Fear, Loathing and Gumbo on the Campaign Trail '72
- Thread starter Drew
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Two (well, three) things, Drew.
First, can I get an opinion on the analysis of the Libertarians as they currently stand that I drew up, along with a possible solution to the discrepancy in the two House seats from Montana? Also, thoughts on a Steven Spielberg-directed The Blues Brothers in 1979?
Finally, with January 1st, 1980 just around the corner, could you maybe do a "Where Are They Now?" update, like is done in some other timelines? It's where we could ask for people in this world for you to give short, few sentence descriptions of summarizing what they've done differently in this timeline, and where they are in early 1980? You could of course not chronicle those who you've felt you've already extensively fleshed-out, or who haven't changed that much over the timeline.
I know I gave a sort of confusion summary of the concept, so I'll post any example of some choice bits from one of these kinds of segments in Lord Roem's For All Time continuation, "Well Enough Alone" (and I hope he doesn't mind me quoting a bit at length here):
Thoughts?
First, can I get an opinion on the analysis of the Libertarians as they currently stand that I drew up, along with a possible solution to the discrepancy in the two House seats from Montana? Also, thoughts on a Steven Spielberg-directed The Blues Brothers in 1979?
Finally, with January 1st, 1980 just around the corner, could you maybe do a "Where Are They Now?" update, like is done in some other timelines? It's where we could ask for people in this world for you to give short, few sentence descriptions of summarizing what they've done differently in this timeline, and where they are in early 1980? You could of course not chronicle those who you've felt you've already extensively fleshed-out, or who haven't changed that much over the timeline.
I know I gave a sort of confusion summary of the concept, so I'll post any example of some choice bits from one of these kinds of segments in Lord Roem's For All Time continuation, "Well Enough Alone" (and I hope he doesn't mind me quoting a bit at length here):
For All Time: Well Enough Alone said:
Thoughts?
The bit with the Richard Dawkins and Osama bin Laden gave me a good hearty laugh!
Great TL keep it up!
Great TL keep it up!
More than likely their intelligence has picked-up on it. They would be aware that they are losing their grip over their North Vietnamese ally who rightly feels they were abandoned by the Soviets. With the PRC such a mess and the DRV not a loyal ally, they have little reach into the region at the moment.
Not as significant as OTL; he might want to continue Percy's 1976 moderate message into the 1980 Republican contest, but there are others to fill the 3rd party field in 1980.
Penn doesn't strike me as a serious politician, something would have to motivate him to run for office which hasn't OTL.
Clint Eastwood ran for Mayor of Carmel to overturn local zoning laws he didn't like, on of which interfered with the operation his restaurant. Since achieving the changes he wanted, he has shown no further interest in public office.
We're not quite there yet but on principle I don't necessarily have a problem with it. One thing I note:
wikipedia said:
I agree that Speilberg has done CE3K as escapist fare ITTL and it has done reasonably well - given that box office returns ITTL are lower overall - but why would Weiss turn to him to clean-up a comedy script? None of his hits to this point have been a comedy.
Also it might hinge on whether Speilberg wants to do Raiders of the Lost Ark. ITTL Lucas is dead, so Speilberg would have to carry all of the load for getting that film made. Since the film was based on a story Lucas wrote before his death, Raiders might also be made as a tribute to Lucas.
Incidentally, and this may help the case here, I don't think 1941 would be made ITTL. The film pokes fun at potential attacks on the U.S. homeland and urban riots, both still sensitive subjects (given a terrorist attack in 1976 and ongoing urban disturbances during the depression). If 1941 were to be made at all, it would be as a straight film glorifying those who volunteered after the Japanese attack.
Just some thoughts on this....
Maintaining some of the ground level details can be difficult, and I don't have a specific individual to point to from that era who could necessarily fill that Montana seat. The greater success of the Libertarians ITTL will no doubt draw in people OTL history would never have heard from.
But in general I agree with the list; Montana, North Dakota and Idaho are the hot bed of Libertarianism, though the idea is spreading as an alternative to "country club/big business" Republicanism. Montana now has 2 Libertarian House members and one Libertarian Senator (and one Republican Senator).
All possible and I agree with Vultan's point about Barry Goldwater Sr. He hated what Falwell and Robertson were doing to the GOP - and the way Republican politicians pandered to them - and he was very vocal about it. Becoming a Libertarian candidate would not be out-of-step with his own political convictions.
Some of these might begin to show-up. It is a little early yet for some of them, but if someone like Ron Paul or Barry Goldwater (Sr. or Jr.) jumps over to the Libertarians you might have a core activist group here. Food for thought.
More Breaking News...
Dellums and Nader Meet
(AP) Washington, DC --- Former Housing and Urban Development Secretary Ron Dellums met with consumer advocate and activist Ralph Nader today at Nader's Washington offices. Their conversation, which lasted for over two hours, was characterized by Dellums as "cordial and productive."
"We had a meeting of the minds on a number of issues," Nader commented. "Most importantly, we agree that progressive voices are not receiving the attention they should. This is partly due to corporate control of the media, and partially because our current political leaders have trivialized political debate."
"Rather than focusing on how he is going to beat-up oil companies, which I don't disagree with, the President should be looking at measures that will bring economic security to ordinary, working Americans, who have been devastated by this made in Washington and Wall Street depression we are now in," Nader added.
Pressed for a commitment about support for a potential Dellums third party Presidential run, Nader only said "I'm open to new ideas and approaches which will serve the people by electing politicians dedicated to reigning in the corporate superstate."
Ralph Nader has often criticized President George Wallace for using an anti-corporate, populist theme to get elected, and then cozying-up to corporate power and lobbyists once in office.
Nader has also criticized the President's measure for taxing oil company profits as "window dressing."
"If he was serious he would work it into the tax code and bring Congress to bear on this issue. Instead, he's posturing, looking to exploit this as a populist measure in his 1980 campaign, and then he'll drop it. We've seen this repeatedly from the Wallace Administration, they threaten corporate power with populist measures, but once they get the donation or support they are looking for - something which usually enhances the President's political image - they back off."
Ralph Nader received one vote for the Vice Presidential nomination at the 1972 Democratic nomination. Recently he has been leading a movement which is calling for more government involvement in job creation through infrastructure projects and a national apprenticeship program.
Ron Dellums was a candidate for the 1976 Democratic nomination. He left the Wallace Administration at the beginning of this year, calling the President's social agenda "hollow" and "a Potemkin village of hot air and no action." Dellums represented Oakland, California before joining President Wallace's Cabinet.
Dellums has indicated that he will run as a progressive candidate for President in 1980, but has yet to officially declare his candidacy.
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Dellums and Nader Meet
(AP) Washington, DC --- Former Housing and Urban Development Secretary Ron Dellums met with consumer advocate and activist Ralph Nader today at Nader's Washington offices. Their conversation, which lasted for over two hours, was characterized by Dellums as "cordial and productive."
"We had a meeting of the minds on a number of issues," Nader commented. "Most importantly, we agree that progressive voices are not receiving the attention they should. This is partly due to corporate control of the media, and partially because our current political leaders have trivialized political debate."
"Rather than focusing on how he is going to beat-up oil companies, which I don't disagree with, the President should be looking at measures that will bring economic security to ordinary, working Americans, who have been devastated by this made in Washington and Wall Street depression we are now in," Nader added.
Pressed for a commitment about support for a potential Dellums third party Presidential run, Nader only said "I'm open to new ideas and approaches which will serve the people by electing politicians dedicated to reigning in the corporate superstate."
Ralph Nader has often criticized President George Wallace for using an anti-corporate, populist theme to get elected, and then cozying-up to corporate power and lobbyists once in office.
Nader has also criticized the President's measure for taxing oil company profits as "window dressing."
"If he was serious he would work it into the tax code and bring Congress to bear on this issue. Instead, he's posturing, looking to exploit this as a populist measure in his 1980 campaign, and then he'll drop it. We've seen this repeatedly from the Wallace Administration, they threaten corporate power with populist measures, but once they get the donation or support they are looking for - something which usually enhances the President's political image - they back off."
Ralph Nader received one vote for the Vice Presidential nomination at the 1972 Democratic nomination. Recently he has been leading a movement which is calling for more government involvement in job creation through infrastructure projects and a national apprenticeship program.
Ron Dellums was a candidate for the 1976 Democratic nomination. He left the Wallace Administration at the beginning of this year, calling the President's social agenda "hollow" and "a Potemkin village of hot air and no action." Dellums represented Oakland, California before joining President Wallace's Cabinet.
Dellums has indicated that he will run as a progressive candidate for President in 1980, but has yet to officially declare his candidacy.
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Of course, Lucas was the one who suggested to make it an adventure film. Spielberg wanted it to be a spy film, like an American James Bond. With the whole Roger Moore debacle, I don't know how that would go over...
Besides, I think the reason he might get drafted to do the Blues Brothers is not necessarily because it's a comedy, but because it's a big-budget film, which Spielberg is almost unique in this time with his extensive experience directing that sort of stuff.
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Orville_third
Banned
Yay! Nader's getting in while the iron is hot and the public's memory is fresh!
John Farson
Banned
I recently saw a documentary about Joe Frazier and Thrilla in Manila and it reminded me of this passage:
ITTL, Ali's defeat would probably be explained as the logical outcome of him just screwing around in Manila, caught in a torrid love triangle between himself, his wife and his mistress, concentrating more on baiting Frazier rather than training etc, while Frazier just fanatically trained, trained and trained for the fight, Rocky-style (assuming there is a Rocky film in this TL).
What's been the history of heavyweight boxing since that fight, up until 1979? Have both Ali and Frazier continued boxing? For that matter, how has Frazier beating Ali two out of three times affected the public perception of the two? Is Frazier generally recognized as, if not better than Ali, than at least as his equal, or is there still talk about Frazier not being the "true champion"?
ITTL, Ali's defeat would probably be explained as the logical outcome of him just screwing around in Manila, caught in a torrid love triangle between himself, his wife and his mistress, concentrating more on baiting Frazier rather than training etc, while Frazier just fanatically trained, trained and trained for the fight, Rocky-style (assuming there is a Rocky film in this TL).
Christ the situation in ITTL’s China is even worse than I thought. I figured it’d be broadly like North Korea, with the lesser Mao trying to build up a power base in the army by lavishing all the PRC’s expanded armaments production, food & consumer goods on them. These new revolutionary guards seem useful only for internal terror whilst the PLA is being gutted.
China really is looking like a gigantic and dare I say it even worse version than OTL’s Cambodia.
Also what is the fate of Bruce Lee, is he mentioned at all? I ask because I was hoping his survival could be worked retroactively into TTL. With him becoming a big Hollywood star, and dare I say it involved in public/political life. ‘’Governor Lee’’ or ‘’President Lee’’. Would be an awesome outcome.
China really is looking like a gigantic and dare I say it even worse version than OTL’s Cambodia.
Also what is the fate of Bruce Lee, is he mentioned at all? I ask because I was hoping his survival could be worked retroactively into TTL. With him becoming a big Hollywood star, and dare I say it involved in public/political life. ‘’Governor Lee’’ or ‘’President Lee’’. Would be an awesome outcome.
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