. ;)

yourworstnightmare said:
I think the point was: don't underestimate the Asian kingdoms, there was a reason they were swallowed by the Europeans quite late.
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Since the Dutch East Indies weren't conquered in a day, and even the OTL Philippines weren't easily conquered, it won't be easy for the Iberians to subjugate the Miguellines. Though butterflies mean that Iberia won't falter like it did in the 17th century.

Plus, OTL is full of quite implausible things, though I try to make sure things happen with cause.
 
kasumigenx

kasumigenx

SavoyTruffle said:
Not really, but due to the Jagiellons' policies Poland won't be more Catholic than the Vatican TTL; plus most of the Hungarian nobles are Calvinist. And more importantly, France will be breaking from Rome in exchange for England not doing it. ;)



Since the Dutch East Indies weren't conquered in a day, and even the OTL Philippines weren't easily conquered, it won't be easy for the Iberians to subjugate the Miguellines. Though butterflies mean that Iberia won't falter like it did in the 17th century.

Plus, OTL is full of quite implausible things, though I try to make sure things happen with cause.
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Just continue the timeline and focus more in europe.
 
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Direwolf22

I wonder how long it will take before the other nations involved adopt this new tactic of focusing on firepower over combat. I think the English might adopt it, they obviously have a first hand account now, and they tend to be more infantry focused anyway.

I'm assuming this war will spread to the French colonies in the New World. It will be interesting to see how, or if, they divide themselves up and who they support in the Civil War. Of course now would be a great time to seize some colonies..
 
SavoyTruffle

SavoyTruffle

Direwolf22 said:
I wonder how long it will take before the other nations involved adopt this new tactic of focusing on firepower over combat. I think the English might adopt it, they obviously have a first hand account now, and they tend to be more infantry focused anyway.

I'm assuming this war will spread to the French colonies in the New World. It will be interesting to see how, or if, they divide themselves up and who they support in the Civil War. Of course now would be a great time to seize some colonies..
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Colony seizing wasn't really big in the late 16th century, unless they were Spanish colonies, considering that they had a large head start on everyone.

And with the emphasis on firepower over close combat, the English did it already in the 14th and 15th centuries with their use of longbows; perhaps TTL they'll follow this along (and considering that England doesn't have the population of France or the HRE to allow prolonged battles with heavy losses).
 

yourworstnightmare

Banned
Direwolf22 said:
I wonder how long it will take before the other nations involved adopt this new tactic of focusing on firepower over combat. I think the English might adopt it, they obviously have a first hand account now, and they tend to be more infantry focused anyway.

I'm assuming this war will spread to the French colonies in the New World. It will be interesting to see how, or if, they divide themselves up and who they support in the Civil War. Of course now would be a great time to seize some colonies..
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I doubt the Colonists really would care about who's king in European France. Also, who they support won't matter, since at this point there aren't really that many Colonists in the Colonies.
 
SavoyTruffle

SavoyTruffle

Heading To A Stalemate?​

1577 would prove that the Great Religious War, or specifically the Second War of the French Succession, would not be ending easily for any side. Despite Henri Belmain's great victory at Amiens, which had shifted the momentum slightly to the Legitimist faction, he would not be able to completely capitalize on this opportunity. Largely it was to be due to the Orléanist counterattack later that year, yet it was also a product of disagreements between Belmain and the Dowager Queen Elizabeth. Belmain had asked the Queen for more men and money, knowing correctly that he could exploit his advantage more if he could outnumber and out-gun the Holy League's forces. However, Elizabeth felt that she could not exploit her position well, even after the Battle of Amiens. Her son Francis III had begun to assert his authority; with his father dead he was now king by the right of succession, and he knew fully the great extent of French royal power. Francis III was cautious as a young man, and thus decided to wait on the question of Belmain's campaign.

Thus Belmain was forced to march with only 20000 men, seeking to pursue the weakened Imperial force. However, the Orléanists made their move, sending an army of the same size northward. This army was supported by other Imperial troops, given that the Orléanists had a smaller base and they lacked Belmain's military genius. By October of 1577 Belmain's army had approached the city of Cambrai, which was annexed by Charles V earlier in the century. Although he was nearing the Imperial army, Belmain was then intercepted by the Orléanist-Imperial army. The resulting battle of Cambrai had resulted in a narrow victory for Belmain, which meant that his pursuit was blunted.

1577 ended with no decisive advantage for either side; the Legitimists stopped the Holy League at Amiens yet were halted themselves at Cambrai, the Swedish had struggled at Weimar, and the Ottoman-Hungarian front remained quiet, for now.
 

zraith

A foreboding update, the lull before the storm. Can't wait to see what finally gives.

Out of curiosity, how effected are the Ottoman Empire by the butterflies?
 
SavoyTruffle

SavoyTruffle

zraith said:
A foreboding update, the lull before the storm. Can't wait to see what finally gives.

Out of curiosity, how effected are the Ottoman Empire by the butterflies?
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So far, the foremost is that Suleiman's son Mahmud survives him and becomes Sultan. Other than that, well, I have to do some reading on the Barbary pirates. ;)
 
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