Map challenge: What happened here?

[Silent Cal]

And here's the map:



With a POD after 1900, your challenge is to figure out the changes/divergences from OTL and a plausible explanation as to how they happened.

Any takers?

 

[yourworstnightmare]

A map challenge with somewhat sane borders (excpet the UK bits), damn it, we can do better.

 

[Stonewall]

-Looks like the U.K went through some serious shit.
-Independant and somewhat-larger poland? Awesome!
-Russia has the Crimea, but not Ukraine...interesting
-Denmark, Iceland, and Greenland joining into one government seems plausible...

Yeah, this doesnt seem too far-out a scenario. Might take a whack at this later.

 

[Silent Cal]

A map challenge with somewhat sane borders (excpet the UK bits), damn it, we can do better.

I've tried being a bit more subtle for a change, not sure if it will work, I've had doubts about some somewhat glaring "changes" myself.

 

[TheMann]

I've tried being a bit more subtle for a change, not sure if it will work, I've had doubts about some somewhat glaring "changes" myself.

That's OK. You're trying, and we do respect people who do think things through here, even if that means that things aren't all that spectacular at first.

I'm also noticing:

- Quebec has separated from Canada (but you made the good move of not having the whole province go, as that was highly unlikely IOTL)
- Paraguay lost a bunch of land to Bolivia (Fought a war and Paraguay lost, perhaps?)
- Zambia and Zimbabwe are one country (I'm guessing that they were made into one colony when they were still both called Rhodesia)
- Katanga and South Sudan are independent (Successful independence movements?)
- Cameroon, Chad, the Central African Republic, Gabon and the French Congo are one country (No idea how you pull this one off. Maybe Cameroon and Gabon become one country and conquer their neighbors?)
- Kashmir is not part of India OR Pakistan (not sure how you get this one, either)
- Something is up with the two Koreas (NK has collapsed and SK has taken over the process of rebuilding, maybe)
- Scotland is independent (Why do people keep going with this idea, anyways?)
- Morocco took over Western Sahara (Spain won't like that one bit)
- Turkey has taken over Cyprus (Without a genocide, this one is ASB)

 

[yourworstnightmare]

The Bolivia- Paraguay thing is probably a Chaco war gone different.

 

[Silent Cal]

That's OK. You're trying, and we do respect people who do think things through here, even if that means that things aren't all that spectacular at first.

Thanks.

- Paraguay lost a bunch of land to Bolivia (Fought a war and Paraguay lost, perhaps?)

ITTL Paraguay lost TTL's equivalent of the Chaco war

- Zambia and Zimbabwe are one country (I'm guessing that they were made into one colony when they were still both called Rhodesia)
- Katanga and South Sudan are independent (Successful independence movements?)

Correct on both counts.

- Cameroon, Chad, the Central African Republic, Gabon and the French Congo are one country (No idea how you pull this one off. Maybe Cameroon and Gabon become one country and conquer their neighbors?)

I was actually inspired by an entry in the MoF "God have mercy on my enemies..." In which a charismatic general created a Union of African Republics from these former French colonies, much to the chagrin of the French...

- Kashmir is not part of India OR Pakistan (not sure how you get this one, either)

Also inspired by an old map series in fact, here a more brilliant Maharaja manages to keep the former princely state of Jammu and Kashmir independent, with reluctant Indian support, by playing off both sides.

- Something is up with the two Koreas (NK has collapsed and SK has taken over the process of rebuilding, maybe)

Correct.

- Scotland is independent (Why do people keep going with this idea, anyways?)

Yeah, that's the glaring change I mentioned I envisioned that some serious economic and political troubles caused by inept political leaders a la For All Time gave rise to increased Scottish nationalism, and eventually independence via referendum. Not the most plausible bit, I know.

- Turkey has taken over Cyprus (Without a genocide, this one is ASB)

Actually, not sure if it's visible, but Turkey and Greece partitioned Cyprus, with Turkey taking the north and Greece the south.

 

[Silent Cal]

BTW I envisioned this TL as being slightly more dystopic than OTL, due to more economic hardship and resulting political blunders, stemming from TTL's global conflicts (WWI and WWII).

 

[The Kiat]

I see a Central African Federation?

 

[Frank5]

Some of my thoughts:
- Lithuania got Kaliningrad, maybe because of different Jalta conference?
- Larger Germany in east so again in different Jalta conference?
- Crimea is russian, because Chrusciov simply didnt give it to Ukraine and it was left for Russia?

 

[yourworstnightmare]

I see South Sudan!!
I don't see Uganda though.

 

[imperialaquila]

I think a different Yalta conference leading to several butterflies in decolonization is the best bet.

The Central African thingie could maybe be explained as the French letting their colonies go as one big unit, rather than multiple smaller entities. The same thing could explain the East African Federation, as well.

Possibly a stronger Pan-Africanism could lead to more, larger confederations among former colonies immediately after independence? And the same Pan-Africanism leads to a more violent decolonization, and the shocks to the British economy lead to Scotland breaking away?

Maybe those shocks then lead to the rump UK going isolationist and staying out of the ATL EU? These economic shocks could have led, indirectly, to the independent Quebec, through the British economy dragging down the Canadian one.

Is that close, Calcion?

This is a very interesting scenario. On the surface, it seems very close to OTL, but when you look below the surface, it gets very complicated very fast.

 

[Silent Cal]

Yep, pretty close, though I imagined the POD being slightly before WWII, during the interwar period. Still, the changes are not quite as profound; the Nazis rise, and appeasement goes as per OTL. The deviances from OTL become more apparent and the butterflies start working more obviously after the war and due to these small changes, there is an alternate Yalta conference (which maybe was held elsewhere instead, who knows?) with slightly different aims in mind than OTL, again due to a slightly different WWII (the POD had caused some minor chances, but not enough to change the ultimate outcome of the war).

 

[Yelnoc]

I noticed that Israel controls all of Palestine.

Also, North Korea is under South Korean influence, but the two are not united. Maybe the Juche regime just collapsed and they are going througha slow reintigration process?

 

[Room 101]

I notice a union between Uganda, Kenya, and Tanzania.

 

[Silent Cal]

Also, North Korea is under South Korean influence, but the two are not united. Maybe the Juche regime just collapsed and they are going througha slow reintigration process?

I notice a union between Uganda, Kenya, and Tanzania.

Right on both counts.

 

[Ulster]

Czechoslovakia hasn't broken up

Croatia, Norway and Macedonia are EU members, but Greece isn't (ejected for partitioning Cyprus perhaps?)

Iraq has Annexed Kuwait.

There seems to be some kind Central American Federation.

Yemen is still split up.

Somalia has also been split up.

 

[cbr]

Romania and Moldova united after the USSR collapsed.

 

[Freizeit]

I notice a union between Uganda, Kenya, and Tanzania.

In OTL it's the East African Community, including Rwanda and Burundi. Why didn't they join with Tanzania, Kenya and Uganda? Both countries supported a union.

 

[Alex Richards]

Presumably the alternative WWII resulted in Italian and British Somaliland remaining seperate, thus two seperate nations later.

Britain also appears to have held onto Aden for longer (or maybe the ultra islamists took charge leading to South Yemen declaring indpendence).

USSR went down differently as well. No Transnistria, South Ossetia, Abkhazia or Nagorno-Karborakh.