Map Thread XV

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I'm making a balkanized China map county-by-county with states based on history and language/dialect. I need some help with names and boundaries of the rest of the nations. I have the rough idea that Hubei, Sichuan and a Yue state should exist along with one for Xiang, Gan, Min, Hakka and Jin dialect people. But it's all very fuzzy and I would appreciate help from any native Chinese on the board to help me balkanize their country in a meaningful way. This is what I have so far:
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A few language maps of China:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a9/Map_of_sinitic_languages_full-en.svg

https://www.dartmouth.edu/~chinese/maps/map4_b.gif

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/08/78/5a/08785a97cf1e8e757697a25bf68c5218.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/f7/a2/a2/f7a2a2cf700d5b2b503b3d923e8c4c99.jpg

http://www.chinamaps.org/images/china-map/maps-of-china/china-ethnic-population.jpg
 
Ok... my first real map in years. I was working on my Independent Tibet project but was running into a problem regarding Africa. So this one became an obsession of mine for a week. Deviantart link.

Very cool, although I doubt a *Rapture which was essentially random would convince the Israelis to convert to Christianity. But hey, can't fight the Plot. :winkytongue:
 
I would think the Council of 12 would just find some willing person of the right build, and then use plastic surgery to make them look like "Jesus".

My personal reason: It's a bit cliche.

Story reason: The Twelve isn't as united a body as you may think. While Jesus is apparently, um, dying, half of the Twelve are engaged in a religious debate, and half are engaged in a political one. The former half is trying to debate why Christ would test their faith so, some of them faithfully asserting that Jesus will return to health soon, or return to Earth when the millenium is up. The latter half is deciding how to play off a potential death, and yes, with the "bait-and-switch" being floated around.

Not bad.

What would have happened if the blitz was a total success and the GC had been the ones to lose and the US and Big Four the big winners?

How is the GC as of right now? I mean culture, ideas and what their plan overall is with Carpathia gone and what happened in World War 4.

I guess the Blitz would have returned America to global dominance, since that would have been its goal by maintaining a monopoly on global weaponry and agricultural exports.

The GC is, by its nature and in opposition to Jerusalem, very secular. In about two r three centuries it'll be culturally homogenous as Sarajevo is really good at moving people around based on regional needs and experience. As well as moving soldiers (the Secretary-General following Carpathia did away with the "Peacekeeper" euphemism) to foreign posts where they can gain battlefield experience (notably, Mongolia and Poland have contracts with the GC in Russia, with Senegalese and Congo troops stationed at posts on the Trans-Siberian.

There's a lot of Scandinavians teaching and managing administration in Africa, South America, and the Pacific, as well as Africans, South Americans, and Pacific Islanders migrating around finding cheap labor.

Very cool, although I doubt a *Rapture which was essentially random would convince the Israelis to convert to Christianity. But hey, can't fight the Plot. :winkytongue:

If you start asking Christians, both IOTL and in the story, they'll have a real hard time telling you who gets taken in the Rapture (the smartest don't bother to answer and shut up). Most people who do answer (based off personal experience) will usually refer to C.S. Lewis' quotes about the noble savage in Mere Christianity. I.e. a Muslim can go to Heaven/get raptured if he has faith in Jesus Christ, just because he doesn't call himself a Christian doesn't matter.

ITTL, with the loudest voices being Christian Extremist, and the raptured not exactly around to ask, it becomes rather difficult to say what people a decade ago believed. And so far, the Christian answer to the event is about as plausible as anyone else's. Prague, the center of research and science has a facility of thousands at work to try and gather data and explain all of the things that happened in the Tribulation.

But frankly, if we start counting the Muslim who "thinks Jesus is important" (i.e. they all do), the Buddhist monk who "concentrates on the Buddhist teachings of mercy more than 'the other parts,'" (the C.S. Lewis quote directly, and hint hint Mr. Lewis, Buddhism speaks quite a bit about mercy), the Tibetan Lama or Hindu Guru who sees Jesus Christ as a bodhisattva, and the Jew and Atheist who think Jesus was an important figure who had only good things to say, all as "noble savages" who still go to Heaven, well, I guess under the rules of Left Behind, they get raptured too. But as we saw in 2016, the loudest group is the one that gets attention and media time, not necessarily the group with correct arguments and hypotheses... :'(
 
Well, the rapture is actually a pretty recent doctrine to develop in Church history, and today it tends to be held by fundamentalist Protestants rather than the general population within the church. Not all even believe in premillennialism so there's that too.
 
Nightrise Short: Venice's Heir
North_Italy_1880.png


1892
The recent developments in North Italy have aroused concern in the neighboring nations France, Vatican and Sicily.
The King of Savoy-Piedmont has offered the union with the Eight Vampire Republics when they would allow their current Heir to be engaged with him. The goal: to press the Northern Greater German Kaiserreich to release the Strings over the Papal States they gained in the Demonic Revolutionary Wars. The first steps to achieve the Italian Irredentist unity is to press Germany to release the Vatican Exclave Nordtoskana and transfer it to the planned Nort Italian State. Further plans include the remilitarization of the Vampire Republic of Venice, the annexation of the Mandate of the Podelta, and the unification of Italy by attacking the Vatican and Sicily, and to demand South Tyrol, Küstenland, Slovenia and Dalmatia.
The further development after 1896 allowed the Transfer of Nordtoskana to Northern Italy, however the implies to violently unite the Italian Penisula has resulted in the fortification of the Vatican States 1902-1907, The Triester Doktrin (Triest Doctrin) in 1908 which expelled most Italians from German Border regions in Tyrol, Küstenland and Dalmatia; and a period of North Italian Isolation erected by France, Germany, Sicily, San Marino, Malta, Vatican and Spain.


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Part of this Timeline
 
Hence why
Well, the rapture is actually a pretty recent doctrine to develop in Church history, and today it tends to be held by fundamentalist Protestants rather than the general population within the church. Not all even believe in premillennialism so there's that too.

Hence why any hypothetical K_Jerusalem is going to be overflowing with Americans, Evangelicals, and JW's eager to get a sweet piece of the Kingdom.
 

Red Orm

Banned
Switching to larger maps is always a hassle, especially when you have to redraw all the borders! Anyways, here's my Gothic Empire TL in 500AD. It can be read here: https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/a-gothic-empire.411687/

Would Judea really be called Judea? The Jews that would have been there have been displaced since the 2nd century. Much more likely that it would be part of the ERE since it's close enough culturally and religiously, and the Sassanids are a huge threat.
 
Nightrise Short: Venice's Heir
North_Italy_1880.png


1892
The recent developments in North Italy have aroused concern in the neighboring nations France, Vatican and Sicily.
The King of Savoy-Piedmont has offered the union with the Eight Vampire Republics when they would allow their current Heir to be engaged with him. The goal: to press the Northern Greater German Kaiserreich to release the Strings over the Papal States they gained in the Demonic Revolutionary Wars. The first steps to achieve the Italian Irredentist unity is to press Germany to release the Vatican Exclave Nordtoskana and transfer it to the planned Nort Italian State. Further plans include the remilitarization of the Vampire Republic of Venice, the annexation of the Mandate of the Podelta, and the unification of Italy by attacking the Vatican and Sicily, and to demand South Tyrol, Küstenland, Slovenia and Dalmatia.
The further development after 1896 allowed the Transfer of Nordtoskana to Northern Italy, however the implies to violently unite the Italian Penisula has resulted in the fortification of the Vatican States 1902-1907, The Triester Doktrin (Triest Doctrin) in 1908 which expelled most Italians from German Border regions in Tyrol, Küstenland and Dalmatia; and a period of North Italian Isolation erected by France, Germany, Sicily, San Marino, Malta, Vatican and Spain.


---
Part of this Timeline

Well, living under Venetian Vampires is still better than the Savoy. I like it.
 
Would Judea really be called Judea? The Jews that would have been there have been displaced since the 2nd century. Much more likely that it would be part of the ERE since it's close enough culturally and religiously, and the Sassanids are a huge threat.

It's actually a Sassanid vassal. It was a part of the ERE for the maps before this, only recently got taken over. The ERE has a lot of religious tensions, and as result isn't doing too hot.
 
Well, living under Venetian Vampires is still better than the Savoy. I like it.
Depends. If you desire to live in a "More money=More rights" state in which corruption and intrigue are common, welcome to the eight vampire republics. If you're more for social equality, species equality and Nordic lifestyle, I'd recommend you to somehow get over the border to Germany. I'll guess since as you might conclude from the text you should trespass Swiss or Vatican Soil first before trying to go to Germany as the border between Germany and Venice is - well - let's say the two nations just don't like each other especially Germany dislikes the situation as Venice was a former ally but turned out just to be allies so they could snack the irredentist borders.
 
Chinese/Indian switch? Interesting. What are the Copts like?

(Quibble; with a POD several centuries BC, Christianity is arguably butterflied, but I can let it pass: Islam, though, after nearly a millenium? No: a new Monotheism arising in the middle east isn't too improbable, but being just like OTL is unlikely. Call it *Islam or Fislam or Bizlam or something. :p )
Yeah, I slapped my head last night thinking about that. Originally, the POD was in the 6th century- I only changed it to Asoka literally as I was writing the map notes.

In reality, attributing the origin of the Dharmic Kingdom to Asoka is a relic of Indish historiography. In reality, it only became stable in the 6th century, around the same time that the Chinese began to lose their unity.
 
Ok... my first real map in years. I was working on my Independent Tibet project but was running into a problem regarding Africa. So this one became an obsession of mine for a week. Deviantart link.

001. His Kingdom Come
I was raised in a conservative Christian home that treated the Left Behind series by Tim LaHaye and Jerry Jenkins as an inevitable future happening (and most likely within our lifetimes). Since I've grown up, traveled the world, became a secular person with Buddhist leanings, I have come to realize Left Behind for what it is: Biblical Fanfiction.

CAN YOU READ MINDS?!? I was just about to make a left behind redux (though from an orthodox Christian standpoint).

Just a few small things:

What happened to Fortuntado? Is his wizard priest order still running around?

Wasnt egypt a key ally of the USA in WWIII?

So basically, Nicolae wasnt ever able to consolidate his power after wwiii so he didnt get quite as feared or popular as he was in the books?
 
lJ6k0M2.png

A continuation of my original idea.

The normal world ended on New Years Day, 2016

The event took no logical idea, no path of reason the draconian physicals laws humans possessed allowed. The event would be called many things over the ages, The Great Transport, The Beckoning, God's Sneeze, but one name above else captures what humanity felt the day of the arrival- Utter Madness.

40 years after the event, the madness has long parted from its worse phase, but oddities and myriad wonders and horrors still light and blight humanity. The day of the event, 12 nations were transported to a planet, which initial satellite images showed to be a massive terraformed mars, although on closer inspection the only thing mars and this planet had in common were outward geography. What the first settlers encountered when they first braved the Barsoomian fields were aliens, though aliens beyond the wildest imaginations of man. Polyp divers, Vetshanks, Robulls, all myriad forms with more genetic diversity than earth ever possessed. This was not a normal planet. Scientific explanation was not ready deal with this. It would not be for a thousand years.

The world stabilized fairly quickly. Fifty years after the event, the new world of Barsoom was starting to reach what could be considered a status quo.

The West coast of the United States of America was transported to the western Tharsian plain, and arid region with coastal fields remarkably similar to California itself. Whatever creature started the event had a sense of irony. Faced with the impossible task of stabilizing in the face of millions of hungry, panicked people, the American provisional government showed remarkable resolve. Drawing from it's older expansionist heritage, and facing the vast alien plains that lied on all sides, a new manifest destiny was starting to emerge. This time, those of all races, creeds, and faith, were pushing the limits of the nation, under the Stars and Stripes, with a more cynical worldview developing due to the initial post-event chaos, California is not as liberal as one might expect. While the original provinces are still run by the democrats, in the outer "New Territories" the new Republicans dominate.

Perhaps the most hard hit nation directly after the event was Japan. Faced with isolation, severe lack of trades and imports, with the only nation close by, the USA, suffering from it's own problems, Japan was reeling under hunger, needing to face it's demons or fall into chaos. The Northern Russian island of Sakhalin had been transported with Japan as well, which had plenty of farms and agriculture. The US soldiers in Japan gave the Japanese army a strategic edge. With Sakhalin reeling under it's own problems, the island had no choice but to surrender. Quickly seizing agricultural outposts in Sakhalin and setting up farms on the continent of Elysium, Japan was finally feeding itself again. With the discovery that much of the Barsoomian life was edible to humans, Japan finally became self sufficient. 40 years post event, Japan is an expanding maritime power, heavily allied with the United States under a trade pact, it's settlers pushing into the heart of the Elysian jungle.

The most successful expander was China, it's capital and metropoles transported to the other side of Tharsis. Stripped of it's fertile countryside and the prosperous ports of Canton, it seemed as though China would die a slow death. Instead, the government lead it's people on great expansion outward, bringing the mandate of heaven with every land touched. The new china would bring peace and order to earth, expand the human frontier, and sail new seas of human experience. It is clearly traversing that boundary with more savvy than any other nation in Barsoom. It is, however showing signs of slowing, as the now settled population in cozy new towns start to embrace the new status quo.

While most governments changed very little after the event, the nation of Turkey was not so convinced that the old order of bureaucratic hypocrisy would survive. Instead, they overthrew the decadent secular regime, and once again established a nation shining in Allah's goodwill, this time on Barsoom. Despite being Islamist, the government is democratic and stabilizing, the last coup attempt being ten years ago. Turkish expansion is remarkably stable, growing steadily and carefully, the new provinces barely distinguishable from the old in terms of living standards. This does however, have the side effect of being very slow.

Denmark and Switzerland were Transported to the Nilo Coast, an area strewn with the most dangerous Barsoomian life. Faced with a wild, seemingly unconquerable frontier, these nations did the unthinkable- conquer that frontier. Trucks strewn with repeater guns now sprawl over the expansion zone, carrying settlers and shipments, killing dangerous Barsoomian lifeforms and clearing vast swaths of forest for safe settlement. As expansion technology gets more and more advanced, the Bern-Copenhagen axis is now hunkering down for a new great expansion.

India was rather lucky getting put in the Hellas Sea, one of the most fertile areas of Barsoom. It's vast populations and relatively well maintained southern infrastructure allowed it to colonize Hellas basin at an unprecedented speed. Now settler towns dot every part of the Hellas coast, each with it's own patron god, those who are to thank for bringing Bharat to the New World. The Settler towns are described as being more pleasant than India itself, as they were built on the modern model of wood and bricks in contrast to the heavy marble of mainland India. With the loss of the North, culture here has taken on an undeniably Dravidian flare, with Hindi being phased out a mere 5 years after the event as the lingua franca. At this point 80 percent of the population of India speaks English, even those not generally considered "educated". With India however, the Nations of Maldives and Sri Lanka were transported as well, now both in the Indian sphere, and rather content as so, being treated with respect, even though some politicians regard Bangalore with contempt.

Britain and Ireland were brought to Isidis bay, and found themselves in a situation that neither wanted to face- working together. With massive hurricanes wrecking the coast and an rising demand for food, the governments of the British isles were put in a tough spot. It was decided in a moment of cooperation that both nations would form an intermittent alliance to save both their nations. Celts and Englishmen alike were sent to to form colonies abroad and ship food, in which it would come back to Britain and Ireland in equal supply. Huge welfare bills and money grants were given to those who volunteered to leave the comfort of home and embark to the new colonies for the sake of their country. These men and women more or less saved the British Isles from a slow and painful decline. However, with the decrease in tension and the current self-sufficiency of both regimes, Celts and Englishmen may once again go their separate ways.

Hungary was a wild card. It had a rather low population, good infrastructure, and was fairly self sufficient, but it's location landlocked deep in the Isidis desert had not allowed it much contact with other nations beyond radio calls. It's location in a desert meant it's water supply was now limited to the draining Danube and a few lakes. Hungary was on bought time. It pleaded to Britain for support, but caught in it's own problems, it would not be able to ship water for another two years, simply too much time. Hungary then decided it would send settlers on a march to the northern coast, and gain water by itself. Great caravans of thousands of trucks carrying purification tanks drive far across the desert, and finally made it to the sea to extract water. The port of New Magyar now provides water to the whole nation.


The nations described above are not the only nations in Barsoom however. brought along in the event were other nationalities, now stripped of a homeland in need of rebuilding- or in the case of the Kurds, a homeland now ready to be built. The nations of Kurdistan, Neuva Mexico, and Novya Rossiya are now established in world geopolitics, if small and undeveloped. A few Muslims in India left Hellas Basin for the untamed frontiers of the north, now living in the nomadic fashion of their distant ancestors.

The nations of humanity are starting to recover, getting back on their feet, now looking to a new, Barsoomian horizon. Only time will tell were we will go from here.
 
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My first map! The World, 2100. (EDIT: Just noticed I overlooked something. Please pretend the border between BC and Canada is coloured like an external border, not an internal one!)

View attachment 312946

I may have left out some things below since I stupidly neglected to take notes as I was making the map. So, if you notice something unexplained, please do ask! The colour scheme is a mixture of TACOS, TOASTER and whatever the basemap was (I just know it was neither of those two because some colours didn't match up) - and then I made a whole bunch of countries grey because they just weren't important and I didn't like how busy all the colours made the map look.
Good first attempt. Honestly, though, the product just isn't that impressive. There's no reasonable explanation for anything that happened. Why were there major wars in Eastern Europe that didn't go nuclear? Why did the PRC invade Taiwan without starting a nuclear war? Why didn't anything happen in Africa or Asia (save the Middle East)? I could go on for quite a while, but suffice to say in the future you should actually do some research.
 
The trend on this board of making Britain into some kind of pariah hell state after Brexit in future maps and in other forms of content is kinda ridiculous. Otherwise, the map isn't too bad.
What can I say, I'm Scottish :p

Good first attempt. Honestly, though, the product just isn't that impressive. There's no reasonable explanation for anything that happened. Why were there major wars in Eastern Europe that didn't go nuclear? Why did the PRC invade Taiwan without starting a nuclear war? Why didn't anything happen in Africa or Asia (save the Middle East)? I could go on for quite a while, but suffice to say in the future you should actually do some research.
I didn't think those first few things required much explanation, but I'm happy to elaborate!

The war involving Russia were a result of the tensions between the EU and Russia escalating further. In a sense, the Ukrainian conflict was a proxy war between EU/NATO and Russia. These are just more iterations of the same phenomenon, coupled with persistent instability in Ukraine and Belarus. Ultimately, there isn't much gain for the EU in nuking Russia for taking part of Belarus, Ukraine, and Transnistria, when significant parts of the population actually want to be Russian anyway. It's much more in their interest to come to the solution they came to, which was to partition them, and now there's a nice, big, stable, functional buffer Poland between the two. Geopolitically, the end result of those wars was thus fairly favourable to both sides, as it resulted in an overall stabilisation of the situation in Eastern Europe. (And turned out to be a major contribution to the cause of European unification, so I'm sure the conspiracy nuts of this TL went mental about it!) I'll admit, this is a bit of a rehash of the early 20th century, but hey, that's why I thought it didn't really require elaboration.

As to the Eastern European wars not involving Russia, there's little incentive for anyone to involve nuclear weapons. Sure, e.g. populist Hungary deciding to retake Transylvania didn't exactly please the EU, but France isn't going to unleash its nuclear arsenal because of a skirmish between Hungary and Romania.

Regarding the PRC and Taiwan, I don't understand the question. Taiwan doesn't have nukes, and China's "No First Use" doctrine is well-established, so I can't see a reason for nuclear weapons to feature - you seem to have a bit of a fixation! Who do you think would nuke whom? The US is going to nuke one of its major trading partners? Fat chance.

Why didn't anything happen in Africa and Asia? In the case of Africa because, to put it bluntly, what happens in Africa doesn't make much of a difference to anywhere else, save perhaps for the US, China or Russia ending up with slightly more or slightly fewer mining interests somewhere. So, for a quick map scenario, I see no point in really bothering that much with Africa unless Africa still belongs to the European powers. It'd be a different matter if I were writing a whole proper timeline rather than just a one-off. In the case of Asia, it's simply been blessed with a period of relative peace (mind that Russia and China did start quite a bit of shit as you yourself point out). Unlikely, perhaps, but not exactly totally impossible.
 
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