"Buffy" Seven years early:

[Kalvan]

Rose Mcgowan as Glory is kinda weird. I don't see her as a Goddess.

Well, I didn't see Claire Kramer as a deity anyway. My first two choices were Jennifer Aniston and Heather Locklear, but Jennifer's going to be busy with Friends, and Heather had a pretty busy film career OTL even during the run of Melrose Place; it could only get busier. I simply can't see either of them wanting to do it in 1994.

With Rose McGowan, the only thing she had done up to this point would be Encino Man. Her first real big break was Going All The Way in 1997, followed by Jawbreaker in 1999. And her OTL career shows her to be very willing to due "genre" material.

Same with Jolene Blallock. Merry, innocent sister?

My first two candidates were Mercedes MacNab and Christina Ricci. However the former looked a little too much like a younger clone of Kristy at the time, (Dawn is meant by the monks to be Buffy's sister, not her exact dulicate) and the latter was already off to a roaring start to her movie career.

Holly Marie Combs as Faith... Awesomeness.

Same for Angelina Jolie as Drusilla. Would love to see that.

In the relevant timeframes, they were young, hungry, and looking for work.

My original choice for Faith was Alyssa Milano, (It would have been basically what Samantha would have been like if Tony had been killed when she was seven or eight in a mistaken mob hit, and raised by a hooker of a mother) but Who's the Boss?'s final season would have gotten in the way.

My original choice for Drusilla was Winona Rider, but from what I can see her most regular TV role ever OTL was The Simpsons.

BTW, by first three choices for Joyce were Susan Saint James, Sandy Duncan, and Holly Hunter. But Susan at the time was fed up with being a TV mom, Sandy was still busy with Valerie's Family, and the only time Holly Hunter does anything TV related is if she's also involved in the production side of things.

 

[Kalvan]

How old would Alyson Hannigan and Angelina Jolie be at the relevant times in this timeline?

Sixteen and Seventeen, respectively.

Alyson debuted in Impure Thoughts, and then played Dan Ackroyd's daughter in My Stepmother is an Alien. (And get this: her boyfriend in that movie was played by none other than Seth Green!)

Jolie's film debut was at age nine in Looking to Get Out, and then she was in several commercials and shorts until a part in a Meatloaf music video led to her getting cast in Hackers.

 

[CalBear]

Kristy Swanson and David Jones? Really? It lasts about six episodes before being cancelled and forgotten.

Four episodes and remembered with a horror reserved IOTL for My Mother the Car

 

[Kalvan]

Pretty harsh, CalBear.

Anyway, here's the ATL IMDB entry for the Movie:

Buffy The Vampire Slayer, (1985)

Director: Joss Whedon

Writer: Joss Whedon

Stars: Traci Lords, Vincent Price, Steve Buschemi

Cast:

Traci Lords: Buffy

Vincent Price: Merrick

Ted Raimi: Amylin

Steve Buschemi: Lothos

Nikki Sparx: Jennifer

Kirk Cameron: Pike

Vanessa Del Rio: Nikki

Jim Carrey: Benny

Stephen Furst: Garry Murray

Katy Sagal: Joyce Summers

Christopher Noth: Hank Summers

John Does 1-13: Basketball Team, Teachers

Jane Does 1-8: Cassandra, Various Cheerleaders, Teachers

Special Effects by Three Guys with a Rubber Hose.

Makeup Effects by LA Nails

Catering by Pizza Hut

Executive Produced by Alan Smithee

Produced by Michael Herz

 

[Andrew T]

Kalvan, you are my hero forever for getting a 14-year-old, pre-fundamentalist Christian Kirk Cameron to star in a movie with Traci Lords, Nikki Sparx, and Vanessa del Rio. That's pure, unadulterated genius.

 

[Kalvan]

Kalvan, you are my hero forever for getting a 14-year-old, pre-fundamentalist Christian Kirk Cameron to star in a movie with Traci Lords, Nikki Sparx, and Vanessa del Rio. That's pure, unadulterated genius.

Well, he needs a real reason to be Born Again: contrary to his image during Growing Pains and what happened to his little sister, he himself never indulged in the Hollywood/Rock and Roll LifestyleTM.

Oh, and one of the Cheerleaders is Ginger Lynn.

 

[Gregg]

Okay, who do you cast as Giles, keeping in mind relative age, British origin, and musical talent?

Ian McKellen, who at that point would have been in his mid to late fifties.

In 1989, he's only just turned 50. Given his strong attachment to the stage, I don't know if he'd really be open to commiting to a US TV series - although Patrick Stewart provides the template.

And his schedule would have been open at the time (according to IMDB, at the time he was mostly doing Dinner Theater and Made of TV Movies, aside from something called Scandal which looks like something he wishes he could have credited his acting to Alan Smithee over).

Dinner theatre? In 1989 he was doing an award-winning, Royal Shakespeare Company production of Othello directed by Trevor Nunn. And Scandal was very well-recieved film about the Profumo affair that rocked the British establishment in the 1950s. I just can't see him wanting to go for a TV series in America, and I tend to think the producers would cast from amongst the actors already there.

People like Christopher Cazenove and I think Robin Sachs (who played Ethan Rayne, of course) are British actors knocking around LA looking for work. Daniel Davis would have just displayed his very convincing fake British accent as Moriarty in ST:TNG. They're all within the age range, I think - no idea if any of them have musical talent.

If Fox were looking outside of America, one very suitable actor who can play the guitar is Jeremy Clyde. In 1989 he'd just done four years as the main villain in Crossbow (an American series filmed in France with a largely British cast). At 48, he's six years older than Head was when he took the part, and he wouldn't have the same reluctance about doing a US TV series as McKellen - but like McKellen, he's not actually working in America (so the producers would need to have clocked him in Crossbow, think he's suitable and bring him across the Atlantic, which perhaps makes it unlikely).

Probably far too young at this point is Hugh Laurie, who is not quite 30. He has the guitar playing, but again isn't already in Hollywood. Maybe one for Wesley Wyndham Price if anyone at Fox happens to see A Bit of Fry and Laurie? Ralph Brown (the drug dealer in Withnail and I) is a couple of years older, and plays the saxophone (can't remember if he plays the guitar), and started doing movies at about that time (though they were probably made in Britain).

However... Eric Idle is 46, has recently been in Terry Gilliam's The Adventures of Baron Munchausen, is in America in 1989 OTL appearing as a ghost in a short-lived US sitcom (Nearly Departed) and is an accomplished guitarist.

Edit: I can't believe it didn't occur to me - there's someone who is working in America in 1989, is the same age as Head was when he took the role, and like Head first became famous for playing Frank N. Furter in The Rocky Horror Picture Show... Tim Curry.

 

[Kalvan]

However... Eric Idle is 46, has recently been in Terry Gilliam's The Adventures of Baron Munchausen, is in America in 1989 OTL appearing as a ghost in a short-lived US sitcom (Nearly Departed) and is an accomplished guitarist.

Perfect!

And he'll work with Derek de Lint as Rayne.

Hmm... I wonder how much more comedic the part will become with an allumnus of Monty Python as an authority figure.

 

[Gregg]

Hmm... I wonder how much more comedic the part will become with an allumnus of Monty Python as an authority figure.

I think the bumbling and ineffectual aspects that were gradually phased out with Head (particularly after Wesley joined), would stay throughout the series. I'm not sure Giles played by Idle would have that edge of menace that Head sometimes does (most obviously when he kills Ben).

(Whereas my late suggestion of Curry would be a much darker and more ruthless Giles from the start.)

 

[Kalvan]

Hmmm... with Joss Whedon doing Buffy all by his lonesome, what happens to Fran and Kaz Kazui? What happens to Rosanne without Whedon to direct some of its pivotal moments? What happens to Alien3? What happens to the careers of Jane Espenson, David Greenwalt, and Marti Noxon? Will Whedon and Spelling start feuding as badly Whedon is with the Kazuis now? Will Shannon Doherty or Tori Spelling try to take over production? Will Spelling be in the mood to take a look at Constance Burge's proposal for Charmed after his experience with Buffy? And how does pop culture change?

Any suggestions?

 

[Kalvan]

Bumped for a few new casting choices.

 

[Kalvan]

To bump it, and add to the cast a little:

Buffy: Kristy Swanson

Joyce: Beverly D'Angelo

Giles: Eric Idle or Tim Curry

Willow: either Gabrielle Carthiers, Mayim Bialik, or Alyson Hannigan

Xander: Anthony Michael Hall

Amy Madison: Ami Dolnez

Cordelia: Shannon Doherty

Harmony: Tori Spelling

Jonathan: Troy Slaten

Principal Flutie: John Lithgow

Principal Snyder: Rene Auberjornois

Angel: Bill Wadhams

The Master: Mark Metcalfe

Darla: Jenny Garth

The Annointed One: Jonathan Taylor Thomas

Jenny Calendar: Christine McGlade (Changed from Roma Gypsy to [Druidic] Irish Traveler)

Drusilla: Angelina Jolie

Spike: Paul MacGann

Ethan Rayne: Derek de Lint

Faith: Holly Marie Combs

Wesley Windham-Price: Tom DeFranco

Mr. Trick: Don Cheadle

The Mayor: David Rasche or Joss Whedon himself

Anya: Jeri Ryan

Reilly: Kevin Kubasheskie

Maggie Walsh: Kerrie Keane or Sandy Duncan

Adam: Kevin Sorbo

Tara: Kelly Rutherford

Dawn: Jolene Blaylock

Ben: Matthew Lillard

Glory: Rose McGowan

Glory's Mintions: Several, but including Peter Dinklage and Warwick Davis, if possible

Warren: Charlie Schlatter

Andrew Wells: Leonardo DiCaprio (This is just after playing Ben on Growing Pains, but a year before his role as The Kid in The Quick and the Dead.)

Kennedy: Mila Kunis

Su-Lin: Stephanie Chow (Of You Can't do That on Television, not Hong Kong action cinema)

Rona: Sharon Leal

Vi: Allison Porter

Eve: Reese Witherspoon

 

[Unknown]

Here's another actor for Giles...Malcolm McDowell.

If anything, it would be a change from the bad guys he usually plays (I saw him in an episode of Law and Order: Criminal Intent, and he was good as the bad guy.).

 

[Kalvan]

Here's another actor for Giles...Malcolm McDowell.

If anything, it would be a change from the bad guys he usually plays (I saw him in an episode of Law and Order: Criminal Intent, and he was good as the bad guy.).

He could work, but he would then be unavailable for several of his best roles, especially Dr. Soran in Star Trek: Generations.

 

[LOTLOF]

To bump it, and add to the cast a little:

Buffy: Kristy Swanson

Joyce: Beverly D'Angelo

Giles: Eric Idle or Tim Curry

Willow: either Gabrielle Carthiers, Mayim Bialik, or Alyson Hannigan

Xander: Anthony Michael Hall

Amy Madison: Ami Dolnez

Cordelia: Shannon Doherty

Harmony: Tori Spelling

Jonathan: Troy Slaten

Principal Flutie: John Lithgow

Principal Snyder: Rene Auberjornois

Angel: Bill Wadhams

Tim Curry as Giles? Wow. I would watch just for that. Certainly no problem with singing and he would be so perfect as a more know it all smart ass sort of character. It would also be too easy to fall into the 'Ripper' persona.

Also would love to see John Lithgow get eaten.

You can't have Rene Auberjornois though, he must be on DS9.

 

[Imperator Novae Zealandae]

To bump it, and add to the cast a little:


Spike: Paul MacGann

This could be quite good. He wouldn't be the same as James Marsters but I think that Paul McGann could put a nice spin on Spike. Not too sure if he'd have the chemistry with Angelina Jolie that James did with Juliet Landau though.

 

[Kalvan]

A few questions:

1: Can Bill Wadhams carry his own show, or will Angel simply be put on a bus at the end of Season Three for the sake of Animotion getting back together and only coming back for specific episodes like "New Moon Rising," "Forever," "Flooded," possibly "Hell's Bells," and the series finale? For that matter, are there better actors out there to play Angel? David Boreanaz is still undiscovered in high school in 1988-89. My first choice was Rob Lowe.

2: How will Willow and Tara's relationship be covered?

3: Who will replace Troy Slaten as Jerry Steiner on Parker Lewis Can't Lose?

4: While being Andrew won't jeopardize DiCaprio's chances to play The Kid in The Quick and the Dead, will it typecast him enough at the time that the role of Jack Dawson in Titanic goes to someone else? Btw, my original choice to play Andrew was Ben Stiller, but he'd have been pushing thirty by then.

5: Who should play Oz and Dinoes Ate My Baby? Seth Green has the musical chops, has already played Hannigan's boyfriend in My Stepmother is an Alien (Assuming she plays Willow), but I'm sure there are others out there that could work. Also, while Dingoes will still be a garage band, Nirvana's Nevermind hasn't come out yet. That leaves a garage hair band, or else a garage postmodern/alternative band following in the footsteps of REM and Cutting Crew.

 

[Kalvan]

Tim Curry as Giles? Wow. I would watch just for that. Certainly no problem with singing and he would be so perfect as a more know it all smart ass sort of character. It would also be too easy to fall into the 'Ripper' persona.

Also would love to see John Lithgow get eaten.

You can't have Rene Auberjornois though, he must be on DS9.

But Armin Shimerman is still stuck on Beauty and the Beast for another year and a half. Also, he'll be dead and free (except for flash backs, the nightmare episode at the end of Season Four, and the First Evil during Season Seven) in time for Deep Space Nine.

Also, who should play new P.E. or (MacGyvering) science teacher Mr. Wood (since there's no way in heck he'll be old enough to be a principal in TTL)?

Oh, would Terrance Stamp work as Quinten Travers?

 

[Garrison]

Some points that you seem to have overlooked:

1. if the show premieres in 1990-91 then it isn't on the WB. If it's on FOX I can see the tone being different from the get go.

2. It won't just be the actors who are different, seven years earlier means a different set of writers and producers, again that's going to mean some OTL episodes aren't going to happen.

3. You also seem to be ignoring that some plot decisions were influenced by real world decisions, the Angel spin off and Seth Green choosing to leave for example, and with different actors those things are unlikely to happen at the same time points.

At the moment you seem to be proposing launching seven years earlier with a different cast, network, and production team but producing exactly the same story arcs.

 

[neopeius]

Okay, who do you cast as Giles, keeping in mind relative age, British origin, and musical talent?

Tony Head actually could have done the job back then.