Hiers of Heraclius, a no Islam timeline

Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: Before 1900' started by Goldensilver81, Jun 17, 2019.

Loading...
  1. Goldensilver81 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2019
    Hello iam golden silver 81 me and my friend Ikkermacht have made this timeline

    i will be posting i and my fried have written a lot but we can still rewrite many things

    some things to consider i will try to keep butterfly effects to minimum so that i might not suffer so much in thinkig of new rulers

    but things will change A LOT

    in this timeline muhamed dies early from disease and influential men like abu bakar and al walid die in tribal conflicts

    this timeline will begin in 642 with the death of heracluis

    ps i know constans was called constantine but i will call him constants for simplicity sake
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2019
  2. Threadmarks: A heros misery

    Goldensilver81 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2019
    A heros misery​

    March 642:
    a soft breeze swept the Bosporus it carried the sounds of cries , coming from the city of Constantinople.

    one child was weeping close to the body crying in this place , it was the funeral of a timid ,temperate, courageous and most of all a great man, Heraclius savior of Rome

    He had led his people against Persia and the avar barbarians and won the loosing war.

    Heraclius had spent the next 14 years since the wars end to rebuilding his empire that was exhausted and weak by the horrible roman Persian war of 602 to 628 .


    he was called Nikephoros the Bringer of Victory , he was truly a great man he returned the roman empire to its former glory , he remade the army , made tax reforms , took back some territories vía conquest ir diplomtic apeal .

    He even manneged to bring the kingdom of altava to roman control as client state due years of negotiation.

    Along with many berber tribes that had trade deals with the Byzantines

    yet he felt sad since he could not fix the church

    But his great sadness came to him later in his life

    In 641 his son Constantine III was dying he told his father that his son was to be future emperor

    He agreed to his son's dying wish , and his son Constantine III died in May, this was the begging of sorrows for the great emperor.

    Due to the death of his son he became more unstable.

    Meanwhile,Heraclonas who was co emperor and her mother Martina where thinking on the succession. But do to pressure from the generals because of Heraclius words he made Constantine’s son co emperor.

    Heraclius become more senile, a rumor was spread that it was heraclonas and martina who killed Constantine .

    Heraclius was too busy to hear pety rumors , so he ignored it since he was trying so desperately to heal the split in the church

    This decision doomed the succession


    Heraclius was a great man

    but despite everything that he had done he would have one big failure the same failure of another great emperor , Justian ; the church he never healed the divide he tried to so desperately in his last year of life but at this point he was to old

    His mind that was so sharp back in this glory days, was now only the mind of a man who forgot things he just heard

    With this in mind the army stormed the palace and exiled both heraclonas and Martina for the "assination" of Constantine

    Heraclius was trying to plan for a council and when the news came to him he wept and fell to the floor

    The emperor ordered the death of all the generals and that Constantinople must be punished he said the would burn the city the generals and advisors did not listen .

    He the great Heraclius was sent in prison to his own palace , Heraclius was a broken man, he was famous, rich,filled with prestige, but alone sad mentally unstable

    He thought over and over again that god had punish him ,and he believed that he was suffering from what the lord had said in mark 8:36

    “For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?”

    The only thing that distracted him from his mesiry , was seeing his grandson that boy knew how to cheer him up.

    The next moths went fast ,but where dreadful for Heraclius, he felt the cold embrace of death comming for him , one nigth of march , he told his grandson to continue his work and be a good emperor that he might have the blessing of god and he might not pass this curse to him.

    He prayed with his grandson and for the last time of his life he felt an emotion that he long forgotten since some years, for the last time he felt happy.

    The next morning his courtiers and servants found him dead He had died in the night after his grandson left

    the boy came back closed his eyes and stood beside his grandfather, as the priests and deacons congregated, he cried as he followed along the priest and the sounds of the prayers of the dead

    The procession ended in the curch of the Holy Apostoles ,on this sunny spring day with the Golden Horn and the Bosporus reflected in light as the breeze carried the sound of sadness and min censers with incense.

    This was the funeral of a great Emperor; the nigth before ,he had given an account of his life and his sins to God especially his marrige and to commend his soul to mercy of the lord Jesus Christ.

    But the Empire continued, and even here in a city full of sadness and weeping, even at this funeral , the boy had to be prepared.

    the next day the boy addressed the senate with a speech blaming Heraclonas and Martina for eliminating his father, the 11 year old began under a regency of senators led by Patriarch Paul II of Constantinople

    an thus began the reign of the boy basilus Constans II
     
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2019
  3. Goldensilver81 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2019
    Eastern roman empire in 642 at the death of heraclius and ascension of Constans II
    Byzantine_and_Sassanid_Empires_in_600_CE.png
     
  4. Jing0ist_Peasant Banned

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2018
    This looks great so far! I just hope ERE doesn't just dominate all italy and keep expanding. Make Zoroastrianism great again
     
    Goldensilver81 likes this.
  5. Philip One L only

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2007
    Location:
    Behind you
    This should probably be Holy Apostles instead of Holy Wisdom.
     
  6. The_Russian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2017
    Location:
    California
    This is starting to look good. Interesting to see how places such as Iberia and Italy will look like with a stronger Byzantium, and no Islamic empires
     
  7. Goldensilver81 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2019
    Trust me this going to be a long story
    I and my friend have tried to make it realistic
    But have added surprises since history is full of them
     
    Gabingston and The_Russian like this.
  8. Goldensilver81 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2019
    You are absolutely right
     
    Gabingston likes this.
  9. The_Russian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2017
    Location:
    California
    Can’t wait
     
    Goldensilver81 likes this.
  10. metalinvader665 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2011
    Location:
    Tennessee, North American Union
    So is Exarch Gregory the Patrician going to lead Carthage to independence, or will Carthage need her Berber allies to lead the city to become something more than just a regional city of the Empire?
     
    Goldensilver81 likes this.
  11. Goldensilver81 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2019
    You Will have to wait and see
     
  12. Threadmarks: erros of the sha

    Goldensilver81 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2019
    may 642

    a messenger enters the palace and surprises the young shahanshah Yazdegerd III , he was busy looking to solve the many problems of his realm , in paper he was king of the whole of Persia ; in reality he had authority only in Sakastan , Pars and Khuzestan, while the north hated him and refused to mint coins of his name .

    this was all due to Heraclius and the civil war that shook the foundation of the empire since the defeat of 628 , by the end he was sha and now he is battling not for conquest , but to keep his realm alive which was being attacked by outside like the Turks and forces and form the inside since so many of his nobles declared independence.

    When the messenger arrive he yelled

    What is it now another Turkish raid? If it is I don’t care we have those every week “

    The messenger replied

    No my king, Heraclius Parviz (the Victorious) has died

    Yazdegerd III was surprised he felt reviled and scared for he knew that Heraclius was a great commander respected and feared by the Persians.

    But he knew that Heraclius wanted peace; he was thinking what will the new king of the Greeks do?

    14 years had passed , his realm could have recovered and he was vulnerable he need to make peace with the king of the Greeks.

    This was so important to him , that he needed to meet him in person he sent letters for an official meeting in 1 month time

    August 642

    Yazdegerd took longer than excepted as he had to deal with raids.

    He arrived at Constantinople,he carried a poor excuse of guards and companions;before the Persian sha had the best guards one could see the riches of him.

    Now the sha had come with almost no jewels, the metals he carried where painted to look like gold and silver.

    One could see how low the Sassanid’s have fallen.

    Yazdegerd was waiting for the emperor and then he saw how a boy came with the patriarch of Constantinople

    Yazdegerd chuckled this is what consumed his mind? This was the great worry? He expected to see a lion and he was seeing a lamb.


    He greeted Heraclius grandson and the patriarch, the the patriarch talked in this meeting , while constant watched with attention.

    The meeting was held and they reached an agreement that they would support Yazdegerd but he had to help Costant.

    The sha agreed he was now confident that the Greek will be no menace to him since in his mind they are led by a “holy man” and a weak boy.


    He returned to Persia, once he arrived there was news Gil Gavbara had declared independence and established the Dabuyid kingdom

    He could not care less

    He said “let the turks destroy him “he was confident now that in 10 years he would reunite the whole of Persia under his rule
     
  13. Talus I of Dixie We need to wank Venice

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2019
    Location:
    Mesquita-RJ, Brazil
    ironic, i just started a timeline about a world where the invasions go further, and i find one where they do not happen

    Well, keep it up, i really liked the idea
     
  14. Goldensilver81 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2019
    lol yeah i got a long history where not stopping until centuries down the line
     
    Talus I of Dixie likes this.
  15. Threadmarks: Seeds of treachery

    Goldensilver81 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2019
    seeds of treachery
    Time moved on since the treaty.
    In the same year a young Constans married valentenuis daughter fausta.

    As time when on, the regency of Patriarch Paul II was coming to an end, Constant had good experience learning to lead his realm.

    He was at the eve of adulthood , he had taken this time of peace to study, so that he migth be able to rule his empire effectively , he also had combat training and battlefield training from Valentinus , but tensions had being growing in Africa.

    The Exarchate of Africa at this time was in internal turmoil due to the conflict between the mainly Orthodox Chalcedonian Christians population and the supporters of Monotheletism, in an attempt at compromise between Chalcedonianism and Monophysitism

    Exarch Gregory the Patrician , in July 645 Gregory hosted a theological dispute in his capital Carthage between the Chalcedonian Maximus the Confessor and the Monothelite former Patriarch of Constantinople, Pyrrhus.

    Gregory being a smart man and persistent one as well tired and seems that he succeeded it to bring about a reconciliation between the two, and Pyrrhus re-embraced the Chalcedonian position.

    But the situation would only get worse over the next few months; several local synods in Africa proceeded to condemn Monotheletism as heresy.

    This tore the exarchate Gregory tired of this sent many letters to the emperor, the letters began with much respect, but as time went on they became more disrespectful towards the emperor.

    Gregory got furious that the emperor was ignoring such a big issue.

    In reality Constans never received them as Patriarch Paul II ignored them seeing it as thing that Gregory had to fix with the bishop of carthage

    Then the letter stopped, one night Gregory had a secret meeting with the highest ranking men of church and state of the Exarchate.

    And gave the following speech:

    I ask you what ruler is incapable of defending the faith? What sins have we committed that caused Basileus to forsake us?

    Have you and I not tried to solve these debates on the nature of the lord? What kind of ruler does not send help to us?

    Why has Constantinople and the empire not called for council? and there is evidence that Basileus SUPORTS THE HERECTICS!

    In seems to me that is not just to serve a uncaring Basileus , much less one THAT SUPORTS HERETICS!

    We should strive with all our determination to free ourselves from our enemies!


    The men cheered as the seeds of distrust had now become the harvest of rebellion.
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2019
  16. Goldensilver81 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2019
    we are close lets see if your prediction is true
     
  17. Threadmarks: Harvest of rebellion.

    Goldensilver81 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2019
    Early 646
    Gregory has been preparing for months , he has prepared his men in constant training , he also convinced berber tribes to join him by his word or the gold in his coffin's , that he has received money from the local churches and has been given support from an unlikely Ally the pope .

    With this wealth Gregory reduced taxes on the populous , this makes him popular , Gregory has also made propoganda.
    At first it was suttle mentioning how tragic it is that Heraclius was gone .
    But it became less suttle saying that things like
    Heraclius would disapprove of his grandsons desision making or in this case lack there of .
    He was doing a good job in using constans greatest source of approval against him .

    But this day all would change; as the men rallied in the streets of Carthage , Gregory stands to speak he utters these words :

    Men of Carthage , today I have assembled you because I can't take it any longer , this beautiful city and all these terretories are being govern by an incompetent , uncaring and worst of all a disgrace that we call basileus

    The crowd fell silent and Gregory got a little nervous for he knew if he didn't not convince them he would be killed by them , he continued:

    I know you want to be loyal to Heraclius , but if you follow his grandson you are not being loyal because he SUPPORTS THE HERECTICTS!

    The crowd began to whisper .

    What basileus does not call for a council ? Why does he let this chaos rule ?
    Is this the attitude of a good ruler ?
    He might be a honorable boy but he is not fit to lead us.

    Some in the crowd began to yell NO!

    It is unjust for us to deal with betrayal to a dream .

    My dream of a United Rome died the day that heraclius died .

    My faith in the healing of the church was burried with him .

    So may ask will you join me ? And together we shall make the dream of Rome and the faith of one cruch real?

    He would have wanted it do you?
    He said this as he pointed at a golden coin of heraclius .

    The crowd began to yell yes we do ! Over and over.

    Gregory smiled as he knew the last step was over he now was master of these lands .
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2019
  18. Threadmarks: The long march

    Goldensilver81 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2019
    May 646

    Gregory for the last 2 months to persecute the monophosyte heretic's these not having the numbers to figth back fleed to tripolitania and the kingdom of atlava .
    Some monophosyte berbers defected but for most gold was more powerful than faith .

    Now with absolute rule; he sets his sigths on the east and the province of Egypt .

    City of Constantinople.

    Costants was furrious and took out his angry at the patriarch he said :
    See what you caused?
    You fool now we have open rebellion do to your incompetence:

    The patriarch said :
    Basileus you must understand I thought the local bishop could deal with it , I had to attend more important things as your regent .

    Constans answered :
    As regent you should have informed me of this situation to AVOID THIS MESS !

    A servant entred and said :
    Basileus?

    Constans said : what ? Can you see iam busy ?

    The servant replied:
    general Valentinus has arrived .

    The emperor said to make him enter .
    Valentinus entered the room and said:
    Basileus I have heard the news .

    Constans just said : Spare me the details Valentinus and speak

    Valentinus answered:
    I ask for troops I shall led them I shall take some 25 000 troops ?

    Constans replied : you don't need more ? Or assistance from the berbers ?

    The general said : it's not necessary Basileus.
    The emepror asked once again and got the same response .

    Finally costans said :
    Fine make your preparations and leave for Egypt.

    While Valentinus prepared , Gregory began his invasion of tripolitania taking some cities like Sabratha,Oea and Letptis Magna.

    The poor outnumberd Garrisons where not ready for a siege ,and in every desperate sortie they tried the berber Calvary would decimate them.

    Despite this Gregory; was advancing slower than before since now he avoided the coast.

    He had left a good part of the navy to defend Carthage and his base of power, for he knew the forces of costans might go straight to his capital to attempt a knock out blow
    Still every costal city the took has a save place to resupply.

    Now he had to cross the desert , the berbers who knew these lands told him that he had 2 options .

    The safe route on the coast but it comes at the risk of the Roman navy spotting him and having the roman army ambushing and destroy him

    Or risk going in to the desert where most of his army could perish and the Romans would win without drawing a single sword .

    Any normal commander would not chose this risk, but he was no normal commander would not take the risk and he took the long route and began to go south into the desert

    (Gregorys rebelion)

    gregory.png
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2019
  19. HerodotosofBerlin Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2019
    Subscribed! Thougt about threadmarking your posts ?
     
  20. Goldensilver81 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2019
    How do I do that
     
Loading...