Proposals and War Aims That Didn't Happen Map Thread

Made a map of my interpretations of Alexander's plans for future territorial conquests had he not died in 323 BCE:
While Diodorus' description of Alexander's Will was almost definitely a fabrication, this is a good representation of what he talks about. I would include coastal Arabia as well considering Alexander was actually considering a campaign for it it when he died.


Map of the Kush District of the Republic of New Africa.
"New Afrikan leaders designated the Kush District as an area along the lower Mississippi River that would be the first place within the Republic of New Afrika’s subjugated national territory to become independent after organizing a successful United Nations-monitored black plebiscite."
6950948048_ba86c11c4f_c.jpg

from https://digitalcommons.lsu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1720&context=gradschool_dissertations
more maps can be found in this document, for those interested.
 
@Višeslav I do not think that Alexander was someone eager to put up with defeat... So reorganize forces and then push east, further then before, to Ganges, to Pataliputra, to Bengal bay!
Would then greek world be more affected by buddhism?

@BrobDingnag what about combination with succesful Valkyrie conspiracy? (I know, no A-bomb yet, however wehrmacht could be more helpfull)
 
Two things to think about as potential ATLs:

1. Since Churchill hated communism, how about a world in which he hates communism enough that when he takes over as PM he immediately negotiates a ceasefire with Germany? That’s 1940, which gives a decent amount of time for both of them to redeploy before the Soviet advance next year (you know, roughly). It would also cause the US Congress to demand that lend-lease to the USSR be immediately stopped.
2. Because Patton felt exactly the same–and since Patton knew that he had been purposely sidelined and denied supplies to prevent his march toward Berlin before the Soviets–what if, in 1945 after Germany surrenders… Patton and Churchill “defect” and launch their own offensive on the USSR using units loyal to them? Basically that would be British forces (maybe hand over their portion of occupied Germany to France) and the US Third Army (and whatever other forces decide to “defect” after an ATL rousing speech by Patton. In that situation, too, could the US justify continuing lend-lease to the USSR? They could maybe try to push the “it’s an ally and it needs our help against these rogue elements” kick, but with Britain (or a part of them) and Patton being those “rogues,“ people would start to look into why they‘re doing this…
I'm not sure even Churchill was a big enough idiot to try defecting from Britain to fight the Soviets on his own, and even if he was - what would he actually accomplish? He wasn't a general - or, at least, not a skilled one - and I'm not sure there were many soldiers who'd be willing to defect to join him in a suicidal crusade. I also doubt Patton would be able to command enough loyalty to get enough defectors to join him to accomplish anything other than getting slaughtered by the Soviets.
 
@Višeslav I do not think that Alexander was someone eager to put up with defeat... So reorganize forces and then push east, further then before, to Ganges, to Pataliputra, to Bengal bay!
Would then greek world be more affected by buddhism?

That's true. What I meant is he might not bother with some of the less profitable areas in the south (or alternatively would die trying to take them). He might leave them for later as he conquered more useful lands to the west, eventually dying. I think the Ganges valley sounds like a reasonable focus for his expansion. Elephants would not be a problem for him, as he had fought them before and had quite a few of his own. His army was better equipped and larger than those of most Indian kingdoms at the time. Not insanely so, but a bit, so this campaign should be ok for him if he lives longer.

He faced odds so much worse in Persia and won, so I don't doubt India is possible assuming he lives long enough to do it.
However, transport and logistics are a big problem, and morale. His soldiers weren't all too happy with the forced march across the entire known world. India's big, and, unless you take it in chunks (which was not exactly Alexander's style, it seems), remaining able to bring supplies over as you expand is difficult, then again, big Al's army was pretty good at foraging, and specifically campaigned along food-rich routes or took detours to get it. Delivering more armor (which they actually did do according to some sources) would be harder and harder as they got further from their territory, but, again, they faced worse odds in Persia.

We do need to note, also, that if Alexander gets older, he might become less hell-bent on conquering an entire continent. Most leaders like him either die young, lose and get imprisoned while they're still young, or calm down a bit as they age.

I'd expect the maximum extent of his empire would be conquering India north of the Deccan Plateau (roughly), Carthage (so a huge chunk of the Mediterranean), what he already had OFC, maybe de jure controlling northern Arabia (he wanted to march his army across it just to assert his claim to it, though the soldiers might be a little disgruntled after that), de facto, I'd expect local Bedouins would pay an annual tribute or something, and then finally, vassalizing Nabatea (Sinai and the bits of modern Jordan and Saudi nearby), Gerrha (roughly Al-Hassa, Bahrain, and Qatar) and Mazun/Makkan (Omani & UA coasts, historically aligned with whoever rules Persia). He might also vassalize Sabba, Hadramout, and Qataban (Coastal Yemen and western Oman more or less). The other Greek states (like Massalia (marseille) and the Black sea kingdoms) for sure, and possibly, thought it's kind of unnecessary at that point, the Etruscan league. Keep in mind, this behemoth of an empire is the absolute maximum.

As for Buddhism, the Hellenistic states IOTL were in consistent contact with India through Bactria, a Greek Buddhist kingdom, but did not pick it up. Assuming Alexander lives longer and establishes a stable line of succession, a more unified empire would allow Buddhism to spread west much more easily.

Seeing as the movement would be centered in a region within the empire, Buddhist thinkers might visit the court of Alexander or one of his successors, maybe the Buddha would be viewed more as a philosopher than a religious leader by the Greeks though. Stoicism was pretty popular at the time, and Diogenes the cynic was greatly admired by Alexander, and these had quite a bit in common with Buddhist teachings (Buddhism might be seen as a kind of pacifist stoicism). This means that, as a philosophy, it is likely to be pretty popular, with, I'd expect, some religious syncretism with whatever ends up being the dominant religion in the western part of the empire (likely still Hellenic Polytheism, though other religions might become popular there as well).

If the empire does break before the Buddhists have a chance to spread throughout it, expect it to be fairly widespread in Indian and Central Asian centered successor states, but a Persian-based successor state might find Zoroastrianism more appealing simply because it was already widespread there, but the Buddhists could become a significant minority. Buddhist-Zoroastrian syncretism is also plausible.

Regardless of how popular it is, Buddhist thinking will certainly have some influence of the future of Hellenistic society, and philosophy ITTL.

That's just my take though, I'm no expert. Sorry for the really long post that isn't too related to proposals and war aims (though the majority is about Alexander's future war plans, so I guess it still counts)
 
I'd expect the maximum extent of his empire would be conquering India north of the Deccan Plateau (roughly), Carthage (so a huge chunk of the Mediterranean), what he already had OFC, maybe de jure controlling northern Arabia (he wanted to march his army across it just to assert his claim to it, though the soldiers might be a little disgruntled after that), de facto, I'd expect local Bedouins would pay an annual tribute or something, and then finally, vassalizing Nabatea (Sinai and the bits of modern Jordan and Saudi nearby), Gerrha (roughly Al-Hassa, Bahrain, and Qatar) and Mazun/Makkan (Omani & UA coasts, historically aligned with whoever rules Persia). He might also vassalize Sabba, Hadramout, and Qataban (Coastal Yemen and western Oman more or less). The other Greek states (like Massalia (marseille) and the Black sea kingdoms) for sure, and possibly, thought it's kind of unnecessary at that point, the Etruscan league. Keep in mind, this behemoth of an empire is the absolute maximum.
Alexander of Macedon's Ambitions.png
<--Is this better?
 
As far as I know, this is the only official map for a proposed Kurdistan. This version of Kurdistan was to be created as a result of the Treaty of Sevres, but Ataturk had different ideas. I'm sure you've already noticed that the Kurdish areas in Syria are not part of the state and that the Iraqi Kurdistan was to be allowed to join Kurdistan after a referendum.

View attachment 542923
It also indicated that the original border of Syria was to the north of the modern border. Urfa is part of modern Turkey. Iraq's borders mostly stayed the same.
 
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From "France and Islam in West Africa, 1860-1960" by Christopher Harrison

So apparently there was a plan in the late 50s for France to make new alliances with South Algerian tuaregs in the hope of creating a separate colony (French Sahara was already special within French Algeria, since they weren't departement until 1955) that could then be continue to use for oil and nuclear tests.

It came at a time when the exploitation of Oil in French Algeria was booming and France was scrambling to be able to keep as much ressources as possible, The advantageous border change with Libya after France stopped occupying the Fezzan or The creation of the Organisation Commune des Regions Saharienne in 1957, aimed at collectively and independently ruling the saharian part of Mali, Mauritania Algeria, Morocco and Niger also shows that. Even during the Evian Accord France repeatedly tried to negotiate for special rights on the French Sahara, which the FLN categorically refused.
 
Here's a quick QBAM showing every major suggested solution to the War in Ukraine over the last six years.

The maps seem to imply that no one ever suggested that Ukraine keep the Donbass. Calling the current status of the Donbass independent is a gross factual error. Also, the status quo was actually it being part of Ukraine. I also notice the absence of option 9: complete Russian withdrawal. Regarding "Novorossiya", it should be noted that ethnic self-identification does not always correlate with language. Also, why is Crimea absent from the map? It gives an Orwellian vibe. "Crimea was always part of Euras- I mean, Russia".
 
The maps seem to imply that no one ever suggested that Ukraine keep the Donbass. Calling the current status of the Donbass independent is a gross factual error. Also, the status quo was actually it being part of Ukraine. I also notice the absence of option 9: complete Russian withdrawal. Regarding "Novorossiya", it should be noted that ethnic self-identification does not always correlate with language. Also, why is Crimea absent from the map? It gives an Orwellian vibe. "Crimea was always part of Euras- I mean, Russia".

Unfortunately, Ukraine currently has no means of achieving that, short of some very, very bad things happening, or the Russian government going "oops, my bad, I'll pack up my toys and go home".
 
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