I do have to mention that not all OTL actors, politicians etc should exist in Hensonverse esp this far out from the PD. There should be alternative people - either people who 'never made it' OTL or even actual original characters. We are in the fiction zone with the timeline - use some fictional people.
Hensonverse Speculation and Commentary
- Thread starter Ogrebear
- Start date
Firstly, we have quite a few fictional people - look at Terrell, for instance.
Secondly... part of the fun of this TL for me is playing little what-ifs with people's careers. For example, the career of Nick Frost was arguably an accident - he was working as a waiter in a Mexican restaurant, when he met Simon Pegg who was the boyfriend of a co-worker who suggested he try stand-up comedy... roughly twelve or so years from the POD.
From an Orthodox Butterflyist perspective, it shouldn't happen. However, it enabled an interesting idea, stemming from the butterflies of this TL...
The 80's British comedy actors - people like Rowan Atkinson, Rik Mayall, Ade Edmondson, Stephen Fry and Danny John-Jules - are all far bigger names in Hollywood than they ever were OTL. And, of course, Penguin has given Britain a proper film industry. Basically, rather than most funny Brits suffering by simple virtue of not being Ricky Gervais, the situation's rather better.
So how would the careers of Simon Pegg or Nick Frost or David Mitchell or Robert Webb end up in that status quo? What films would the "dream team" of Pegg, Frost and Wright be able to make? That's a fascinating idea to explore - would primarily using fictional people enable this idea to be explored in quite the same way? Maybe... but probably not.
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Or him/her/them! (I'm mostly in the pop-culture side of this TL, so I might need a bit of a reminder...)
I would also like to take this moment (already stated on the main thread) to talk about a theme that's emerged in this TL... luck. Aside from, obviously, the people who were saved or killed, we've seen luck as a major element in an actor's success in the smaller elements of this TL.
The diverging career trajectories of two people - Hank Azaria and Johnny Depp - are good examples of this.
ITTL, Hank Azaria ends up playing Aquaman - who becomes The Justice League's big scene-stealer and gets a hit solo film - and follows that up with Captain Jack Swallow (who, fun fact, was originally Jack Swallows) in Red Sails. So the popularity and acclaim of both those roles become career-defining and end up propelling him to the A-list (far closer to it than he ever was OTL).
Meanwhile, Johnny Depp looks to be staying in the indie circuit, with the occasional Tim Burton/Richard Stanley film to pay the bills. He's probably known as, in this TL, "the chaos theory guy in Jurassic Park, right?"
Acting, as this TL says (although, technically, this was about music), is a roll of the dice half of the time– some people get lucky on their first roll and land the big parts, others don’t (that doesn’t make those who don’t any less talented). Luck is a massive factor. Or, as this TL says;
And, sometimes, luck can be subjective. Here's a couple of good examples of this.
Robert Downey Jr got the part of Superman, bringing his own unique smart-arsed charm to a beloved character, and making him a Big Name far earlier than he did OTL... How well did that really work out for him?
Not well.
The stresses and scrutinies that come with fame drove him into the worst aspects of addiction far sooner than OTL, culminating in an arrest for reckless driving/DUI - which is a PR nightmare for WB and nearly leads to Downey losing his DC gig. At his lowest point after the incident, Downey realises how shit things have gotten for him and ends up in rehab and takes it seriously...
And then, two years sober and turning his life around... he dies in a random car accident because of a distracted driver. His death ends up dogged by rumours and his already grieving family end up having to launch a libel lawsuit because there's some assholes in the right-wing media and tabloids looking for the next story trying to exploit his death to fill their "Hollywood is an immoral cesspool" agenda (the former's case) and to sell more copies (the latter's case).
Another case is Aleksa Palladino - her breakout role in Drifters impresses Steven Spielberg and George Lucas enough to cast her as Padme in the Star Wars prequels. Great, right?
No.
Sexist angry trolls aside, with Ken Branagh's marriage disintegrating over an affair with a young actress, Palladino ends up the subject of salacious rumours about an affair - with tabloids and the same "Hollywood is an immoral, godless cesspool" assholes mentioned with RDJ accusing her of being a homewrecker. Basically implicated in a situation she has nothing to do with.
So Revenge of the Sith comes along and she says "F*** this", dumps the agent who started the mess in the first place and uses the paycheck to define her own career - she's not appearing in blockbusters or in the public limelight anymore (except for occasional returns as Padme, presumably)... yet she's doing what makes her happy now.
So sometimes luck can be a bit muddy - was Palladino lucky to get the role of Padme... or was she lucky to get out before fame ate her up and shat her out? Or, whilst obviously dying was unlucky for Downey, was he lucky to get the part of Superman because it elevated his career or because it got him realising how miserable he was earlier, meaning that he ended up inadvertently giving himself a good legacy?
Perhaps neither? Or perhaps both? Guess it depends on your point of view.
If Disney owned the full rights to Spider-Man, you can BET this would be the basis for a 22-minute special. It has all the makings of an official self-parody otherwise.
Spider-Mouse
Saw this comment and I did want to comment that I do largely agree. Though politics is an older person's game so it would take awhile for new faces to join in. Currently about 1/6 of the members of the House of Representatives were born after the POD, while only 1/20, 4, Senators were. By my own reckoning I had about 1 in 4 members of the House and 3 in 25 members of the Senate as different by the late 10s. The Supreme Court, I think, I had at 2/3rds different by the present . I might have to do work on that for a "present" accounting of l the government for the guest contribution thread.
I had some random thoughts about Ms. Taylor Swift, but she was born a year after me so a whole decade post POD. Maybe Tyler Swift is a financial exec who had a band on the side lol. But I ended up not thinking about that for too long because, it feels weird erasing real people that are my contemporaries.
With real people in the entertainment industry, it's also much easier to explore certain overarching ideas that have arisen from the butterflies of this TL.
A good example of this is Nick Frost. Now, his OTL career was mostly an accident - - he was working as a waiter in a Mexican restaurant, when he met Simon Pegg who was the boyfriend of a co-worker who suggested he try stand-up comedy... roughly twelve or so years from the POD.
From an Orthodox Butterflyist Perspective, the odds of these events happening is pretty low. However... it enabled us to explore an interesting ramification that arose from the butterflies of this TL:
Many of the 80's British comedy actors - people like Rowan Atkinson, Rik Mayall, Ade Edmondson, Stephen Fry and Danny John-Jules - are all far bigger names in Hollywood than they ever were OTL. And, of course, Penguin Pictures - due to Richard Daly leaving Warner Bros - has given Britain a proper film industry.
Basically, rather than most funny Brits suffering by simple virtue of not being Ricky Gervais, the situation's rather better for both them and the British film industry.
So how would the careers of Simon Pegg or Nick Frost or David Mitchell or Robert Webb end up in that status quo? What films would the "dream team" of Pegg, Frost and Edgar Wright be making? That's a fascinating idea to explore - would primarily using fictional people enable this idea to be explored in quite the same way?
I mean I planned a fictional Hmong-American to be Mayor of either Minneapolis or St. Paul.
Okay, now I'm genuinely fascinated by the ideas for career butterflies that could come about like this.
Likewise, a certain MM in Detroit has apparently never been talent-scouted by Andre Young and hasn't gone on to dominate the early 00s.
I just find the idea that so many of the celebrities we know from OTL a) still exist many years after the POD b) still go into show biz c) have careers that do well to be somewhat breaking the plausability line. If he even born Nick Frost should have stayed a waiter, perhaps he could still have been an actor/comedian but not because Simon Pegg found him but maybe someone else.
Or instead of X actor winning a part that becomes their breakout role its Y actor who gets it, an actor who in our world is washing cars.
Yes, I know there are examples all over the timeline, but as we move into totally fan contributions, I wanted to highlight this - there should be fictional and C-Z listers from our world whom are the Big Stars in Hensonverse.
Ditto in politics- just cos someone is born close to the POD does not mean that person's life should end up the same where they go into Parliament/Congress/Duma. Perhaps Michael Portillo became an astronaut for example.
Think big folks.
Or instead of X actor winning a part that becomes their breakout role its Y actor who gets it, an actor who in our world is washing cars.
Yes, I know there are examples all over the timeline, but as we move into totally fan contributions, I wanted to highlight this - there should be fictional and C-Z listers from our world whom are the Big Stars in Hensonverse.
Ditto in politics- just cos someone is born close to the POD does not mean that person's life should end up the same where they go into Parliament/Congress/Duma. Perhaps Michael Portillo became an astronaut for example.
Think big folks.
I tried to do something like this. Nicholas Brendon, the guy probably best known for playing Xander on Buffy OTL, and who has had a nasty public battle with addiction ended up getting clean and is a notable actor ITTL. Probably not as big as you're asking us to think, but it's something at least.
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Having a B-Day in 1972 ensures that he's still around, but probably not acting.
Or he does loss interest to play professional baseball and his now a mediocre MLB player.