Medieval America Mark III

Can I inquire about Texas? What happened to the former state

Most of it is pastoralist territory, populated and governed by the cowboy hordes. The Andersons of East Texas are adopting some sedentary civilization under Southron tutelage. The Dinetah maintain forts and outposts in the west of the state.


Since we're going to be doing New England and the Maritimes soon, I thought this plant hardiness plant I found would come in handy in determining what places are inhabitable

[Semi-Canon] Some ideas about New Jersey
Some ideas about New Jersey, as someone from there:

1: City states ruled by rival dons in places like Asbury Park, Newark, Montclair, Atlantic City. Sinatra should be a folk saint The Dons have a Commission like the HRE electorate or Ten of Venice that selects the ruler of the state. Actors perform decayed bastardized versions of The Godfather, Goodfellas, A Bronx Tale and Sopranos and Boardwalk Empire episodes as Shakespearean stage plays, but they revere Scorcese as the greatest playwright not Shakespeare if they have an education.

2: Bards that cover Springsteen and Bon Jovi and Gaslight Anthem songs.

3: Northwestern NJ, the Skylands, is very different than the rest of the state, more an extension of rural PA. Near where I come from, is the towns of Mahwah and Ringwood and there are these hill people who live in poor and primitive conditions, calling themselves the Ramapo tribe, though they're mixed descendents of Dutch and Hessian colonists and escaped slaves. Into the Furnace is about them. That general area in north Passaic, Morris, Warren, Sussex and Hundertdon counties should be a barely controlled hinterland of the Italian Mafia descended culture of the rest of the state.

4: The same with the Pine Barrens. Also have them live in fear of the Jersey Devil and have it on the state's Coat of Arms.
I like the new update though I do feel the rise of the new religions is too soon. I've always imagined the Church beginning as a purely secular attempt at calming inter doctrinal conflict. Nevertheless, I like the history given to George Washington II.


I like the new update though I do feel the rise of the new religions is too soon. I've always imagined the Church beginning as a purely secular attempt at calming inter doctrinal conflict. Nevertheless, I like the history given to George Washington II.
Wdym by the rise of new religions?


The Great Church of the East: The First President

The Church in Baltimore wasn't always a part of the new USA. In fact, there was a time where there was no organized government that called itself the United States of America and the seat of President laid empty. After the DC riots of 2121, the president and his cabinet were killed. So many in the line of succession died that noone could reliably claim to be president. Many tried, but without the legitimacy of the Chief Justice, they all faltered.

Over time, the Church District of Columbia grew as the Supreme Court absorbed more and more powers of the old American government and its role in society became more defined. However, it drew the attention of the local warlords who saw the power of the church as something they could usurp and control. And so the Governor of Virginia, invaded the Church District of Columbia to seize the power of the church. Though the Appalachian Guard was at that point a reasonably well-trained and organized force, the Virginian Governor and his allies overwhelmed the Appalachian Guard in battles at Woodbridge and Arlington and soon began besieging DC. However, messengers were able to flee the city before it was fully encircled and the Governor of Maryland, Eric Chesapeake received news of the siege and massed a force to relieve the Supreme Court.

Eric Chesapeake's early history is unclear. He himself never spoke about it to anyone, or if he did, it was never recorded. He emerged as the shiphand of a merchant ship owned by a prominent Baltimorian family. After leading a mutiny, he took control of the ship, began expanding his pirate empire and took over land along the southern tip of the Delmarva Peninsula. When the rivalry between two factions of Baltimore's merchant houses erupted into civil war, Eric stepped in and took over the city and proclaimed himself Governor of Maryland.

A few years later, the State of Virginia began to fight the Supreme Court over some dispute about relationship between Baptists and the Non-Denom church. The Appalachian Guard was decimated at Fredericksburg and soon DC itself was under siege. Chesapeake gathered as many men as possible and within 3 days marched on DC to relieve the Church.

When Chesapeake arrived, his army routed the Virginian forces and lifted the siege. At that point the Appalachian Guard was a shell of what it was before the war with barely 100 men able to fight. The routs and prolonged siege had greatly depleted their fighting numbers. On April 17th 2230 as Chesapeake climbed the steps of the Capitol, Chief Justice Knox II Harrison asked Chesapeake to kneel and proclaimed Eric Chesapeake, President George Washington II, the new President of the USA. Newly anointed President George Washington II then held a session of Congress within the Capitol. The First Session as it would be called, lasted nearly 3 months and in that time, important members of the Baltimore and Church elite gathered in DC to draft what would become the Articles of Emergency. These Articles would bind the elite of the Chesapeake Bay area to the Non Denominational Church to create the basis of the new USA.
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[Semi-Canon] New Jersey/Novo Giosi
New Jersey/Novo Giosi

System of Government: Independent State
Head of state: Capo Di Tutti Capi (Boss of All Bosses, selected by Commission of the Five Families)
Population: 1.4 million
Religion (Official): Roman Catholic Church
Religion (Popular): Roman Catholic Church
Totemic Symbol:

Novo Giosi is a realm on the Atlantic Coast formed of what used to be the State of New Jersey before the Regression. When American society collapsed, New Jersey's notoriously corrupt state government fell apart quickly. Gangs from blighted inner cities like Paterson and Camden went on rampages through the suburbs as the electricity and water failed and small town police were overwhelmed. Into this power vacuum stepped those who had always really run society in New Jersey. The Mafia. The Mafia had soldiers establish protection rackets over large suburban areas and go in and either take over or burn down cities that would not accept their rule. For a century or two after the Regression, the different families fought, with the De Cavalacantes, Gambinos and Lucheses coming out on top but often bloodying one another's noses. Different cities became city states and feuded.


Mafioso armies in combat at the Battle of The Raritan River

In time, wars with the rump USA in Washington and New York lead to consolidation of the Families into a Commission for the state to select a Boss of All Bosses to run the state. Feuding between cosa nostra nobility takes place behind the scenes through intrigue, with hitmen conducting the occasional whacking or poison or shakedown. The maritime traders from Washington, New York and Boston sail into Asbury Park and Atlantic City to hawk their wares and the local dons heavily extort protection from the merchant classes. Capos and soldiers turn their aggression outward, raiding into Pennsylvania and Delaware for tribute or "shakedowns" in small armies, though the state does not have the resources to totally conquer its neighbors. DC tolerates Novo Giosi but with its Catholicism in contrast to the Non Denominational Church and local Italian dialect, it does not really have much influence.

The Dons on the Commission meet in Hoboken where the capital was moved to from Trenton, too distant from the main power centers by horse. Young Capos show off in jousts, Dons intrigue and bargain and show off their goomahs, and consiglieres try to exercise power behind the thrones. Acting troupes put on performances of Goodfellas, A Bronx Tale, The Godfather and The Pine Barrens at the Mile Square Theater and bards sing the ancient folk songs My Way and Living on a Prayer.

That is not to say the whole land is the mafioso noble class though. In the Northwest are the Jackson White tribes from Mahwah to High Point. These hill people are descended from Natives, Hessian and Dutch colonists and escaped slaves in times of old and always resisted regular society in the hills of the Ramapo mountains and they still do. Few large towns exist and the Morris Canal long silted over and dried up and became too hard to use for river traffic so aside from an occasional raid of Capos sent from Hoboken from the garrison in Fairfield along Route Quarantasei to shake them down for protection, the various hill tribes run their own affairs in their villages and their hilltop mall fort in Dover.

In the South, the Shore is the domain of the cosa nostra ruling class, but inland of it, things change. Lakewood is a large Jewish shetl run by a Rebbe who in exchange for tribute to the Don of Asbury, runs the area as his own fiefdom. Piney tribes live in the ancient looming forests of the Pine Barrens. Their villages are usually walled and they have occasional forts for fear not of men but of the Leeds Devil, a horrific winged monstrosity that they say haunts the forest from ancient times and will slaughter the unwary. They say its unearthly screeches and tracks can be found in the forest, and it once had a great battle with another flying dragon, Hindenburg and slaughtered it, causing it to fall on fire from the sky.

Trade and wagon routes are maintained along the Parkway and Turnpike, which are fractured concrete filled in with stones and debris from time to time to keep them usable. A guild of boatmen called the Port Authority controls merchant traffic with New York across the Hudson and is looked on with suspicion by the rulers of both places.
[Semi-Canon] A Vision of Jersey
Like the post, but @Flashman had a vision surrounding Jersey so talk to him about his thoughts.
Here's what I wrote:

Well it seems to me that a lot of the history of the Northeast is centered around three powers: the United States, New Jersey and Quebec. The United States, of course, attempts to secure its trading interests along the midatlantic and New English seaboard, and must balance that interest with (or, at times, against) the interests of the Court. Quebec, of course, wants more souls for the Catholic Church, and more living room for Frenchmen. Their interests are largely focused on Canada, upper New York and inland New England, but they also want to project power through coastal New England via the Maritimes. So where does Jersey come in in all of this?

From the get go, it's obvious that Jersey is going to be run by the mob. That's obvious. The mob is one of the American myths, right up there with cowboys and George Washington. Further, many have made the observation that the mafia essentially operates as a state (and vice versa), so it's no great leap to say that as government collapsed the mob would step in to fill up the vacuum. So what exactly is the extent of that?

The core of the mob, of course, is New York City and Northern Jersey. This is the core where the mob wields the most power. It is still present but less so through the tristate area as a whole - so down through southern Jersey, Long Island, Upstate New York. At its furthest extent it goes down through Delaware, up to Providence and potentially as far as Boston. There is also a very strong presence in Philly.

As the Federal Government and therefore the Federal Bureau of Investigation retreats, the Mob moves in. It quickly consolidates control over North Jersey. The rest of its range is more contentious - New York is of course, extremely diverse, with lots of institutions (both legitimate and il) to also attempt to fill the gap).

This kicks off something called the "Jersey Wars", which comes in three phases. The first phase is consolidation against competing institutions. The Mob has the benefits of not being associated with the failed federal government and, unlike competing illegitimate institutions, it has a lot more cross-over appeal, both between different crews/families and with other ethnic groups. While the Triads may be able to consolidate their control over a decaying Chinatown, they have little chance of moving beyond that. There aren't really many Chinese gangs outside of Chinatown and in the hinterlands, and they are fundamentally foreign whereas the mob not only has the aid of many different crews with shared values and idols to call upon, but generally cultural support through extensive media penetration and a strong identification with Catholicism which many will find comforting.

Ultimately, the mob is able to consolidate a very strong core in Jersey, Philly and New York south of Westchester. Families may even for a time control large swathes of Connecticut, Rhode Island and Delaware, maybe even Boston.

The second phase comes through internal division. The several families are only loosely united and often fight at a low level throughout the first phase but, when control is consolidated, things break down. Jersey descends into effectively many different, vibrant city-states, constantly competing.

The US begins to recover strength during this period and intervenes somewhat in the conflict. The Mob, in the Medieval America as now, makes a lot of its money over control over the docks, and its domination of the Midatlantic means that it is essentially the maritime power in the northeast. The US backs various families and crews to cause chaos and leverage some control. Through this method, they gain power over much of the marginal extent of the mob's domain.

The final phase of the war comes when the US is genuinely strong, and the wars with Quebec have raised the Catholic Question. Historically, the Catholics were fairly friendly and cooperative with the Non-Denominational Church, being among the more moderate of the American denominations. However as time goes on and the Nondenom Church begins to act more liek a proper church and not just a loose organization, American Catholics in some quarters grow more hostile and sympathize with the Quebeckers. While in most of the country most catholic churches have atrophied and effectively joined the Church, this is not the case in Jersey where the mob patronizes the Church heavily, and the Church has increasingly tied itself to Quebec as the only major branch of the Church within communicable distance.

The US issues an ultimatum for the Catholic Church to fold into Nondenom, which of course is rejected. The Boss of New York, with the support of the Cardinal, rallies the families to unite and fight a brutal war against the US. In the end, the Boss of Philly, with US backing, converts to Nondenom (the city's historic stature meant the Church here had already more or less integrated) and conquers Jersey for the US, while the US takes NYC and Long Island. A few concessions are made, but for the most part Catholic identity is erased.
I'll bite and agree with Flashman - TL;DR New Jersey certainly is and even likely will be Mob-controlled as a feudal state, but I can see it easily being folded into Nondenom in terms of religion - from sheer soft power/pressure, hard power/conquest, and certainly the tons of Anglos and non-Italian populations that make up the majority of its people shifting more naturally to Nondenom vs the minority Italian and specific Mob elements of it sticking with Catholicism.
I personally like the version where Novo Giosi continues to be a power a bit better, even if they've seen better days. Plus they're fairly unique and I like seeing variety in this thread. Maybe they've (mostly) converted to Non-Denom for economic reasons but still have a bit of independence.
Firstly, it's meant to be Novo Giorsi. Novo Giorsese itself is something of an argot or a conlang if you like, constructed from a mixture of Italian American Vernacular English, Church Latin and a smattering of Quebecker French to build a passable recreation of Italian.

Secondly, I agree that they probably do still have a bit of independence; they're one of the biggest players in the Northeast, afterall Still, I forsee really big problems with unity, and maybe they're headed on an upward trajectory by the present after a century or two of immisertion at the hands of the Americans.
Firstly, it's meant to be Novo Giorsi. Novo Giorsese itself is something of an argot or a conlang if you like, constructed from a mixture of Italian American Vernacular English, Church Latin and a smattering of Quebecker French to build a passable recreation of Italian.

Secondly, I agree that they probably do still have a bit of independence; they're one of the biggest players in the Northeast, afterall Still, I forsee really big problems with unity, and maybe they're headed on an upward trajectory by the present after a century or two of immisertion at the hands of the Americans.

I hope that Novo Giorsi will be able to keep said conlang after being immersed in the American sphere for two centuries.

I like the idea of living in the American sphere of influence ironically providing a sense of unity to the feuding families. Novo Giorsi would keep its unique governmental structure but would likely mellow out a bit over time.

The things I liked about @djf64360's post are:
  1. The idea that the capital was changed to Hoboken to bring it closer to the main mafia power centers.
  2. I like the idea of the hill tribes having a fort that at one point was an old mall in Dover. I think thin at in some places "mall" could become a term for a fortified marketplace/fort where people can hole up in the case of an attack.
  3. Definitely like the idea of stage play versions of mafia movie classics.
  4. The Lakewood shetl is a good idea too. I think it should still exist even after Giorsi is absorbed into the American sphere of influence.
  5. I like how the stories of the Jersey Devil mingled with half-remembered tales of the Hindenberg disaster.
  6. It makes sense that the Parkway and Turnpike would be maintained as best as they could as major trade routes.
  7. The evolution of the Port Authority into a merchant guild makes a whole lot of sense. Hopefully they also managed the transition to American influence well.
The mall in Dover is the Rockaway Mall. I'm assuming when society collapsed the Jackson Whites multiplied since a lot of them lack electricity as it is. I used to date one and went to high school with a lot of them. There are similar groups in Northwest NJ they could merge with. Nowadays they live in Mahwah, Ringwood, etc. and when I was a kid they got in a shootout with the Mahwah police.

Lakewood NJ is currently a major Hasidic center to a lot of local controversy I won't get into. A Hasidic sect dominates the town and believes the area to be the Promised Land as their sect rejects Israel or something.