God Owes Phillip II Twenty Bucks

[Nicholai IV Vonskrieger]

July 16th 1588, Off the coast of Plymouth

For almost two months the Grand Armada assembled by His Majesty King Phillip II of Spain, has been on the move. With each day it comes closer to the English coast. Aided by fair weather in the bay of Biscay, the fleet has arrived ahead of schedule and caught the whole of the English fleet unawares. On the deck of the San Martin the Duke of Medina Sidonia converse with his King, who decided to accompany the armada on the whims of a dream. As Sidonia looks over the English forces scrambling against the low tide to try and array themselves into an order of battle, he turns to his monarch. "Your majesty, if it would please you, I would urge us to strike now and destroy this English resistance before they can rise against us." As Philip gazes out over these waters that the Heathen English queen claims, to the coast that should belong to those who serve the true faith, his eyes harden and he nods. "Burn their ships, let these be the first heathens to taste gods wrath."

July 17th, Plymouth harbor.

Flame and smoke. That is all that remains of the shattered hulks of England's first line of defense. Her ships lay in ruins, shattered by Spanish powder and shot, and the Great Armada that unleashed such hell upon gods enemies now sails ever closer to the Duke of Parmas army in Flanders.

(This is my first timeline so I'm willing to accept any and all criticisms and advice)

 

[Prince de Pringondani]

I like it Phillip who leaves Spain for the North after such a long time

 

[Nicholai IV Vonskrieger]

I like it Phillip who leaves Spain for the North after such a long time

Thank you, so, as can probably be guessed, this will be a Spainwank. Any advice on what might be a good direction? I've got the basic outline already worked out, but detail wise I'm a little sparse.

 

[Nicholai IV Vonskrieger]

July 21st, 1588 - Suffolk

With the duke of Parma's army in his ships bellies, and the ships of the Dutch rebellion lying at the bottom of the depths, Phillip turned his ships towards the eastern coast of England. Now, they have arrived. Phillip, committed to following this second Reconquista across its soon to be violent path, Is receiving a report from the Duke of Parma on the resistance the English have assembled. And all the while, More and more of the Dukes 30,000 strong army disgorge themselves from the holds of the Spanish ships.

"At Ipswich, the English have assembled a force numbering some six thousand under Sir Francis Vere. Reinforcements are expected to come in from London soon, a force numbering some seven thousand under The Earl of Liecester. It will be a formidable force, but it will be the vast majority of the forces they can raise. We also expect to have the support of a large majority of those Englishman who still hold to the True Faith. If all goes well, England will fall within a few weeks."

The king nods approvingly as he looks down at the maps in front of him and listens to the extremely positive report from the Duke.

"God truly has blessed us in our endeavor. What of the Scotish and Irish. Can we expect them to be sympathetic to our righteous cause and not intervene?"

"Even if they do attempt to take advantage of the situation my lord, they can be 'persuaded' to aquiesce to our demands. They are no worry"

The Kings face breaks into a wide smile. "Then all is well. Soon, the vile usurper Elizabeth will feel gods holy fire."

And so the armies of Spain march across the rolling farmlands of England. Fire and blood to be left in the wake of this holy war.

 

[Avalon]

Ah, a Spanish wank. I can't wait for more, keep it up. Watched.

 

[Nicholai IV Vonskrieger]

July 27th, 1588 - Colchester

Behind the Spanish army, at the remnants of the town of Ipswich, lay the bodies of 4,500 English soldiers and 1,700 Spanish dead. After joining battle on the 23rd, the Spanish and English armies engaged in battle for three days. After the loss a third of their forces and the death of the Earl of Leicester (slain by a rogue Spanish cannon round), the English force now under the command of Sir Francis Vere fled south. However, Parma was close behind. Now, on the fields of colchester, Parma and Vere are meeting to discuss the terms of Vere's surrender. As Vere dismounts, he is a sad she'll of a man, harried and worn.

"Sir, I have come to discuss the terms of my surrender"

Parma, resplendent in court attire in a deliberate attempt to derdide the brash Englishman, walks closer, in a mocking bow he says

"His majesty King Phillip is glad to hear that you realize the folly of your situation, but he gives his condolences that your forces cannot be allowed to disperse. Those Catholics among them will find no wrath from us. But your heathen army will be destroyed".

As Parma turns and remounts, riding back to the Spanish lines, Sir Vere was seen to collapse to his knees, and be dragged from the field by his entourage. Two hours after the meeting, some thousand English Catholics that compose Vere's army abandon the army and flee to Spanish lines. Fifteen minutes later, the Spanish army moves in and smashes the remaining English forces. As Vere is brought before His Majesty King Phillip, the Spanish monarch only had a few words for those men who brought Vere in, and none for the man himself. "Send his head to Queen Elizbeth. That should be fitting reward until we meet in person". As Vere was dragged away crying, Phillip stood and turning to the host assembled for the march on London. With his voice rising above the tumult, those present said it carried the weight of God's will as he said,

"The Heathen hosts of these English infidels have once more been shattered by your brave actions. Now, we march on the den of the demon herself. Ready yourselves my people, Ready yourselves to burn London to the ground!"

The host erupted into cheers and with little delay, begins its unstoppable march on the English Capitol.

 

[alexmilman]

July 16th 1588, Off the coast of Plymouth

For almost two months the Grand Armada assembled by His Majesty King Phillip II of Spain, has been on the move. With each day it comes closer to the English coast. Aided by fair weather in the bay of Biscay, the fleet has arrived ahead of schedule and caught the whole of the English fleet unawares. On the deck of the San Martin the Duke of Medina Sidonia converse with his King, who decided to accompany the armada on the whims of a dream. As Sidonia looks over the English forces scrambling against the low tide to try and array themselves into an order of battle, he turns to his monarch. "Your majesty, if it would please you, I would urge us to strike now and destroy this English resistance before they can rise against us." As Philip gazes out over these waters that the Heathen English queen claims, to the coast that should belong to those who serve the true faith, his eyes harden and he nods. "Burn their ships, let these be the first heathens to taste gods wrath."

July 17th, Plymouth harbor.

Flame and smoke. That is all that remains of the shattered hulks of England's first line of defense. Her ships lay in ruins, shattered by Spanish powder and shot, and the Great Armada that unleashed such hell upon gods enemies now sails ever closer to the Duke of Parmas army in Flanders.

(This is my first timeline so I'm willing to accept any and all criticisms and advice)

To achieve this noble goal you have to provide Armada with enough culevrines: IIRC, it OTL they were too short on the long-range artillery which Spain could not produce in the needed numbers.

 

[alexmilman]

July 27th, 1588 - Colchester

Behind the Spanish army, at the remnants of the town of Ipswich, lay the bodies of 4,500 English soldiers and 1,700 Spanish dead. After joining battle on the 23rd, the Spanish and English armies engaged in battle for three days. After the loss a third of their forces and the death of the Earl of Leicester (slain by a rogue Spanish cannon round),

Leicester's death would be a bonus somewhat compensating for the losses.

BTW, what would be initial sizes of both armies? And why Vere had to capitulate if he had all England to run to?

Anyway, don't you think that both Phillip and Parma are a little bit too bloodthirsty (to fit the popular Anglophonic stereotype )? At least Parma was, seemingly, anything but a fanatic and probably even Phillip would not necessarily be beheading the enemy general.

The host erupted into cheers and with little delay, begins its unstoppable march on the English Capitol.

Errrrr..... unless I'm completely confused the closest "English-related" Capitol would be available in Washington, DC centuries later (and not quite "English"). Sorry, but temptation was too great.

 

[Nicholai IV Vonskrieger]

To achieve this noble goal you have to provide Armada with enough culevrines: IIRC, it OTL they were too short on the long-range artillery which Spain could not produce in the needed numbers.

Ah, should probably explain (sorry for my writing, I can't do battles very well and so generally skip to the aftermath). The armada didn't she'll the fleet from off the coast, they did what Sidonia originally planned to do OTL, sailing into the harbor itself and smashing the English fleet before it could arrange itself into a line of battle. Range was not really an issue.

 

[Nicholai IV Vonskrieger]

Leicester's death would be a bonus somewhat compensating for the losses.

BTW, what would be initial sizes of both armies? And why Vere had to capitulate if he had all England to run to?

Anyway, don't you think that both Phillip and Parma are a little bit too bloodthirsty (to fit the popular Anglophonic stereotype )? At least Parma was, seemingly, anything but a fanatic and probably even Phillip would not necessarily be beheading the enemy general.

Initial sizes of the forces are as follows.

Leicester/Vere: roughly 13,000. All present on the field of battle

Parma/Phillip: roughly 30,000. 21,000 present on the field of battle

As for Vere's attempt at surrender. The main reason was that he was suffering massive desertion. With a massive chunk of his army slaughtered, and the charismatic commander, that was keeping a large part of the London army from fleeing in the face of such an overwhelming force dead, he had a large number of troops deserting. Not just the thousand Catholics, but some 2000 Protestant troops. By the time Vere reaches Colchester. He is facing more desertions before he reaches London and he only has around 5000 men to face the 30,000 Spanish.

I'm also tampering with the number of Nobles who kept to the catholic faith. They're all still officially good Anglicans. But in reality a large number of powerful nobles are known to covertly be Papists. This is going to put the hurt on any defeated English army trying to get support from the various nobles.

And on to the most important part. Phillip and Parmas attitudes. Parma in this timeline is still a capable commander, but he's also more of a showboat. He's a lot like Leicester ITL. As for Phillip. I tweaked his devotion to the faith a little bit. He's more radical in his beliefs and willing to do what is necessary to get the message through to the Anglicans. All in all, this will probably lead into a Papacywank as well. Just by association.

 

[Jonathan]

Interesting time line, haven't seen a Spanish Armada victory in a while. Hopefully see great things.

 

[Art]

But the Duke of Parma would have been mad to try to send his army out on the North Sea where the Dutch light warships could slaughter his men in the water. The Armada had Galleons, Carracks, and Galleys, but no light warships to counter the Dutch. And what are Spain's long term goals, after England is conquered? I give them 20 years, at most before Spain suffers an insurgency in England just as bad as the one in the 17 Provinces. Spain was already on the verge of going broke BEFORE the Armada sailed. The fact that they had vast amounts of gold and silver did not really help, because the trade and manufacturing of Spain was ruined by the expulsion of the Jews and Muslims a generation before.

Is England to be a puppet state? Then France will become the power to take advantage of the wealth of North America. Or Germany. Spain is still screwed in so many ways, by a indolent Castilian nobility that did not use the potential wealth of Spain, and wasted their vast lands in the America's on the exploitation of plantations and mining the gold and silver of Peru and Mexico.

 

[Nicholai IV Vonskrieger]

But the Duke of Parma would have been mad to try to send his army out on the North Sea where the Dutch light warships could slaughter his men in the water. The Armada had Galleons, Carracks, and Galleys, but no light warships to counter the Dutch. And what are Spain's long term goals, after England is conquered? I give them 20 years, at most before Spain suffers an insurgency in England just as bad as the one in the 17 Provinces. Spain was already on the verge of going broke BEFORE the Armada sailed. The fact that they had vast amounts of gold and silver did not really help, because the trade and manufacturing of Spain was ruined by the expulsion of the Jews and Muslims a generation before.

Is England to be a puppet state? Then France will become the power to take advantage of the wealth of North America. Or Germany. Spain is still screwed in so many ways, by a indolent Castilian nobility that did not use the potential wealth of Spain, and wasted their vast lands in the America's on the exploitation of plantations and mining the gold and silver of Peru and Mexico.

This would take a while to explain. So here's the cliff notes version

1. It could be argued that the car racks and galleys are light ships, but it's been stated earlier that the armada sank the Dutch ships blockading Parma.

2. Spain's long term goals are to establish a Catholic government, that will be semi subservient to Madrid, but would still retain enough autonomy that it can tell its citizens that they are still independent, even if only nominally. And, I've already said I've tweaked the strength of the Catholic Church in England, insurgency is nowhere near as much of a problem as in OTL

3. Eh, your right, I'm probably going to use some butterflies and insignificant pre main POD, PODs to say that Spain isn't totally broke and that some Jewish banking families have "converted" in order to protect themselves from Spanish wrath and to give Spain some semi competent economic powers.

4. No, England will not be a puppet state per se. They will still mantain her colonies separately, but there will be substantially more Spanish 'ambassadors' In The English court.

5. Myopic castilians. I. Going to say that, with help from some more intelligent ones, Phillip is going to be quietly sapping the power of most of the nobility and operating a more meritocratic government in the colonies. (As meritocratic as a radical Catholic king can be)

 

[alexmilman]

But the Duke of Parma would have been mad to try to send his army out on the North Sea where the Dutch light warships could slaughter his men in the water. The Armada had Galleons, Carracks, and Galleys, but no light warships to counter the Dutch.

But this WAS OTL plan which Parma approved of. He even spent a considerable effort to take Antwerp AND the points securing Scheldt River. Of course he complained that his "personnel carriers" were not of a good quality but this is neither here nor there: it seems that he did not worry about the Dutch navy. BTW, the light ships usually did not carry a heavy artillery meaning that they'd not be able to do too much harm (AFAIK, not a single big Spanish ship had been sunk by the English during encounters in the Channel) while being vulnerable to the enemy's naval artillery.

And what are Spain's long term goals, after England is conquered?

It seems that Phillip was mostly interested in the short-term goals. In his (and Parma's) opinion the rebellious Provinces had been holding mostly due to the English help and encouragement so removal of Elizabeth was supposed to solve this specific problem and Parma should not remain in England for too long: as soon as the organized resistance is crushed he is back to the Netherlands. Most of the job is going to be done (as Phillip was assured by the enthusiastic English Catholic refugees) by the English gentry rising against the usurper Queen.

 

[Nicholai IV Vonskrieger]

August 2nd, 1588 - The Remains of London

As that early August storm fell on the English capital, it was quenching the last embers of a fire that had ravaged the city for three days and nearly leveled it. While in later decades and centuries it would be determined that the Great Fire of London was caused by careless English citizens, fleeing in the face of the Spanish army's advance, at the time it was used by Protestant English Lords as an example of monstrous Spanish violence. Though several attempts would be made by these individuals to rally resistance against the Spanish, it would go largely unheeded once the news of Queen Elizabeth's capture became widely known.

August 5th, 1588 - Richmond Palace

Three days after the last fires would sputter out in London proper, the Queen of England would be escorted from her Palacial estate to be tried by the Spanish court present in England. Only one account of the event remains. A diary entry from a Spanish guard at the event. Captain Valentín Rodriguez would later write,

"As the English queen stood before His Majesty, there was no hint of fear or of sorrow, only defiance. Even standing before the king in days old clothing and hair askew, She Gave an Aura of Regal Authority, much like the King. And when she was sentenced, it was like watching a lioness be denied her prey, for she flared her nostrils and with Nose upturned spun away from the king and ordered that she be escorted out. It has been one of the most interesting experiences I have encountered while on campaign in England."

When Queen Elizabeth was brought before King Phillip, it was less trial as it was a sentencing hearing. Found guilty on charges of Heresy, King Phillip ordered her Exiled to the Isle of Elba* where the queen would spend the rest of her days. But now, with the Tudor dynasty off the throne, King Phillip had a major issue, who would he install upon the throne? While a Hapsburg would be preferable, Phillip knew that it would be very difficult to sell a Hapsburg monarch to the English populace, and that revolt would be likely. But who did that leave?

*ITTL Elba is a Hapsburg Spanish posession

(Legit question about that, are the Stuart's genuinely Protestant or are they still good Catholics at this point, second question, if they are not Catholic, who would be a choice that is acceptable to both the English nobility and Madrid?)

 

[ByzantineLover]

I think IOTL Philip planned to put his own daughter, Isabella, on the English throne.

 

[Nicholai IV Vonskrieger]

That seems likely, but I'm assuming Phillip is more intelligent and knows a Hapsburg with, at best, tenuous, ties to the English throne won't be accepted

 

[Nmale]

I’ve also heard he planned on putting one of his sisters on the throne and marrying her to another Habsburg or his son.

 

[Nicholai IV Vonskrieger]

Still all hapsburgs, is there really no one else?

 

[Jonathan]

Still all hapsburgs, is there really no one else?

His daughter Isabella and king James VI are both not yet married. You could have a non-Habsburg on the throne with his influencial daughter pulling the strings, maybe even playing regent while James deals with Scotland.
If you want to be really nasty you could murder James off after a son is born, remarry Isabella to a Habsburg cousin, adopting their son making them a Habsburg.